posted
Dear kareamber, An overgrowth of Candida can cause herxes as well. A Jarisch-Herxheimer reaction is mentioned in a number of books about Candida. This yeast is notorious for being stubborn to destroy. I have a massive overgrowth of it, so I herx from even a slight amount of die-off. The only time herx appears to be used much is to describe Lyme and Candida. It likely could be used with any bacterial infection, though.
posted
The Herx was discovered in Syphylis treatment. Syphylis is a spirokete like lyme. I don't see how it relates to other bacterial die off cause if that was true everyone with sinus infection or sore throat would herx too.
My LLMD said there is no such think as Bart or Babs herx yet many people on the board will contest that.
Yeast is fungus and toxic in own rights, I would think treating it would only make you feel better, but luckly I have not experienced any problems with that yet, so I don't know if there is reaction to killing it. But Jin seems to have reaction so she would prolly know best.
I guess in the broadest of terms just about anything can be called herx cause current treatments seems to get people very toxic, it may be more from impaired liver and kidney fuctioning and ABX side effects than actual bacterial die off...
If a treatment is working in make sense that you would get a herx followed by some relief once your body catches up and the bacterial load is reduced, but based on what some people post some seem to never catch up
In the text book sense: When the spiroketes die they release toxins, the toxins cause the reaction, I don't even think they are 100% sure if it the immune system response to the toxins or toxins themselves that cause the issues
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TerryK
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I should preface this by saying that I'm not positive but from what I've read, I doubt that M.D.'s are taught in medical school that other bacterial infections besides syphilis can cause a JH reaction.
I believe there are many bacterial infections that can cause JH reactions.
This document lists the following (many are spirochetal): http://www.arthritistrust.org/Articles/The%20Herxheimer%20Effect.pdf Yaws Vincent's angina Relapsing fever Rat bite fever Leprosy Glanders Anthrax Brucellosis Glanders Rheumatoid Disease Lupus Scleroderma Psoriasis
Although not a bacterial infection, some doctors think that babesia produces a toxin that is similar to borrelia's toxin.
"Our research also suggested that toxins from tick-borne pathogens such as Borrelia burgdorferi (Lyme disease organism) and Babesia microti may cause chronic illness even after the spirochetes or intracellular protozoa (also called apicomplexans) have been killed by antibiotics."
Treating the Jarisch-Herxheimer(JH) Flare Reaction
Stuart L. Weg, M.D. is certified by the American Board of Anesthesiology with added qualifications in pain management.
"The observed temporary worsening of clinical status in patients undergoing anti-infective treatment is called the Jarisch-Herxheimer (JH) reaction. It may be referred to by some of the terms listed below. This phenomenon, described in the cover article, is not just present in rheumatologic disease but is common to all forms of anti-infective therapies that I have used for most chronic painful states."
I think whether a person has a JH like reaction may depend on the ability of the person's immune system to handle a specific toxin. Those who have trouble getting rid of the toxin will have symptoms.
Terry I'm not a doctor
Posts: 6286 | From Oregon | Registered: Jan 2006
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TerryK
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Member # 8552
posted
: Protein Eng Des Sel. 2009 May;22(5):305-12. Epub 2009 Mar 18.
Humanized-monoclonal antibody against heterologous Leptospira infection.
Maneewatch S, Sakolvaree Y, Tapchaisri P, Saengjaruk P, Songserm T, Wongratanachewin S, Tongtawe P, Srimanote P, Chaisri U, Chaicumpa W.
Graduate Program, Faculty of Allied Health Sciences, Thammasat University, Rangsit Center, Pathum-thani 12120, Thailand.
Patients with leptospirosis are commonly treated with antibiotics. Jarisch-Herxheimer reaction caused by toxic bacterial substances massively released as a result of the antibiotic mediated-bacterial lysis occurs in some patients which may aggravate the existing severe clinical manifestations.
In this study, a humanized-murine single-chain monoclonal antibody (HuScFv) was produced and tested as an alternative of antibiotics for treatment of leptospirosis.
Complementary DNA was prepared from total RNA of a murine hybridoma clone secreting monoclonal antibody (MAb) specific to LipL32 of pathogenic Leptospira spp. The MAb had therapeutic efficacy in Leptospira challenged hamsters.
The VH and VL coding sequences were amplified using the cDNA as a template. The sequences were linked to form a single-chain variable murine DNA fragment (muscFv). CDR sequences of the muscFv were grafted onto the best matching human VH and VL immunoglobulin frameworks.
After cloning of the humanized murine DNA sequences (huscFv) into a phagemid vector and the vector was introduced into competent Escherichia coli, the HuScFv was produced. On the same weight basis, the HuScFv possessed equal neutralizing activities to the murine ScFv counterpart against heterologous Leptospira-mediated hemolysis in vitro and rescued hamsters from a heterologous Leptospira lethal challenge.
The HuScFv antibody has high therapeutic potential as an alternative to antibiotics for human leptospirosis, especially for drug hypersensitive patients.
PMID: 19297536 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
: Cases J. 2008 Nov 29;1(1):360.
Recurrent Jarisch-Herxheimer reaction in a patient with Q fever pneumonia: a case report.
Aloizos S, Gourgiotis S, Oikonomou K, Stakia P. Second Surgical Department, 401 General Army Hospital of Athens, 41 Zakinthinou Street, 15669, Papagou, Athens, Greece. [email protected].
ABSTRACT: Q fever is a zoonotic disease caused by coxiella burnetii. The Jarisch-Herxheimer reaction (JHR) is associated with the antibiotic treatment of certain bacterial infections. We report a very rare case of a 36-year-old male with Q fever pneumonia that resulted in recurrent ARDS and presented the JHR during his treatment.
The patient was admitted for treatment of community acquired pneumonia. He developed ARDS, was intubated and placed on mechanical ventilation.
Doxycycline was empirically added to his antibiotic regiment. The patient presented an acute rise in temperature, tachycardia, tachypnea, hypoxia, hypotension and a temporary deterioration of his chest x-ray.
The same 6-hour-long reaction which is known as JHR was presented another 3 times. Cultures were negative but antibodies against coxiella burnetii were positive.
This case reminds us that any deterioration of a patient treated in the ICU should not be considered as a new septic episode and time should be allowed for the antibiotic regiments.
PMID: 19040755 [PubMed - in process] PMCID: PMC2621130
Eye. 2009 Jun;23(6):1472-3. Epub 2008 Jul 4.
Jarisch-Herxheimer reaction: paradoxical worsening of tuberculosis chorioretinitis following initiation of antituberculous therapy.
Cheung CM, Chee SP. PMID: 18600241 [PubMed - in process]
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