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» LymeNet Flash » Questions and Discussion » Medical Questions » link between endometriosis/women issues and Lyme?

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Author Topic: link between endometriosis/women issues and Lyme?
littlebit27
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I know I'm spelling that all wrong, please forgive me. Can anyone tell me if there is a link between endometreosis and other menstrual problems and Lyme?

I know I've read breifly about a link but haven't been able to find much else.

Thank you

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*Brittany Lyme Aware on FB*
http://littlebithaslyme.wordpress.com/

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Tammy N.
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I don't know about that.... but I have heard it can be related to a diet that includes animal protein (meat/dairy). Vegan diet is suppose to be very helpful. Worth looking into further..... Good luck!
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cactus
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Yes - they are linked.

Somewhere around here, I have studies... I will see if I can find them for you.

My LLMD showed me the studies, initially, so I can't claim credit for having found them initially. [Smile]

Endo was the (literal) thorn in my side for many years ... Are you dealing with it, too, littlebit? I'm sorry.

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Did you ever stop to think, and forget to start again? - A.A. Milne

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cactus
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Oh... Tammy, I just read your post, and had to throw this out there...

I was vegetarian... for 14 years. Both before and after my endo diagnosis. I was vegan for one year of that time (just before symptoms appeared)...

So I found your info interesting... since my experience is to the contrary.

We're all different, I guess! [Smile]

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Did you ever stop to think, and forget to start again? - A.A. Milne

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littlebit27
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It's not me, it's my friend. And I keep telling her I think the issues are related to the Lyme but I have no proof. She has different endocronoligists (spell?) trying to DX her with cushings then PCOS.

But then they go back and say oh no that's not it after the blood work.

I'm a firm believer that when people who are sick with Lyme starting developing different symptoms it is related to the Lyme. It can wreak havoc on our bodies, I feel like it's to blame for everything, lol.

It is a bad condition that is for sure. I know quite a few people with endo.

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*Brittany Lyme Aware on FB*
http://littlebithaslyme.wordpress.com/

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Pam08
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Yep...my LLMD said that lyme can definitely cause female/menstrual issues.

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Sick since 10/2001. Tested CDC positive for Lyme 10/2008 through Quest and Igenex. Started treatment 1/2009 with LLMD. Lyme, Erichilosis, Chlamydophila Pneumoniae, Q Fever, Strep Syndrome and probably a few others I am forgetting.

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Rumigirl
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cactus, and anyone else who knows, I would very much like to see any studies or more info on the connection.

I have a client, who has endometriosis, and I suspect she may have Lyme, but wasn't sure about the connection.

I believe Candida can be a causal factor, too, if I am remembering correctly.

More info, please. What a horrible disease! It makes it worse if a woman is on the Pill, too.

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BoxerMom
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Lots of women with Lyme develop endometriosis. And PCOS-like symptoms without actual PCOS (though they may have Lyme cysts or even endometrial tissue on their ovaries). Lyme is very confusing to OB/GYNs!

Do a search here or on Google.

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 - Must...find...BRAIN!!!

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karenl
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It could be chlamydia pneumonia as well. If you type in the search function on cpnhelp.org there are posts with endometriosis.
Cpn and lyme often comes together.

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rosiegeorge
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Thanks for this post I think i've had chronic lyme since childhood and I have terrible pcos & mild endo

All my lifelong health issues keep seeming to be all related to Lymes. If anyone has any articles on this . I'm actually seeing my gyn next week

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littlebit27
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Will check this stuff out.

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*Brittany Lyme Aware on FB*
http://littlebithaslyme.wordpress.com/

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Marnie
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"Estrogen-Dependent Rapid Activation of Protein Kinase C in Estrogen Receptor-Positive MCF-7 Breast Cancer Cells and Estrogen Receptor-Negative HCC38 Cells Is Membrane-Mediated and Inhibited by Tamoxifen "

http://endo.endojournals.org/cgi/content/full/144/5/1812


Bb has a PKC inhibitor (which I think is PKCB2), that does not mean the other forms of PKC are being inhibited (they are not - they are "on").

PKC = calcium activated transfer of phosphate (kinase) onto a protein. There are many "subforms" of PKC.

Tamoxifen is a man-made PKC inhibitor that also blocks chloride channels.

Frontline, to protect our DOGS from lyme, works by blocking chloride channels in the TICK. NOT safe to use on US - humans. If you "google" the chemicals in Frontline, eventually you will find the chloride channel link.

Sometimes tamoxifen doesn't destroy all DNA damaged breast cancer cells. Some are resistant. Too many cells dying too fast = sepsis.

This is tightly controlled by our own bodies.

Google:tamoxifen EPA.

EPA works on multiple levels.

Estrogen dominant women may have a harder time if they contract lyme.

There is a histidine link too...long fingers, 2nd toe larger than the first, seasonal allergies, etc. High histamine looks to be a "sign" of estrogen dominance or visa versa.

Estradiol (E2), corticotropin-releasing hormone (CRH)

E2 treatment increased CRH content and histamine turnover in the hypothalamus.PMID: 19619143

There are many forms of estrogen...this gets complex.

Here is a B6-estrogen link:

When B6 is low to control Na (one of its MANY functions), the back-up kicks in...aldosterone which comes from cholesterol.

To control aldosterone levels...testosterone or estrogen may go up....perhaps.

"Estrogen Reduces Aldosterone, Upregulates Adrenal Angiotensin II AT2 Receptors and Normalizes Adrenomedullary Fra-2 in Ovariectomized Rats"

"Both Estrogen Receptor Subtypes, alpha and beta (symbols), Attenuate Cardiovascular Remodeling in Aldosterone Salt-Treated Rats"

alpha and beta tubulins = globular proteins

OspA and OspB????!!!

Bb needs NaCl for motility. The channel activated is TRPM8 which is a Na-Ca channel.

"Endometriosis is fed by estrogen."

Or...

"Endometriosis patients tend to have these imbalances;

Estrogen excess and Progesterone deficiency,

excess calcium, and magnesium deficiency.

Essential fatty acid deficiency,

high stress, excess dietary caffeine and excess alcohol intake."

http://www.ultimatehealing.com/endometriosis.html

Fatty acid deficiency is usually the Omega 3s.
Magnesium levels drop "significantly" at the outset of lyme (understatement).

Mg works WITH B6.

Mg is an anti-inflammatory, anti-histamine and inhibits HMG CoA reductase.

Inhibiting HMG CoA reductase is what statin drugs do...block the cholesterol pathway which is one of many pathways Bb uses to build his cell walls.

Romanian doctors restored Mg levels AND gave IV abx. and cured lyme in just some early onset lyme patients.

The active form of B6 (which we don't hold onto long and which is destroyed by our stomach acids) is P5P/PLP. It can be taken sublingually and IS part of a formula by Dr. Valletta (Italy) whose patent is titled: "Magnesium for autoimmune." He used Mg pyrophosphate (PPi) and sub B6.

When Bendectin (H1 receptor blocker with B6) was pulled from the market in the U.S. the number of premature babies DOUBLED.

SOME women need that Rx for the histamine triggered N/V of pregnancy.

When pregnant our DAO enzyme (to help breakdown histamine) goes up ...get this...500 fold!

To protect the fetus from excess histamine.

Oddly the H1 blockers normally make us sleepy. They are the only ones that cross the BBB. But *low* B6 = sleepy. So the combination in a coated pill (Bendectin) blocked N/V, but did not -> falling asleep.

The interplay of the hormones, the nutrients needed to make them (along with the neurotransmitters) is mind-boggling.

You will find "conflicting" research as you go along.

Try to stick with "edu" (university websites) and the very latest research to document your book.

Complex...very!

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cactus
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Glad Marnie came along, hopefully that will be helpful.

I will look to see what if I can find some studies that I had several years ago... I believe they were done by one of the endo associations (although I think not the one by that name)...

I know there was some good info discussed at an endo conference several years ago, and there were links.

Endo is known to be associated with fibromyalgia... and we all know that that one is often misdiagnosed Lyme... so...

Will check for some research.

A post here might turn up something good too. Look for a member named Trails ... I think she may have originally posted the studies that I found as well.

Littlebit - glad you don't have endo. It is a nightmare.

Mine, by the way, is at last under control - even a hysterectomy had not helped... but Lyme and co treatment seems to have at last brought relief from the agony.

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Did you ever stop to think, and forget to start again? - A.A. Milne

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Lymetoo
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Definitely linked!! At least in MY book, coming from my experience!

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--Lymetutu--
Opinions, not medical advice!

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littlebit27
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Oh, I know it's horrible. I know 6 women with endo. I've seen their pain and everything else. I can't imagine having to deal with it alone let alone with it in conjunction to Lyme.

I sent the link to my friend, but I guess she is still not convinced that it could Lyme and friends related. Thanks for the information.

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*Brittany Lyme Aware on FB*
http://littlebithaslyme.wordpress.com/

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Shahbah
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Hum, if endometriosis is linked to lyme, then why does endometriosis usually go into remission after menopause but not lyme?
Also, endometriosis is linked to fibromyalgia, if endometriosis goes into remission, so would the fibro right? But fibro seems more common after menopause , which is the contrary of endometriosis...
More over, endometriosis does not affect men, like lyme does...So obviously, things must be a bit more complicated than just endometriosis=lyme=fibro...
Has anyone seen his endometriosiis go into remission with lyme treatment and before she reached menopause?...

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Lymetoo
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I think it's the inflammation that causes it .. and of course the hormones influence the remission.

--------------------
--Lymetutu--
Opinions, not medical advice!

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penguingirl
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I have endometriosis but I didn't know it could have been related.

I just thought the fatigue was due to the endo.

Grr...

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Liz D
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I had lots of issues, had all the usual tests then a D&C where the gynae said 'we found tissue that was suspicious, worrying and unknown'. Had a tottal hyster shortly after which triggered full blown lyme symptoms. Not only full blown lyme but menopause symptoms that werent helped by any patch, cream or pill. Its been a tough five years I can tell ya - so in my case, yes, definately related.

[ 01-26-2011, 03:51 PM: Message edited by: Liz D ]

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Jamers
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I have had endometriosis since I was 15 (Im 27) but I do not think I had Lyme then. I believe I got it 2 years ago. The funny thing that happened to me was that when I started Birth control to help endo. thats when I started getting Lyme symptoms. I thought it was the birth control giving me panic attacks, and headaches ect... So something in the birth control pill triggered Lyme.

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Diagnosed Pos. Lyme Nov. 17, 2010, Igx.
Pos. Babesia Duncani March 2011, Igx.
Clinical diagnosis for Bartonella

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elizzza811
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I suspect it's related to Lyme, because I had endometriosis. In fact, most of the endo tissue was found on the OUTSIDE of my bladder...

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Shahbah
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I would think endo definitely triggers lyme, not the reverse... However, i would curious to know how goes the lyme if endo goes into remission after menopause...
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