[ 09-18-2009, 04:49 PM: Message edited by: groovy2 ]
Posts: 2999 | From Austin tx USA | Registered: Oct 2004
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Just Julie
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 1119
posted
Jay, I THANK YOU! for posting this. I first thought it might be something like Michael Moore's Sicko movie (which I watched and cried during) but I think the Frontline piece will be something different. I'm starting with it in order, so I will be going back to watch the 2nd half of the UK piece now, I just didn't want to get in the middle of it without saying thank you.
I have a special place in my brain for stuff like this, as I am a nurse, and I spent 20 years managing my mom's medical care (nightmare) from 1982-2003, when she died. She had a mental (chronic) condition, and worked part time for Sears (as a secretary) for the last 25 years of her working life. She had no medical coverage for the first 5 years of her chronic condition, and I spent my mid-late 20's trying to navigate her medical care without insurance coverage, and living 400 miles away from her!
To say I learned my lesson in healthcare would be a bit too tongue-in cheek, but needless to say, I did learn something that I have carried with me to this day (and while trying to navigate the muddy waters of next to NO good coverage for myself and my son's lyme treatment for 4 years!) and that is, I will be leaving the US for Europe to live for the rest of my days, and mostly this decision is due to the healthcare state that the countries I am interested in, have.
The US sucks, and most American's will not, or cannot accept this. No American President will fix this. It is unfixable at this point. I refuse to go bankrupt in my elder years to hopefully achieve a level of care in my later days. I also refuse to put my son's in the position to have to decide ANYTHING monetarily concerning my possible healthcare in my later days. If I have anything to do with it!!! Which, if I can get my act together in the next 2 years, I will have EVERYTHING to do with it.
I depend on no hopes for the future in this country. No depending on any one human who is elected president, to change this mess around, the boat is sinking, the train has left the station.
But, thanks for the Frontline link---it could help those skeptics (or rich people) who think that they will be able to pay for their healthcare in the years to come. Unless you're Bill Gates, I think it's highly unlikely.
-------------------- Julie Posts: 1027 | From Northern CA | Registered: May 2001
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bettyg
Unregistered
posted
jay,
is this something you can LISTEN to without visually watching it too?
i do better that way where i can read/look at messages here but still listen. thx my friend!
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groovy2
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posted
Hi Betty
Yep you can just listen to it - you will still get 100% out of it-
The reporter is T R Reid - he has been around forever and he is Very Good -
I want to make clear the PBS show is Not a political show at all-
Both people running for president now say the US health care system is broken and say they are going to try to Fix it -
It just shows how 5 other countries health care systems work - just facts- No BS or fluff -
I promise you that it will be the best hour you have ever spent getting informed on the medical systems -
Like is said I am asking Everyone to watch this as a favor to me and to you- our country and our kids -
Thanks --Jay--
Posts: 2999 | From Austin tx USA | Registered: Oct 2004
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lymielauren28
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Will do! Thanks Groovy!
Lauren
-------------------- "The only way out is through" Posts: 1434 | From mississippi | Registered: Nov 2007
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lymielauren28
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
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posted
Will do! Thanks Groovy!
Lauren
-------------------- "The only way out is through" Posts: 1434 | From mississippi | Registered: Nov 2007
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posted
I saw this a while back on the tube when it was aired by pbs, and agree that it is very very good. Having seen it, I am discouraged that neither political party in the U.S. is prepared to fix the situation. Hilary tried and is still being blasted for it. And people keep yapping about socialized medicine. Well, does anyone think that insurance company domination of all things is producing a good system? Maybe if you just pay into the system and never ask it for anything, do not get sick.....then you might think it works.
Between big pharma and big insurance, we are just pawns. Unregulated capitalism leads to this. You saw what happened to unregulated power companies, this happens in all unregulated industries. Greed and fraud take over.
But when the medical system gets it wrong, they all get it wrong. Capitalism has failed to help lymies, and so have the countries that have universal health care. This was probably true with many other health problems over the years. Or maybe it comes from U.S. domination of the world, the way that influences other countries who ought to be charting their own course.
Anyway, I will climb down from the soapbox and agree with groovy that watching this video is time well spent.
Posts: 8430 | From Not available | Registered: Oct 2000
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posted
I will definitely watch. I've been interested in our health care system since my mom was very sick with Hep C from a blood transfusion when she had my brother Sean and then my parents got divorced (my dad just quit working - ended up in jail ) and my mom had no health care.
But she was so sick. No where to turn. She tried to work at Arby's bless her heart, which made me sad to see because that just wasn't "us", it wasn't like "our family". She used to home school us and when she wasn't doing that she worked in a day care.
She couldn't even work full time. When she tried, and trust me, my mom is STRONG and not a whiner like me and she couldn't even hold a pot of coffee at work, one day her arm just gave out and she dropped it all over herself.
That's when she knew she was in big trouble. I immediately joined the military to put her on as a dependent of me so that she could have health care. That was the only way to support both of us.
She fought the disability system for 3 years. We fought hard. I wrote very long HEARTFELT letters to our senator. And he actually called me in the end to let me know that her SSI got approved...before the SSI ppl even told us.
But we had to fight and fight hard. I felt like my mom contributed to society and should never have been treated the way she was by society.
That's what made me change my opinions on politics and her's as well. That's all I will say.
This country needs to change. We have to take care of our sick and our poor.
-------------------- "~*~My smile hides my bite~*~." Posts: 506 | From N/A | Registered: Jun 2008
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kam
Honored Contributor (10K+ posts)
Member # 3410
posted
JAY,
THANKS FOR THE WEB SITE. I LIKE THE FACT THAT I CAN WATCH IT IN SEGMENTS.
AND GENEAL....I DID CLOSE MY EYES AND JUST LISTEN.
IT WAS TOO MUCH FOR ME TO WATCH AND LISTEN THIS AM.
THINKING WHOEVER BECOMES PRESIDENT NEEDS TO CALL THIS GUY IN AND GET HIM ON BOARD WITH CHANGE IN OUR HEALTH CARE SYSTEM.
Posts: 15927 | From Became too sick to work or do household chores in 2001. | Registered: Dec 2002
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thanks for posting this. This always amazes me to see things like this.
How can our very own country have such deplorable health care????
Your right, it should not be a political discussion and yet, we must choose the side that can offer change that we can believe in this November. Change that will really make a difference.
Health care is one of the most important issues on the docket for the upcoming election. I think we all need to really use our votes wisely.
Too many Lyme victims can't get the proper treatment they need. It's a crying shame and must be stopped.
-------------------- aka: Lyme Warrior
In order to do "real" science, you have to have a "real" conversation with nature.
Well Behaved Women Rarely Make History!
"Just Demand your Rights" Posts: 869 | From nor - cal | Registered: Apr 2008
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Brussels
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 13480
posted
The documentary was interesting! Thanks Jay. I still haven't seen the Taiwan part but saw the others.
OK, I live in Switzerland for the last 7 years, and lived in Japan for about 7 years. And in Brazil for many years, that copied the US health system.
If you get sick in Brazil and go only with the public health system, you can really die. Quality is usually awful (with exceptions, of course). But if you have paid private insurance, your chances of getting good care are good.
The bills can go very high too, but not to the astrononmic amounts I keep hearing from the States. I dislike the system there because it is very unequal and if you get no job for any reason, you're in big trouble.
In Japan, it's a special system indeed. It costs very little. I never went to a pharmacy to buy any meds, we buy the meds in the hospital for a fraction of the price (most are done locally in the hospital and are all covered).
I don't remember making any appointment to go see a doctor there (I just drop by a hospital and get treatment).
Dentists are fully covered in Japan, we pay about 10% of a fixed governmental price for a treatment, which is really low compared to anywhere else I lived.
In Switzerland, we also pay about 10% of the costs after the franchise amount is reached, if until then, it's 100%. People that often go to the doctors pay higher insurance monthly than people that don't go.
When I was very sick with lyme, I lowered my franchise, and most of my bills were then covered by 90% (I paid only 10%) which was reasonable.
But there is STILL a problem with lyme disease diagnostic all over the world. It has nothing to do with the health system. If a patient gets no diagnose (like myself), it doesn't matter where we are (Brazil, Switzerland,Belgium or Japan).
No diagnosis = no coverage. We pay our own expenses then to 100%.
Of course, if I had gotten a problem with heart valves, extreme swelling due to arthritis and so on, I would have these treatments covered.
But I didn't wait until I got so bad and went on treating lyme, SO , I had to pay many bills 100%, specially because I went 'abroad' to get treated (this is not covered unless we were on vacations or so).
There were though ways to somehow play with the system that I can't clarify in a public forum, that's why I got 90% of the consultation costs paid by the insurance (because there are doctors willing to help, because they know lyme is controversial and will teach us how to 'swim around' in the health insurance system).
In Belgium, I could also swim if I was living with lyme there, because I found cooperative doctors (I know now a couple of them). It means, the insurance would have covered great part of the medical costs there too, but without a formal lyme diagnosis.
I once got to emergency while I was travelling in Belgium, and everything was covered, ambulance costs, absolutely everything. And I even got some pocket money from my insurance in Switzerland, which surprised me (as though to cover expenses like taxi, food, whatever, during the short hospitalization). I even didn't have to pay the 10% because it was concidered like an accident.
Same as for pregnancy, it cost zero here. Nothing for the cesarean, nothing for ultrasounds, nothing. I saw the bill, the insurance paid 100%. I stayed 9 days in the hospital and paid zero.
And I only pay basic monthly insurance!
In Belgium, I got all my 4 wisdom teeth off in a hospital and spent one night there. It cost me so little (about 10-15 dollars) that it sounds ridiculous. Of course, taxes are higher.
From all these countries I lived, the worst health system so far is Brazil, that copied the US system. My father retired there as an engineer and his monthly pay check can't cover even the monthly private health insurance for him and my mom.
The older they get, they have to pay more for health insurance, which is absurd. He starts his month with about 100 dollars NEGATIVE then, just to pay his monthly bill of the insurance company.
He still pays taxes, has to eat, pays house expenses like everyone else. Everything then is taken from his economies. They do go often to see doctors, and they have to buy medicine that usually are not covered, so they pay many 100% of their price. I hate this private health system there.
If you are rich, it's fine there in Brazil, pretty fine really. If you are middle class, it's NOT fine. If you're poor, you don't even exist.
You can be in denied to be accepted by an insurance company, or pay very high monthly bills the more sick you are. Sounds familiar to you guys in the States?
This is inhumane.
My opinion, of course, Selma
Posts: 6199 | From Brussels | Registered: Oct 2007
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It is amazing to see how health is treated around the world.
I can't believe anyone in this day and age would argue that it's humane to treat humans so poorly.
Hopefully people will follow their hearts on this one.
thanks for sharing all your health care information.
-------------------- aka: Lyme Warrior
In order to do "real" science, you have to have a "real" conversation with nature.
Well Behaved Women Rarely Make History!
"Just Demand your Rights" Posts: 869 | From nor - cal | Registered: Apr 2008
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groovy2
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posted
bump
Posts: 2999 | From Austin tx USA | Registered: Oct 2004
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tdtid
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posted
I too had seen this awhile back and have to admit that when I was first given the link, I was a bit skeptical as to what the agenda was going to be.
But I have to admit that I was glued to it from beginning to end.
Definitley an intersting and informative link. Thanks for sharing.
Cathy
-------------------- "To Dream The Impossible Dream" Man of La Mancha Posts: 2638 | From New Hampshire | Registered: Oct 2006
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groovy2
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bump
Posts: 2999 | From Austin tx USA | Registered: Oct 2004
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groovy2
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Bump UP
Posts: 2999 | From Austin tx USA | Registered: Oct 2004
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groovy2
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Ashamed we are rated 57th in the world being supposed 1st world country.... I also ashamed to say was on the other side one time. Give me brake for spoke up too many times to Dr. needless to say did not make me popular. Was not working at hospital for popularity, except from my patients. I have been through sooo much alone. Sicker than ever....UGH sigh Huggggssss, to all in need Kerry
Posts: 746 | From Clearwater/fl/Pinellas | Registered: Jun 2003
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![[group hug]](graemlins/grouphug.gif)
![[Frown]](frown.gif)
) and my mom had no health care.![[Smile]](smile.gif)
and she couldn't even hold a pot of coffee at work, one day her arm just gave out and she dropped it all over herself. 
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