posted
If you currently have, or had, amalgam fillings at any point and did not properly chelate the body load out, taking ALA to treat lyme could easily end you up in a straight jacket or permanently brain damaged.
I know because I'm battling both and I will not use ALA to treat either, simply because I've seen too many people go nuts. It crosses the blood / brain barrier. If you have current fillings and/or a high mercury body load, you can easily make an already bad situation, totally unmanageable. I use DMSA and the best I ever feel mentally/physically is after a 4 day round of the cutler protocol.
Just thought I'd post this, a lot of simliarities and connections between mercury and lyme and maybe I saved a life out there of someone that doesn't understand ALA can be life threatening in the wrong situation.
It took me over a month to recover from a poorly informed ALA dosing I did once. Trust me, you don't want to experience mercury loads handled wrong and dumped on your brain especially in the middle of lyme problems.
Abxnomore
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 18936
posted
You can't use ALA with out NAC. Yes ALA cross the BBB and chelates metals but you need NAC for it to latch on to, to carry it out of the body.
However, ALA alone is not a good chelating protocol. You need something much more efficient such as EDTA or DMSA along with ALA and NAC and
other nutrients such as chlorella, garlic, cilantro and vitamin C. I personally am not a fan of DMPS but that is another one of the big guns.
Chelating heavy metals out of the body must be done under the supervision of a very knowledgeable practitioner or else one can became very ill if the metals are mobilized out of the tissues but not moved out of the body. And if
your phase 1 & 2 of liver detoxification are not working properly you will be in for big trouble, so before you start make sure phase 1 & 2 of liver detoxification are tested. If your body
can't clear out the metals don't even begin to try to chelate them out of your tissues. Your body will turn into one toxic waste dump and you will feel sicker than hell.
However most people have more than just mercury in their system. Lead, cadmium, aluminum and others are very common and DMSA won't chelate out all metals.
Posts: 5191 | From Lyme Zone | Registered: Jan 2009
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lymeHerx001
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Member # 6215
posted
ALA never helped me, prob cause I full of mercury
Posts: 2905 | From New England | Registered: Sep 2004
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bettyg
Unregistered
posted
what's ALA? please spell it out in subject line....thanks xox
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seekhelp
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Member # 15067
posted
Betty, it's Alpha Lipoic Acid. Posts: 7545 | From The 5th Dimension - The Twilight Zone | Registered: Mar 2008
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bettyg
Unregistered
posted
help, big thanks for explaining that to me
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posted
Why would ALA be listed on Dr. B's required supplements list if it is this dangerous? Glad I didn't follow the guidlines that are shown to many newbies on here...Seems scary and dangerous??
-------------------- If you keep doing nothing...nothing changes!
Truthfinder
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 8512
posted
Thanks for this thread. Unfortunately, it came a bit too late and it looks like I'm a casualty in the ALA Unawareness Group.
Apparently, I did EVERYTHING wrong when using it. I had absolutely no idea this supplement was so tricky. I started taking it because my blood glucose has been slightly over normal and ALA was a top recommendation in one of my nutritional healing books.
I assume NAC refers to N-acetyl-cysteine? Well, I'll assume that.
I started taking 250 mg. a day of ALA right after having a large amalgam filling removed by a conventional dentist back in December. I'd heard NAC was good to take with it but wanted to see how I did with just the ONE supplement first.
Long story short, it began to affect my heart almost immediately with increased heart palpitations and brief episodes of fibrillation and tachycardia. It also began to affect my bowel action (reduced peristalsis) but that progression was so slow that I didn't figure that part out until just this week. I even tried taking it every other day or every 3rd day, thinking I would get `used' to it.
I guess I kept trying because I thought I felt some benefits at first (but now I can't remember what they were).
Oh, and I forgot to mention that I still have 11 amalgam fillings in my mouth.
So now, after I've had a major episode with my heart and my bowels are nearly at a standstill, I've got to figure out what to do about it. I still don't understand why it affected my heart and my bowels, but it did, so I go from here.
I think this thread - or a similar one - should be made into a `sticky' thread and put right at the top of the Medical Questions forum!
(Except that ALA should be spelled out so people know what the heck it is. Same with NAC. This board can be very confusing to new people with all the unexplained achronyms getting tossed about.)
-------------------- Tracy .... Prayers for the Lyme Community - every day at 6 p.m. Pacific Time and 9 p.m. Eastern Time � just take a few moments to say a prayer wherever you are�. Posts: 2966 | From Colorado | Registered: Dec 2005
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TF
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 14183
posted
To lakes 592, you asked why Dr. B requires ALA supplementation if it is dangerous.
Remember that Dr. Burrascano's lyme treatment guidelines are written to doctors, not patients. They are not designed for you to read them and do-it-yourself.
Any supplement or medication can be dangerous to any one person depending on their circumstances (unknown allergies are a good example). This goes for all medical treatment, not just lyme. There is no avoiding this medical fact.
That is why medical treatment (and lyme treatment) is to be done by a physician.
And, that is why the patient is to let the doctor know if negative things begin to happen when a new medication or supplement is introduced into treatment. Then the doc can evaluate what is happening and tell the patient to stop the treatment if necessary.
So, you are not the one who is to follow Dr. B's Guidelines. We show them to you so you can learn about the complexities of lyme disease and what good lyme disease treatment involves. Then, you are better able to evaluate your lyme doctor's treatment of you.
Please don't ever try to treat yourself. You could be endangering yourself.
They say that if a man represents himself in court, he has a fool for a client.
By the way, I took alpha lipoic acid under my lyme doctor's direction with absolutely no problem. It really helped me. That is probably the case with the majority of people. But, they don't get on and post that they did fine on x, y, and z supplements.
Posts: 9931 | From Maryland | Registered: Dec 2007
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hiker53
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 6046
posted
What is NAC?
-------------------- Hiker53
"God is light. In Him there is no darkness." 1John 1:5 Posts: 8913 | From Illinois | Registered: Aug 2004
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Keebler
Honored Contributor (25K+ posts)
Member # 12673
posted
-
NAC is N-Acetyl-Cysteine
NAC is produced in living organisms from the amino acid cysteine. Thus, NAC is a natural sulfur-containing (sulfhydryl) amino acid derivative found naturally in foods
Those who have problems clearing sulfur could have problems with NAC . . . and high doses can produce problems in anyone.
--------------------
I have taken ALA and NAC and done very well with with both.
As for seeing "too many people go nuts" well, there are many other factors involved. Perhaps having problems from the wrong dosage? It may take a little while to figure it out.
It's important to always start slowly with a low dose and never start 2 new things at once. Remember that we are all a little different. If something causes a harsh reaction, back off, back up . . . change course . . . and, of course, be in close consult with your doctor if there is a problem.
And, backing up, follow medical advice (really). If you think you are getting bad advice, get a better doctor.
Too many try to rough it out. Not everything is just right for everyone. And . . . we don't know everything -- sometimes it's not necessarily exactly what we think, with so many factors involved and so many mitigating circumstances.
And I also need to add in here that not everyone gets that "body is a temple" thing. I have heard of someone thinking a vitamin nearly killed them only to find out, not only did they not take it with food, but they washed it down with a beer.
When you hear reports, it is good to read up on the subject yet, even when a particular herb or vitamin is reported, we do not always have all the facts and the patient may not have followed directions. It takes a lot of reading to put this all together.
From what I've read, though, both ALA and NAC are fabulous tools that have the capacity to help us in many important ways.
----
If one has a bad reaction to NAC, this might be considered - see the post from the CPN site poster:
"You're asking what 'symptoms' to look for . . ." . . . .
"NAC flu is basically a 'flu-like' reaction to NAC. . . . If you take it and get what we call 'NAC flu', you can probably be reassured you have a cpn infection and should try the Vanderbilt or Wheldon protocol. . . . ."
Much more about this at that thread.
-
[ 05-26-2009, 12:24 PM: Message edited by: Keebler ]
Posts: 48021 | From Tree House | Registered: Jul 2007
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Keebler
Honored Contributor (25K+ posts)
Member # 12673
Search results for N-Acetyl Cysteine (NAC) - 98 articles found
=================================
NAC (N-Acetyl-Cysteine)
This, from a protocol for Chlamydia Pneumonia (Cpn) which is a similar chronic stealth infection. This treatment protocol is also similar to that of chronic lyme.
This is what one of the protocol authors says about the power of NAC to help protect the liver:
. . . "Surprisingly, the only anti-chlamydial agent that did not cause hepatitis in some patients was NAC. In fact, NAC is recognized as being protective.
See attached references.
My conclusion is that NAC should be the first agent in an anti-chlamydial regimen and should be a constant part of the therapy for this protective effect, not to mention it's effect against elementary bodies.
. . . more at link above.
- -
[ 05-23-2009, 03:40 PM: Message edited by: Keebler ]
Posts: 48021 | From Tree House | Registered: Jul 2007
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Truthfinder
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 8512
posted
Well, Keeb, I guess that's the point of this thread - to inform others that this is one of those supplements requiring a little more research than average.
Thanks for editing your original post.
Nothing in the literature I read initially addressed any special consideration for those with amalgam fillings or any of that. Clearly, I didn't go far enough with my research before I started taking it.
I never had a harsh reaction to it - the changes were mild and subtle - especially after I reduced the dose. That made it harder to figure out what the problem was for sure.
Thanks for providing all the links - you are always so helpful in offering information on various subjects. You do a great service on this board, Keebler.
-------------------- Tracy .... Prayers for the Lyme Community - every day at 6 p.m. Pacific Time and 9 p.m. Eastern Time � just take a few moments to say a prayer wherever you are�. Posts: 2966 | From Colorado | Registered: Dec 2005
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posted
Hi Truth, Have you tried increasing your magnesium and vitamin C for motility? Sorry you had such a bad experience.
TF, I love your quote. "They say that if a man represents himself in court, he has a fool for a client."
I just proved your point by taking Wobenzym. Knocked me wayyyyyyyy down. So, I am "guilty as charged" Posts: 677 | From Virginia | Registered: Sep 2002
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Truthfinder
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 8512
posted
Yes, imagine, I've tried both those things plus a number of others. I finally had to drag out the 'big guns' a couple of days ago (Miralax). But even with that, I'll have to take Cascara or something to get the guts moving..... it's insane. I feel likle a rock factory.
Thanks for the suggesetions, though....
Yes, it is up to each of us to know what we are taking before we do it. And if we have a reaction - even if mild - we'd better do some more research, just to be sure.
-------------------- Tracy .... Prayers for the Lyme Community - every day at 6 p.m. Pacific Time and 9 p.m. Eastern Time � just take a few moments to say a prayer wherever you are�. Posts: 2966 | From Colorado | Registered: Dec 2005
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Scary thing is LLMD recommended ALA and I told him I could not touch the stuff even 1 yr post amalgam removal.
Still doing low dose DMSA with nutramedix Algas and NAC and trace minerals inbetween.
Someday I may try ALA again but not until I do another metals urine challange test and even then, do very low dose ALA.
-------------------- Bart Henslea 1976 Fibro/CFS/arthritis 2004 Lyme diagnosed 2007 3 1/2 years treatment with oral combos, Cowden, IV roc. BW herbs. Off all abx in 12/10. Feeling good. Posts: 647 | From NY | Registered: Dec 2007
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posted
Gothcha...unfortunately my LLMD doesn't recommend any supplements. Not even acidophilous so I have had to take that on my own without his recommendation.
He says it isn't necessary. He is who I am stuck with for the time being so I have had to do alot of research on my own. I had my amalgam filling's removed 5 years ago on my first go round with lyme but never actually did any chelating as I was nervous from things I read.
Yes, perhaps a sticky on this or sidenote on the guidelines page would be a good idea.
Thanks, Ann
-------------------- If you keep doing nothing...nothing changes!
posted
Yes, if you have sulphur pathway problems, NAC may not work for you.
I take ALA but about an hour later I take chlorella and that combination has been working for me. Again we are all different with different dysfunction in our bodies.
If I forget about the chlorella after ALA, I usually get a headache which quickly subsides when I take chlorella.
Just my experience.
Posts: 590 | From Canada | Registered: Oct 2007
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posted
Chlorella gives me the same bad effects ALA does, I do not know why but many mercury toxic people report the same reaction. Chlorella is a BINDER but does not a CHELATOR. If you have mercury load, chlorella can damage you--period.
I would put chlorella in the same category as ALA, i.e. something I cannot and will never touc for this reason.
Mercury toxic people need to really research these things and be careful because what works for Lyme can mess you up in all the wrong ways.
Lyme patients don't need bad mercury redistribution to further their problems.
Google: Cutler protocol.
DMSA is my happy pill and is the only thing I will use to remove mercury. 12.5 mg every 3 hours for 3 days here and there. I feel amazing after a round of that. -Nothing- else gives me the feelings I get from DMSA rounds except maybe a benzo. ALA and chlorella have me running for my gun to end the misery.
be careful guys.
Posts: 501 | From Cleveland Ohio | Registered: Apr 2009
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posted
Well, again different physiology, allergies? etc. DMSA made me feel very sick! From my experience I would never take it again.
My body loves chlorella, I feel so much better within minutes of taking it.
There is no blanket recommendation that works for everyone. I've learned not to expect someone else's treatment protocol to work for me.
It's always good to see the different reactions people have in order to get the full picture.
I was diagnosed with Mercury allergy and ALA & Chlorella are helping me.
Personally I wouldn't tell anyone else to depend on my supplements helping them though. I have no way of knowing how their bodies will react.
Posts: 590 | From Canada | Registered: Oct 2007
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