I am currently on mepron/zith and want to add in these herbs- I have them.
I did 5 drops of samento yesterday. I was wondering if I need to space out the samento/cumanda/burber or can i take them all at once?
The goal is to get up to 15 drops 2x a day of each (I didn't read the burber bottle, so maybe that is different)?
Also, do I have to space them out from meds, vitamins, other herbs? I am taking bromelain, will start nattokinase and serrapeptase. I also take fish oil, NAC, B-complex and extra folic acid, baby aspirin, and probiotics and cholestepure (for detox).
thanks!
Posted by klutzo (Member # 5701) on :
Sounds like you need to read the Cowden Protocol ASAP!
Burbur is taken after meals only, if I remember correctly, and the dose is always ten drops. (It's been a long time since I did the Cowden).
Samento and Cumanda should be seperated from each other by 30 mins. and from food by 30 mins.
Cumanda is used for two months before even starting Samento, unless you have no yeast issues, and the dosage is 20 drops, twice daily.
Quina is used for two months before starting Cumanda, unless you are absolutely sure you do not have Babesia.
Samento should be started at only one drop and worked up very slowly,increasing by one drop every 3 days, esp. if you are also taking ABX. Otherwise, you could have a herx that could be dangerous and damage your organs. This is esp. important if you have any heart issues.
Please go to www.samento.com.ec, click on lyme borreliosis library and read the Cowden Protocol. Hopefully, it is still there, if not Google it and print it out. It is quite complicated, and there are supplements you must take too, like bromelain and magnesium.
You only need one of either bromelain, nattokinase, or serrapeptase, not all of them. Since they are very expensive, esp. the last two, no need to waste them.
Good luck, Klutzo
Posted by maureen2174 (Member # 11471) on :
oh, okay thanks! i can't do the whole cowden protocol now, just wanted to try those 3 things.
i'll read about it though before going any further. i figured i would try samento first since i have been on cats claw already, but I guess that isn't the best thing to do.
thanks!
Posted by maureen2174 (Member # 11471) on :
i was under the impression that nattokinase and serrapeptase did do different things? i asked about these in a post recently.
i have genetic factors involved in hypercoagulation, so i need to address this.
thanks
Posted by disturbedme (Member # 12346) on :
From what I read, you don't have to take Quina before Cumanda. From what I read, you start with Cumanda, then after 18 days switch to Samento and then also add in Quina.
Go very slow with drops though, since this stuff can be powerful.
And yes, Cumanda, Samento and Quina need to be seperated by at least 20 minutes. They also need to be seperated from Burbur and Pinella. But Burbur and Pinella can be taken together as they are both detox herbs. Posted by maureen2174 (Member # 11471) on :
why do you have to take cumanda before samento?
I think a lot of people are just taking samento- is it more effective to take the cumanda before samento?
thanks
Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
Here is a study on the Cowden herbs and a chart on when to take them.
I take Cumanda, 2 times daily, 30 drops, 30 minutes before breakfast and dinner.
Samento before bed, 20 drops.
I take burbur 10 drops right before breakfast and dinner and right after breakfast and dinner.
These dosages are off the chart from Dr. H's study.
You start Cumanda before Samento just to be able to ramp up and observe any reaction.
Quina is alternated with Cumanda, two weeks one, 36 hours off, then two weeks of the others.
Posted by maureen2174 (Member # 11471) on :
thank you very much! are you doing the whole protocol or just the cumanda, samento, burber, and quina?
is it helping you?
thanks again!
Posted by CherylSue (Member # 13077) on :
Maureen, You can take the cumanda, samento, and/or burbur with abx. I certainly do. The handout given by Bionatus Labs mentions, I think, that there are no drug reactions.
However, there is a chart to show which of the Nutramedix herbs cannot be mixed together. You need to separate them by at least 30 minutes, preferably 2 hours. This info is found on the nutramedix.cc Ecuador site.
Cumanda is stronger than samento, and has a broader spectrum that covers viral and yeast microbes. You can add samento later. I started cumanda in July and I had terrible herxes. Now I can take 19 drops/twice daily. Go slowly with either one.
Also, take burbur for detox. It really helps with your herxing. You can take 8-10 drops every 10 minutes if the herxes are bad. You'll know by the fatigue and malaise. I also take it as a sedative to help me sleep at night.
Dr. H did a study using both abx and the Cowden protocol. He found combined or following ABX therapy it was very effective. The Cowden protocol used alone is only moderately effective. He did state that this protocol is not effective for babesia.
Quina is quinine and can cause hearing loss. I think it also can affect the kidneys. Some people cannot tolerate quinine at all. In March Nutrmedix is coming out with Enula that is specifically targeted agains babesia. I haven't heard anything about side effects yet.
You don't have to do the full Cowden. It's very aggressive and most people cannot tolerate it. I didn't like the pinella, and the parley didn't do anything for me. You'll be fine if you use the cumanda, samento, and burbur. I purchased the zeolite, but haven't used it yet. I'm pretty leary about the heavy metal detox. One has be be careful there because they can do more harm than good.
That's about it in a nutshell.
CherylSue
Posted by Health (Member # 6034) on :
I would never do these herbs with Mepron and Azithromycin until you talk to your LLMD.
I have had some severe reactions with mixing herbs and antibiotics, such as severe heart racing, SEVERE, I thought I was going to die.
I stopped using all herbs 4 years ago, while on antibiotics unless a LLMD told me it was ok.
Also, Mepron is so expensive, and is it safe to take these herbs with it? will these herbs cancel out Mepron? maybe not, but I would
not fool around, I have fooled around and it is not safe. NOT safe, I learned the hard way.
Severe reactions can happen when something blocks the liver pathway of a drug, be careful.
Trish
Posted by maureen2174 (Member # 11471) on :
Thank you for the responses everyone!
My LLMD is the one who told me to take cats claw and the one she recommends is Prima Una De Gato, TAO (or is it TOA - i forget free).
The Samento is cheaper for me though and I wanted to try it. I haven't tried the Cumanda or burber yet.
Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
I am on the Full Cowden in addition to Mino, Plaquenil, Malarone, and Lariam.
It is helping. It has a lot of adrenal support and detox, so I'm feeling the best I've felt in a long time.
I had a little bit of a babs relapse, I wasn't quite ready to get off the Malarone, so we started it back up a few days ago, and it feels like we're on the right track again. Other than that, I feel great.
Posted by lucy96734 (Member # 8372) on :
When I started the Cowden protocol I was still taking Zith, Omnicef, and Bicllin injections. I took them together for nearly 2 months.
I'm now just on Cowden and off all abx.
I feel fantastic!
Posted by Chia Pet (Member # 12399) on :
I too did the Cowden with Malarone and it helped me. No antibiotics though. I am back on antibiotics, Zith and Rifampin.
My only concern with combining the herbs is with Rifampin since although it usually lowers other drugs potencies, it can also do the opposite.
I think before I add any of the "antibiotic" components of Cowden like Cumanda and Samento, I will talk to my LLMD first, but otherwise I wouldn't hesitate to use the herbs with antibiotics even Mepron.
I had no problems with anything while on Malrone and that contains Atovaquone.
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