posted
I am in my early forties and have noticed my libido is waning lately. I also have increased fat in my belly area, hips and buttocks. I am in fairly good shape and have good muscle tone overall, can now work out again without suffering post workout fatigue. Still have some bad days here and there, mostly neuro stuff.
How many men out there have low testosterone? Mine was recently tested at 258.5 which is on the low end (241-850).
I was curious how many lymies have it and what I can do with my LLMD to treat it. Herbs? Natural ways to up testosterone?
Would appreciated any input!
Thanks!
Posts: 770 | From USA | Registered: Jul 2006
| IP: Logged |
posted
bump
Posts: 770 | From USA | Registered: Jul 2006
| IP: Logged |
Pinelady
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 18524
posted
I know a fella who does the shots.
He says it makes him feel sooo much better.
He does not have Lyme but is borderline diabetic
and when his Tes. level gets low his sugar go's
high. He feels bad and has to go for shot. I told
him he needed to see a great endo for this and
maybe find the cause but he still believes as
long as he gets better with the shot he is ok.
-------------------- Suspected Lyme 07 Test neg One band migrating in IgG region unable to identify.Igenex Jan.09IFA titer 1:40 IND IgM neg pos 31 +++ 34 IND 39 IND 41 IND 83-93 + DX:Neuroborreliosis Posts: 5850 | From Kentucky | Registered: Dec 2008
| IP: Logged |
gwb
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 7273
posted
My testosterone is off the charts low. I have been taking Androgel for about two months now. It's a gel that you rub on your shoulders, thighs and abdomen. I've noticed a very slight improvement since taking it but not much. Is this something I shouldn't be taking with lyme disease?
Posts: 1349 | From OK | Registered: May 2005
| IP: Logged |
posted
My husband also applied Androgel for a while; noticed some improvement at first, but that waned. It was prescribed by PCP, but LLMD did not object.
LLMD has mentioned a supplement called Testoplex, that is made by Xymogen. Perhaps ask your LLMD about that?
Best, Viva
Posts: 532 | From southeast US | Registered: Oct 2005
| IP: Logged |
Lymeorsomething
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 16359
posted
First, establish if your levels are due to primary hypogonadism or secondary hypogonadism (primary--testes have diminished T production; secondary--pituitary has a weak LH/FSH signal).
Test your LH/FSH levels if you haven't already. If your T is low and your LH is low too then you are most likely secondary. If your LH is high then your T is probably low due to poor functioning testes.
Also! Before adding any sex hormones make sure thyroid and adrenals are OK. Hypothyroidism can lower T somewhat.
If you're ultimately secondary, you can try a Clomid challenge (increases LH via estrogen blocking)to see if your testes adequately respond to the spike in LH.
If you're primary, try T shots (preferably twice a week or more to keep levels stable).
Gels are real messy and may cause a bigger spike in DHT.
If you're secondary, try HCG (probably through an anti-aging MD). Sub-Q shots are a breeze! (Note: you can do T shots sub-Q as well).
You may have to add an aromatase-inhibitor at some point as you don't want estrogen going too high.
It seems complicated but it really isn't (very)...
You'll want to check your IGF-1 levels too. Lyme really took a toll on this for me. Adding T will raise IGF-1. However, if your IGF levels are in the basement, you may want to just run GH solo which may help T levels somewhat too. GH is more expensive though.
FIRST, you'll probably want to optimize sleep and health and see if that improves your T levels naturally... (this may not work if lyme is still active)
My LLMD says low T is somewhat common with male Lymies.
-------------------- "Whatever can go wrong will go wrong." Posts: 2062 | From CT | Registered: Jul 2008
| IP: Logged |
David95928
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 3521
posted
This topic keeps coming up. It seems like many (if not most) male lymies have low T, from teenagers to codgers! Untreated, my level is in the low 200s. My urologist thinks that the Lyme has affected my pituitary gland. Antibiotic treatment has not cause a reversal of this effect.
Low T is a very real health risk, particularly mental health, cognition, cardiac health, and bone density. There are basically two treatment approaches. They are to either add T or to try to stimulate its endogenous production.
As far as adding T goes, options include topical gels and patches and injections. Gels work well for some but not others. In addition, it is critically important to avoid the gel getting on others either through direct contact or, perhaps, even a towel. Gels can also cause hair growth at the location where it is applied. In my opinion, patches are not a viable option due to being conspicuous and causing rashes.
In the U.S., the current injection options are testosterone cypionate or testosterone enthanate. They work about the same. They both are in oil and are absorbed gradually. Some physicians try to limit dosing to every two weeks or three. However, they are mostly excreted within a week and lower dosing on a weekly basis maintains more stable levels. They are given IM, usually in the butt or thigh.
It is anticiapted that within the next year a very long-acting testoterone injection called Nebido will be approved by the FDA. It's been in use in Europe and Australia for quite some time and seems to work well. After the first dose, another is given in six weeks. After that it usually is only needed every ten to twelve weeks.
Stimulating endogenous production can sometime be accomplished with the fertility drugs Clomid and Corionic Gonadotropin. Clomid is taken orally and works for some. Chorionic Gonadotropin is probabaly more reliable but must be injected either IM or SubQ several times a week.
Hope this helps.
-------------------- Dave Posts: 2034 | From CA | Registered: Jan 2003
| IP: Logged |
Lymeorsomething
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 16359
posted
Yeah, David is right. Lyme most likely upsets normal pituitary gland response. I'm going to guess that you're secondary but you'll want to run the appropriate tests to make sure...
Just make sure your thyroid is up and running...
-------------------- "Whatever can go wrong will go wrong." Posts: 2062 | From CT | Registered: Jul 2008
| IP: Logged |
posted
Mine testosterone level was at 145 and i'm 26 years old!!! I think this means I'm a 9 year old boy again. My cortisol and DHEA is low too and I'm taking both of those but not the testosterone. My doctor had his reasons for not adding in testosterone but I can't remember exactly. I think he said it'll make it harder for my system to adjust later once we get rid of the lyme, but cortisol and DHEA are more important because they'll actually affect immune function if they aren't balanced. It was something like that...
Posts: 499 | From Indiana | Registered: Oct 2007
| IP: Logged |
posted
My testosterone is low also. 39 years old here and the low T didn't start until I got Lyme. My T was measured as low and then it came back into range and now I'm sure it's low again.
The gels unnerve since one of the side effects is a higher risk of prostate cancer.
Posts: 194 | From Colorado | Registered: Nov 2008
| IP: Logged |
lpkayak
Honored Contributor (10K+ posts)
Member # 5230
posted
buhner who wrote the lyme book also wrote a book on testosterone. it helped my brother a lot. it is as well researched and written as the lyme book.
i don't understand it all...but my brother says there are problems if you take the testosterone prescriptions...either your body stops making it or something
also-i have read-i think in the potbelly syndrome book-that belly fat turns testosterone to estrogen -or something... it said it "turns men into women" but i'm sure it didn't really mean that
-------------------- Lyme? Its complicated. Educate yourself. Posts: 13712 | From new england | Registered: Feb 2004
| IP: Logged |
Lymeorsomething
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 16359
posted
Yes, taking T will suppress the body's own production of T but this doesn't really matter if you're primary. However, using HCG if you're secondary will help the body produce its own T.
Supposedly, if lyme treatment is successful and the HPA is restored, one can ween off supplemental T and the body will resume normal production. This may take longer though after one has been adding outside T...
-------------------- "Whatever can go wrong will go wrong." Posts: 2062 | From CT | Registered: Jul 2008
| IP: Logged |
losferwrds
Unregistered
posted
I have a friend that went on Androgel
Within a month his T went from 190, to over 800.
Its powerful stuff, but don't know much about the pros and cons of that approach to supplimentation.
He doesn't have lyme, and went to a doc that chose to treat the symptom without doing any testing to find out why. At 45 it certainly could be andropause though.
I had my LLMD check mine, I am waiting for test results
IP: Logged |
posted
Thanks for all of the comments. I will look into this with my LLMD.
Posts: 770 | From USA | Registered: Jul 2006
| IP: Logged |
Lymeorsomething
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 16359
posted
Good luck, Myco. Keep in mind that not all LLMDs are savvy enough to deal with the hormonal issues you may have so ultimately you may have to bring a good anti-aging MD on board (or an open-minded endocrinologist).
Most endocrinologists will just push T on you even if you're secondary...not good...because it will shrink your jewels...
It's important to tailor treatment to match your specific issues...
Best...
-------------------- "Whatever can go wrong will go wrong." Posts: 2062 | From CT | Registered: Jul 2008
| IP: Logged |
David95928
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 3521
posted
A urologist who specializes in male fertility issues might also be a good bet. I know one in SF but he does not take insurance.
-------------------- Dave Posts: 2034 | From CA | Registered: Jan 2003
| IP: Logged |
The Lyme Disease Network is a non-profit organization funded by individual donations. If you would like to support the Network and the LymeNet system of Web services, please send your donations to:
The
Lyme Disease Network of New Jersey 907 Pebble Creek Court,
Pennington,
NJ08534USA http://www.lymenet.org/
UBBFriend: Email this page to someone!
Printer-friendly view of this topic