posted
At least I hope we are on the right track. I've taken trazodone for at LEAST 10 yrs. I've had issues with my heart for 13 yrs... Dxd with A-fib 5 yrs ago.
I was referred to a pulmonologist to see about a sleep study because I keep waking up in the night with tachycardia and/or A-fib. My cardiologist said I may have sleep apnea and that can cause heart arrhythmias.
OK...
So the pulmonary guy tells me that traz is notorious for causing heart arrhythmias. HUH?? Why didn't my cardio know this? I even asked about it once.
He said that because he has more experience with this drug HE was the one who would know. (probably so)
So we are changing one med and tapering the traz.. then will add something else to the mix.
I'm excited to finally find this out and I wanted to warn you guys!
-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96222 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
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gigimac
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 33353
posted
Thanks for posting this. My husband recently started trazodone for sleep and shortly after has had heart pounding sensation, feeling like he couldn't breathe while sleeping. I noticed him snoring more loudly and gasping.
We are not 100% it is related but it sure seems like it could be. He is gonna stop the meds for now and see if it helps.
Posts: 1534 | From Greensboro NC | Registered: Aug 2011
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posted
You have to taper off. Thankfully, I have 50mg tablets so I can do it pretty easily.
-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96222 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
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Catgirl
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 31149
posted
Thanks for posting this Lymetoo. I have yet to find a cardiologist with a brain.
-------------------- --Keep an open mind about everything. Also, remember to visit ACTIVISM (we can change things together). Posts: 5418 | From earth | Registered: Mar 2011
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posted
You don't know how many times I have ended up in the ER over this!!
I do hope this is the answer!!
-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96222 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
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Keebler
Honored Contributor (25K+ posts)
Member # 12673
posted
- That could explain a LOT. When I was taking trazadone my heart rhythm was all over the place. I had cardiac testing, I was passing out a lot and no cardiologist could tell me anything.
They looked at me like I was from outer space, like they'd never seen someone with my symptoms before. This was after years of having lyme but just before the diagnosis of 3 TBD.
I've had terrible effects from about a half dozen (or more?) different Rx for sleep, even at very, very low dose. This was about a four year period, ending about 1997. I will never take another sleep Rx, ever, especially since there are so many other safer options.
This is why I post so often about sleep help that is not pharmaceutical. I was later shocked to find out that bad side-effects are not published. See next post.
"BAD PHARMA: How Drug Companies Mislead Doctors and Harm Patients"
Ben Goldacre, a medical doctor, wrote the "Bad Science" column for the Guardian (UK) from 2003 to 2011. His book, "Bad Science," has sold over 400,000 copies and has been published in 18 countries.
Ben Goldacre talks about the influence of the pharmaceutical industry in the global healthcare system and argues that pharmaceutical companies hide negative studies and use questionable testing and intensive lobbying to get what they want, regardless of whether the drugs they produce are good for patients.
Mr. Goldacre spoke about his book at Town Hall Seattle.
Aired on BOOK-TV Sunday, March 3rd at 7pm (ET) -- you can watch this presentation on line now, see the video link to the right of page
Sorry that one long like sends this post "wide" but I have found that the shorter "tiny url" links disappear over time. Like a parking meter just runs out. -
Posts: 48021 | From Tree House | Registered: Jul 2007
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Keebler
Honored Contributor (25K+ posts)
Member # 12673
posted
Thanks, kudzu and Keebler and thanks to those who PM'd me with info.
I've tried all kinds of natural things to help me sleep ... to no avail.
-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96222 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
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Keebler
Honored Contributor (25K+ posts)
Member # 12673
posted
- Once trazadone is out of your system, you should see some improvement. I sure did. Once all the sleep Rx were gone from my body, I did so much better.
Certainly circadian rhythm is complex. Still, I tend to like the late night hours. I know adrenal dysfunction plays into that but I just love being up, learning, exploring when it's quiet enough to think. I can't think if anyone else in the city is awake.
Very bad habits started in college and as a midnight radio DJ long ago - still, I wonder if genetics might play a role. I had an aunt whose internal clock was literally backwards. She did not fare well and I need to remember that - had forgotten about her until just now.
Some other things to consider, though, in my search of this matter:
Avoid all fluorescent lights, all day long (I know this may seem impossible but it's really important if we can do this). It's very stimulating & irritating to the nervous system.
Liver stress can cause heart rhythm irregularities, too.
I know you know most of this but for those new, just good to keep in mind. Toxicity load affects heart rhythm and sleep.
posted
I tried trazedone and had the same issue and stopped it. Some doctors just don't pay attention to side effects that may be rare.
I always google the meds I am prescribed and check for interactions with anything else I am taking.
I can't tell you how many times there is a problem with the meds interracting and the pharmacy or doctor never figure that out.
Hope you feel better soon!!
-------------------- Faithful
Just sharing my experience, I am not a doctor. Posts: 2682 | From Colorado | Registered: Oct 2009
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Keebler
Honored Contributor (25K+ posts)
Member # 12673
posted
- If the side-effects are hidden and not published, the doctors and pharmacists have no way to know. But they really should BELIEVE us when we tell them. There's no excuse for their not believing us.
It's a very pervasive effort by the pharmaceutical INDUSTRY to hide dangers. -
Posts: 48021 | From Tree House | Registered: Jul 2007
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Keebler
Honored Contributor (25K+ posts)
Member # 12673
posted
- Here's what would be so helpful (in my dreams, I know):
A nice swimming pool, just the right temperature in a modest, yet comfortable home.
A massage
A bed time story
And a serenade
I'd like to say a warm cup of milk with vanilla but dairy makes my sinuses swell and that interfers with sleep. All the "alternate" milks contain too many additives that make me speedy (and there is no "sleepy" with "speedy" at the controls).
So it's Peppermint Tea for me. -
Posts: 48021 | From Tree House | Registered: Jul 2007
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lpkayak
Honored Contributor (10K+ posts)
Member # 5230
posted
traz has been pushed on me so many times and i have tried it but i just dont like it...it seems i dont really wake up for 3 days after one pill
so i tried but dont take it anymore
-------------------- Lyme? Its complicated. Educate yourself. Posts: 13712 | From new england | Registered: Feb 2004
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posted
I would freak everyone out if I told you how much I used to take!!
-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96222 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
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nonna05
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 33557
posted
What else is working for sleep?
Didn't like trazadone this time, but 20 years ago I did a 3 month run with it and did fine....
Maybe because I hadn't had this fight to find answers ,get well etc. at that time I didn't notice or care.... Just wanted other issue overwith..
I think When I tried it about 8 years ago for only 5 days is when my ears started ringing (R).
I also had an ear infection that they didn't catch for a week....not sure what /which started it.
So much worse now....the hissing/ringing gets so loud sometimes I have to listen to somethingthrough ear plugs do distract myself from how frustrating it is.
I've had little signs of the above once in a while.. Does it affect Qt factor also?
?
Posts: 2563 | From Denver,CO | Registered: Aug 2011
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Rumigirl
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 15091
posted
quote:Originally posted by Lymetoo: At least I hope we are on the right track. I've taken trazodone for at LEAST 10 yrs. I've had issues with my heart for 13 yrs... Dxd with A-fib 5 yrs ago.
I was referred to a pulmonologist to see about a sleep study because I keep waking up in the night with tachycardia and/or A-fib. My cardiologist said I may have sleep apnea and that can cause heart arrhythmias.
OK...
So the pulmonary guy tells me that traz is notorious for causing heart arrhythmias. HUH?? Why didn't my cardio know this? I even asked about it once.
He said that because he has more experience with this drug HE was the one who would know. (probably so)
So we are changing one med and tapering the traz.. then will add something else to the mix.
I'm excited to finally find this out and I wanted to warn you guys!
Good grief, Lymetoo!! That's unreal! Why the heck do so few drs understand the side-effects of meds!! I ALWAYS look up about
any med before I fill it---and many times thereafter---to figure out how it works, what the side-effects are, whether I will likely not be able to take it, what to watch out for, etc. I am sooo sensitive to meds!
So many drs have told me, "That (symptom) can't possibly be from that med," when it's right there in the PDR. I am always having to be my own dr, as many of us are. Frustrating.
Posts: 3771 | From around | Registered: Mar 2008
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Razzle
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 30398
posted
I was given a very low dose of Traz. for chronic pain. It made the pain worse, and gave me a headache to boot! Blech!
I come to find out I have a hard time detoxing antidepressants (DetoxiGenomic test from Genova Diagnostics)... No wonder I got a headache!
-------------------- -Razzle Lyme IgM IGeneX Pos. 18+++, 23-25+, 30++, 31+, 34++, 39 IND, 83-93 IND; IgG IGeneX Neg. 30+, 39 IND; Mayo/CDC Pos. IgM 23+, 39+; IgG Mayo/CDC Neg. band 41+; Bart. (clinical dx; Fry Labs neg. for all coinfections), sx >30 yrs. Posts: 4166 | From WA | Registered: Feb 2011
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posted
When I first went on it, I didn't notice any changes in my heart issues. I knew the risk was there... same with many other drugs.
You never know if it's a minor risk or a major one. This Dr said it's a MAJOR offender and big cause of heart attacks. Had I known THAT, I would not have taken it!
-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96222 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
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posted
Yes, they gave me that when I had my first heart episode. Knocked me right out. I was supposed to take it during the day!
I knew it was very addictive, so I wanted off as soon as possible.
I do take time released melatonin too.
-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96222 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
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map1131
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 2022
posted
Tutu, you were probably up to the 6 at bedtime, like I was when I was on traz. I didn't start out with 6.
Started with 2, that worked for a couple months, then increased up and up. Then 6 no longer worked either. I would guess I was on it for 2-3 yrs before I weaned off.
Still had to find something for insomnia and nothing natural helped. Melatonin...beware if your have thyroid disease. It sent me into a Tazmainian devil, like doing speed.
Pam
-------------------- "Never, never, never, never, never give up" Winston Churchill Posts: 6478 | From Louisville, Ky | Registered: Jan 2002
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posted
OH man... Going OFF this stuff is kicking my butt! Any advice?
-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96222 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
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annxyzz
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 20404
posted
I would consider taurine amino acid . I have used it - very calming ( have to have enough Vit B6 ) or Gaba .
-------------------- annxyzz Posts: 1178 | From East Texas | Registered: May 2009
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nefferdun
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 20157
posted
I feel for you. Insomnia is horrible and getting off a chemical sleeping pill is hell.
GABA will help. Methyl B12 and folate will help too. Just in case you are CBS positive, avoid foods with sulfur which leads to excitotoxicity. That would be meat, eggs, cabbage family, soy etc.
Jujube seeds and corydallis root are the best natural sleep aid I have used but nothing affects hard core insomnia that is caused from an infection like bartonella or protomyxzoa so you need to address that first.
-------------------- old joke: idiopathic means the patient is pathological and the the doctor is an idiot Posts: 4676 | From western Montana | Registered: Apr 2009
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Antidepressants cause bradycardia and heart block in GD 13 rat embryos in vitro. (April 2012)
Excerpts:
. . . . One drug, trazodone, caused arrhythmia consistent with blockade of the hERG (human ether-a-go-go related gene) potassium channel. . . .
. . . The least margin of safety was seen with the tricyclic antidepressants and the serotonin antagonist and reuptake inhibitor trazodone. . . . (end excerpts)
---------------
Also realize that the "over" dose for some may be quite lower, especially for those with liver &/or kidney stress (nearly everyone with lyme) because metabolism can be altered. Many with lyme are very sensitive to even tiny doses of certain pharmaceuticals in this class so it can take less to "over" dose, so to speak.
Some meds that cause heart rhythm problems can do so by lowering magnesium or blocking glutathione, etc. So if the sooner the underlying CAUSE(s) can be addressed, the better. The LLMD must be part of this investigative endeavor. -
Posts: 48021 | From Tree House | Registered: Jul 2007
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Keebler
Honored Contributor (25K+ posts)
Member # 12673
posted
- TuTu,
1. Taurine also upsets my stomach but I forgot all about that until you posted. Thanks for that note. Maybe a different form of it or mixed in with other things - or primarily from food sources - may work better, and WITH food. Just be sure to at least get enough from food.
2. Regarding pain, Berberine has been absolutely remarkable for me to reduce pain, tremendously.
I run out often, so I've been able to test this out. Each time I've off it for a while the pain gets much worse, nearly intolerable. When I finally get more ordered, after a few days, it's remarkably better again.
It might be of help to you. I find this helps in so many ways. It's a very bad habit that I run out so often. I need to put this at top priority.
Thanks, again, to MARNIE (who is on a bit of a break from lymenet) for bringing this to my attention.
I prefer the one that is free of any dyes, from Tahoma Clinic:
"Trazodone-induced cardiac arrhythmias: a report of two cases."
What do you click on?
-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96222 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
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Keebler
Honored Contributor (25K+ posts)
Member # 12673
posted
- NEFFERDUM,
Q: What is "CBS" ?
as in your note above "Just in case you are CBS positive, avoid foods with sulfur which leads to excitotoxicity. That would be meat, eggs, cabbage family, soy etc." (end quote) -
Posts: 48021 | From Tree House | Registered: Jul 2007
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Keebler
Honored Contributor (25K+ posts)
Member # 12673
posted
- TuTu,
Sorry.
You might go back to the PubMed search result page. I think that was about #2 or #3 down & the link only connects to the basic details of the article title, authors, etc. -- not the article text or even the abstract.
Were I to have some energy, I might take the authors, or the date and cross search with the title to see if a better link might come through with a Google Advanced Search.
I left it as only a glimpse, though, so that others who wanted to track it down. Often with such other detail, a better link can be found but I'm rarely have energy or attention span to cover all the bases. -
Posts: 48021 | From Tree House | Registered: Jul 2007
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posted
Thanks.. I think CBS has something to do with sulfur sensitivity but I don't know what the letters mean.
-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96222 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
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Keebler
Honored Contributor (25K+ posts)
Member # 12673
posted
- nefferdum mentions Jujube seeds & Corydalis. Jujube is also called Zizyphus. Both have links here (especially in Heparpo's HerbSom). And Seven Forests has a nice Zizyphus formula:
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