"Elimination of Bartonella spp. by antimicrobial drugs in immunocompetent patients may be more difficult to achieve than is currently appreciated ."
" I found the human healthcare system to be frayed, if not broken. Whether blame lies with the insurance companies, our litigious society, the profit-based motivations of hospital administration, the increased complexity of medical technology, or the medical education of physicians, it really does not matter."
Quotes above by Dr. Breitschwerdt from the article above.
posted
Thanks for the link. Read every word. Wow!
Posts: 426 | From Berkeley, CA | Registered: Feb 2009
| IP: Logged |
lpkayak
Honored Contributor (10K+ posts)
Member # 5230
posted
you are educated, have a scientific mind, and were in a position to have tests run that give you a good idea of what happened.
many of us have struggled for years trying to help loved ones and ourselves. often we are unable to get the info you got-factually-altho we strongly suspect microbes because of all we have learned, seen anecdotally and experienced outselves.
but you're right...in the end "it really does not matter."
i esp liked your ending:
"Epilogue Some years ago in a conversation with my mother I suggested that the term natural death may well represent an oversimplification of the processes that end a person's life. My father and our family were substantially affected during his illness. Each day, from initial hospitalization until his death, there was at least 1 family member at his side. In the eyes of family and friends, my father was a great man in so many respects. He was a loving husband, a caring father, diligent worker, and a friend and supporter to many persons. Potentially, his illness illustrates a complex interaction between intravascular Bartonella infection and complex disease expression, provides documentation for an as yet uncharacterized zoonotic rodent Bartonella sp., and offers disconcerting evidence supporting antimicrobial drug ineffectiveness and clinical evidence supporting the concept that persistent infection with >1 Bartonella spp. may lead to immunosuppression and opportunistic infections with organisms such as herpes zoster and C. albicans. As in his life, Dad would want this story to benefit others after his death. We hope that it does."
THE more i learn and experience this disease complex-the more i believe it is the cause of many if not all conditions blamed on "old age".
i believe one of the strongest sources of hope for those of us still fighting is when educated, scientific minded people like you go thru this experience first hand.
many of our llmds have come from docs who lose loved ones or get "lyme" themselvs, see how poorly the medical response is, and then go on to get themselves as well as they can and then help others...even tho it is risky and non-conventional.
i am so sorry you had to go thru this. i am so sorry for the others going thru it now. thank you for writing what you did...and i hope you do not have to go thru such an ordeal again.
-------------------- Lyme? Its complicated. Educate yourself. Posts: 13712 | From new england | Registered: Feb 2004
| IP: Logged |
posted
So no mention of the bartonella being caused by a tick??? He mentions a tick in the beginning, but later says his dad must have gotten the infection from fleas....?? Did I miss something??
Makes me think bartonella should be checked for just as often as Lyme. ( around here, it seems to be, thank goodness! )
Excellent article!!!
(kitty... this is not YOUR father, right?)
-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96222 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by lpkayak: you are educated, have a scientific mind, and were in a position to have tests run that give you a good idea of what happened.
many of us have struggled for years trying to help loved ones and ourselves. often we are unable to get the info you got-factually-altho we strongly suspect microbes because of all we have learned, seen anecdotally and experienced outselves.
but you're right...in the end "it really does not matter."
i esp liked your ending:
"Epilogue Some years ago in a conversation with my mother I suggested that the term natural death may well represent an oversimplification of the processes that end a person's life. My father and our family were substantially affected during his illness. Each day, from initial hospitalization until his death, there was at least 1 family member at his side. In the eyes of family and friends, my father was a great man in so many respects. He was a loving husband, a caring father, diligent worker, and a friend and supporter to many persons. Potentially, his illness illustrates a complex interaction between intravascular Bartonella infection and complex disease expression, provides documentation for an as yet uncharacterized zoonotic rodent Bartonella sp., and offers disconcerting evidence supporting antimicrobial drug ineffectiveness and clinical evidence supporting the concept that persistent infection with >1 Bartonella spp. may lead to immunosuppression and opportunistic infections with organisms such as herpes zoster and C. albicans. As in his life, Dad would want this story to benefit others after his death. We hope that it does."
THE more i learn and experience this disease complex-the more i believe it is the cause of many if not all conditions blamed on "old age".
i believe one of the strongest sources of hope for those of us still fighting is when educated, scientific minded people like you go thru this experience first hand.
many of our llmds have come from docs who lose loved ones or get "lyme" themselvs, see how poorly the medical response is, and then go on to get themselves as well as they can and then help others...even tho it is risky and non-conventional.
i am so sorry you had to go thru this. i am so sorry for the others going thru it now. thank you for writing what you did...and i hope you do not have to go thru such an ordeal again.
I need to clarify: This was written by Dr. Ed Breitschwerdt- a vet at NC State.
Posts: 819 | From East Coast | Registered: Apr 2009
| IP: Logged |
quote:Originally posted by Lymetoo: So no mention of the bartonella being caused by a tick??? He mentions a tick in the beginning, but later says his dad must have gotten the infection from fleas....?? Did I miss something??
Makes me think bartonella should be checked for just as often as Lyme. ( around here, it seems to be, thank goodness! )
Excellent article!!!
(kitty... this is not YOUR father, right?)
He does mention the possibility from a cat scratch:
" My parents had an old (≈21 years of age) exclusively outdoor barn cat that would occasionally scratch."
And goes on to say:
" Recently, B. vinsonii subsp. berkhoffii genotype II was isolated by BAPGM blood culture from a cat with recurrent osteomyelitis (E.B. Breitschwerdt, unpub. data), which suggests that a bacteremic cat might facilitate transmission of this subspecies."
************************
I-kitty9309- have personally tested positive for this species through Dr. B. I had a classic bulls eye rash, flea, cat and dog exposure. There is no way to know which transmitted it to me.
Posts: 819 | From East Coast | Registered: Apr 2009
| IP: Logged |
feelfit
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 12770
posted
Wow Kitty thank you for this find....you have obviously stayed on top of this better than I have. It is now very clear to me what has motivated Dr. Breitschwerdt to identify new bartonella species.
I am hoping that his new testing methods (BAPGM) are available to all of us soon. I would think that the release of this important paper indicates that it can't be far off.
Galaxy Labs was said to be set to begin testing in late Fall 2009, employing Dr. Breitschwerdts testing methods...Appears that the time is near!
a very troubling aspect of Dr. B's article is that while abx appeared to help short term, relapse followed shortly after discontinuation.
Symptoms of Dr. B's father certainly correlate with many of my own....and others here as well.
Thanks again Kitty, Feelfit
Posts: 3975 | From usa | Registered: Aug 2007
| IP: Logged |
posted
Edited to change title for more interest. (hopefully )
Posts: 819 | From East Coast | Registered: Apr 2009
| IP: Logged |
nefferdun
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 20157
posted
Kind of hard for me to follow the scientific aspects of this but from what I understand his father was given relatively short courses of abx and as soon as he improved, it was discontinued. The scary thing for me is that he completely recovered mentally the first time and then the second time around it was not as effective. This seems to suggest the bacteria build a resistance. The first time I treated bart I had a speedy recovery but had to quit because of tendonitis. Then I took herbs and relapsed. Now I am taking rifampin and zithro and not having such great results. It really worries me. I sure wish more research could be put into finding out how to treat and cure these infections but that will take the CDC recognizing there is such a thing as chronic lyme etc. So depressing. I am getting old timers myself.
-------------------- old joke: idiopathic means the patient is pathological and the the doctor is an idiot Posts: 4676 | From western Montana | Registered: Apr 2009
| IP: Logged |
The Lyme Disease Network is a non-profit organization funded by individual donations. If you would like to support the Network and the LymeNet system of Web services, please send your donations to:
The
Lyme Disease Network of New Jersey 907 Pebble Creek Court,
Pennington,
NJ08534USA http://www.lymenet.org/
UBBFriend: Email this page to someone!
![[Smile]](smile.gif)
)
Printer-friendly view of this topic