Dow Chemical and DuPont, the same corporations that brought misery and death to millions around the world through Agent Orange, are now the driving forces behind the promotion of soy as a food for humans. They are financing anti-meat and anti-milk campaigns aimed largely at those concerned about animal welfare and the environment, trying to convince them that imitations such as "soymilk" are not only healthier than the real thing, but better for the earth too.
There is no evidence that consuming soy products can improve health, reduce environmental degradation or slow global warming. In fact, the evidence suggests quite the opposite.
For more information, go here:
Posted by adamm (Member # 11910) on :
Link didn't get posted.
Posted by Angelica (Member # 15601) on :
Here is a link to a website with information about how soy can be harmful for you
....I'm pretty sure that fermented soy used in small amounts like in soy sauce and tofu is OK, however do we really need 'soy protein extenders' added to meat and everything else???
Bottom line, soybean oil makes a perfectly good home heating oil/diesel fuel...why not use it that way???
Charlie
Posted by emla999/Lyme (Member # 12606) on :
I agree, soy's benefits to human health are way over hyped. And I also believe that soy's benefits to the environment are way over estimated as well.
I have read that soybeans release nitrous oxide(N2O)into the atmosphere. So, biodiesel made from soybeans may not be a good thing for the environment.
And N2O is a MUCH more powerful greenhouse gas than is carbon dioxide. Actually, the global warming potential of N2O is 296 times larger than an equal mass of carbon dioxide.
And on top of that most soybeans planted in this country come from GMO seeds an they are heavily sprayed with the herbicide Roundup.
So, I have serious doubts that soybeans are good for the environment.
Posted by Angelica (Member # 15601) on :
We get plenty of soy without even eating it because it is fed to chickens and every other farm animal.
Posted by disturbedme (Member # 12346) on :
Okay, I think I've had enough of the 'soy is BAD, soy is the devil' campaign being shoved down our throats.
IMHO, I think it all depends on MODERATION... I think if someone eats a TON of meat, that's going to be just as bad for them as eating a TON of soy... Plain and simple.
There is MUCH evidence that meat can be very bad on our systems (just like soy). So why is it that the soy is always the one being thrown in such a bad light??? It's weird, but you never do see anything negative posted on meat and how bad it can be in large quanities. Posted by Marnie (Member # 773) on :
In certain regions of the world, particularly in Asia, a low incidence of breast cancer has been observed.
These women have diets that are high in soy and low in fat, unlike the Western diet.
Interest in the protective effects of soy derivatives has led to the research of phytoestrogens and metabolites of soy that are described by some as
As a result, many clinical questions have been raised as to whether phytoestrogens, which are also found in other natural foods, can protect against breast cancer.
This article reviews the development and role of the ***more common SERMs, tamoxifen*** and raloxifene.
In addition, this paper will also highlight the emerging studies on phytoestrogens and their similarity and dissimilarity to SERMs.
PMID: 18843590 Planta Med. 2008 Oct 8 Fox Chase Cancer Center, Philadelphia, PA, USA
Our response to soy may be altered by previous BC pills taken when younger.
Go to Pubmed and type in the word
Soy
There are many summaries (abstracts) to skim.
Pay close attention to those also that are related to cholesteol...since this is one of the pathways Bb takes.
Posted by Lymetoo (Member # 743) on :
Sorry about the link problems... Lymenet wouldn't allow me to come back and post the link....but someone posted it above.
It was the Mercola link.
Posted by Angelica (Member # 15601) on :
One reason the women in Asia had much lower rates of breast cancer is because they ate more fish then most Americans. Eating more fish equals getting more essential fatty acids.
I believe heavy consumption of soy can actually cause cancer because it loads your estrogen receptors with fake estrogen.
I do not think the breast cancer rates in Asia are as low as they use to be because many Asians are now eating more like Americans.
The soy products they eat in Asia are healthier then the ones that are pushed on Americans by the natural foods industry here because their products are traditionally fermented longer than ours.
In my opinion drinking soy milk in "moderation" or giving it to your childern is not a good idea. You can read about it on the soy online link above. It is the opposite of healthy.
Soy is hard on the digestion especially for those people with type O blood and it is also hard on the thyroid. Lymies need to assist their thyroids not harass them.
Posted by Keebler (Member # 12673) on :
-
Not all soy is the same. Dow Chemical and DuPont (and other chemical companies) do unspeakable things - not just to soy beans but also to the entire plant kingdom. Soy, too, was never meant to be consumed in the quantities - and variations - that the marketers would desire.
Still, it is not so simple. From much that I've read, it may have it's place. So, to consider is the source, type, dosage, etc. Here is a little more research to help in the decision process:
Chinese Medicine in the Treatment of Estrogen Dependent Tumors
Effective levels for treatment are not firmly established, but ingestion of soy isoflavones in the dosage range 60-180 mg/day appears reasonable with the ...
A growing number of reports indicate that soy products may be helpful both in preventing cancer and in helping to treat it. The active components of soy ...
Update on Soy Products: Are They Appropriate for Women Concerned ...
Soy products are a major nutritional food source in Japan and China. ... By contrast, commonly used soy food products, such as tofu, may provide only about ...
SOY STRIKES BACK - New Research Refutes Soy's Hypothyroid Effect, Supports Cholesterol-Lowering Ability - By Kimberly Pryor
EXCERPTS:
Soy is reported to aid in reducing menopause symptoms, reduce heart disease risk factors and help maintain bone density. Yet, despite soy's growing reputation as a powerful disease fighter, not everyone sings soy's praises.
Soy has been portrayed as both the hero and the villain. The anti-soy camp claims soy inhibits the thyroid and increases the risk of estrogen-dependent cancers. Those in the pro-soy camp point to research showing soy can reduce cholesterol, alleviate menopausal symptoms and lower blood pressure.
Those in the anti-soy camp cite the theory that soy inhibits thyroid function and increases breast cancer risk. Recent reports and past evidence, however, refute that theory, indicating that soy is perhaps unjustly maligned. Other recent studies have shown soy positively influences cholesterol metabolism and that it may benefit type 2 diabetics.
. . .
Conclusion
Although the debate will likely rage on between the pro-soy and anti-soy camps, studies indicate that soy does not inhibit thyroid function in individuals consuming adequate iodine and that, in humans, it does not cause the cell proliferation that can initiate cancer.
Furthermore, studies indicate that soy can lower cholesterol and that it may have a role to play in the prevention of osteoporosis and heart disease
- Full article and citations at link above.
-
Posted by Angelica (Member # 15601) on :
If I thought I had cancer I would run from soy.
The naturals foods industry would love us all to buy and consume tons of soy. They come up with B$ studies to support whatever they want to say or market. I am not buying it.
Posted by emla999/Lyme (Member # 12606) on :
Soy, can also interfere with cancer treatment.
According to a recent study, the phytoestrogen genistein, a substance that is found in high amounts in soy could interfere with cancer treatment and could even make cancer tumors grow in size.
A quote from one of the scientists of the study, Dr. Helferich.
``Dietary supplements containing soy-based phytoestrogens provide high enough dosages that it could be a significant issue to breast cancer patients and survivors."
Posted by herbalfrog (Member # 12711) on :
I am so glad this subject is being discussed. Some of you know by now from my posts that I have had severe digestive problems over the past four months with vomiting and an inability to absorb the nutrients in food. 28 pounds lighter, three ER trips, one hospitalization, I am closer to the cause! A trip to an immunologist proved I am allergic to many foods, many antibiotics, all outdoors, and all environmental toxins, one of the culprits being SOY. I urge all to evaluate your diet, and read labels!
Posted by Marnie (Member # 773) on :
I would HOPE you look at ALL the things in soybeans and not just one.
Like garlic...soybeans contains an ABUNDANCE of nutrients which
interact.
It is very "dangerous" to look at just one part of a whole food and then say it is dangerous.
Look closely at apples...why does this fruit = "keep a doctor away"...is it pectin in the skin (fiber), is it the natural sugars...
OR is it the way these nutrients ALL TOGETHER are working?
Posted by emla999/Lyme (Member # 12606) on :
Soy also contains Genetically Modified Organisms GMO's.
Most of the soybeans grown in this country are (GMO's). And GMO foods pose health risks for those eating them.
GMO's are not just a problem for soybeans though. Many other plants that we eat have been genetically modified also.
The book, "Seeds of Deception" describes the effects of GMO foods wonderfully.
DuPont heads this year's Toxic 100, a list of the top corporate air polluters in the U.S. from researchers at the Political Economy Research Institute at the University of Massachusetts. Nissan Motor, Archer Daniels Midland, Eastman Kodak, and General Electric round out the top five.
The rankings take into account not only the quantity of releases, but also the relative toxicity of chemicals, nearby populations, and transport factors such as prevailing winds and height of smokestacks, according to the researchers.
For the first time, the Toxic 100 includes foreign corporations with facilities in the U.S. Three of them - Nisssan, Bayer Group, and Acelor Mittal - made the list's top ten.
Posted by Angelica (Member # 15601) on :
From soy online
Have you ever wondered about soy?
It's promoted as the miracle food that will feed the world while at the same time prevent and cure all manner of diseases.
But what if all you've read about soy is nothing but a multi-million dollar marketing strategy based on scanty facts, half-truths and lies?
Most people remain unaware that soy is known to contain an array of potent chemical toxins.
The modern manufacturing processes of high-profit industries make no effort to remove these potent toxins.
High levels of phytic acid, trypsin inhibitors, toxic lysinoalanine and highly carcinogenic nitrosamines are all present in soy products.
Phytoestrogens that disrupt endocrine function and are potent antithyroid agents are present in vast quantities in soy, including the potentially devastating isoflavone Genistein.
Infants exclusively fed soy-based formula have 13,000 to 22,000 times more estrogen compounds in their blood than babies fed milk-based formula, the estrogenic equivalent of at least five birth control pills per day.
Premature development of girls has been linked to the use of soy formula, as has the underdevelopment of males. Infant soy formula has been linked to autoimmune thyroid disease.
Soy is linked to infertility, breast cancer, hypothyroidism, thyroid cancer, and many other disorders.
"Imagine drugs that are known, by years of scientific documentation, to be both carcinogenic and to also cause DNA and chromosome damage being prescribed and administered through the food supply to populations of many countries around the world without the knowledge or consent of the individuals consuming these foods ...
with no way to track dosage, individual reactions, or harmful side-effects ... and without any concern for some people's increased vulnerability to these drugs, such as cancer patients.
It sounds crazy, but that is exactly what is happening around the world when Soy is added to our food supply.
Soy contains the scientifically documented carcinogenic and DNA damaging and chromosome damaging natural chemicals genistein and daidzein." - True Health, the magazine of Carotec Inc., Naples, Florida. May/June 2004.
Are all Soy Beans bad?
Soybeans are widely known to contain a gamut of natural toxins - and it makes no difference whether they are organic, "Round-Up Ready", or in any number of modern products (see our GUIDANCE page).
The trouble with modern soy products is that fast industrial processing does not equate to historical methods of fermenting "for two summers" or boiling "for the length of an incense".
The method of modern get-rich-quick corporations is simply to leave these well-known natural toxins in our products.
"Among the Hawaii "study's" conclusions: that tofu accelerates brain weight loss in aging users, that the more soy you use the more it impacts your mental abilities, that soy acts like a drug, not a food." -
True Health, the magazine of Carotec Inc., Naples, Florida.
May/June 2004.
Posted by randibear (Member # 11290) on :
my sister drinks soymilk, east soyburgers, soy bars, everything all soy. i hate going to her house as everything as to be soy or some protein or other....i'd rather eat out and get junk food.
plus she has melanoma cancer....
Posted by disturbedme (Member # 12346) on :
quote:Originally posted by randibear:
plus she has melanoma cancer....
Well, we can pretty much assume the soy didn't give her the melanoma!!!!!!
Geez, you'd hate my house too... I have a lot of soy stuff... I eat it in moderation though and all that crap... Posted by Keebler (Member # 12673) on :
-
Yet soy, fermented, as in organic MISO, can be very good for us. It contains wonderful probiotics.
-
Posted by Marnie (Member # 773) on :
The amount of soy products consumed in Japan is much greater than that in Western countries.
Recent evidence indicates that soy isoflavones play a beneficial role in obesity, cancer, osteoporosis, and cardiovascular disease.
The soybean isoflavone genistein is present at high levels in soy products.
Genistein is structurally similar to 17beta-estradiol (E2), and
genistein has been suggested to be act as E2 (estradiol)
or an antagonist against E2.
Genistein suppresses antigen-specific immune response in vivo
and lymphocyte proliferation response in vitro.
However, genistein *enhances* the cytotoxic response mediated by NK and cytotoxic T cells and the cytokine production from T cells.
Thus, the effect of genistein on immunity is immune cell-dependent.
Due to its unique effect on immune function, genistein has been used for the treatment of the diseases in animal models and it has been found that genistein inhibits allergic inflammatory responses.
In this review, we summarize current studies related to the effect of isoflavone genistein on the immune system.
PMID: 18797128 J Med Invest. 2008 Aug;55(3-4):167-73 Department of Public Health and Applied Nutrition, Institute of Health Bioscience, the University of Tokushima Graduate School, Tokushima, Japan.
However:
"Furthermore, pertussis toxin and genistein eliminated both PKCd translocation and PLD activation."
"or genistein (a tyrosine kinase inhibitor)"
*Another* PKCD inhibitor?!!! It looks like Bb already has one of those! Which also enhances "cytokine production from T cells" and "suppresses antigen-specific immune responses" and downregulates Th2...
Our NK (natural killer) cells "squirt" precancerous cells every day with ...get this...a "free radical".
It maybe the powerful lone superoxide radical.
We are trying to destroy the cells and the pathogens using oxygen...and forms of oxygen.
H2O2, NO, SO4...depending on which pathogen.
But Bb has LOTS of anti-oxidant protection.
Posted by StephenC (Member # 15171) on :
I <3 my soy milk.
Posted by Angelica (Member # 15601) on :
Marnie the soy products in Japan are fermented much longer then ours. The Japanese for example have miso soup with a bit of seaweed in it for breakfast not soy milk lattes.
Soy milk is not good for you!
Posted by disturbedme (Member # 12346) on :
Angelica -
quote:Soy milk is not good for you!
That is YOUR opinion. No one knows for sure how good or bad soy is for a person. There's two sides... as there always is and always will be.
So one side can say it's awful for a person, while there is the side that says it's not. Who knows if anyone is really going to know for SURE. We all have our opinions on the subject though...
There is always going to be two sides to it... as there are two sides to everything. We are left to believe what we want from the literature and defend the side we want.
But the truth of it is, for now, it's all just opinion.
Once again, why are we talking about soy? This is a Lyme board. Why doesn't someone post about how bad MEAT is (in large quanitities or not)??!?
Posted by Angelica (Member # 15601) on :
I think we are discussing diet here which many of us are concerned with because diet does have something to do with disease including Lyme disease.
There are often diet discussions on this forum.
Yes you are correct I am expressing my opinions based on what I have learned about soy.
Maybe you should start a red meat thread.
Posted by Angelica (Member # 15601) on :
I found this article about diet on another Lyme forum. It is written by a Dr. Wilson. You can read the whole article at the link below.
"Dried beans in general are not considered complete protein sources.
This means the balance of amino acids is not adequate.
Roasted soy beans, isolated soy protein, soy powders, soy milks and textured vegetable protein or TVP contain anti-nutrients such as phytates, thyroid inhibitors and enzyme inhibitors.
Soy powders and soy isolate are leftover products from the manufacture of soy oil and contain chemical residues used in the oil extraction process.
I suggest eating only traditionally fermented soy products such as tempeh and tofu. These are less toxic products. They are still lower quality proteins and I would limit intake to no more than three times a week.
Toxic, stressed and nutritionally depleted individuals often do not digest, absorb and synthesize proteins adequately.
If digestive enzymes are deficient, or if the stomach is too alkaline, protein foods will putrefy or rot, rather than digest. Putrefaction produces harmful chemicals called toxic amines.
If the colon is alkaline due to improper flora such as candida albicans, more of these toxins are absorbed into the liver.
Constipation or low fiber in the diet also enhances toxin absorption.'
Posted by disturbedme (Member # 12346) on :
I love me some tofu.
See, that's just what I'm talking about. Some articles say not to eat tofu or soy milk or anything like that because they are the bad soy, but miso and tempeh, etc., are okay. Posted by emla999/Lyme (Member # 12606) on :
If someone starts a red meat thread then we need to be aware that all meat is NOT created equal.
Meat that comes from organically raised GRASSFED animals has superior health benefits to meat that comes from conventionally raised, grain fed animals.
Now, I am not saying that everyone should eat like the Stoccareddo people. There maybe a genetic reason as to why they are so healthy.
But since they live in a very small village I would be willing to bet the animal products that they consume comes from animals that are grassfed or raised free range.
So, is it possible that some of their good health is a result of their grassfed dairy/meat diet?
Posted by Angelica (Member # 15601) on :
disturbedme please eat whatever suits your fancy
Posted by aklnwlf (Member # 5960) on :
I've eaten soy products my whole life being half Oriental.
I don't care for milk so I drink soy milk.
I used to live in Okinawa Japan and our typical diet was high in soy.
Especially the fermented soy-Miso-which we used in many dishes and ate about every day.
I didn't realize there was a problem with soy consumption.
Okinawans are known for their longevity and diet and lifestyle is the key.
Posted by Angelica (Member # 15601) on :
aklnwlf,
Do Okinawans typically drink soy milk?
I do think non GMO fermented organic miso does have beneficial properties.
Posted by aklnwlf (Member # 5960) on :
Yes Angelica they do. But it's old-fashioned homemade. Not what you would drink here in the US. Sometimes it's flavored with.....you guessed it....Miso.
It's usually made as a home remedy for an illness. I can't remember which one. I'd have to ask my Mom.
Posted by Angelica (Member # 15601) on :
I definitely think there is something very special about old-fashioned and homemade.
One of my best friends was taught to cook by Mishio Kushi's daughter. My friend taught me how to cook miso soup and it is done with intent and stirred in the same direction as the planet turns. Her recipe seems way more healing then any instant miso soup packets I have had in the past.
Posted by aklnwlf (Member # 5960) on :
I know Okinawans, like alot of other cultures, use food as medicine.
And I believe that stirring story.
Some things have to be done a certain way.
Posted by Angelica (Member # 15601) on :
I so agree with you. I loved my friends cooking lessons and reasons for doing things.
It opened me up to a whole new way of cooking and eating not that I always cook or eat with intent but it is nice when I remember to.
Posted by on :
![[cussing]](graemlins/cussing.gif)
![[shake]](graemlins/shake.gif)
![[Razz]](tongue.gif)
I eat it in moderation though and all that crap... ![[Roll Eyes]](rolleyes.gif)
![[bonk]](graemlins/bonk.gif)