posted
I have been on Doxi for 4 weeks, then Ceftin for 2 weeks. I discovered that due to the Nexium I need to take the Ceftin is not absorbed all the way into my system.
My Dr. has switch me to Flagyl 1/4 tablet for a few days then move up to 1/2 then so on until I get to the 250mg per day he want me to take.
I was supposed to take zithro next but I'm going directly to flagyl? Not sure why have only been on abx for 8 weeks total?
DOes this sound like anyone else treatment?
What has been your Flagyl experience?
I really haven't had much improvment other than my weakness and fatigue seems to have gotten better, (not much stamina still) but anxiety has gotten worse while on abx.
I started L-tryptophan experimental dosing to see how it would affect my anxiety and it really did work. ( I take Xanax but don't want to anymore) maybe this will get me off of it...WIll continue with that therapy and add l-tyrosine w/msm. Has anyone tried this therapy for mood replacement therapy?
sutherngrl
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 16270
posted
I started treatment my first month with Flagyl and Zith. Then went to just Zith for a few months.
I don't think there can be a set standard of who takes what, when. Your LLMD will prescribe what he feels is best for you at the time and for your situation. Everyone's treatment should be diffferent since we are all different.
Not sure about the absorption thing. I am on Prilosec and was told it was okay as long as it wasn't taken within a few hours of the Doxy, and I guess any antibiotic. Nexium is not an antacid so shouldn't be a problem as far as I know. I am sure there are others that take Nexium, Prilosec or Previcid, etc.
I didn't notice improvement in any form or fashion until 1 year of treatment, and that was slight. So just hang in there. 8 weeks is not very long.
As far as anxiety, I take Xanax and it helps. My anxiety has gotten somewhat better during treatment. I have not tried L-tryptophan.
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Abxnomore
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 18936
posted
So as I understand it you are now only on flagyl?
If so, I would recommend tindamax as it is easier to tolerate for most and does the same thing. Flagyl can be a difficult med to handle. Tindamax is not picnic but somewhat easier by most people's accounts.
Also, if you are only on flagyl, which is a cyst buster, you need to be on another ABX, probably two.
Amox and zithro would work well with either flagyl or tindamax. It is good to start off flagyl slowly but if you are only on flagyl I don't think that is a good protocol.
I think the amino acids you are on are a good way to go as long as you are responding to them well.
Posts: 5191 | From Lyme Zone | Registered: Jan 2009
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Cindy Ss
Unregistered
posted
I don't know why but the nurse called me after some confushion with the way the ceftin was set up after a call from me to understnad what I'm supposed to be taking.
She talked to Dr. about my symptoms and the nexium/ceftin. She called back and said to begin the FLagyl. I'm not going to start it until after my phone consult with him on Thursday, I still have lots of quesitons such as the ones you are asking me...
It is hard to live 4 hours away from Dr. and hav open communication with him. I don't know if I'm supposed to take another abx with it or not maybe it would be on my prscription when I get it but I think I understand it to just be Flagyl.
Very cofusing based on all of your experiences. Maybe due to my anxiety he thinks it will attack it better? I just keep getting more and more confused with this.
I really liked the L-tryptophan though, it really balanc4ed out my mood and helped me sleep better but I still woke up before the crack of dawn. I think if i could get better sleep I would feel much better during the day.
I tske Xanax but it wasn't helping at the low dose so the dose was upped to .50 from my local MD. It did help a little better but the L-tryptophan just made my mood feel less tense and anxious and not as groggy as Xanax. I know Xanax can be habit forming and I have been on it since April. WOuld like to get off ot it.
My primary was trying to get me to begin Cymbalta, but I thought I would try the natural supplements first before adding another drug I may have trouble with. I dont' feel depressed more worried about this disease. And the anxiety/panic I have is unpredictable and just comes on for no know reason. More noticeable as the Xanas is wearing off. SO much meds...
DIdn't want the withdrawal problems. I didn't need any anxiety meds before Lyme and I hope when Lyme is better for me I can do with out them.
I'll probably put new post after I get Info my my LLMD. I know we are all different as well as treatment and LLMD variing treatments. ITs nice to be able to compare here and learn from everyone.
Abxnomore
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 18936
posted
There is a lot to learn and we learn it along the way. Most doctors are not so good at the fine details.
In general, but there are always exceptions, herbs, amino acids and minerals are taken on an empty stomach. Everything else with food and probiotics about a half hour after a meal but some doc's say on an empty stomach.
Meds should be taken alone with at least an hour gap before supplements. Supplements should be taken alone.
Any thing that kills pathogens, ABX, olive leaf extract, grapefruit seed extract, oil of oregano, etc. must be taken at least three hours away form ABX as it will kill the probiotics.
L-tryptophan helps your body produce serotonin levels natually, the same thing that SSRI's do, except SSRI's recycle what you body has. You are better off with his protocol if it is working for you. Tyosine will give you energy and help support thyroid and adrenal function.
I would wait until you hear from your doctor but taking flagyl alone is not a smart protocol. Plus tell him you really want to try tindamax which is much easier to tolerate and does the same thing. You should try to get two ABX that that work well together, plus a cyst buster.
If he gives you a problem about the tindamax go to pubmed.com and type in Brorson AND Tinidazole + Cysts and it will pull up a medical abstact showing that it kills cysts. They use Tinidazole which is the European equivalent of Tindamax.
FAX it to him. He can't argue with science.
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WildCondor
Unregistered
posted
Why are you on those tiny and ridiculously low doses of Flagyl? Flagyl is best when combined with other antibiotics and the dose is usually 500 mg 4x per day and used in pulse therapy.
I took it many times, while on IV and orals. Ceftin was 3,000 mg/day and Biaxin 2,000 mg per day, also Bicillin LA 3x per week and pulsed FLagyl with that. Take as much xanax as you need to get through the herxes, the anxiety will go away once you treat the Lyme and co-infections properly.
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Cindy Ss
Unregistered
posted
You know I think the problem is communication with his nurse. She is so blunt and seems like she doesn't want to be on the phone long. She only stated Dr wants you to start Flagl, I said Flagyl? she said yes. I said aren't there lots of scarey side effects with it and she said yes if your going to herx it will probably be on flagyl.
She said take 1/4 dose at a time for a few days until get to full effect. I asked a few more quesstions and I seemed to be dismissed.
I don't think she hs a very good bedside manner...
DO you think they monitor this site?
Anyway, I am reading Dr. C initial guidlines and he does mention taking flagyl with other abx.
This nurse I think messed up the way I was supposed to take the Ceftin. On the sheet she typed up that went to pharmacy it said to take one week ceftin then one week doxi, when I called to question (same yes or no nurse) said no it is ceftin only. I told her that is not what it says on my pres bottle or the paper I turned it.
So maybe Doc meant to take with zithro but she just didn't communicate with me. If he has something different to say to me with my phone consult on Thursday I'm going to let him know about her.
Better watch out they could be marriedL)
That is how I have been taking vitamins about 1 hour away from abx.
Thanks you for your info it is very helpful to me.
The Ceftin/Nexium interaction was never addressed with the nurse that called me, which I would of like to know!
posted
Also maybe he uses Flagyl because if is very inexpensive? I don't care about that my insurance has been covering most abx. If it is better and less side effects I will mention the tindamax and see what happens.
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The drug interaction between Ceftin and Nexxium is very interesting. I looked it up in a PDR (rxlist.com). I'm on Prevacid (similar to Nexxium), so your post alarmed me.
However, Omnicef, a newer version of Ceftin does not have the same drug interaction according to the same source.
The only interaction listed for Omnicef is with Maalox type antacids. Maybe you should look into switching to Omnicef.
I am on Omnicef AND azithromycin. According to my LLMD the cyst buster is best added MUCH later in the treatment. Besides, the cyst buster needs to be given with the other abx, not alone.
Are you seeing a LLMD?
I went on Tindamax after 10 months (at my request). I wanted Flagyl but he doesn't like the side-effects. (I was on Flagyl 15 years ago for "giardia" (it was almost certainly lyme though) with no side-effects).
My brother's LLMD added Flagyl and he's had no problems and has had amazing improvement in the last 5 months.
For anxiety maybe try Klonipin (clonzepam). It lasts much longer than Xanax, and is less addicting.
L-Tryptophan was a big scandal in the 80s when it was discovered that high dosages caused organ problems (either liver or kidney, I forget). Stick to the real drugs.
Good luck,
James
Posts: 872 | From New York City | Registered: Jun 2008
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posted
I was on Flagyl but had to go off of it after two weeks.
I had unbelievable side effects (terrible, horrific nightmares and nausea/vomiting daily) and felt "off" like I was losing my mind (difficult to explain).
My liver enzymes went off for the first time ever too, while on Flagyl and they took over two months to get back to normal.
Personally, I would never take Flagyl again.
Posts: 366 | From MA | Registered: Apr 2006
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seekhelp
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 15067
posted
Flagyl certainly seems to be a love it or hate it med. No in between. This idea to use only Flagyl just makes no sense to me at all no matter how much I research it.
Posts: 7545 | From The 5th Dimension - The Twilight Zone | Registered: Mar 2008
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Cindy Ss
Unregistered
posted
Yes that is what I will bring up when I have my phone call with him. Why Flagyl so soon, and with a combo? I did find that the other form of Flagyl is expensive and most pharmacies don't stock it so it has to be ordered, I don't mind that either.
I read about the scandal with L-tryptophan, from Japanese plant it was toxic. I can't find any other negative info on it other than that.
I was having the same type issues before I decided to just try the L-tryptophan. I have Cymbalta sitting here but am really not wanting to go that route.
I think I only need temporary relief and this drug scares me more than the l-tryptophan...
What abx are you taking seekhelp? (you probably noted somewhere, but I forgot). Is it helping you at all? I know you have been ill longer than I have...
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Cindy Ss
Unregistered
posted
Alliebridge what was your dosage? Did you start out small and work your way up to needed dose?
Abxnomore
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 18936
posted
The essential question is not why so soon, many LLMD's use it early on, but why alone. If it is used to break open the cyst form to revert back to
spiral form typically two different ABX's are used to attack and kill the newly released spirochete. It's readily stocked in areas where there are many LLMD's and it can be compounded to as Tinidazole from a compounding pharmacy.
Regarding the scandal with L-tryptophan, it was one batch of tainted tryptophan that caused it to be banned. Many doctors in the alternative world believe that the drug companies were behind it, as it happened shortly before, I believe it was Prozac, hit the market.
L tryptophan competed with it, so they tried to taint its image and succeeded in having it removed from the market until the molecular structure of it was changed slightly and it was reintroduced to the market as 5HTP. They are essentially the same.
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Cindy Ss
Unregistered
posted
Yes abxnomore (does that mean you are no longer on abx:)
I'm not entirely sure that he wants me to take it alone, based on this pareticular nurse has made an error with translation with me before. I will clear it up with questions when I talk to the Dr. personaly.
I see he has an entire section devoted to this in the handout that was different than the initial prscription and my personal handout says.
I'll make sure I ask him about the kill off and what would be there to kill it when it converts.
I'm hoping for good things with the L-tryptophan so I can stay away from the prescription drugs, they sometimes scare me more than the supplements that can sometimes provide the same relief.
So far since yesterday the L-tryptophan has helped my anxiety more than the Xanax and I'm not loopy. I'm going to continue to take it ad add the other product that my Dr. says to take along with it and see how my mood goes.
I hope things are progressing with you and your recovery because I often forget who I have spoken with or corresponded with in posts:)
Abxnomore
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 18936
posted
Yes, no more ABX.
If you can go the supplement route, do so. You are putting amino acids in your body, what naturally occurs in the body. Lyme really messes with our neuro transmitters and amino acids is what helps balance them.
Keep us posted. You'll get this all straightened out and I'm sure you know there isn't a one size fits all with this illness. But just taking
flagyl is really not the norm. It's probably a communication error. I hope you can get the tindamax. It's much easier on the system. You can search on this site about it.
[ 08-11-2009, 06:30 PM: Message edited by: Abxnomore ]
Posts: 5191 | From Lyme Zone | Registered: Jan 2009
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Cindy Ss
Unregistered
posted
Thank you abxnomore.
See I really dont even know wht amino acids are, I know I have read about them in some of my info. I want to take all the supplements I can to beat this besides the abx..
Abxnomore
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 18936
posted
They usually have an L before them such as L arginine, L tyrosine, etc. It takes time to learn this stuff buy you will.
Dr. B's guidelines has a section on supplements but IMO it's not comprehensive enough. There are many more we can benefit from.
Posts: 5191 | From Lyme Zone | Registered: Jan 2009
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posted
FWIW, Flagyl was one of the few abx I ever did NOT herx horribly on. So, you never know. Everyone is different. -s
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