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» LymeNet Flash » Questions and Discussion » Medical Questions » The difference between Mino and berberine and much more

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Author Topic: The difference between Mino and berberine and much more
Marnie
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Both look to decrease iNOS and work in many similar ways, but Mino interferes with remyelination (see link below).

http://www.psychiatrictimes.com/articles/there-role-minocycline-neurodegenerative-disease-treatment

http://www.biomedcentral.com/1471-2202/7/78

Minocycline *reduces remyelination* by

***suppressing ciliary neurotrophic factor*** expression

after cuprizone-induced demyelination. J Neurochem. 2013 May 7.

Compared to:

Four weeks after berberine administration (20 mg/kg i.p. once per day for 1 week), the thickness of remyelinated axons improved approximately 1.4-fold in the distal stump of the injury site.

Taken together, these results indicate that berberine promotes neurite extension and

***axonal regeneration in injured nerves*** of the PNS.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3308712/


http://www.ihop-net.org/UniPub/iHOP/pm/1573210.html?nr=8&pmid=9753298 for info. on ciliary neurotrophic factor expression.


http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3308712/

They both look to impact:


inflammation in murine microglia (N9)

N9 retroviral immortalized microglial…

http://www.jneuroinflammation.com/content/pdf/1742-2094-9-115.pdf

retroviral?

N9 =

neuraminidase antigen of subtype N9 from
an avian ***influenza virus***

Prior exposure to influenza A or type B looks to cross react with HTLV-1:

"Furthermore, while the pol gene of HTLV has remarkable sequence homologies with that of other type C retroviruses (9), the Pol-3 amino acid sequence did not show homology to pol protein from other retroviruses.

Instead, considerable homology (Fig. 5) was observed with

neuraminidase,

a surface glycoprotein of influenza virus A and B virions (4).

Thus, it is conceivable that the antibody responsiveness to Pol-3 in normal donors could have been due to

prior exposure to influenza virus.

http://jvi.asm.org/content/65/4/1870.full.pdf

In response to those viruses...

We observed an increase in active TGF-beta levels within 1 day in mice infected with influenza virus.

***Further studies showed that the neuraminidase glycoprotein of influenza A and B viruses directly

activates latent TGF-beta in vitro. ***

There are sufficient levels of TGF-beta activated by virus to induce apoptosis in cells.

In addition, influenza virus-induced apoptosis is partially inhibited by TGF-beta-specific antibodies.

These novel findings suggest a potential role for

activation of TGF-beta during the host response to influenza virus infection, specifically apoptosis.

This is the first report showing direct activation of

***latent TGF-beta

by a viral protein.***

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC190955/

Transforming growth factor-beta (TGF-β), a multifunctional cytokine regulating several immunologic processes,

is expressed by virtually all cells as a biologically inactive molecule termed latent TGF-β (LTGF-β).

We have previously shown that TGF-β activity increases during influenza virus infection in mice and suggested that the neuraminidase (NA) protein mediates this activation.

http://www.plospathogens.org/article/info%3Adoi%2F10.1371%2Fjournal.ppat.1001136

HTLV-1 bZIP factor enhances TGF-β signaling through p300 coactivator.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21705495

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transforming_growth_factor_beta READ!!!

Bottom line..IF p8 = HTLV-1 which activates TGF-B like several viruses do...

"Berberine is also on our list of things which lower transforming growth factor Beta-1 (TGFB-1), a factor that may increase risk of metastasis of some cancers. Thus if test results for TGFB-1 are high, berberine is often our first choice in supplements that may lower it."

http://www.denvernaturopathic.com/berberineandradiationgastritis.htm

CONCLUSIONS:

Our findings provided new evidence that berberine is an effective inhibitor of the metastatic potential of A549 cells through

suppression of TGF-beta1-induced epithelial-to-mesenchymal.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24456611
2014

Minocycline ALSO looks to downregulate TGF-B:

http://mcr.aacrjournals.org/content/11/10/1279.abstract

Above is one of many links.

BUT...the main difference between Berberine and Minocycline appears to be remyelination after "insult".

And berberine does look to help those with MS who have demyelination happening. (Google: berberine MS)

Most MS relapses either get better or improve greatly when the immune reaction subsides and the demyelinated lesion repairs itself.

This process of remyelination is carried out by a type of stem cell present in all of us called an oligodendrocyte precursor cell (OPC).

In response to demyelination, OPCs multiply, migrate to the area of damage and then mature into an oligodendrocyte which makes a new myelin sheath to surround the nerves again - a process called remyelination.

http://www.mstrust.org.uk/information/opendoor/articles/1208_08_09.jsp

Although good old ASA very recently was found to increase CNTF (ciliary neurotrophic factor) in astrocytes.

And recently I read where good old ASA impacts candida biofilms too!

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15216946


Involvement of GABAa receptors in AD, Parkinson's and MS and RA...

http://link.springer.com/article/10.1007%2Fs00726-011-1193-7

Berberine impacts "anxiety" via impacting 5HT receptors (specific ones)and altering levels of other neurotransmitters also.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15350820

Berberine is linked to salutaridine which is linked to GABAA also (agonist).

Berberine (et al) inhibits an enzyme called CYP2D6

There is considerable variation in the efficiency and amount of CYP2D6 enzyme produced between individuals!!!

Let me tell you why knowing more about that enzyme is extremely important:


…a 2-year-old boy who received acetaminophen/codeine and
died 2 days after adenotonsillectomy.

He was found to have

functional duplication of the CYP2D6 allele (UM phenotype).

These polymorphisms are described as four phenotypes: poor metabolizers (PM); intermediate metabolizers (IM); extensive metabolizers (EM);

and ultra-rapid metabolizers (UM).

Codeine -> morphine = respiratory depression.

This enzyme also metabolizes several endogenous substances such as *hydroxytryptamines* and neurosteroids.

Serotonin or *5-hydroxytryptamine* (5-HT)

That enzyme (inhibited) MIGHT impact Tamoxifen "success" - a METABOLITE OF Tamoxifen (which happens when it is broken down)...is the "active" chemical to arrest breast cancer.

Sooo...it is extremely important to discuss with your doctor the use of berberine in conjunction with OTHER Rx's and OTHER supplements!!!

BTW...

"To reduce the risk of benign intracranial hypertension, concomitant treatment with tetracyclines and vitamin A or retinoids, such as isotretinoin, is contraindicated."

http://www.tga.gov.au/hp/msu-2013-06.htm#minocycline

This includes minocycline.

Now...sometimes there are antibodies to CYP2D6!!!

Molecular mimicry at the B-cell level between a structural motif of CYP2D6 and HCV proteins could explain the production of anti-LKM1 antibodies in HCV-infected patients.

HCV is linked to HeLa cells (immortal)...

"HCV core protein on the NF-κB signaling in
HeLa and HepG2 cells"

And we know Bb can attach to and some can infect HeLa cells...(linked previously).

"Biological assessment of Berberis vulgaris and its Active Constituent, Berberine: B) Antibacterial, antifungal and anti HCV effect"

http://www.researchgate.net/publication/255708731_Biological_assessment_of_Berberis_vulgaris_and_its_Active_Constituent_Berberine_B)_Antibacterial_antifungal_and_anti_HCV_effect

http://www.diabetesaction.org/site/PageNavigator/complementary_4_12.html scroll down to in 2010...


I know...complex!

Posts: 9424 | From Sunshine State | Registered: Mar 2001  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
VV
LymeNet Contributor
Member # 38828

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So... you are saying take berberine, but not in conjunction with minocycline?
Posts: 922 | From Philadelphia | Registered: Sep 2012  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
   

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