Nal
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 6801
posted
Oh brother.
I am supposed to go in for nose surgery in less than two weeks. I had an appt with my LMD today. I mentioned the surgery to him. He said he really, really didn't want me to have it done right now and to put it off.
Now this surgery was to fix a deviated septum in my nose-I broke it as a child and have had breathing problems since off and on.
Anyway my LMD told me that sometimes people who have major surgery (its a 3 hour procedure too), can actually have a huge flare up afterwards from Lyme.
Has anyone ever heard of this before or even dealt with this?
I wont have the surgery if LMD says no because I do not want to go against his wishes and such ya know? Im really disapointed though. I was looking forward to fixing this problem. Its horribly depressing when you cant even go in and fix a simple problem without flaring this stupid, putrid illness!!
Nancy
-------------------- Life is 10% what happens to you, 90% how you respond to it!
-Chuck Swindoll Posts: 1594 | From Colorado | Registered: Jan 2005
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posted
how i WISH i had a lyme doctor. i've actually had TWO "deviated septum" surgeries, one at age 19 and one at age 62. both were awful, but recovery pretty fast.
the reason i had two procedures was because the first time, (way back in the dark ages of the 1950's) tooooooo much cartilage was removed, and my nose was collapsing on the inside, with age.
so the second surgery was done to graft ear cartilage into my nose. not a bit fun. it was supposed to help my sleep disorders. NOT. didn't do it; in fact, made breathing better, but nighttime awakenings WORSE. go figure.
i'm DONE with surgeries. although i did not have a "flare" after the surgery 3 years ago, i continue to feel just terrible. i would pay attention, if i were you, to your llmd, who might help you avoid unnecessary cutting on your body!!
btw, i've had eleven surgeries. some can't be avoided, of course, as we go thru life, with our lyme bodies disintegrating. since YOU are being treated for lyme (i was, but not nearly aggressively enough, and i'm still very sick) you will not be in this category. lucky you! dianne
Posts: 21 | From spokane, WA | Registered: Apr 2004
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Aniek
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 5374
posted
Nancy,
Surgery is a huge stress on your immune system. That added stress is probably what could cause a flar. In addition, with surgery there is always a chance of catching another infection.
That's probably what your LLMD is worried about.
Good luck!
-A
-------------------- "When there is pain, there are no words." - Toni Morrison Posts: 4711 | From Washington, DC | Registered: Mar 2004
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cantgiveupyet
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 8165
posted
Nancy- I just had that cysto/hydro and 2 biposies taken from my bladder last week. Im still recovering. The days after i felt like i was herxing real hard...not sleeping, bad mood swings..wanting to die one moment and laughing the next. then i felt great for a few days now im back feeling horrible.
The dr thought my bladder bled(which can be a complication) because of the lyme.
i would trust your LLMD on this one...3 hours is a long time...i know you want this done, but i just dont want to see you hurting even more because of it.
-------------------- "Say it straight simple and with a smile."
"Thus the task is, not so much to see what no one has seen yet, But to think what nobody has thought yet, About what everybody sees."
-Schopenhauer
pos babs, bart, igenex WB igm/igg Posts: 3156 | From Lyme limbo | Registered: Oct 2005
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Nal
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 6801
posted
Im crying tonight. Im just so darn disappointed .
I am by far not the prettiest person out there (even though dh disagrees), and my nose is definately a little deformed. I totally hate it.
Yes, this was partially for vanity reasons and partly for the fact that I do have breathing problems.
Anyway, I wont have the surgery-not now anyway. I know he is right--I cant risk getting worse. I know the recovery from the surgery is also very painful.
I hate having this disease run my life. However, I need to listen to my LMD and wait. However, I am very sad about it.
Nancy
-------------------- Life is 10% what happens to you, 90% how you respond to it!
-Chuck Swindoll Posts: 1594 | From Colorado | Registered: Jan 2005
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quote:Originally posted by Nal: Im crying tonight. Im just so darn disappointed .
I am by far not the prettiest person out there (even though dh disagrees), and my nose is definately a little deformed. I totally hate it.
Yes, this was partially for vanity reasons and partly for the fact that I do have breathing problems.
Anyway, I wont have the surgery-not now anyway. I know he is right--I cant risk getting worse. I know the recovery from the surgery is also very painful.
I hate having this disease run my life. However, I need to listen to my LMD and wait. However, I am very sad about it.
Nancy
Nancy,
I was diagnosed with Lyme last year. I've probably had it for 25 years. I did have my septum fixed and turbinates reduced in 2001.
The surgery went well and I didn't have a set back. I also had Lasik done in 2002 with no problems.
I think you should follow your LLMD's advice. Maybe you need to wait a little longer.
-------------------- Peggy
~ ~ Hope is a powerful medicine. ~ ~ Posts: 2775 | From MN | Registered: Apr 2001
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tabbytamer
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 3159
posted
I wonder if it is the surgeries that cause a flare or if it is a herx from receiving IV abx for the surgery?
posted
A month prior to my walking into an LLMD's off I had major surgery-total hysterectomy and bladder repair-fortunately due to having an excellent surgeon and after care I had no major longterm complications from it as a reult of having lyme(undiagnosed) at that point.
I say no long term effects,I guess I am being naive-I should say I healed from the surgery but have been unable to return to work because my lyme symptoms progressed to the point I am laid off.
When I mentioned to LLMD that the optometrist wanted to due surgery around my eyes-the LLMD immediately said NO SURGERIES. I don't have bell's palsy, but my face muscles are all droopy,including skin around my eyes. I kind of have that sad dog look going on.
lymie tony z
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 5130
posted
Surgery....hmmmm
OK, when I had my first total knee replacement I had to donate my own blood that was not frozen as I and my llmd at the time requested. I was given morphine and vancomycin after surgery....
Man o Man did I ever have a reaction...psychologically and physically....
The second knee replacement five years later I had my donated blood frozen and had a spinal. I don't know what abx they injected into me this time but I had no reaction...
Three variables changed so I'm not sure which one was responsible for not getting any reaction...
I did develop rediculating pain in the hip on the side of the first knee replacement and had caudal blocks put in which my llmd said would not work....but they did...I knew the risk but the pain was tooooooooo intense not to try something.
Fortunately the first injection negated my pain about 90 percent and has'nt returned until recently...six years down the road.........
You're on your own....physical trauma can and often does make our lyme flare....good luck.zman
-------------------- I am not a doctor...opinions expressed are from personal experiences only and should never be viewed as coming from a healthcare provider. zman Posts: 2527 | From safety harbor florida(origin Cleve., Ohio | Registered: Jan 2004
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SForsgren
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 7686
posted
They talk about this at the conferences too. Any trauma including surgery can send you in a downward direction.
-------------------- Be well, Scott Posts: 4617 | From San Jose, CA | Registered: Jul 2005
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lymemomtooo
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 5396
posted
Nal, I do not have any good answers but I also have a deviated septum. I have not had mine fixed because of 2 things, one, I am afraid I will choke on the gauze that is put in and 2, years ago the Dr did not give me much hope of it being successful.
But I would do it if I wasn't such a wimp. I would love to take a good breath..
But on the other hand, I have not been diagnosed with lyme disease..I think that would make it even more complicated.
I have heard that the teeth can be the gateway to the brain and central nervous system infections. I would think that the nose would be the same.
I would ask the Dr for specifics but if this is a fear, forget surgery. Neurological and psych complications are not worth any surgery. We live with very severe ones 24/7. lymemomtooo
Posts: 2360 | From SE PA | Registered: Mar 2004
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Truthfinder
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 8512
posted
Perhaps things have changed, but about 15 years ago, nasal surgeries often led to additional nasal surgeries because of the development of polyps after the first surgery.
Of the 3 people I know who had nasal surgeries during that time, only one had no additional problems.
I, too, have a deviated septum, apparently from a broken nose as a kid (who knew?). My docs wanted me to have it fixed to clear up sinus issues, but my brain said "don't do it" and I never did. Now that I know I have Lyme in my body, I'm kind of glad I didn't.
When the time is right, I'm sure your LLMD will give you the okay. Sorry this is so frustrating for you.
Tracy
-------------------- Tracy .... Prayers for the Lyme Community - every day at 6 p.m. Pacific Time and 9 p.m. Eastern Time � just take a few moments to say a prayer wherever you are�. Posts: 2966 | From Colorado | Registered: Dec 2005
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posted
If the surgery is primarily elective, I'd put it off.
To facilitate healing of damaged tissue, the body suspends some of its normal immune system action in that area. This allows bacteria like Lyme a better chance to gain a foothold in the area. Once there, they produce chronic inflammation. This explains why so many of us have chronic pain from injured areas that should have healed.
I had surgery about 5 years ago, and had pain in the area until this year. I think the relief has come from finally getting abx treatment.
Posts: 727 | From USA | Registered: Mar 2006
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Sue vG
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 3143
posted
I had back surgery several years ago, about 2.5 years after contracting lyme and a little over 1 year into treatment.
I slipped gradually for a few months, then took a one-week overseas vacation and flared up pretty badly, to where some of my original symptoms that had disappeared with treatment, returned.
The doc had to change my abx to get me back on track and I gained back that lost ground pretty quickly.
Posts: 1307 | From TX | Registered: Sep 2002
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quote:Originally posted by dguy: If the surgery is primarily elective, I'd put it off.
Me too. I had a very rough time last summer after gallbladder surgery. Could have died from the resulting infection I got. With a shot immune system, surgery is risky.
-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96223 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
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quote:Originally posted by lymemomtooo: Nal, I do not have any good answers but I also have a deviated septum. I have not had mine fixed because of 2 things, one, I am afraid I will choke on the gauze that is put in and 2, years ago the Dr did not give me much hope of it being successful.
But I would do it if I wasn't such a wimp. I would love to take a good breath..
But on the other hand, I have not been diagnosed with lyme disease..I think that would make it even more complicated.
I have heard that the teeth can be the gateway to the brain and central nervous system infections. I would think that the nose would be the same.
I would ask the Dr for specifics but if this is a fear, forget surgery. Neurological and psych complications are not worth any surgery. We live with very severe ones 24/7. lymemomtooo
My septum surgery has been very successful. My nose wasn't packed with gauze. They used Intranasal Splints.
The number of sinus infections was greatly reduced and my sleep is better.
-------------------- Peggy
~ ~ Hope is a powerful medicine. ~ ~ Posts: 2775 | From MN | Registered: Apr 2001
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posted
I had an emergency appendectomy last summer with complications. 3 hour surgery. I swear, I am still recovering.
It was a blow.
But I'm thinking it was partly due to the IV flagyl, gentamyacin and Cipro...Also the fact that I lost part of my colon.
I asked for Diflucan 2nd day post op and the Dr. refused until I stuck my white tongue out.
Honey, get a new hair color or pierce your ears or something while you wait for that time that you're healthy enough for this surgery. Every time you look in the mirror say, "oh you be-ut-i-ful thang!!!!"
Bug
-------------------- Every experience God gives us, every person He puts in our lives, is the perfect preparation for a future only He can see....Corrie Ten Boom Posts: 343 | From Northcentral Iowa | Registered: May 2005
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Nal
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 6801
posted
Honey, get a new hair color or pierce your ears or something while you wait for that time that you're healthy enough for this surgery. Every time you look in the mirror say, "oh you be-ut-i-ful thang!!!!"
Bug [/QB][/QUOTE]
LOL, thank you!! I called and canceled it today.
Nancy
-------------------- Life is 10% what happens to you, 90% how you respond to it!
-Chuck Swindoll Posts: 1594 | From Colorado | Registered: Jan 2005
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trails
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 1620
posted
Nal--I had 4 hour surgery for endo (and they also took out my appendix) last August. I had stopped abx for the surgery, but started them within a month afterwards.
I did not experience any backslide from this surgery. I felt better than I had in years because it really cleared up a lot of the disease. Of course there was the initial recovery that was hard, but otherwise I did very well. In fact my LL surgeon and two other LLMDs including the one you have now, said it was okay to go ahead with this surgery. And in fact that it was recommended coz I might get relief from my pelvic pain which might lead to a better quality of life.
I had to decide to deal with lyme first or deal with endo. I decided endo. Turns out I am still dealing with endo, but not as severe as before. I am also still dealing with lyme but no backslide from surgery.
I am about to have more pelvic surgery. It is partially elective....these cysts arent going to KILL me, they are just a pain and they arent going to get better on their own.
I am only concerned with the surgery coz it is surgery, but not coz of lyme.
In my opinion, you gotta live your life and deal with other health issues as much as you can right along side of lyme.
Breath is life. Breathing right and long and deep is about the most healing thing you could do for your body. Feeling attractive and good about your appearance is also really healing and your self esteem plays a big role in how you feel physically.
Do what your LLMD says, but maybe ask him again to reconsider. It sounds like the disappointment from NOT being able to deal with this is causing a lot of harm.
Everyone is different and every surgery is too. Just wanted you to know it is not out of the question and every surgery doesnt turn out to be a big relapse. Take care now, Trails
Posts: 1950 | From New Mexico | Registered: Sep 2001
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posted
I had a hysterectomy 3 years ago with no problems. Had lyme for 25+ years at the time, but no treatment. That started 6 months after the surgery.
-------------------- tj Posts: 296 | From Portland, OR | Registered: Jun 2003
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bettyg
Unregistered
posted
Nancy, I had/have severe nose bleeds and had this surgery TWICE; both times NOT solving the problem of stopping my nose bleeds! 1980 & 92?
Both times that gauze; I could blow my nose constantly; other folks, can't...me, non-stop flowing!
My recent new LLMD wrote in her summary my PCP should check for a blood vessel still BLEEDNG?
I've had 12 surgeries; 11 during my misdx lyme; all had complications galore. I was MURPHY'S LAW over & over; if anything could go wrong; will go wrong!
Twice very sick in hospital and felt like I was going to die from 2 staph infections and collapsed lung.
Consider yourself LUCKY your LLMD had your health in mind when he decided that. Best wishes.
I know how disappointed you must feel about delaying surgery. I had to have surgery last November due to a hemorrhage and I'm still paying the price for it today.
My immune system came crashing down shortly after. Prior to surgery I was literally running up and down 2 flights of stairs - 28 stairs in all. Now I'm barely moving. I was healthier a year ago than I am now!
I'd follow your LLMD's advice on this. It's GOOD advice.
Good luck!
-------------------- Posts: 703 | From Almost Heaven | Registered: Aug 2004
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Its horribly depressing when you cant even go in and fix a simple problem without flaring this stupid, putrid illness!! ![[Mad]](mad.gif)
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said it was okay to go ahead with this surgery. And in fact that it was recommended coz I might get relief from my pelvic pain which might lead to a better quality of life.
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