nefferdun
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 20157
posted
I just read that one doctor says 90% of his lyme patients have hypercoagulation - excessive blood clotting. This can be be related to the MTHFR mutation although he did not mention it in his article. I test high for hypercoagulation.
This doctor prescribes heparin to thin the blood. He says it is not only a blood thinner, it is also anti inflammatory and it kills bacteria. With thinner blood, medications can be assimilated better and your body can remove toxins better. You will have less pain, fatigue and brain fog.
The first year of treatment I used some of Zhang's herbs. I actually consulted with him on the phone and he recommended heparin to improve circulation so the other herbs could be absorbed better. I thought it was probably a waste of money as surely my circulation was just fine. I was wrong.
When I said in the past, I used massive amounts of herbs and they did not work. That is one explanation why. I do believe herbs work best in combination with abx if you are really sick but even the abx need the heparin to be properly assimilated. I think this might be another piece of the puzzle I have been missing.
-------------------- old joke: idiopathic means the patient is pathological and the the doctor is an idiot Posts: 4676 | From western Montana | Registered: Apr 2009
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posted
I had some notable improvement when I was on heprin.
My balance was better and my circulation.
Posts: 131 | From Maryland/USA | Registered: May 2011
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nefferdun
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I am very slow to catch on, Lymetoo. I guess that is because I am operating with half a brain and responsible for making almost all the decisions for my treatment. I just forget or don't understand. Then suddenly - OMG! So that is what I was missing!
I like to tell other people what I learn for three reasons:
1. It might help them. 2. It helps me to remember and. . . . 3. Maybe they will remind me later when I forget.
-------------------- old joke: idiopathic means the patient is pathological and the the doctor is an idiot Posts: 4676 | From western Montana | Registered: Apr 2009
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nefferdun
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posted
Talk about memory. . Zhang's remedy is circulation P, not heparin. I didn't know heparin needs a prescription. I have seen 4 doctors and they never mentioned it.
My thrombosis antithrombosis complex test was very high. This causes hypercoagulation. The normal is less than 4.7 and mine was nearly eleven.
-------------------- old joke: idiopathic means the patient is pathological and the the doctor is an idiot Posts: 4676 | From western Montana | Registered: Apr 2009
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Rumigirl
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Lymetoo, when you were on the heparin, did you do 1 5 ML syringe of heparin daily or what? How long did you do that? Very interesting! It makes sense.
nefferdun, so what you are talking about that helped you is the Zhang formula, not heparin?? If so, you probably got it confused, because Zhang's co name for his herbs is Hepapro. Or was that the name of one of his formulas?
Posts: 3771 | From around | Registered: Mar 2008
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posted
OH yes, heparin is a blood thinner, but it works on the fibrinogen. You would not get the same effect out of taking something like warfarin (coumadin) for example.
I don't think so, Rumigirl. It was prescribed according to how thick or thin your blood is. I took the shots twice a day for a month or two, then all of a sudden I began reacting to something in the shots.
So we switched to oral heparin troches. Worked great, but fairly expensive since it is a compound. The shots were not expensive at all.
I did that for maybe 3 yrs? Not sure. I should still be taking it, but the cost was too much. I then took Boluoke, which also got expensive if you ask me!
Heparin helped me with pain, brain fog and ?? .. uh... gotta think!!
it helps the abx get deeper into the tissues, so they work better too!
oh.. I think I have info on a compounded nasal spray with heparin.
-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96222 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
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Rumigirl
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Thank you, Lymetoo, that completely makes sense! I wonder how many LLMD's understand this. It's not the first time I heard it, but I never heard that much about it before---or heard anyone clearly say that it helped. Every little bit helps, and this sounds like it might be more than a little. Between the biofilm, the fibrinogin, and the hypercoaguation (the last two may be the same thing), it's a big deal.
Posts: 3771 | From around | Registered: Mar 2008
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nefferdun
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Lymetoo, when I see my GP (LLMD two months out), what type of heparin should I ask him to give me? I don't want to give myself shots. I am sure if I show him my test results he will give it to me. What are oral heparin troches?
I was going to just take baby aspirin until a LLMD appointment but that is too far away.
Did you have hypercoagulation or were you just taking it to help the abx ?
-------------------- old joke: idiopathic means the patient is pathological and the the doctor is an idiot Posts: 4676 | From western Montana | Registered: Apr 2009
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posted
Yes, I have hypercoagulation. Your doctor would have to have knowledge on how to handle the dosing. He/she would not prescribe it unless they knew what to "do with it."
Oral heparin is just heparin compounded into troches that you dissolve in your mouth.
Aspirin won't help hypercoagulation or fibrinogen.
You may be able to do a search here of old posts on heparin.
-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96222 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
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nefferdun
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I am posting as I discover. The following are quotes.
"His premise was that "the chronically ill patients have a coagulation regulatory protein defect" and that this may be the difference between those that get bit by an infected tick and recover completely and those that remain chronically ill and never recover. "
"He estimated effectiveness of various natural agents for hypercoagulation at: 50% - Bromelain 60% - Wobenzym 70% - Serrapeptase 80% - Nattokinase 95% - Lumbrokinase " (same as Boluke)
"Heparin is an agent that has been useful for many people dealing with hypercoagulation."
I am going to take lumbrokinase.
I also just discovered another common genetic mutation causes high iron levels and storage of iron -Ferritin. Both of my levels are very high. This is treated by "blood letting".
50% of diabetics have this mutation. My son was just diagnosed a year ago. The iron can affect the pancreas. I don't know how it affects lyme but it causes fatigue on it's own.
-------------------- old joke: idiopathic means the patient is pathological and the the doctor is an idiot Posts: 4676 | From western Montana | Registered: Apr 2009
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posted
Yes, take the lumbrokinase! Boluoke is the best brand. Proven to be effective.
-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96222 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
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Dekrator48
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Member # 18239
posted
I tried heparin, but I did not notice any benefit.
-------------------- The fibromyalgia I've had for 32 years was an undiagnosed Lyme symptom.
"For I know the plans I have for you", declares the Lord, "plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future". -Jeremiah 29:11 Posts: 6076 | From Pennsylvania, USA | Registered: Nov 2008
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Dekrator48
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I was on heparin for several months.
-------------------- The fibromyalgia I've had for 32 years was an undiagnosed Lyme symptom.
"For I know the plans I have for you", declares the Lord, "plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future". -Jeremiah 29:11 Posts: 6076 | From Pennsylvania, USA | Registered: Nov 2008
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nefferdun
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posted
My husband said he would dig some worms up for me. Anything to help out!
-------------------- old joke: idiopathic means the patient is pathological and the the doctor is an idiot Posts: 4676 | From western Montana | Registered: Apr 2009
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posted
Both of my Lyme family memebers were on sub-lingual heparin. We purchased through a compounding pharmacy, and insurance reimbursed at 80%.
They took it early in their tx, so not sure that it helped. Sure is a lot cheaper though than ground up worm guts.
The pharmacy we used is very knowledgable about Heparin therapy, and would talk to anyone about it. Not sure if they ship out of state though.
PM if anyone would like the name/number.
Posts: 333 | From Lyme Here Too | Registered: Mar 2010
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nefferdun
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Tincup, why the big fuss about eating worms? )
We are already full of worms, spirochetes, protozoa etc anyway. At least the bolouke is dead worms. And their guts are isolated in capsules.
I will get heparin when I can but in the meantime -
-------------------- old joke: idiopathic means the patient is pathological and the the doctor is an idiot Posts: 4676 | From western Montana | Registered: Apr 2009
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