posted
Not tried anything yet. Just found this last night.
Bea Seibert
Posts: 7306 | From Martinsville,VA,USA | Registered: Oct 2004
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Keebler
Honored Contributor (25K+ posts)
Member # 12673
posted
- Bea,
Thanks so much. She seems very educated in this field, good presentation. I love the powerpoint slides, so much easier to read than text.
Page 40, excerpt:
* When used as part of a diagnostic evaluation for Lyme disease, the IgG Western Blot Test should be performed by a laboratory that reads and reports all of the 10 bands related to Borrelia burgdorferi. The CDC requires only 5. IGeneX in Palo Alto, CA is currently the only lab that reads and reports all 10 bands. . . . " -- end quote.
The slide mentions only the IgG Western Blot. Now, as this was a multi-media presentation, she may have talked about the IgM but we don't have the audio portion so would miss that.
For notes, patients should get BOTH the full IgG and full IgM Western Blots as, unlike most other infections, IgM can be more telling for chronic infection, according to Dr. C (details below).
Dr C's Western Blot explanation is discussed here:
"With most infections, your immune system first forms IgM antibodies, then in about 2 to 4 weeks, you see IgG antibodies. In some infections, IgG antibodies may be detectable for years.
Because Borrelia burgdorferi is a chronic persistent infection that may last for decades, you would think patients with chronic symptoms would have positive IgG Western blots.
But actually, more IgM blots are positive in chronic borreliosis than IgG. Every time Borrelia burgdorferi reproduces itself, it may stimulate the immune system to form new IgM antibodies.
Some patients have both IgG and IgM blots positive. But if either the IgG or IgM blot is positive, overall it is a positive result.
Response to antibiotics is the same if either is positive, or both. Some antibodies against the borrelia are given more significance if they are IgG versus IgM, or vice versa.
Since this is a chronic persistent infection, this does not make a lot of sense to me. A newly formed Borrelia burgdorferi should have the same antigen parts as the previous bacteria that produced it.
But anyway, from my clinical experience, these borrelia associated bands usually predict a clinical change in symptoms with antibiotics, regardless of whether they are IgG or IgM." -
Posts: 48021 | From Tree House | Registered: Jul 2007
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posted
I live in NH where she is located and have seen her in past years at Herbal conferences (when I was more healthy). You can order her lyme tea and "chronic lyme tonic" from her/Misty Meadows Herbal. I tried the tea/decoction (much more than a tea-brewed very strong over night) and it added to the downward neuro MS like and a whole lot more spiral/crash hell I'm now in. I added it when i finished the first pharm drugs I 'e taken in 12 years flagyl/diflucan. Maybe it was a herx not sure.. but I've not recovered from it. My naturopath said she's never had anyone react to the tea like I did. BUT I'm an odd duck---it does have astralagus in it which buhner does not recommend for late stage lyme, but not all herbalists agree.
Posts: 200 | From New England | Registered: Dec 2009
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TerryK
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 8552
posted
f13girl Thanks for letting us know. Makes me wonder if you are one like me who must use a binder to get the neurotoxins out?
For those with the genetics that cause this problem, supposedly it's possible for the toxins to cause illness until removed with a binder. I find that I will slowly (very slowly) clear them but I can be in trouble if I continue to add more biotoxins through killing pathogens unless I use a binder.
Terry
Posts: 6286 | From Oregon | Registered: Jan 2006
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sparkle7
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 10397
posted
TerryK - which binders do you use? I think I have this problem, too. I haven't had any genetic test but I suspect this may be a problem for me.
I'll take a look at the presentation later! Thanks.
Posts: 7772 | From Northeast, again... | Registered: Oct 2006
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TerryK
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 8552
posted
I use actos to down regulate cytokines and cholestyramine to bind. In Dr. S's book, he mentions that actos can be used as a gene therapy of sorts for this problem but in any case, it can help lyme patients tolerate cholestyramine while they get the toxins out.
There are over the counter binders that may work.
beta sitosterol cholestepure modified apple pectin Activated Charcoal (supposedly 62% as effective as Cholestyramine) micronized chitosan Sarsparilla (per Dr. K) Butyrate "The oral use of butyrate, a short 4-carbon chain fatty acid, is of striking benefit (Fusunyan et al 1998, Segain et al 1983, Yin et al 2001) in mobilizing renegade fats, lowering TNFalpha, sequestering ammonia, and clearing biotoxins."
Posts: 6286 | From Oregon | Registered: Jan 2006
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sparkle7
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 10397
posted
Thanks! I read that Butyrate also makes artemesia more effective... There was a study done in regards to cancer.
I didn't realize that sarsparilla was a binder. I'll have to continue researching this.
Posts: 7772 | From Northeast, again... | Registered: Oct 2006
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