"Antigens of Lyme disease of spirochaete Borrelia burgdorferi inhibits antigen or mitogen-induced lymphocyte proliferation."
Chiao JW, Pavia C, Riley M, Altmann-Lasekan W, Abolhassani M, Liegner K, Mittelman A.
Department of Medicine, New York Medical College, Valhalla 10595.
Modulation of cellular immune responses by the spirochaete Borrelia burgdorferi, the bacteria that causes Lyme disease, was demonstrated.
When cultured in the presence of sonicated Borrelia preparation (Bb), the mitogen-or antigen-stimulated proliferative responses of normal lymphocytes were consistently lowered.
Bb caused the greatest reduction in Concanavalin A (ConA) or antigen-stimulated proliferation, where almost 100% reduction in proliferation could be achieved.
Bb also reduced phytohemagglutinin-M (PHA) or pokeweed mitogen (PWM)-stimulated peripheral blood lymphocyte (PBL) proliferation, with the PWM proliferation being the least affected.
This regulatory activity was not due to toxicity and was determined to be caused by Bb protein antigens. The degree of the proliferation reduction was directly proportional to both Bb quantity and length of exposure to lymphocytes.
IL-2 production was significantly reduced from Bb-exposed lymphocytes. The entry of lymphocytes into the proliferating phases of the cell cycle was also shown to be blocked.
These results have demonstrated an immune suppressive mechanism of B. burgdorferi. The magnitude of host immune responses may be dependent on the degree of suppression which is related to the spirochaete quantity and their length of presence in the host.
PMID: 8173554 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
keywords -
*antigen - the target of an antibody, such as bacteria
*mitogen - an agent, such as bacteria, that produces mitosis (the process of cell division)
*lymphocytes (B & T cells)
although my lyme serology has been equivocal at best i did recently undergo an immunological workup which showed lymphocyte mitogen levels to be very low.
my test scores - (cpm - counts per minute)
PHA (phytohemagglutinin) stimulation - 37,465 cpm
normal range >78,000 cpm
PHA is predominantly a T cell mitogen.
CON A (concanavalin A) stimulation - 19,794 cpm
normal ragne >45,000 cpm
CON A is a predominantly T cell mitogen.
PWM (pokeweed mitogen) - 15,915 cpm
normal range >51,000 cpm
PWM is a predominantly B cell mitogen which requires T helper cells to induce proliferation.
these lymphocyte mitogen responses are generally non-specific and does not indicate immunity to a specific antigen.
impaired mitogenic resposes are specifically encountered in immunodeficiecy diseases and other immunocompromised states.
ultimatley i think that this is good evidence that borrelia infection does unequivocally create an aquired immunodeficiency which goes way beyond mere spirochetal infection.
quote:
Originally posted by zipzip:
ultimatley i think that this is good evidence that borrelia infection does unequivocally create an aquired immunodeficiency which goes way beyond mere spirochetal infection.
This sounds like you're saying that if I get a cold or the flu, that it will take the immune system correspondingly longer to combat it?
This is a step towards AIDS then, is it not?
Any list members noticed any trends on duration of non-spirochetal infections?
For example, have you had a cold or the flu for a longer period than usual?
Michael
quote:
Originally posted by cmichaelo:
This sounds like you're saying that if I get a cold or the flu, that it will take the immune system correspondingly longer to combat it?l
yes. as determined by immuno-incompetency as consistent with duration of borrelia infection.
i have had 2 cases of chronic sinusitis, for example, during my time with Lyme.
I still think some of us suffered from a sub-clinical immune deficientcy prior to borrelia exposure---there's plenty of proof to back up my assumption
Could very well be a reason why many of us present as auto-immune, while many others do not.
Most healthy immune systems will literally go into *overdrive* fighting the borrelia
Hence, elavated IgG subclasses, and elavated IgM classes, and circulating immune complexes
To the uninformed....that shouts "AUTOIMMUNE"----they never look for an infectious agent that would cause the immune system to mount an attack in this manner---and this is WHAT the immune system is ment to do.
So it gets labeled auto-immune--since neurologist are not trained to recconize the infectious pathology of many neurologicial disease states....and are just too darn lazy to try!!!
Now back to immune deficientcys, or an immune deficient state:
Do notice all the co-factors that many lyme sufferers share.....not just Lyme and other TBD co-infections
Having to deal with molds, funguses, metals, dental infections, staph, strep, mycoplasmas, multiple viral titers that are off the wall, parasites, morgellons like syndrome...I could go on
But I won't...suffice it to say....most immune comptent people don't have the problems dealing with some of the above listed agents that we all ( or most) seem to!!
Lyme is capable of immune supression...no doubt in my allied health mind (PharmD)
But can it cause a permanent aquired mutation?
Immuno-supressed borrelia patients present with a b-cell defect--per common immune status testing measures---bet your glad to hear that! Huh?
For your further reading pleasure, check out the google combo's below
CVID and Toxoplasmosis
CVID and Babesia
CVID and Erlichia
CVID and Bartonella
Lots of immuno-supressive/possiably immune destructive agents that many of us are dealing with
Intialily, the immune system mounts one hell of an attack with regards to the above infectious agents.....this lack of immune responce, or immune recconiztion(SP) later in the disease state, has been linked to those who are late-stage, chronic infection--the worst of us
Does borrelia "Really" invade the immune system?(yes, we have proof positive of that factoid-it enters both the red and white cells and literally destroys the cell---simple explaination...I know!!)) But can it be truly Evasive?(no, or your body would not recconize the pathogen and mount a response in the first place---ever)
Can it cloak it'self--yes, but not be truly evasive--it uses the lipids and clotting factors within us to evade the immune system--so in and of it'self...it doesn't just slink around the immune system unnoticed.
Is that the aquired mutation that triggers CVID and other immune deficientcys???
What's first? The chicken or the Egg?
I'm playing the Devils' advocate here....since I happen to appreciate Zip's posting of abstracts that are both Yey, and nay--with regards to some well loved current lyme beliefs
You gotta look at it from both angles
Many are not getting well--maybe we need to start addressing the immune system more
And not with just supplements and detoxes'
i have heard IVIG has been successful for chronic neuro lyme even with discontinuation of antibiotic which begs the question of autoimmune/post lyme syndrome.
or at the least a state where the spirochete level is low and the borrelia is non-active... with the exception of the damage it has already done to the immune systme and CNS.
the pathology is the same - borrelia. but the manifestation is different due to the primary/secondary (chicken/egg) immune dysfunction.
yankee - how long did you do IVIG for CVID before you noticed a marked difference in symptomology?
and did you continue on abx? (also had you previously done the rounds of co-infection treatment?)
btw - my IgG sublevels were low, not high. indicative of suppression and not being able to mount an immune response, not being overactive.
but the CD3 circulating immune complex was high at the same time. the 'unknown' infection(s) winning.
one ID doc, even with all my immunological testing in, still does not believe it is/was either Lyme (at least not anymore if ever) or a post Lyme syndrome but Chronic fatigue Syndrome (with an unknown etiology).
he wouldn't budge on this point (still he wants to test me for syphillis???).
yankee - i would like to email you if you would post your address....
Sent an e-mail to what I believe was your account....so search your accounts and let me know
It didn't get returned
[This message has been edited by zipzip (edited 14 February 2005).]
Cholesterol levels drop before WBCs rise.
The body dumps this acidic compound to try to fight the infection...as fast as possible...until the army is ready.
It takes calcium and MAGNESIUM to make immunoglobulins!
http://www.mdschoice.com/elements/elements/major_minerals/magnesium.htm
Look at what "autoimmune" diseases were cured by what...
http://patft.uspto.gov/netacgi/nph-Parser?Sect1=PTO2&Sect2=HITOFF&p=1&u=/netahtml/search-bool.html&r=1&f=G&l=50&co1=AND&d=ptxt&s1=6,248,368.WKU.&OS=PN/6,248,368&RS=PN/6,248,368
[This message has been edited by Marnie (edited 14 February 2005).]
Which, if any, magnesium products would increase blood flow to the brain or reduce Lyme encephalopathy? Thank you.
b
YIB
[This message has been edited by yankee in black (edited 16 February 2005).]
When the pathogens are killed (cell wall destroyed)- even by our own antibodies - this causes the body to become very toxic (acidic). This puts a tremendous strain on the kidneys...to maintain the pH balance. Too acidic = healthy cells destroyed too.
Less more often. The turtle wins the race. See Valletta's patent for TIMING issues.
Then look closely at my nutshell post re: what INactivates PFK. (Mg - ATP is supposed to do this under healthy circumstances.)
If you are unable to exercise, Dr. B's guidelines recommend CoQ10. My nutshell post explains why this is important. CoQ10 supplements are usually made with Rice Bran or Soybean oil...which contain...
Once again, do NOT overdo this!!!
For guidelines, into a search engine type in "CoQ10 cancer" (which also uses sugar for energy). Once again, timing is very, very important. Sorry this supp. is not cheap...at least the good ones.
[This message has been edited by Marnie (edited 16 February 2005).]
And then I came here, and now I'm checking into the possibility of it being Lyme. I have my first appt. on Friday, so hopefully the doctor can shed some light on this.
If I do have Lyme, it has affected my immune system. That's why I think IVIG helped me slightly. I catch just about everything going around (colds and flu, etc) and have it twice as long as everyone else.
Very interesting...