this is a wierd question but a necessary one i think.
if you are, say, a cruel person will it make you more cruel?
if you're verbally abusive, will it make it worse?
or if you're a quiet person, will it make you withdrawn?
well, you get the idea.
Posted by LisaS (Member # 10581) on :
I hope not, otherwise I'm a big rage filled jerk!
Posted by Keebler (Member # 12673) on :
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Randi,
I think if a cruel person gets any disease it is unlikely they will change.
If a kind and caring person gets a disease it is unlikely they will cease being kind and caring.
What lies within us is the real stuff and, while illness certainly is a strain, it is never an excuse for an intelligent adult to be unkind.
The real question that I see here is if anyone should accept abusive behavior from another because the illness makes them abusive.
Where help has been suggested and available - to understand and address the issues - my answer would be to never accept abusive or dismissive behavior from another.
We all get confused and short tempered and snap. Sure. But your phrases above imply a much more serious issue.
The words "cruel" and "abusive" are not just about someone having a bad day due to having a chronic infection. That goes deeper. That requires open eyes and an action plan, for whichever end of that one finds oneself.
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Posted by METALLlC BLUE (Member # 6628) on :
No it doesn't. It attacks the brain causing damage and loss of function. The behavior patterns you see are a result.
Who you are character wise and behavior wise is environmental primarily -- education from parents and other experiences you've had. Lyme Disease attacks from a biological direction.
Posted by Keebler (Member # 12673) on :
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Well, I've never been an angry person. I even take flies and spiders outside. But I have had the impulse to shoot a few leaf blowers - more than once or more than once a day.
I have thought, though, that I would go right for the leaf blower machine itself, rather than the person operating it but I might not be able to make any guarantees, depending upon how much their assault assaults my tender brain. (Relax, though. I have no gun - and could never get close enough, anyway!)
There can be a very wide spectrum of anger issues in illness. Professional advice and counseling is so important to be able to sift out what is illness and what is not - and when someone is capable of controlling their behavior or not.
In addition, underlying issues for one's self (alone and as part of a relationship) are brought right to the top.
After coming to an understanding of what is happening and why, the real value from counseling is in development of the action plan - for everyone.
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[ 08. November 2008, 03:33 PM: Message edited by: Keebler ]
Posted by Dawnee (Member # 15089) on :
I agree... it's NOT my natural nature..but seems lyme rage is a big problem for me. It's horrifying.
Posted by disturbedme (Member # 12346) on :
I'm like Dizzyup as well. I used to be an independent person... now, I'm scared being alone or doing anything without my hubby by my side. I've become pretty clingy that way.
I'm not as outgoing as I was or happy, but who can be happy feeling so ill?
I do get the lyme rage though and at times will tell it like it is. I used to not be able to stick up for myself, but now I feel it's easier to do so, especially if I'm having a particularly bad day or lyme rage day. I've been through hell, so I don't care anymore. I'll tell them so.
I also cry easily (I always did, but NOT THIS easy). Any movie I watch can easily make me cry. Commercials even.
Posted by randibear (Member # 11290) on :
Well, you're right. There is a lot more going on if you can read between the lines. How does environment and psychological abuse affect lyme?
I've been told it plays a large role in getting better.
Has anybody left someone and actually gotten better? Or improved?
Posted by AP (Member # 8430) on :
For a long time, Lyme made me the exact opposite of who I really am.
Posted by AP (Member # 8430) on :
quote:Originally posted by randibear: Has anybody left someone and actually gotten better? Or improved?
Like a significant other???
My boyfriend and I met before I got sick. He hung in for almost 4 years after the diagnosis, through times when even I didn't want to be around me. I frequently begged him to leave, and in June we amicably split.
I've been making vast improvements without him. It's not that he was a horrible man - he was wonderful, often caught crying outside of my hospital room... I think we all settle into routines and get stuck.
It was terrifying to put him on a plane home. I couldn't imagine my life without him. Letting him go has forced me to become independent once again. It's encouraged me to find myself, and taught me to take things one step at a time.
I'm lucky that he's still there when I really need him, but I'm happy that I can do this on my own.
Posted by gemofnj (Member # 15551) on :
I do think lyme causes "personality" changes because if you are in pain, have anxiety or fatigue you dont always have the patience to react the way you normally do.
Also, lyme affect hormones, thyroid, etc. and they can really scr*w up your brain so you have a baid hair day!!
I think I was guilty of being cranky because of excess fatigue. Once I knew I was sick, I allowed myself to rest more, and thus not being so cranky. Before that I would push myself beyond my limits.
Posted by lymielauren28 (Member # 13742) on :
I'm very much like Dizzy and Disturedme...
Before Lyme I was extremely independent as well, but now I hate being alone and often have panic attacks when I am. I cling to my Fiance way too much...poor guy!
I was also SO social, had never known a depressed day in my life and worry rolled right off my shoulders. I'm now withdrawn much of the time and I struggle with anxiety and depression(that's getting better though)and I worry about stuff obsessively now .
I can't wait to get the old me back...the loud, crazy,social,carefree,funny,hardworking,bubbly, absolute lover of life girl that I know I am...
Lauren
Posted by Liz D (Member # 16739) on :
I am 50 pounds heavier so there is more physycally. I am also shocked at how mean, nasty, short tempered and sarcastic I have become. I am not a nice person at the moment. Liz
Posted by clairenotes (Member # 10392) on :
Lyme never made me more of what I am, but the complete opposite.
A brain infection will cause many different moods and states that are not reflective of who we are whatsoever, in my opinion.
In fact, I strongly feel that someone who has a tendency to be angry or fearful before lyme, is either in a pre-lyme state, or some other pre-illness state that has just not crossed over into the physical realm yet. I don't believe a 'fixed' negative state is a natural state.
In answering Randibear's last question -- if someone is in a relationship that is not supportive then it would seem that things should improve at least on some level if one left that relationship. Because I think those of us with lyme are very vulnerable to the energies of others. But still the infection must be focused on.
But there could be other stressful issues to face, such as finances, which may or may not make it worthwhile. It will depend on the situation and cost/benefits have to be weighed very carefully.
Claire
[ 09. November 2008, 08:49 AM: Message edited by: clairenotes ]
Posted by ByronSBell 2007 (Member # 11496) on :
I'm more of what I "am not"
I use to be fun to hang out with, i was constantly playing pranks on other, joking around, talkative, ect.
I've been a lame duck since my illness.
Posted by Ocean (Member # 3496) on :
I'm with those who used to be independent and the constant anxiety/panic took it away. I've had this for my entire adulthood and I often wonder what my life would have been like without the Lyme. I've made stupid decisions when I was so depressed/sick, thank goodness I didn't kill myself at my worst (had many suidical thoughts).
Once I took my brother's handgun and put it to my head. I saw myself in the mirror and broke down, wondering how it had come to this? I had a friend in highschool (I got sick in high school) who was depressed, she cut herself, ect. I was always trying to make her feel better about herself. I was so bubbly and outgoing and happy, I couldn't understand why anyone should feel sad.
I thought if I could do that, she could just snap out of it. Little did I know how the chemicals can change your brain and your thinking. I couldn't understand why on earth anyone would commit suicide, seemed so repulsive and horrific and stupid to me.
Then a few years later my mental state turned very dark. I think this is one of the reasons I am terrified of starting treatment. I am terrified of going back to the depression. Yes I don't feel great now with the anxiety and the fatigue, but I am by no means even comtemplating suicide, I want to live! I can smile, I know how bad it is to have severe depression, so I truly appreciate where I have been for the past 7 years, mentally.
I haven't been like that since 2001 and I don't ever want to again.
take care, Ocean
Posted by Dahlia (Member # 17066) on :
quote:Originally posted by Ocean: Once I took my brother's handgun and put it to my head. I saw myself in the mirror and broke down, wondering how it had come to this?... Then a few years later my mental state turned very dark. I think this is one of the reasons I am terrified of starting treatment. I am terrified of going back to the depression.
Ocean, after your scary times with deep depression I can understand your fears of going back to that place.
Why do you worry that treatment will make you depressed? Of course you may feel worse for awhile when you herx, but you will know that is part of the treatment process. You will feel much better physically and emotionally by getting yourself on the right treatment plan!
I think the key to starting a scary new situation (like Lyme treatment) is to have a support system and an action plan should you become depressed. I know family can't necessarily our best support because they don't understand what we are going through, but if you explain in advance the signs of depression, perhaps the people around you will know if they should intervene and call your doctor.
Having a regular appointment with a therapist would be a great way to make sure any depression that resurfaces gets dealt with ASAP. If you start seeing a therapist even before you start treatment, so you can discuss both your history of depression and fears about starting treatment. The therapist should help you work on addressing those fears so you can start treatment once you feel less scared about it.
Lastly, try to remember that people tend to post on here for advice about their medication side effects and other treatment problems. So the posts on here are biased towards negative experiences on treatment (no criticicm of Lymenet, that is just the nature of a health support board). I didn't start reading on here until I had already started treatment. If I had, I probably would have been too scared to start treatment too!
Posted by AP (Member # 8430) on :
quote:Originally posted by Dahlia: Ocean, after your scary times with deep depression I can understand your fears of going back to that place.
Why do you worry that treatment will make you depressed? Of course you may feel worse for awhile when you herx, but you will know that is part of the treatment process. You will feel much better physically and emotionally by getting yourself on the right treatment plan!
I think the key to starting a scary new situation (like Lyme treatment) is to have a support system and an action plan should you become depressed. I know family can't necessarily our best support because they don't understand what we are going through, but if you explain in advance the signs of depression, perhaps the people around you will know if they should intervene and call your doctor.
Having a regular appointment with a therapist would be a great way to make sure any depression that resurfaces gets dealt with ASAP. If you start seeing a therapist even before you start treatment, so you can discuss both your history of depression and fears about starting treatment. The therapist should help you work on addressing those fears so you can start treatment once you feel less scared about it.
Lastly, try to remember that people tend to post on here for advice about their medication side effects and other treatment problems. So the posts on here are biased towards negative experiences on treatment (no criticicm of Lymenet, that is just the nature of a health support board). I didn't start reading on here until I had already started treatment. If I had, I probably would have been too scared to start treatment too!
This is so much easier to say than do when you are in the throws of deep depression. Aren't we taught to not revisit the things that trigger suicidal tendencies?
I flat out told my LLMD last week that I didn't want to do the work. Slipping in to deep, hospitalization-type depression again is so far from what I want that I am willing to risk my recovery.
It's a tough decision to make, and we've all got to do it for ourselves. We all know what we can and can't handle, and what we're willing to put up with.
Posted by Ocean (Member # 3496) on :
Dahlia, Yes, I know I probably won't go back to that place, I'm also not sleeping 14-16 hours per day like I was back then and having some of the symptoms I did then. I'm waaaay more functional now than I was! My Dr knows about my anxiety (because I almost had to jog in place at his office I had so much anxiety =), he purposely prescribed Omnicef, because he said Doxy makes some people depressed and with the anxiety, he wouldn't want to push it.
Yes I have told my husband before to watch me for signs of depression. After my first really bad relapse in 2003 (got Lyme in 1996), I had horrible anxiety and thought the depression was coming for me next, because that is what had happened before! I was terrified and told him many times to help me if it suddenly changed.
I have 3 precious babies now and I have so much to live for. I just want to get on with my life now, ya know? I think part of my hesitation is because so many people haven't resolved their Lyme with antibiotics (although I have read of a few), I wonder if they are the answer. I'm off of sugar now and this has helped me. I recently had the stomach flu and couldn't eat much for 4 days, so I lost weight that I didn't have to lose, so I'm going to try to gain a little before starting treatment. Omnicef can cause loose stool and I really don't want to lose more weight.
Thanks for your support!!!
AP, I'm not trying to be nosy or anything, just wondering if you are going to try alternatives? This disease is such a maze! Sometimes I wish I had something that was treatable that didn't mess with the mind !!
Take care, Ocean
Posted by AP (Member # 8430) on :
Ocean, the only alternative that has worked for me is regaining my life.
I'm not saying I'm not in a great deal of pain on any given day, and my life is completely void of all Lyme. I'm actually rather sick.
I think our minds are way more important than our bodies, and I needed time to let mine heal. I'm supposed to begin IV antibiotics again tomorrow. I don't know what's going to happen to me, but I feel that I am in a better place mentally than before and I'm not putting too much pressure on myself.
I plan on taking one day at a time, one infusion at a time, and seeing what happens.
Posted by shazdancer (Member # 1436) on :
Hi Randi,
Your question: "if you are, say, a cruel person will it make you more cruel?"
I relapsed during a time when I had a significant other in my life. While I was in treatment, and unable to work and do as much as I had before, he got worse.
I wasn't providing what he wanted, in time, energy, or money, I guess. So what were once occasional problems between us turned into pretty constant nastiness. Then when I saw him turn his nastiness on one of his college-age kids, I knew it was his problem, not mine.
Was some of it due to his own Lyme, which he'd had before I knew him? Perhaps. But there was a calculated, behind-your-back quality to some of it, unlike the scenario of "Lyme rage," which flares in the moment and subsides just as quickly.
So I left him. Still sick, sick teen in tow, still without enough employment, I left. That was in 2005. One of my better decisions.
-- Shaz
Posted by hopeandhealth (Member # 17605) on :
Last week, I sat on our loveseat with my husband on the couch. (I do hate him, yes hate, Lyme or not) but I just couldn't stop....I just kept insulting and insulting....I even went as far to make fun of our daughter (step daughter to me) because she is too lazy to talk....unless she wants us to buy her something. I didn't do it to her face, but it doesn't matter.
I remember sitting there thinking, "Is this Lyme Rage?" I've never experienced it before. It was like I was watching myself outside of my body thinking "What the heck am I doing?" but I just could not stop.
*Hangs head in shame*
I even totally let my mom have it and said some really nasty things. That IS NOT ME. I vowed I will never do it again. That was the first time I ever did ANYTHING like this.
Posted by Brussels (Member # 13480) on :
Lyme rage is very real. Herx rages too. But herxes can happen without lyme, only with candida and fungi.
I'm so aware of being not me, but I can't avoid behaving like I hate everything around me. I just feel I need to be left alone, no wish to exchange anything whasoever with any person, I just want to be close into a room and left there without noises. And no one may dare try to take me off that room, I'll just blow up.
I just tell people (my 4 year old daughter included), well, "I'm not angry with you all, it's just that I don't feel well and I want to be left alone. The problem is with me, not you, and as soon as I feel better again, I'll be back again to be who I am".
My daughter is used to my ups and downs since she was 1 year old, she understands me and let me alone, talking the minimum to me. I just stress, 'mom is not angry with you, you know that, right?"
![[Frown]](frown.gif)
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