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» LymeNet Flash » Questions and Discussion » Medical Questions » Absence or partial seizure today WHILE DRIVING...help?

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Author Topic: Absence or partial seizure today WHILE DRIVING...help?
elizzza811
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Luckily my neighbor was in the passenger seat to tell me what had happened.

Apparently I started drifting off the road...she tried to get my attention, yelling in my ear, but I was 'zoning' and not hearing her or responding. Apparently I was doing some things that were 'reflexive'...like I put the car in park when we came to a stop, threw my cigarette out the window...

I ended up in a ditch though; apparently wanted to back the car up somehow and continue driving, unaware of how serious this was that I was 'zoning' and had ended up in a ditch with one wheel hanging over some concrete. Luckily I wasn't driving very fast and was not yet in a high traffic area.

Had another seizure in front of the cop and ambulance people when they got there. My BP was up some in the ambulance...they said it might be from the stress of what had happened.

All they did at the hospital was a chest x-ray (normal), and they looked over an MRI from a few months ago (normal). No EEG, no CT or MRI with contrast, nothing. Didn't want to hear anything about Lyme, bart, babs. In fact, the ER doctor was condescending and told me 'maybe you should go to medical school'. In other words, shut up, I'm the doctor here.

This is serious though. I'm not supposed to drive until I'm cleared by a neuro.

Is this Lyme? Bart? Babs? Please help. My pupils are tiny day and night, but they keep saying they aren't that bad. And last week when I was driving my cats to the vet, I had trouble driving because my vision was so blurry, I couldn't read any of the signs. And with pinpoint pupils, even in the dark, it just seems too 'dim' to me at night somehow. My daughter is in nursing school right now, and she says my pupils respond to darkness some, but not to the degree that they should. My OCD is through the roof, too, lately.

I woke up earlier today though with memory problems (before the accident). This happens on occasion...maybe once a month, occasionally twice, sometimes less? Am I seizuring in my sleep?

I remember having a funny taste in my mouth right before I 'zoned', and probably 45 minutes or an hour of time at the accident scene feels like just 20 minutes max to me. Help?

Oh, I wanted to add...my neighbor said I was doing something with my lips or mouth when I seizured? Like licking them or something?

Could this be what I feel constantly in my lower jaw and lower teeth though?...seizures? abnormal electrical activity in my brain? This constant sensation that there is a magnet inside my head somewhere, pulling my lower jaw upwards against my will? I also heard wooshing in my right ear and felt pressure at the base of my skull again today.

Help?

--------------------
Urge Congress on EMF Safety, FCC Must Change Exposure Guidelines for Microwave Radiation Exposure: http://tinyurl.com/2cjq54y
Halt Universal Broadband, A Public Health Hazard:
http://tinyurl.com/3x7xrmq

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Keebler
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I'm sorry to hear this. I'm no stranger to seizures nor stranger to doctors not knowing about lyme. It's best to just not talk about lyme right now and get a good workup.

While lyme and other tick-borne infections DO often cause seizures, so do the toxicity, liver overload, hyper NMDA-excitatory issues as well as magnesium and other nutrient deficiencies.

Call your LLMD Monday morning and see if she or he can suggest a good LL neurologist.

Depending upon the state in which you live, and what the neurologist determines, you may have to avoid driving for probably at least 6 weeks. And that is if you are started on a certain anti-seizure medicine, and after blood levels show it's stable for you and you are seizure free for a certain number of weeks.

Now, you may not have to start ANY anti-seizure medicine if your EEG is clear and the neurologist thinks it may have been just a one time event with little chance of it happening again.

I do hope your LLMD can direct you to a LL neurologist as it's important that the neuro know your full history, etc. - but if that neuro is not LL, it can be a grueling and mortifying experience so hold onto your hat.

For most states, driving after a seizures is a 2 - 6 month time-out.

Your insurance rates may be affected but that would have to be determined. One thing, for sure - if you do drive now and have any problems, your insurance may not be valid - and you could also face citations from the DMV. So, as hard as it is, don't even think about until you get some more information about what happened and why.

But, really, driving really is the least of concerns. Personal safety and that of others is the first point of order.

I wish they had given you an IV of magnesium and B vitamins at the hospital.

You will likely have to stop smoking if you start taking any anti-seizure medicines. I understand that, by smoking, you may have been self-medicating so please be open with your LLMD about this and approach is as a medical issue.

I have to stop now but will post some sets of information that I've gathered over the years.

It is important to keep in mind that many people have at least one seizure during their lifetime and many have more. Some resolve but, as your case is more complex, a thorough work up is needed. There can be any number of causes.

Best of luck to you.
-

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Keebler
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www.epilepsyfoundation.org/

Epilepsy Foundation-trusted, reliable information for people with seizures, and their caregivers.

==============================

Do an internet Cross Search: QEEG, seizures

===============================

http://www.drlwilson.com/articles/epilepsy.htm

Epilepsy & Seizures - by Lawrence Wilson, MD

==========================

http://www.worldwidehealthcenter.net/articles-115.html

Seizures: A Nutritional Approach - By Ward Dean, MD

Seizures can be attributed to a number of causes including metabolic abnormalities, infections, nutritional deficiencies, or trauma. . . .

===============================

http://www.vrp.com/brain-health/vinpocetine-cognitive-enhancers-role-expands-to-incontinence-and-epilepsy

Vinpocetine: Cognitive Enhancer�s Role Expands to Incontinence and Epilepsy

================================

http://tinyurl.com/5aegv5

Altern Med Rev. 2007 Mar;12(1):9-24. Links

Natural approaches to epilepsy.

===============================

http://www.mbschachter.com/importance_of_magnesium_to_human.htm

MAGNESIUM - The Importance of Magnesium to Human Nutrition

================================

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/entrez

PubMed Search:

Hypomagnesemia, seizures � 90 abstracts

Magnesium, seizures � 723 abstracts

Calcium, seizures � 1782 abstracts

Fish oil, seizures � 14 abstracts

Vinpocetine, seizures � 11 abstracts

=====================================

ARNICA - BOIRON homeopathic � I take this right after a seizure and it reduces brain swelling.

ADRENAL SUPPORT is also very helpful as some seizures are the result of adrenal exhaustion and depletion.

Keep your head and neck as supported as possible to prevent strain - well, as much as possible.
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Keebler
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Go right to the post about "SECONDARY PORPHRYIA"

http://flash.lymenet.org/scripts/ultimatebb.cgi/topic/1/91842?

PORPHYRIA
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Keebler
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As many sleep and pain meds are toxic and hard on the liver and kidneys, here are some suggestions for sleep support that can safely nourish & calm the body:
---------------

http://flash.lymenet.org/ubb/ultimatebb.php/topic/1/89790

Topic: NATURAL SLEEP - Links to articles & supplements

ADRENAL SUPPORT LINKS are included here.
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Keebler
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Regarding smoking and support methods for stopping - &/or with many other issues, you might ask your LLMD for a suggestion for a LL ND or LL L.Ac. Other ways to find them are here:
-----------------------

http://flash.lymenet.org/scripts/ultimatebb.cgi/topic/2/13964?

Topic: How to find an ILADS-educated LL ND (naturopathic doctor), L.Ac. (acupuncturist), etc.
-

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elizzza811
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Thanks for all the information, though I'm a little overwhelmed, I must admit...what types of seizures am I having though?

The paramedics thought either absence or partial, but I've also had 'episodes' in the past where the power seems to suddenly go out of my one leg. I actually have a huge scar on my knee from one of these episodes...

...I was taking my cats out to the car in their cat carrier following a veterinary visit, and on my way out, my one leg just 'collapsed' on me, causing me to crash onto the concrete sidewalk.

These episodes are probably less frequent that the memory-problem, funny-taste-in-my-mouth episodes...maybe once or twice a year?

Does anyone here though know a Lyme Literate Medical Doctor neurologist in PA?

Also, is it safe to get a lumbar puncture with Lyme, bart, babs?

--------------------
Urge Congress on EMF Safety, FCC Must Change Exposure Guidelines for Microwave Radiation Exposure: http://tinyurl.com/2cjq54y
Halt Universal Broadband, A Public Health Hazard:
http://tinyurl.com/3x7xrmq

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Keebler
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WHY in the world would you need a lumbar puncture? That's not needed to assess seizure activity.

I can't address all your questions now but my guess is that different variations of seizures have been going on for a while.

Partial and complex partial, likely. Drop seizure where teh pwer seems to go out of your leg. That could also be an inner ear stressor trigger some brain activity. The "drop" attacks could also be a drop in blood pressure or other things.

This does not need to get worse. My guess is that nutrient deficiency is a big part of this and once it's sorted out you will get better and better. And ANYONE can have seizures from toxins. ANYONE. The correction may indeed be easy - it just may take some work to figure it out.

Your LLMD should be able to guide you on this. I would see him/her first.

Avoid cell phones and fluorescent lights in the meantime. Good sleep and good nutrition really matter, too. Good luck.
-

[ 12-20-2010, 01:07 AM: Message edited by: Keebler ]

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GiGi
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http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:-43z9zQ53vgJ:www.healingcancernaturally.com/klinghardt-heavymetalchelation.html+what+causes+seizures+klinghardt&cd=2&hl=en&ct=c lnk&gl=us

Please scroll down to "seizures". I have always associated them with toxic metals on the move and an inadequate metal detox program shifting them in the central nervous system. I have had a few tiny ones myself and know what that feels like.
A good metal detox program with lots of binders will help to clear the metals out,

Take care.

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Keebler
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I'm so glad GiGi mentioned Heavy Metals. While mentioned in some articles above, no one addresses like Dr. K in that link.

MSG? ASPARTAME?

Also to consider: Did you consume even a trace of MSG or aspartame. Google for all the names they each hide under. They can certainly trigger seizures, especially for those with TBD and other toxicity issues.

Supplements that raise the glutamic acid level of the brain can also trigger seizures. L-Glutamine should be avoided, other than in normal amounts found in foods but, as the Wilson article mentions, some foods might need to be avoided due to high glutamic acid concentrations.

Also to consider: tuna or other high mercury fish --also ANY additives, colors, dyes, artificial ingredients, artificial sweeteners, and fake fats or hydrogenate oils.

The chemicals in the cigarettes can also cause seizures and contribute to several physiological dysfunctions that can make someone more susceptible to seizure events. A good ND can help clear the smoke around all this and there are many tools to make it easier.
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Cass A
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It is possible that you may need an anti-seizure medication while you deal with the cause of these seizures.

I had a set of seizures that had me unconscious in the hospital for over 24 hours.

That was it on trying to deal with them only with herbs, etc., and detoxing, which I'd been doing for quite some time.

The neurologist I saw prescribed a generic form of Keppra for me at a low dose. It does make me more tired, and there are many other potential side effects, so read the package insert (or its equivalent) online before going that route.

If you need to keep driving, you may have to do this, at least for a while.

If you have a feeling that signals a seizure is about to occur, called an "aura," you may be able to head them off with B-6. This worked for me when I was awake. However, this last set of seizures happened when I was asleep. And I didn't wake up.

Best,

Cass A

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elizzza811
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I'm considering a lumbar puncture because I do believe some infection is involved and was hoping it would pick up Lyme or one of these other bugs I have? I have a bart rash on my thigh, for instance. Will any of these show up on a lumbar? It could even be viral, since recently I've developed warts on my one finger for the first time in my life, so I'm evidently not fighting viruses either.

Glutamine? Is it related to glucosamine? I believe I've been taking things that increase glucosamine recently, but I thought glucosamine was good?

And how does Keppra compare to Klonopin? I used to take Klonopin daily for 'anxiety', but I cold-turkeyed it several years ago when doctors refused prescribing it unless I was active in counseling. I was tired of being treated like a drug-seeking psycho. Is Keppra a controlled substance?

Thanks for all the info though...I'm checking it out now...

By the way, I DID feel an aura just prior to my seizure...I've experienced these many times when I wasn't behind the wheel...but I wasn't realizing for all these years that this was what it was...an impending seizure. What's really weird, too, is that fluorescent lights have always made me feel funny, and when I got home from the hospital I noticed that everything was shocking me with sparks! My cats, the light switch, you name it!

Also, I'm the poster here who has been claiming that she can 'feel' sunspots and geomagnetic activity. The sun was actually sunspot-free for the first time in ages yesterday, and earth was inside a solar windstream. Any connection to my seizures?

--------------------
Urge Congress on EMF Safety, FCC Must Change Exposure Guidelines for Microwave Radiation Exposure: http://tinyurl.com/2cjq54y
Halt Universal Broadband, A Public Health Hazard:
http://tinyurl.com/3x7xrmq

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lou
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Aura is also associated with migraine headaches.

I had several petit mal seizures early on, before and when just starting treatment. One while driving. None in a long time. Tickborne diseases can do this. Not sure of the mechanism.

A lumbar puncture is almost useless for tickborne diseases, and if negative, your ins co may use this as an excuse to stop paying for treatment. Are you looking for some other infection?

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elizzza811
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I'm not sure what I'm looking for in a lumbar, but thanks for telling me...I don't want to screw up my being able to get antibiotics for Lyme, bart, babs, even though I'm presently off antibiotics. See, nothing ever seemed to help some of my symptoms, like this rubber-banded jaw-pulling sensation I feel almost non-stop, so I stopped antibiotics earlier this year.

Also, I've had episodes where I am lying flat on the sofa, and I feel the need to swallow...only when I try to swallow, I can't, and gag. This might happen several times before I turn to lay on my side and am usually okay then.

--------------------
Urge Congress on EMF Safety, FCC Must Change Exposure Guidelines for Microwave Radiation Exposure: http://tinyurl.com/2cjq54y
Halt Universal Broadband, A Public Health Hazard:
http://tinyurl.com/3x7xrmq

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elizzza811
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By the way, I've been logging many of my wake-up-with-severe-memory-problems days, and they appear to happen every twenty-some days...like 23 or 25, I forget. Also, when the sun is blank and there are no sunspots, or the only sunspot present is fading. Weird, huh?

--------------------
Urge Congress on EMF Safety, FCC Must Change Exposure Guidelines for Microwave Radiation Exposure: http://tinyurl.com/2cjq54y
Halt Universal Broadband, A Public Health Hazard:
http://tinyurl.com/3x7xrmq

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Cass A
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Dear Elizza,

Keppra is not a controlled substance. It is a prescription drug. It is a recently developed anti-seizure drug, not a psychotropic drug. It may have psycho-active effects, but controlling moods or whatever is not its primary purpose.

I'm not that familiar with Klonopin to be able to compare them.

You could try taking B-6 (about 200 mg) when you get the "aura" feeling. Some research suggests that the "aura" is actually a very, very brief epileptic event. And, some of the symptoms you mention--especially the confusion and severe memory problems--can be post-seizure symptoms, again possibly of epileptic events that are very, very brief. And, if you have seizures while you're asleep, you may not even know it!

As brought up on LymeNet more than once, and by Dr. K in his seminars, etc. (see links posted by GiGi), parasites and Lyme and neurotoxins can cause seizures. According to GiGi, the parasites are most active every 28 days when the moon is full.....

Since I've been taking Keppra (about 6 weeks), I haven't had an "aura" or a seizure. The neurologist is looking for 3 months without a seizure as a stabilization point.

It did take about a month for some of the more objectionable side effects to fade out, which is what the consulting MD and pharmacist warned me about. None of the side effects I experienced were as awful as the seizure and its aftermath! But, reading the full package insert to know what to look out for is very important!! I didn't experience any of the more serious ones.

I'm hoping to be able to reduce my dose and eventually get off it completely by treating the CAUSATIVE factors effectively.

However, I do need to be able to drive. And, I can't put my family through a 2-day stay in the hospital again. Sometimes, people have seizures and don't wake up at all. This last time, it took over 24 hours. That is WAY too long.

If you're fading out while driving, the time for experimenting with non-prescription solutions is probably over, unless you're willing to give up driving. It's really not OK to put others at risk.

Hope this helps!

Best,

Cass A

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Keebler
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-
I agree with CASS, you need to address this full on - and if prescription anti-seizure meds help you WHILE you address all the other matters, it could be life saving.

But, many do not mix with cigarettes. And liver support is vital with an anti-seizure meds. Neurontin, though is not processed through the liver but mainly through kidneys. Still, smoking can put undue strain on the liver and kidneys and affect any anti-seizure medicine.

It may be that anti-seizure meds will help calm your body so that feeling the need to smoke will just disappear.

However, many can make you feel more sleepy at first, so that needs to have some planning around it.

An EEG should be done before any medicine and the neurologist may or may not want to do any kind of brain imaging after talking with you.

� Do you NOT need a lumbar puncture. You already have the diagnoses of lyme, babesia and bartonella.

As you are not currently being treated for ANY of those, then, had you been totally in remission for at least a couple months before you stopped treatment?

If not, you already KNOW of 3 infections and each of those often cause seizure activity and neurotoxicity, neuro-exicitablity of the NMDA nerve receptors.

Glutamine? Related to Glamatic Acid but NOT at all related to glucosamine.

That you are taking glucosamine, though, signals that lyme and co. were not at all really resolved. Rather than treating symptoms, it is vital to be sure the underlying infections are adequately addressed.

I hope you have a LLMD whom you can check back with about this. What you describe is not at all foreign to LLMD - and most good LLMD are also keenly aware of the heavy metal issue.

The EMF issue is one that some LLMDs are aware. If the heavy metals, nutrient needs AND the INFECTIONS are properly addressed -- along with good liver support to reduce toxicity.

Still, regarding your driver's license, you will have to go through normal hoops - and with your history it may take a while before you'll be safe at the wheel, but it can happen again.

Again, I'd see a LLMD who addresses heavy metal detox and liver support along with backing up and assessing lyme, babesia and bartonella as they may be raring.

Then, you will need to have some sort of neurologist to sign off.

But, I warn you to play it as straight as possible with a neuro if they are not LL. See if there is anything else on the screen, so to speak. It's important to cover all the things you know that could be related but also keep an open mind to other things.

While EMFs are an issue for lyme patients, it's best to not "go there" with most regular doctors. There are things to lessen the impact of EMFs in your home - and AVOID cell phones and iPods, etc. but when the infections and heavy metals are addressed the EMF stuff gets easier.

Same with the static electricity sparks during this dry winter. Put a kettle on the stove and you'll have more moisture so less sparks. But, lyme patients do seems to get more of that sparking from synthetic blankets, etc., according to the doctor at the neurotoxin lyme site. (Dr. S.)

Be sure to ground yourself before touching your cat so the poor critter doesn't get too stressed.

And, I don't want to push it but stopping smoking is the number one matter of importance - with good support to do that. That, alone, may turn this around for you so that the other things are much more easily addressed.

Good luck.
-

[ 12-20-2010, 12:09 PM: Message edited by: Keebler ]

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elizzza811
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Keppra? What are the side effects? Now I'm scared. Sleepiness? I actually HOPE that is a side effect because I have severe insomnia most nights.

As for smoking, I smoke twice as much because I can't sleep...wish everybody would realize that. What else am I supposed to do at 3am when I'm still wide awake?

--------------------
Urge Congress on EMF Safety, FCC Must Change Exposure Guidelines for Microwave Radiation Exposure: http://tinyurl.com/2cjq54y
Halt Universal Broadband, A Public Health Hazard:
http://tinyurl.com/3x7xrmq

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Keebler
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I apologize if my comments were upsetting. I tried but obviously failed to inject a kind and understanding tone - very hard to do on a computer. Please accept my concern in the manner presented and read in a soft, caring voice and just matter of fact information about cause and effect and possible triggers.

As insomnia is so common to lyme, the SLEEP thread above has some good detail to help with insomnia. Also, lack of good sleep is a number one way to lower the seizure threshold the next day and for days later. So, after a night of insomnia, much greater care is needed to avoid seizure triggers or anything thing else that lowers the threshold or sparks kindling.

"Threshold" and "Kindling" are two terms you will learn about as you read more. However, just being on the computer can be rough so you may want to copy, paste, download and print out articles to read off of the computer.

Best of luck - I know this seems like a huge task but, in the long run, this may have been just the key to help you figure out the best plan for regaining health. Take care.

====================

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kindling_model

Kindling model

====================

Smoking can clog circulation in the brain and that can lower the seizure threshold. Along with many other effects that hamper liver, kidneys, lung and skin - all major organs of detoxification . . .

http://www.livestrong.com/article/25320-can-smoking-cause-seizures/

Can Smoking Cause Seizures?

Overview

Smoking is known to cause seizures in some people with epilepsy. Nicotine in cigarettes increases neuronal firing in the brain and affects receptors for the excitatory neurotransmitter acetylcholine.

===============================

Transitioning away from cigarettes would need to be done very carefully.

However, one good reason to never light up again: since a cigarette was tossed out of your hand during the last seizure, that could happen again and you might not be aware enough to stop a fire, especially if in clothes or home furnishings that can go up in flames in an instant.

CANDLES ? It may be best to also avoid having any lighted candles around - for safety in case a seizure causes one to topple over or go unattended.

GAS STOVE TOP ? If you have a gas stove top, be sure to avoid loose fitting sleeves, scarves, etc. - and if you have long hair, pull it back as a habit - just in case of any spasm activity around the burners. Planning ahead and establishing new habits for safety really helps.

I know this is a huge amount to take in but there really are some wonderful support options that, hopefully, will feel nurturing and empowering.

In addition to many solid support methods, acupuncture and supplements that a ND or L. Ac. could offer, here is a post from a previous thread on the topic:

jalama posted:

"Please get the book called "The Easy Way to Quit" by Allen Carr. It is totally amazing and makes quitting totally easy and painless. Just follow instructions exacactly and then don't ever experiment with "just one." There is no such thing! Good luck!"

=============================

Call and talk with them. They should be able to answer many basic questions.

http://www.epilepsyfoundation.org/aboutus/affiliatelookup.cfm

Find Your Local Epilepsy Foundation

==============================

In addition to your previous LLMD, others in your area who have lyme + co. may have suggestions for local (LL?) neurologists and LL NDs to help with support methods.

http://www.lymenet.org/SupportGroups/

Find your area Lyme Support Groups
-

[ 12-20-2010, 05:36 PM: Message edited by: Keebler ]

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elizzza811
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Thanks, I know. I think I'm just 'extra' sensative because the ER doctor seemed more worried about my smoking habit than the fact that I'd just driven my car off the road having a seizure. My mom died of lung cancer, too, so I'm aware...don't worry. I think maybe if I get some sleep here for a change I won't want to smoke as much...I definitely smoke more since my health went downhill...twice as much, easy. I'm not proud of it, but it keeps me sane...for now.

And this is off topic, but nobody's answered in 'Computer Questions'...my cat hit something on my computer, I must have saved it, and now I can't get into my regular Windows...help?

http://flash.lymenet.org/ubb/ultimatebb.php/topic/5/1025

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lipanz
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I'm considering a lumbar puncture because I do believe some infection is involved and was hoping it would pick up Lyme or one of these other bugs I have? I have a bart rash on my thigh, for instance. Will any of these show up on a lumbar?

In reference to lumbar puncture there is no guaranteed 100% test that will pick up lyme, bart etc. not even a PCR is reliable. It is like looking for a needle in a haystack.
Some bart rashes can look exactly like various lyme rashes. The bull's eye rash it has been found is not the most typical lyme rash. There are many many different lyme rashes- which mimic other skin dermatologic rashes..

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lipanz
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And this is off topic, but nobody's answered in 'Computer Questions'...my cat hit something on my computer, I must have saved it, and now I can't get into my regular Windows...help?

http://flash.lymenet.org/ubb/ultimatebb.php/topic/5/1025

I put a reply for the cat computer question of what I only know. It has to still be on your hard drive unless you did not save it. The reply is on the site.

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elizzza811
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The nurse practitioner that treated my Lyme in the past said a lumbar is safe. I'm just worried they'll use a negativelumbar to deny me Lyme treatment now? Is that something I should worry about???

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Keebler
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Well, that NP failed to tell you it is NOT a good test for lyme.

You already have a diagnosis of lyme, right? You do not need another test, ever. Save yourself lots of money, pain and predicted negative test that will forever keep you from lyme treatment.

=============================


http://flash.lymenet.org/ubb/ultimatebb.php/topic/1/99673

Topic: Lumbar puncture?

===============================

A LP (lumbar puncture/spinal tap) is such a poor test for lyme.

It's like fishing. If you catch a fish in a lake, you know the lake has fish. But if you don't catch a fish, you can't say there are no fish in the lake. You just didn't catch one.

Spirochetes do not just all swim around the spine waiting to be sucked up into a needle. While, once in a blue moon, the needle may withdraw CNS (cerebral spinal fluid) that might contain some evidence of a spirochete, in general, spirochetes hate vibration, light, motion, etc. They will spring away from the action.

While some have no problems, for many, a LP can be very painful and you could have a tremendous migraine for weeks afterward needed someone to care for you, at least for many tasks.

And, they are expensive. Even if you do not pay out of pocket, someone is making a huge sum of money from a test that does not even work to dx lyme. It's a waste of money unless in a life-threatening emergency and they are looking for other reasons. To assess lyme, it's a wasteful exercise in futility.

However, the doctors know this but will use the predictably negative test to DENY TREATMENT.

AND - even if they found lyme the neuro will go by IDSA standards for treatment and you'd get 9 days' worth or 3-4 weeks max of one medicine alone.

Not enough. Go only to doctors who are truly educated about lyme and all tick-borne infections - and how they impact a person at various points in time after transmission.

=======================

http://www.ilads.org/search/search.php?zoom_query=lumbar+puncture&x=0&y=0

Search results for: lumbar puncture at the ILADS website (includes the IDSA guidelines for comparison)

========================

http://www.ilads.org/lyme_disease/treatment_guidelines_clearing_ilads.html

Summary of ILADS Guidelines

Excerpt:

. . . Lumbar puncture has also been disappointing as a diagnostic test to rule out concomitant central nervous system infection.

In Lyme disease, evaluation of cerebrospinal fluid is unreliable for a diagnosis of encephalopathy and neuropathy because of poor sensitivity.

For example, pleocytosis was present in only one of 27 patients (sensitivity 3%) and with only seven cells.

The antibody index was positive (>1) in only one of 27 patients (sensitivity 3%). An index is the ratio between Lyme ELISA antibodies in the spinal fluid and Lyme ELISA antibodies in the serum.

The proposed index of 1.3 would be expected to have even worse sensitivity. . . .
-

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elizzza811
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Thanks for the info; I will most likely steer clear of having a lumbar puncture done...I can't sleep as it is.

I guess my only concern is that other infections could be involved? even viral ones?...that's the only reason I even considered it. I mean, I have OCD, and few people on here with Lyme do. And some symptoms never were even touched by antibiotics. Is it safe to assume Lyme, bart, babs are the only infections that should be searched for? I mean what if my OCD is caused by some other infection that might show up on an LP?

I'm not even sure she's even going to want to do an LP on me...?

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Keebler
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-
There may be some things that kept your treatment from working. Do not assume those 3 are gone. You've been diagnosed with those, you need not search again. But a good LLMD should go back over your treatment, your life-style and assess what might have stood in the way of success.

In addition to the usual coinfections from ticks (such as babesia, bartonella, ehrlichia, RMSF, etc.), there are some other chronic stealth infections that an excellent LLMD should know about:
----------

http://flash.lymenet.org/scripts/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=069911#000000

TIMACA posted 03 August, 2008

I would encourage EVERY person who has received a lyme diagnosis to get the following tests.

- at link.
-

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elizzza811
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Wow! Thanks for the excellent list! I did have high titers of parvo, HHV6, and EBV, but I wasn't tested for a lot of the other viruses. I was tested for some of the other coinfections, but not all of them.

I know I still have bart and Lyme though..I have the bart rash, and bart treatment is what seemed to help the most, along with IV Rocephin in the beginning.

This may sound crazy, but could I still have dormant chicken pox? I ask because I had a severe case of it as a kid, and even scarred my face with it. Any possibility that could be causing seizures?

I think you've convinced me NOT to get a lumbar though! Thanks!

--------------------
Urge Congress on EMF Safety, FCC Must Change Exposure Guidelines for Microwave Radiation Exposure: http://tinyurl.com/2cjq54y
Halt Universal Broadband, A Public Health Hazard:
http://tinyurl.com/3x7xrmq

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Keebler
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-
Rather than think that any one infection is the culprit, a complete approach is best.

I really don't know how to say it any more kinder - but any doctor will tell you that the cigarettes are the number one thing to address right now, in a safe way. There are many things that can help your (hopeful) decision about that. Whatever you are getting from cigarettes, it is possible to find what you need in more healthful ways.

Go back over the links above that discuss causes of seizures and consider everything on the lists while you also schedule an appointment with a good LLMD and a neurologist.

Still, as far as action you can take, clearing out the smoke is the number one priority as you work through all of this. You will likely see a dramatic improvement. Then, heavy metal detox can be better addressed and, as for treating whatever infections that are going on, you will have a better chance. Smoking usually torpedos all efforts at fighting infections.

In all kindness, I do wish the best of luck as you do what you need to build a healthy life.
-

[ 12-20-2010, 11:11 PM: Message edited by: Keebler ]

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elizzza811
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Thanks. I'm kind of bummed now though...I'm realizing I'm going to lose my driver's license now for at least 6 months. I don't think the cop reported my seizure (I'll know in like 48 hours, I guess), but doctors in the state of PA are required to.

http://www.epilepsyfoundation.org/living/wellness/transportation/drivinglaws.cfm

Can things get any worse?

I wouldn't even have gone out anywhere on Sunday with the way I was feeling...I woke up with severe memory problems. But my neighbor needed to pick up carpeting and I have a hatchback, so I pushed myself.

She helped me in a way...if it weren't for her, I wouldn't even have known I'm having seizures. But at the same time, now I'm going to lose my driving freedom.

I'm bummed.

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Rumigirl
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Well, hard as it may be to not be able to drive for now, it's better than injuring or killing yourself or others!! I know you know this, but that's the bottom line.

Ask about LLMD's and LL neurologists in the Find a Doctor section. I have some ideas about that, too, but it's very late here now.

And, yes, a LL neurologist would be REALLY important, if possible. There are one or two in CT. (I know, you would have to get a ride, but that will probably have to happen anyway).

Yes, it's good that your neighbor was there to witness it, so you have a better idea of what happened!

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Cass A
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As for sleeping help, B 1, B complex, and topical Magnesium Oil are all very helpful with insomnia.

Best,

Cass A

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elizzza811
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I actually just started taking magnesium, although with everything going on, I'd forgotten it the last several days.

I just talked to my auto insurance company though, and they can't believe that absolutely zero tests were done on my head in the ER when I'd just suffered two seizures. What good is a chest x-ray going to do for a seizure?

That's another reason I'm tired of the smoking issue...I go in as a smoker with a seizure, and they are more interested in my lungs than my brain when I'm breathing just fine (now that I've gotten abx for Lyme).

In fact, I wonder if smokers really get lung cancer from all the unnecessary chest x-rays they get every time they walk in with ANY health issue, as their doctors 'await' their lung cancer.

And yea, I'm serious.

Don't forget that I'm knowledgeable about EMFs, which include x-rays. I won't argue that smoking damages the lungs, BUT I do believe that the body is equipped to repair any damage...if not subjected to artificial EMFs. Cancer cells closely resemble stem cells, regenerative cells...regenerative cells that have gone awry.

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Urge Congress on EMF Safety, FCC Must Change Exposure Guidelines for Microwave Radiation Exposure: http://tinyurl.com/2cjq54y
Halt Universal Broadband, A Public Health Hazard:
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Keebler
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-
Bodies are not able to repair damage from smoking if smoking is on-going. When stopped, the body can repair some of the damage - sometimes most - depending upon each case, as time passes.

All this talk about smoking - and the ER doctor's concern - is not meant to start a war. It's not intended to place blame or make you feel bad. There are probably several dozen ways smoking can contribute to seizures. It's truly the number one thing to address - and all the other things would then become easier, including being able to get the most benefit from any Rx for anything.

In your insurance thread, today you wrote: "Once my seizures are controlled on meds . . ."

I'm sorry to say but it's not always that simple.

Sometimes, it's a trial of various meds over time to find the right one. Smoking will impair any seizure medicine's effectiveness and safety.

(please read with a neutral tone) By leaving smoking behind, you will have a better chance at finding a medicine that might work for you - if that is what's needed.

Anti-seizure meds don't work for all kinds of seizures, though, nor for every person. It depends a lot on the cause of seizure and the individual's overall chemistry.

Yes, high EMFs are not great for us, however, damage from smoking is much more controllable. But, back to why they took an x-ray.

It could be that your chest or upper back did take some stress from the accident and they needed to be sure about that. Even if you did not hit the steering wheel, etc. there could have been an internal injury of some kind - either from the accident or maybe from what the EMTs saw during that second seizure.

If your lungs are not working properly, it will cut off the flow of oxygen to your brain. That can trigger a seizure, the same as impaired blood flow to the heart or the brain can trigger a seizure or seizure-like activity.

There is a certain kind of fainting that will trigger seizure-like spasms, etc. - they were probably assessing if constriction in your lungs might have cause a kind of fainting that can appear as a seizure.

The ER doctor likely listened first to your lungs and found some cause for an image. They were not looking for cancer. They were likely assessing blood flow that could cause lung constriction. You may feel like you are breathing fine but the blood vessels in the lungs can still not be working right - and that may have been their concern.

Most EEGs or MRIs would not be done through an emergency room with no apparent head injury. It's best that a neurologist determine the specifics for brain imagining after a clinical evaluation. That is why they did not do it then but told you to see a specialist who would do testing. Not all EEGs are the same, nor MRIs, etc.

An EEG would not have shown past seizure activity for any time before being hooked up and the machine being activated.

An EEG will only show seizure activity if happening at the same time of the test. And an EEG does not show everything, some seizure activity cannot be measured if coming from a place where the electrodes are not placed to measure, such as for places deep in the brainstem, etc.

After the neurologist talks to you, then the exact placement of the electrodes for an EEG will be determined.

Also know that EEGs will not pick up seizures from many causes such as toxicity from chemicals or infection, or inner ear dysfunction that triggers seizures. This is why a LL neurologist would be so important. A LL specialist would understand the NMDA neurotoxicity issues.

I would do EVERYTHING possible to find a LL neurologist, even if you have to find a ride to the next state.
-

[ 12-21-2010, 03:37 PM: Message edited by: Keebler ]

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elizzza811
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No, my oxygen saturations were fine...I think I heard 99% in the ambulance. I was not given any oxygen either...not in the ambulance, and not when I got to the hospital. So they were fine. I had no bruises and no pain whatsoever. The car had no dents...maybe some scratches to the undercarriage, but no dents, because there wasn't much impact at all...it was just a little bumpy drifting down the shoulder until I hit the storm drain concrete, but the grass slowed me down a bit.

Admit it...they did the chest x-ray because that's what you do with smokers...you x-ray their lungs.

Seriously though...my mother DIED of lung cancer that spread to her brain...after having quit for 5 years. So do you really think that some cocky doctor in the ER, who speaks to me in a condescending manner ("well, maybe you ought to go to medical school?") is going to convince me to quit when my own mother's dying of it didn't? And at 45 years old I think I probably have heard once or twice that smoking is bad for me?

My smoking 'cure' is to give me back the life I once had before Lyme, before seizures. I easily smoke twice as much as I once did, just from not being able to fall asleep until 3am...

--------------------
Urge Congress on EMF Safety, FCC Must Change Exposure Guidelines for Microwave Radiation Exposure: http://tinyurl.com/2cjq54y
Halt Universal Broadband, A Public Health Hazard:
http://tinyurl.com/3x7xrmq

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