Senators Joe Biden (D-DE) and John Warner (R-VA) debate the war in Iraq. Biden is the ranking Democrat on the Foreign Relations Committee and Warner is the chairman of the Armed Services Committee.
Recap: Biden says the war in Iraq is not lost but that we have a ``six month window to get it right''. The military cannot sustain current troop levels in Iraq for the long term. The question is not if but how we draw down troops. Biden calls the recent ``sense of the Senate'' resolution a ``vote of no confidence'' towards this administration.
Senator Biden harshly criticizes the progress made in training Iraqi security services saying we have ``squandered a year and a half''. Iraq has no officer corps or command and control. Biden again recounted his discussions with officers who have told the Senator they need more troops. He now calls his vote to authorize the war a ``mistake''.
Biden took the administration to task for hyping intelligence and misleading the public into war. He cited numerous occasions in which senior administration officials used language that implied something other than what the intelligence community tried to convey when assessing the Iraqi threat.
Warner says he thinks the U.S. can maintain current troop levels in Iraq for the next two years. The Senator charges that General Pace referred to Biden's claim of troop sustainability as ``inaccurate''.
Warner: ``We should not be establishing any timetable with regard to our withdrawal.'' He calls for more accountability from the administration regarding their strategy for victory in Iraq and that they should present their findings every 90 days before Congress.
Warner discussed a closed door meeting he had with ten field commanders serving in Iraq. He gave no specifics, but said they discussed the use of improvised explosive devices. Russert leaned heavily on Warner to admit that his comments regarding Hussein possessing WMD were wrong. The Senator stood by his statements. In his judgment, the President would not intentionally mislead the public.
Biden cleaned the administration's clock. I haven't seen someone prepared like that in a long time. Apparently he brought with him a stack of papers documenting the assertions made by the administration along with his own statements in the run-up to the war. Listening to Biden, anyone but the blind faithful should have their own questions about how the intelligence was used. Whomever you blame for getting it wrong, something terrible happened and nothing less than our national security has been compromised.
I give points to Lugar for making a tough case, but we should all be looking for answers.Posts: 8337 | From the other shore | Registered: Jul 2002
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LymeOjai
Unregistered
posted
Mo,
Biden cleaned the administration's clock. I haven't seen someone prepared like that in a long time. Apparently he brought with him a stack of papers documenting the assertions made by the administration along with his own statements in the run-up to the war. Listening to Biden, anyone but the blind faithful should have their own questions about how the intelligence was used. Whomever you blame for getting it wrong, something terrible happened and nothing less than our national security has been compromised.
I've read the transcript of the Biden - Warner interview on Meet the Press and I couldn't find the italicized comments anywhere. Are these your opinions or someone elses?
I personally didn't get the sense of Biden "cleaning the administration's clock", anymore than I did of Warner championing the administration.
I thought both Senators spoke well of the differences they perceived in our handling of intel, they were pretty much divided down political lines.
The real clarity I got from the "Meet the Press" discussion came quite late in the interview when Biden made it clear his intention to run for President in 2008, again drawing the political line between he and the conservative view.
The politicalization (is that a word?) of this war is enough to make me want to puke (sorry Marine Corps phrase). We're again spending all this time advertising to our sworn enemy our division as a people.
We broadcast our intentions to the very people who are attempting to end our way of life, all in for the sake of political gain. This crap drives me NUTS!!! (am I allowed to say crap?)
How were we able to successfully prosecute the last declared war?? We turned the fighting over to the military and the people stood behind the decisions made by the field commanders and the commander-in-chief.
Why have we lost (a tie in terms of war is a loss) two of the last three major conflicts we've fought? Political division amongst the people.
We have not lost a major fight on the battle-field since we were pushed south out of the Chosin Reservoir, yet we've been defeated as a nation on two occasions.
My great-grandfather was a Republican and he used to tell us that he voted for FDR mainly because we were at war. He didn't think it right to change horses in mid-stream, he sure didn't like Roosevelt.
I doubt seriously that the parents of young men killed at Anzio or Iwo Jima felt the loss of their loved ones any less than those of today's war.
lymie tony z
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 5130
posted
I watched it sunday also...
and I did'nt get the sense that either one cleaned the others clock...
Good try ole girl...but NOT!
AND once again it don't much matter how we got their at this point...
The point is to kick some *** and show the muslim radicals we ain't gonna take their CRAP!
NOT before not now........not ever!
"United States" should mean just that....
Don't be given dem boys/n girls over there two different signals....
-------------------- I am not a doctor...opinions expressed are from personal experiences only and should never be viewed as coming from a healthcare provider. zman Posts: 2527 | From safety harbor florida(origin Cleve., Ohio | Registered: Jan 2004
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(that word looks good to me, but that's not saying much)
of this war is enough to make me want to puke (sorry Marine Corps phrase).
I agree. I see there are Dems thinking of '06/'08 elections and prostituting their responsibilities as senators in speaking to that end.
However, in all honesty.. I also see this in full force from our administrators, and the Commander in Chief.. and the White House administrators which is also very disturbing.
This is a view that I now wonder if you guys get in activity, that has been emitted from the White House since day one and amplufied during the '04 elections.. and I think it does have considerable puke triggering effects.. seriously, from anyone this is deplorable during War Time..this politicalization.
Biden? I don't know enough about him. I haven't thought ahead to '08., too much to worry about now --
but if I had to pick any of the Democrats to support on a dime right now, it would be Barach Obama. Unfortunately, I don't think he is in the running but you never know. I see no republican in the horizon I personally would support, but allot can happen in three years. Then again, it may (for me) be another 'lesser of two evils vote' ..but I am hoping for more.
However, in the discussion surounding pre-War Iraq intelligence, I think at least in this interview, Biden had allot to present for consideration, and I do not se many considering it seriously who are in the 'Bush camp' here. These issues clearly deserve at least some examination.
In addition, time and time again, the Administration has had the opportunity to level with the American people. Unfortunately, they haven't been willing to do that.
Presidents Roosevelt and Truman led America to victory in World War II because they laid out a clear plan for success to the American people, America's allies, and America's troops. I believe that is at the heart of the differneces here, on top of the fact these were different circumstances and the enemy of a much different nature.
"We're again spending all this time advertising to our sworn enemy our division as a people."
Agreed agian and this really worries me.
I want to ask you what things you (in your opinion) attribute that division to?
Mo
Posts: 8337 | From the other shore | Registered: Jul 2002
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LymeOjai
Unregistered
posted
Mo,
"I want to ask you what things you (in your opinion) attribute that division to"?
Your question deserves serious consideration. Let me think it over and I'll respond. I don't like to knee-jerk this type of stuff.
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