As many of you have probably figured out by now, or know, I am almost 6.5 months pregnant and have late-stage lyme, diagnosed in 95. I am on zithromax, mepron and omnicef for the pregnancy. I am working with good LLMDs.
I am feeling terrible and am scared. I think the Lyme is sort of under control at this time, but it looks like the baby is sitting on my lateral femoral nerve, rendering it difficult to stand or walk, and many other things. I am trying to taper off sleep meds etc. so that baby will be born healthy. I live alone. I am thinking of moving in with somebody bc I do not know if I can make it the rest of the way on my own. I guess I am in somewhat of a panic tonight and recently.
If anybody has been through this, or has any words of advice, I would love some support right now. I have been to the yahoo pregnant lyme group but did not find it to work or be user friendly.
Little things like are we better off having c-section, what classes to take - any sort of guidance is welcomed here.
I feel dumb posting this and would prefer to keep quiet about this all but I need support from people who understand. My obstetricians in the high-risk clinic are somewhat useless and almost cruel/mocking re. the Lyme.
God I feel like such a whiner, but honestly, I do not know where else to get real answers than from people who understand or have been through this.
Thank you.
[ 03-04-2009, 11:26 PM: Message edited by: luvdogs ]
Posted by jamieL (Member # 16563) on :
Sorry you're going through such a hard time. I can't offer any advice (except maybe don;t breastfeed) but I do hope you feel better soon.
Can you find a different OB?
Posted by nomoremuscles (Member # 9560) on :
Hi Doggies,
In two-and-a-half months you're going to have a beautiful, healthy, Lymeless baby. And as you hold him and gaze into his eyes, his powdery smell filling you with warmth, all of this will be a distant memory.
Sleep well.
Posted by Hoosiers51 (Member # 15759) on :
Hi, I just wanted to reach out and let you know that no one minds if you complain or whine here. You will be in my thoughts!
My husband and I would like to start a family as soon as we can get my chronic lyme and co's under control, so I joined the PregLyme (is that the name of it?) group on Yahoo.
It's not just you....that site is incredibly difficult to use, and I gave up, with how bad my brain fog is. It was SO difficult to navigate!!! I am in a couple of "groups" on Yahoo, and I pop into them from time to time, but I haven't gotten any useful information from them because after about 5 minutes I get frustrated and give up.
It must be the way Yahoo structures it's groups, I hate it!!!!
But the pregnancy issue is something I think and worry about a lot, and I can COMPLETELY sympathize with what you must be going through, because as someone considering pregnancy, I haven't found any good resources or support out there on the internet! It's really sad.
So please, whine away, because those are my frustrations, and I'm not even pregnant yet (it will be awhile, with how my treatment is going, etc).
I have tried to bring the issue up on lymenet a couple times, and it's funny, because while some people have been great about the topic and willing to share knowledge, others have scolded me for asking about it in my condition, been rude to me for asking questions that maybe they thought were too personal, or not responded to PM's. And this is on Lymenet!!! So I can only imagine what you must be up against.
That said, I brought the topic up again in a very recent post about babesia, and the three people that responded were all very kind and helpful. So there have been some bright spots.
But I just wish there were more resources out there for women dealing with Lyme and Pregnancy, or women like me who are wondering how they can best prepare for a safe pregnancy.
I think much more dialogue is needed on the topic of pregnancy and lyme, so please feel free to complain and ask questions as much as you want on Lymenet, and my hope is that others will help as best they can. Maybe it will open the door for this not to be such a rare topic of discussion around here.
I'm sorry I can't help too much with your specific questions, but just know that you have at least one person who is eager to hear more about what you're going through, and who doesn't mind you complaining! You are going through a lot!
Best of luck dealing with the docs.....just do what's best for you and your baby! I hope things get better for you. Please just take as good of care of yourself as possible! Know there are people that care!
Posted by Janice70 (Member # 16319) on :
A c-section will be a lot harder to recover from than vaginal delivery, and would probably make your Lyme symptoms worse, because it is such a stress on the body. It is a major abdominal surgery.
By the way, that makes me sick that the doctors are mocking you about Lyme.
Posted by bettyg (Member # 6147) on :
i have no personal experience, but copying some links from my newbie package below; hopefully, you might come up with some good info; i don't know!!
This will take you to topics dealing with Lyme and pregnancy on the CDC website. http://tinyurl.com/ywo8un
As for their comment about no proof of transmission through breast milk...I remember Mo sent a sample of her breast milk to a lab and they did find Bb! AND her baby did develop Lyme.
LYME IS COMMUNICABLE BY TINCUP thesis Ticks, fleas, mosquitos, mice, rabbits, birds, mouth, by pregnancy
* Infants can be infected with Borrelia transpacentally in any stage of pregnancy and/or via mother's breast milk.
* The co-infections: Babesia, Bartonella, Mycoplasma and perhaps even the Ehrilichias can be transmitted transpacentally to the developing fetus.
* Gestational Borreliosis can be associated with repeated miscarriages, fetal death in utero, still births, hydrocephalus, cardiovascual anomalies,
intrauterine growth retardation, neonatal respiratory distress, and maternal toxemia of pregnancy.
* Infants either infected congenitally or from breast milk can have
- Floppiness with poor muscle tone - Irritability - Frequent fevers and illness early in life - Joint sensitivities and body pain - Skin sensitivity - Gastro esophageal reflux - Developmental delays -Learning disabilities and psychiatric problems
* Infants bitten very early in life will have many of the same symptoms - loss and decline in developmental milestones.
I found this to be a pretty inclusive list of signs/symptoms for small children, infants, and those suspected of congenital Lyme.
Sadly, my two children do exhibit many of these symptoms and both have positive bands for Lyme via Igenex diagnostic lab in PALO ALTO, CALIFORNIA. Geneal, 2007
plus going to phyllis mervin's 50 state lyme yahoo board ...
People seeking doctors might be able to get help from their state online information and support group. Nearly 3,400 people belong to state groups. Some of the groups are small but more than 20 of them have 50 or more people and seven have over 100.
The groups are moderated and you have to apply. Most don't allow doctor names, but once on the group, you can ask for doctors in a certain area and ask people to email you privately. *******************************************
best wishes dogs! Posted by Hoosiers51 (Member # 15759) on :
Actually, I was just re-reading this, and had a flashback to a random comment my LLMD made to me, that I wanted to share.
I think he said that it was best to NOT have a C-section, because of all the blood involved.
I'm not sure if I am remembering this correctly or not, but I think I am. Recently I expressed to him my concern of transmitting babesia to my children, and I think he said something along the lines of,
"Well, with the delivery, just as long as you don't do something like a C-section where there's tons of blood everywhere, you should be okay...."
Like I said, I could be mis-quoting, and I normally don't say things on lymenet unless I'm sure of them, but since I'm pretty sure he said that, and you are concerned about it, I thought I would pass it along to you.
You could maybe ask one of your OB's if there is more concern in transmitting bloodborn pathogens in C-sections?
But based on what I'm remembering, go with the normal, non-surgical delivery if possible.
Posted by METALLlC BLUE (Member # 6628) on :
During pregnancy the body shifts aware from cell mediated immunity in order to protect the fetus. When hormone levels fluctuate and the immune system stablizes agains -- or tries to -- after pregnancy, if no antibiotics were being used, many woman get extremely sick following pregnancy (If they already had Lyme). Pregnancy is like using an immunosuppressive drug for 9 months -- although not a harsh one like Prednisone.
Posted by njlymemom (Member # 15088) on :
You are not whining by any means, this forum is here for support.
It it great that you are working with good llmds, and what a shame tht your ob/gyn's are not supportive. Makes me furious to here this.
I did not know that I had lyme when pregnant with my 3 children. Like someone mentioned above, breastfeeding is not your best option unfortunately. I am sure you are already aware of this.
Are your ob/gyn's communicating with your llmds?
You are seeing critical care ob/gyn for a very good reason, if it was any other chronic illness they would be. I would insist on it.
Moving in with someone is a good idea. Or having someone move in with you. You need the company and support of someone who understands.
I don't have much info of value here since I was not on abx when I was pregnant. You will have a much better experience than I did since you are being tx and have llmds on your side.
I agree that a c-section would be much harder on you, I would not choose that if it is not necessary.
I just wanted to offer you some support. Congratulations on the baby, this is a time of joy in your life. It will work out.
Best Wishes.
Posted by luvdogs (Member # 9507) on :
Thank you Hoosiers and Betty, Janice Jaime, Metal, lymemom and muscleless,
I go through nights when it just panic and in the morning things seem better. I know I can get through this.
No, I can't switch obs any more. The first one already tipped off the second one, and it will just go like that.
My obs refuse to speak with my Lyme docs, and mocked their CVs and questioned whether they went to med school even though they went to Stamford etc. They suck. They literally told me that I could see no more doctors and they refused to speak with anybody more of my doctors.
Anyway, no more is right - just a few months left and I can do it - except that it is 3.5 left lol!
Ok, no c-section. That is good to know. Unless, of course, absolutely necessary.
Thanks you guys
[ 03-05-2009, 11:20 AM: Message edited by: luvdogs ]
Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
Hi luvs. Hang in there, being pregnant with Lyme is no picnic. I had all five of my babies (one is adopted) without having a c section. I did not know I had Lyme at the time though I had been disabled by the fatigue from it previously .... enough that I had to quit working.
The pregnancy made the lyme symptoms flare badly for me. The doctor just thought I was exaggerating my pregnancy symptoms. Basically, they thought I was just whimpy.
I was not on meds during pregnancy and did extended breastfeeding ...... my kids do not have Lyme symptoms. Would I have breastfed if I knew I had Lyme? I do not know.
One of my daughters does have Lyme, but she had a tick attached for days, so we don't know that it was from me. I believe some of it probably was, but I was not on any meds to prevent it from passing to her.
Hang in there! You will be so happy when you're holding your new baby!!
Posted by sometimesdilly (Member # 9982) on :
more hugs to you, Louise... glad you're getting answers and support here.
love, thelma
Posted by Melanie Reber (Member # 3707) on :
My Dearest Luv,
My heart so bleeds for you for the anguish you are experiencing. I can't even begin to imagine what you must be feeling right now. The mixed emotions of joy tempered by the unknowing of what the future may hold.
I too want so badly to just comfort you and tell you that all will be well. No matter what the outcome...all will be well.
I understand that you are wise and experienced enough to already know the possible obstacles associated with this pregnancy, therefore, I don't really feel that now is the time to dwell in that space.
Yes...you do need to prepare. And by gathering information, you are doing just that. You are nesting. As you continue this, please remember that you need not only the building materials of knowledge, but also need to pad that nest with excited anticipation of great things to come.
From what I know of you, that little precious spirit will be in exquisitely loving and caring hands. He will be blessed to have a mother such as yourself, and he will also be a blessing to the rest of your days.
I would like to put you in contact with someone that I feel will be able to add to your list of supporters. And you do know that it is a long list, right? Please email or PM if you are interested.
Much love, Melanie
Posted by luvdogs (Member # 9507) on :
Dilly Thel, six and Melanie,
You are all so sweet!
I posted this last night after taking colace which was recommended by my ob. I seem to have had a brain flare from it - most likely a result of chemical sensitivity to the red dye and glycol etc. Of course, I have MCS from the Lyme. I have had to sedate myself a few times since then bc I became extremely disoriented and panicky and it has lingered through today. I will not take that any more.
But I am glad that it was the impetus to write here bc you are all such a nice reminder of what support I do have and what a wonderful community we have here, despite our naysaying doctors.
Melanie, I have heard wonderful things about you as well and would love to know more about this contact, and would love to speak with you any time as well
Hugs to all of you, luvs
Posted by MY3BOYS (Member # 17830) on :
sounds like even if your ob is a jerk (sooo
sorry), your LLMD is still handeling your abt tx?
from what i understand (my LLMD happens to be
ob/gyn originally and now is moving his practice
to lyme only b/c he is only one in our state!)
I have 3 kids and did not know i had lyme. from
what he has taked to me about: i breast fed 2, so
they are at risk, one has ADD so he is at risk.
vaginal delivery is prefered to let nature sqeeze
out that amnio fluid for their little lungs!!
lyme babies are more at risk for resp. distress
at birth (had this happen with baby #3 for us)..
my sympoms were better when preggo, as explained
by mettalic body protects baby. but, after the
deliveries i crashed out with worse symptoms..
so, would your LLMD be willing to cont, with abt
tx post-partum as well so you dont go without
lyme tx??? LLMD thinks my kidos MAY have a chance
not to be congentital as I did have some abt off
and on for other issues, dental,other infections.
best wishes...having someone with you is a good
idea in my opinion..and LLMD i see is very
admiment about lyme does pass through brest milk
and placenta, as well as sexual transmission.
enjoy your new baby, there is nothing like it!!
Posted by lymeric (Member # 16465) on :
Good Luck! We are all behind you! Cesarean sections
probably should be avoided anyway. But on such occasion,
comfort can be found in that a large percentage of geniuses are
born this way. (One reason for c-section abuse.) Unfortunately, I
apparently did not benefit from the associated possibility. I'm
sure, though, your lovely child will be bright, healthy and
amazing by any result!
LymericThought: This is a learning moment for myself. (And a
great example of the site that teaches. ) So I break post
to share:
Years ago, seeing the Discovery (?) documentary on c-
section, crushingly and tearfully changed me.. Poor Mom!.. Only
today, creating this post (older, supposedly wiser?) was I struck
with a deep sense of guilt. I caused this for my awesome,
wonderful, caring Mom.
I know it's not my fault; they created me. But really, conditions
were created for - as a friend points out - my Dad's "swimmer"
to win "the most important race of your life!" (For everyone who
never won anything, lol.) Poor Mom! She won me.
Luvdogs, you won all of us in the Lyme Lottery! Tracy and Blake
are heros for making their home a way station for total strangers
on the Lyme Railroad to wellness; room at the Lyme Inn with
comfort, succor and nourishment. (Coming this summer: the
Lyme-In at the Lyme Inn???)
Taking their cue, we have room if you want to come. You would
be ten minutes from them. I remember chatting some times and
don't consider you a stranger; feel comfortable making this
offer. And you're Tracy and Blake's friend; they said you were
nice. We all love you!
Best of luck! Sending Light and Love, Peace and Grace!
[ 03-05-2009, 04:22 PM: Message edited by: lymeric ]
Posted by TerryK (Member # 8552) on :
I was a computer programmer before I became disabled. Perhaps I can help you navigate yahoo? What problems are you having?
I think it would be a great help to read about others who are pregnant with lyme. I also think it will be important to know what to do afterwards based on my own experience and if what Mike said is true.
I did not know I had lyme when I was pregnant. I had a somewhat difficult pregnancy with my daughter and afterwards I was very ill for about 2 years. I wish I had known so that I could have prevented the problems during and after the pregnancy.
My daughter is my only child. I never got pregant again because by the time I wanted to, I was too ill. My daughter is 30 years old and has had a few signs of illness off and on over the years but she is well enough to work full time while finishing her doctoral degree.
The sickest she has been is when she was exposed to mold. That seemed to set things off and cause all kinds of problems which may or may not be related to lyme.
When she was around 3 she had lots of ear infections. Her doctor put her on long term abx. This may have been her salvation.
All my siblings are sick like I am and out of 5 of their children, all are sick except 1. 3 are disabled and 1 is non-functional. The other one is doing very well. I don't know if my daughter has lyme and she does not want to deal with it.
Given my experience, I would think it is important to have your children checked out and treated early on if they have any signs of lyme. It could avoid years of illness later on.
My daughter has always been one of the greatest joys in my life. I agree with Melanie. Enjoy it as much as you can. Even though I was really sick after my pregancy, I really cherished my daughter and have never regretted having her.
Best wishes for a very happy life to you and your child.
edited to add: I think that if my neices and nephew were treated for lyme, their disabilities would likely disappear. 3 of them have very lyme like symptoms and one is mildly autistic.
I really hesitated to bring out all the negatives but I think it is better to know of any possible negatives so that you can deal with them and hopefully avoid them.
That said, since you've been in treatment and are likely in much better shape than my siblings and I were, you may have none of these things to worry about.
My prayers are with you. Terry
Posted by Melanie Reber (Member # 3707) on :
PM sent.
Posted by Dekrator48 (Member # 18239) on :
luvdogs,
I'm not really sending you advice, but I will pray that you will find peace, joy and happiness along with good health for you and your baby.
We are all here for you.
Posted by hshbmom (Member # 9478) on :
Hello luvs,
Since you know you don't want a C-section, you might consider taking a Bradley natural childbirth class. They are very very educational. You'll learn how your body works and how you can prepare now for the upcoming birth...not just how to be a good patient while you're in the hospital.
You will learn stuff you'd never learn in a hospital prepared childbirth class.
Bradley trained mothers have a 96% success rate for unmedicated births. Even if you weren't planning an unmedicated birth, the techniques and information are invaluable.
You don't have to find someone registered to have a good instructor. Be sure to do some price comparisons with the instructors you find. Some women teach these classes as a ministry, so don't be overwhelmed by the cost of the classes.
I've had six children without medication. I'm not superwoman! I did prepare for birth by taking Bradley classes and found the preparations essential for a normal delivery. The more you learn about childbirth, the less fear you'll have, and the less pain you will experience. Bradley teaches you to work with your body during labor.
Another great thing you might want to consider is a doula, a woman who helps women during childbirth. They aren't nurses or midwives, but a support person who believes in the normal functioning of a woman's body during labor. The presence of a doula and will help your labor go faster. A well-trained doula will build confidence in yourself.
Blessings to you and your little one!
Posted by Tracy9 (Member # 7521) on :
Dang it all, I just wrote a long post and it didn't post.
Short version: Come live with us. When we get sick of you, we'll just bounce you over to Lymeric's house for a while.
You are in control and can change docs. If you come here you immediately get insurance, covers everything at 100 percent. Don't know if you are still working.
Sorry I lost the long version.
Posted by sometimesdilly (Member # 9982) on :
dear loves (and is loved):
ditto what mom says about at least doing some reading on un-medicated childbirth, even if you already know you will want an epideral.
my midwife said something hugely important to me as i was finishing up transitional labor, a few minutes before I left the sanctuary of a giant tub filled with warm water and headed for a four poster bed to start pushing.
bear with me here for a minute.....
typically the birthing center where i went insisted that anyone giving birth there had to have attended classes and visited with the center's midwives for their whole pregnancy. i hadn't.
I went to the center literally a week after i was due, and only because where i live it was the only place in the entire city that wasn't going to force me to have induced labor because my baby was a week "late."
So, i had one week to catch up on my reading about natural childbirth...
i hadn't read up on the pushing part- i thought everything after transitional labor was more or less automatic, so why bother?
ummm.. not.
i didn't feel the pain lessen when i felt that first urge to push.. it was just utterly different, and probably felt more intense because i hadn't been expecting the pain.
moral: do your homework
i remember looking up at my midwife, trying to prepare mentally for the worst, and saying to her in no doubt a deeply tragic poor-me voice---- is this as bad as it is going to get??????
she answered- and i quote ...
"(dilly), honey, labor is about bringing your son into the world.
there is no "bad" or "worst" here- just some more work more for the two of you to do before you get to see him for the first time. So sugar, let's get going...
yep. genuinely feeling THAT all the way through labor would make a big difference; just as much or more than reading up on the part about how to use imagery etc (including all we know about sitting, yes? ) for pain management.
And last, all the way up your alley. At my mid-wife's suggestion, I had a full-blown, 3 hour acupuncture session about 30 hours before i went into labor.
I've always been convinced that as a result my active labor was shorter (4 1/2 hours) and far less painful than it would have been otherwise.
Just as important, or even more so, the acupuncture helped make me feel incredibly, remarkably peaceful and at ease both physically and mentally.
you'll get there too, i know.
hugs, dilly
Posted by luvdogs (Member # 9507) on :
You guys are all so sweet! You are all offering very sound advice. I knew there was a reason I posted, even if I felt like a jerk doing it.
I mean, after all, come on - how long can I really keep my mouth shut for on this group with something so important happening in my life, and al of you being the only ones who really might get me in many ways?
I think the classes are a great idea and that is totally the type of thing I am thinking about. I am going to look into this.
Tracy, I am still working but limitedly. I have to get off of my feet about every 5-10 minutes which is a bit of a challenge given the nature of my work. But I think I can find ways around it. It is still possible that the baby is not sitting on the nerve and this was brought on by the edema / edema stockings harming that nerve - in which case there is hope of it healing.
Regardless, maybe I'll move in anyway
Hshb, I like your idea about the Bradley childbirth class. And ditto for dilly I know I need some guidance but have had a hard time figuring out what guidance i need.
I will be meeting with an anesthesiologist to discuss pain control options as I do not want epidural. With my MCS I do not trust that I will not react poorly to anesthesia hooked up to my spinal cord. If I couldn't take the colace, what is going to happen with that?! lol
3boys, yes, I will definitely continue with abx after pregnancy. I have been on them for 15 years already, so why stop now lol! But seriously, I know my docs are lining up the big guns to prevent a major relapse.
Dill you crack me up. I think we discussed your moving in for the duration of this pregnancy. I am wondering when to expect you. This weekend will be good to start. Now get your butt to RI!
And Tracy, I am so sorry that you lost your pong post. I HATE when that happens!! but it is nice to hear from you and I need to get your update soon.
And Terry, thank you for your offer. The yahoo group is beyond what I could even begin to explain how confusing it is! From what I can see, all they do is send me an email log of posts and if I try and respond they tell me that I am not an administrator. And it seems like people only post once in a while. It is not a group like this at all. More like a running log... that doesn't really run!? It is peculiar..
Hugs to all of you. One day at a time, right? Thank you so much for everything and mostly just knowing that you are all here is more help than you know.
Posted by creativeguy (Member # 15046) on :
Luvdogs,
I may not be able to offer much advice regarding childbirth, but I AM willing to learn... So, I signed up for prenatal yoga classes... Sure, I get funny looks, but I'd do anything for ya, hon. ...Ya know, this leotard is kinda uncomfortable though, so I can relate on that end!
Seriously though, you wrote: "I go through nights when I just panic and in the morning things seem better." Remember, you can call anytime 24/7 if you need an ear, okay? Never panic alone... Let me panic for you! You can always call if you need, okay?
Remember, you have a HUGE bunch of wonderful friends who love you. They say it takes a village, but your child with have a major metropolitan suburb at the very least.
Hugs!
Posted by luvdogs (Member # 9507) on :
CreativeGuy... is that a leopard skin leotard? I didn't think that was your type... maybe I don't know you as well as I thought I did!
You are so sweet. I promise to call next time I am panicking
How are those classes going? Let me know what you learn, ok? Maybe you can teach me over the phone?
hugs to you
Posted by TerryK (Member # 8552) on :
luvdogs wrote: From what I can see, all they do is send me an email log of posts and if I try and respond they tell me that I am not an administrator.
You can read and respond to posts on-line in a similar fashion as here. The difference is that each post shows up as an entry on the page whereas here, each subject shows up as an entry and you can see all replies once you click on the subject. Just a little different in organization.
I found two lyme/pregnancy groups.
Called PregLyme 185 members 76 messages for feb - looks like it has recently grown. http://tinyurl.com/avs4ts
Called LymeInPregnancy 82 members 3 messages for feb - looks like it has shrunk http://tinyurl.com/cu8jm7
You might find some interesting information by looking through past messages or searching the archives. There is also a file section, photos, links etc. associated with each yahoo group. There may be information there that you can look at.
After you sign up you can log on to the group and search through the archives, read messages and reply to messages. You can also look at their files section which may be may contain research or other information.
Anyone who is having problems using the website, feel free to PM me and I'll do my best to help you learn how to navigate the group.
Terry
Posted by luvdogs (Member # 9507) on :
Thank you so much Terry! That is such a big help. Must investigate now!
Posted by Tracy9 (Member # 7521) on :
Hey, on Private Practice Cooper moved in with Violet the second she found out she was preggers.
He put his own relationship at risk, Violet is a fully functioning psychotherapist WITHOUT LYME, she is just an insecure whiner.
So no way in hell should you feel bad about posting this!!! You deserve Cooper more than she does! Plus he's a pediatrician!
(...am I watching too much TV?)
Posted by lymeloco (Member # 7192) on :
I think you should try and attend the screening at PPAC showing UOS. Dr. Jones will be there, and who better to know what to do, than him.
There usually is a question and answer session after the movie, and some of the doctors are there even after that.
I also think they're will be others who are in the same boat as you. I saw a few pregnant women at the last screening.
Posted by lymeloco (Member # 7192) on :
If your watching too much t.v., than so am I. Did you see the episode where the Naturopath doctor's friend had a tick embedded in her back?
I love that show!
Posted by luvdogs (Member # 9507) on :
lymeloco - I will be there! I will be the fat girl. You going to be there? I do consult with him - he is a Godsend... Thank you!!!!
And Tracy - get to bed and stop watching teevee! Ok, I'll turn mine off too. I don't know Private Practice - must start watching bc getting sick of "House".
Posted by Janice70 (Member # 16319) on :
Bradley childbirth classes are great. I don't know if they are still called "husband coached childbirth" but you don't need a partner. You will learn how to protect yourself in the hospital, and how to deal with the pain so you can avoid drugs. The hospital classes won't teach you those things.
Posted by Tracy9 (Member # 7521) on :
Hey, we are all lining up to be her partner!!!
Pick me!! Pick me!! Okay, so I'm unreliable at times and sick in bed most of the time but maybe I'll be better by June....
Then there's Melissa, who asked first, so she thinks she has dibbys...
And Rob! He is already practicing!!! How long to fly from Maryland to Providence????
And of course David, well he really ought to have the honors....
But I'll bet you already picked your mom, huh???
boohooooooooo.....hey, can't we make it a LymeFest Birth? In fact I'll bet we can get some closed circuit TV, sell some tickets (dont' worry, no crotch shots) and make it a fundraiser to help pay for Dr. Jones to evaluate little baby boy Ryan-Bruce!!!!
WOOHOO!!! This is going to be so much fun!!!!
(Are you feeling better yet????)
Posted by sometimesdilly (Member # 9982) on :
hey louise-
i'll remember to come up to RI to live with you as soon as you remember to send me directions and a satellite thingamachingy for my car so i can't get lost, no matter what...
kiss kiss, thelma Posted by JesseSapp (Member # 16630) on :
quote:Originally posted by luvdogs: Hi all,
As many of you have probably figured out by now, or know, I am almost 6.5 months pregnant and have late-stage lyme, diagnosed in 95. I am on zithromax, mepron and omnicef for the pregnancy. I am working with good LLMDs.
I am feeling terrible and am scared. I think the Lyme is sort of under control at this time, but it looks like the baby is sitting on my lateral femoral nerve, rendering it difficult to stand or walk, and many other things. I am trying to taper off sleep meds etc. so that baby will be born healthy. I live alone. I am thinking of moving in with somebody bc I do not know if I can make it the rest of the way on my own. I guess I am in somewhat of a panic tonight and recently.
If anybody has been through this, or has any words of advice, I would love some support right now. I have been to the yahoo pregnant lyme group but did not find it to work or be user friendly.
Little things like are we better off having c-section, what classes to take - any sort of guidance is welcomed here.
I feel dumb posting this and would prefer to keep quiet about this all but I need support from people who understand. My obstetricians in the high-risk clinic are somewhat useless and almost cruel/mocking re. the Lyme.
God I feel like such a whiner, but honestly, I do not know where else to get real answers than from people who understand or have been through this.
Thank you.
Not to scare you, but Mepron is a pregnancy category C drug...Animal studies have revealed evidence of increased resorption and fetal harm. It also does cross the placenta. I'm sure your LLMD has weighed the risk, but if not, please discuss it with him/her.
Posted by hshbmom (Member # 9478) on :
Hi luvpuppy,
I once taught natural childbirth classes and have coached many women during labor.
Here's a suggestion concerning the baby's position & the resulting nerve difficulties:
Bradley's "cat's back" exercise is a great excercise to gently encourage the baby to change positions so the nerve problem will be history.
Get on the floor on all fours like a dog. Relax your spine & belly & let them sag a little...but don't hyperextend your back. Take some deep relazing breaths, then begin to tighten the muscles in your spine, belly, and buttocks while arching your back. Hold your breath, keep your muscles tight, keep your back arched. Then slowly relax, exhale, and sag your back again.
Do these several times a day. It will get the pressure off your lymph & blood vessels and help reduce & prevent swelling in your legs. This will strengthen your muscles and relieve back-ache. It will likely encourage your little one to find a different position and will remedy the nerve problem.
You might want to start out slowly, with 5-10 reps a couple times a day, then work up to 20 reps 10 times a day.
You can practice tightening and relaxing in increments as you do these exercises. Tighten, tighter, tighter, tighter. Relax, more, more, more. This will help train you to relax during birth.
Many women have used this exercise to turn a breech baby.
You will love this excercise as you get more full with child.
Here's a link to THE book. The book will not replace Bradley classes, but is excellent learning tool. Bradley classes are the mother of all childbirth classes.
Natural Childbirth the Bradley Way: Revised Edition (Paperback) by Susan McCutcheon-Rosegg (Author), Erick Ingraham (Illustrator), Robert A. Bradley (Introduction)
"In 1968, I started teaching childbirth to a few friends, and in the next year I completed my first teacher-training course at the American Institute..." (more)
Now is a great time to start doing Kegals. You want this muscle in shape! It's the cylinder-like muscle supporting the vagina, urethra, and rectum.
You will learn to contract and relax this muscle in increments. During birth you will be able to consciously relax this muscle to help your body give birth. If you tighten this muscle during birth you will experience pain. That's most women's reaction to the increasing pressure of the contractions. It's no wonder they have pain and are screaming for an epidural.
Women need to prepare for childbirth as though they are training for a marathon. The only muscles you need to use to give birth are the diaphragm and the muscle excercised when you do Kegals. Any other muscle is not needed.
Bradley will teach you how to maximixe your pushing effort. The entire rest of your body should be relaxed. No sore arms, shoulders, or bloodshot eyes from ineffective pushing! We don't have a baby with our face or skeletal muscles, so they can be relaxed during birth.
Have you ever watched an animal give birth? That's how normal childbirth can be. You should see my birth videos. Everyone thought I was asleep when I was in labor. Ha! I was working with intense concentration to keep every muscle relaxed. Some nurses thought I had been hypnotized. Ha! I didn't want to talk.
Bradley classes are THE BEST form of childbirth preparation. Your teacher may be willing to attend your birth and coach you through it. If she offers, grab the chance. You would never regret it. She would act as a liason between you and your doctor & nurses. You will be concentrating on having the baby. You will NOT want to be talking to the doctors and nurses while you're working so hard mentally. It's similar to trying to carry on a conversation with a five year-old while taking a final exam in college.
Have you given any consideration to breastfeeding? Dr. B does not recommend breastfeeding due to the chance of transmission.
When are you due? Are you planning a hospital or home birth? Have you ever broken your tailbone?
luvs, call or send me a message *anytime*.
Posted by hshbmom (Member # 9478) on :
Forgot to mention-- find a good chiropractor and go as often as needed.
A chiro kept me on my feet with my last few pregnancies. They know how to encourage the baby to stay off your nerves and in the correct position.
You many want to go to the chiropractor within a few days after the birth. Things can get out of whack and a chiro can help you immensely. Babies sometimes need a post-birth adjusment too. Ask around for chiros who work on babies and they're probably good with pregnant women too. They're usually moms or dads themselves.
Posted by luvdogs (Member # 9507) on :
OMG you guys are sooo helpful! hshsb, that is such great advice I have been trying to do that type of thing on my own - it feels good while I am doing it, but it has been to little avail, and nobody ever to me it was good. Now that I have real instructions on how to do it, I can try!
Do Bradley Classes teach this type of thing too? Or is it mostly for the actual chilbirth process?
My chiropractor was afraid of me and said that her sister went through this same nerve problem and never had another baby as a result bc it was so painful. I was hoping she would be able to help. Maybe I will go to another or so some PT with this pretty progressive and supposedly fantastic woman / group.
Re the mepron - they are using it was success in Lyme and babs and are preventing the babs from being passed on - the babies are healthy and it keeps the mom healthy while pregnant. I have lots of studies on it being used in pregnancy in conjunction with 2 other drugs - the results are promising and the babies again are born healthily. These studies are done for the treatment of malaria for the mother. But thank you for your concern Jesse. I, too, was concerned at the beginning. Here is one such study: ________________________________
R. McGready1, 2, 3, K. Stepniewska2, 3, M. D. Edstein4, T. Cho1, G. Gilveray1, S. Looareesuwan2, N. J. White2, 3 and F. Nosten1, 2, 3
(1) Shoklo Malaria Research Unit, PO Box 46, Mae Sot, Thailand (2) Faculty of Tropical Medicine, Mahidol University, Bangkok, Thailand (3) Centre for Tropical Medicine, Nuffield Department of Medicine, John Radcliffe Hospital, Headington, Oxford , UK (4) Australian Army Malaria Institute, Brisbane, Australia
N. J. White Email: [email protected] Phone: +66-22-460832 Fax: +66-22-46 7795 Received: 6 February 2003 Accepted: 7 July 2003 Published online: 30 August 2003
Abstract
Objective To determine the pharmacokinetic properties of atovaquone, proguanil, and the triazine metabolite cycloguanil in women with recrudescent multi-drug resistant falciparum malaria during the second and third trimesters of pregnancy treated by artesunate-atovaquone-proguanil.
Methods Serial plasma concentrations of atovaquone, proguanil and cycloguanil were measured in 24 women at baseline and after the final dose of the 3-day treatment with atovaquone (20 mg/kg/day) plus proguanil (8 mg/kg/day) plus artesunate (4 mg/kg/day) daily.
Results The triple combination was well tolerated and highly effective. The outcomes of pregnancy were all normal. Population mean (� SEM) oral clearance (Cl/F) estimates were 313�33 ml/h/kg and 1109�43 ml/h/kg, total apparent volume of distribution (Vd/F) 13.0�1.3 l/kg and 22.9�1.4 l/kg, and terminal elimination half-life; 29.1 h and 14.3 h, for atovaquone and proguanil, respectively. Using conventional and population pharmacokinetic analyses, Cl/F and Vd/F estimates for both drugs were approximately twice, and plasma concentrations less than half those reported previously in healthy subjects and patients with acute malaria.
Conclusion Artesunate-atovaquone-proguanil is a promising treatment for multi-drug resistant falciparum malaria during pregnancy, but the dose of atovaquone-proguanil may need to be increased.
______________________________________
There are many other studies like this one.
[ 03-08-2009, 10:51 AM: Message edited by: luvdogs ]
Posted by luvdogs (Member # 9507) on :
Dill, your mailbox is full and I wrote this whole email to you and then could not send...
parts of it include...
"Thanks for your support my friend. I think the word is "gps"??? I just got a new one the other day! You can borrow for your trip up here
Off to Dr Jones' Under Our Skin thingymabob.... must run but thinking of you.. xoxooxoxo Louise"
Posted by hshbmom (Member # 9478) on :
Yes, Bradley teaches you these things and so much more.
They teach you comfort measures for pregnancy and childbirth, such as how to sleep comfortably. They teach you how a woman's body and the baby's body respond to childbirth. It's so amazing to realize women were designed to have babies. Pregnancy is a normal state, not a medical crisis.
They teach you about common obstetrical interventions in great detail and inform you of the true risks associated with these interventions.
Hospital prepared childbirth classes assume you'll be using most interventions. They don't inform you about how the interventions work (leave your brains at the door) or what happens when they fail to work, nor do they think you need to know the risks involved in with various interventions.
They're goal is to produce a "good patient" who believes pat answers and doesn't question standard hospital practices. "This is what we do...accept it, because it makes our job easier."
Common interventions:
stipping membranes to induce labor the use of medications to ripen your cervix breaking the amniotic sac (water bag) to "induce labor" the use of pitocin to start labor the use of other procedures to start labor epidurals episiotomies
The Bradley method teaches you why you might choose to avoid the common interventions and how to succeed in avoiding them.
Even if you're planning on a C-section or an epidural, the information presented in a Bradley course is very important.
Do you have a close friend willing to take these classes with you? They're designed for couples, but you can take any suppportive friend person. The classes teach the support person how to comfort you and encourage you during pregnancy & labor.
Most Bradley classes start in the 4th month of pregnancy because they present so much information. You'll get a lot out of the book, but the classes are essential in my opinion. Video classes may be available, but they should be used to supplement local classes.
I'd love to send you some of my birth videos...then you'd see how normal and natural a birth can be.
You can find a great instructor who isn't certified. They'll probably be cheaper than a certified instuctor and just as competent. Ask around at health food stores, chiropractor offices, or the OB's office. The local LaLeche League could probably give you a great referral.
Posted by Tracy9 (Member # 7521) on :
BTW, we are selling tickets to those who want to attend the birth for $500 each to raise money to get the little guy to Dr. Jones after he is born.
Okay, just kidding!!!!
Posted by maureen2174 (Member # 11471) on :
Wow... I have been thinking of the c-section question a lot. I plan on trying to get pregnant this summer. I am 95% well and off abx. now for 6 months. Actually, not even sure if the remaining symptoms are lyme at this point.
Anyway, I am almost certain I had lyme disease with my son who is almost 4. I had a c-section. I also breastfeed (without being on abx.) until he was 20 months.
He is a happy, healthy almost 4 year old!
I was actually planning on another c-section, so now I am re-thinking this due to some of the comments in the post. I am actually going to ask over on the yahoo pregnancy/lyme group if they know anything as well and will post any info. I find out.
Does anyone know if steroids are given to the mom before or after c-section? I cant remember.
Congratulations on your pregnancy- glad that you are doing well and like others have said, it is so worth it!
I dont like posting about pregnancy too much here either because a few times, I was actually sent pms more or less telling me it was not the right thing to do, I was being selfish, etc.....
Posted by Ocean (Member # 3496) on :
Maureen,
Has your 4 year old been tested for Lyme? I'm just wondering because I too had Lyme with my kids and didn't know it. Only one has symptoms, 5 and 2 year old seem pretty normal. I am just hoping that only my oldest has it.
I would love to have another child, but am afraid now, course I'm not well enough yet, but in the future (like you).
also, sometimes it is VERY difficult to find an OB/Hosptial who is willing to do a VBAC. There is a slight increase in uterine rupture due to the scar tissue during labor/delivery. We did have a mom at my hospital (when I used to work) who attempted a VBAC and did have uterine rupture, they almost lost mom and baby. Baby ended up in the NICU for a little while.
However, I know another woman who had first one C/S and her second 2 were vag. I am all for choice, I had my kids at home, so I think everyone should do what they feel comfortable with!
Good luck with trying for baby #2 and I'm glad you are feeling so much better, that's terrific!
Take care, Ocean
take care, Ocean
Posted by Mo (Member # 2863) on :
hey luvs,
wow, congratulations, this is wonderful!!
it's so great that you placed the topic here, i have been dismayed at the lack of realistic pregnancy dialogue here on LN, when it is such an important topic for most women. (i believe that is why the yahoo group was started.)
since you are consulting with j., i'm sure you will have bases covered as far as screening baby at birth.
also, i just want to say, in addition to the above advise, be sure to educate yourself on the c-section route, even if you choose natural childbirth.
i was so sure in my pregnancies that i would only go natural, period.. but sometimes there are real reasons why it turns out differently. (i ended up with an emergency c-section)
because i was not prepared for that, and so many natural childbirth educational books and dialogues do not spend any time to speak of focusing on the procedure of a c-section (some treat it as a dirty word!) ... i felt very frightened and traumatized, and was totally unprepared for my emergency "c". the second birth i had to have another c-section, and i was able to make that a wonderful experience.
studying natural childbirth is absolutely prudent, but i'm just saying to learn about c's as well, just in case. there is alot of myth regarding c-sections.
come to think of it, there is a lot of myth regarding lyme and pregnancy as well.
be well, enjoy!!
living alone will bring up fear in any pregnancy. i think i spent the sixth month crying daily for no reason, lol..
so, mostly i'm glad you have a place to come and share.
blessings, mo
Posted by luvdogs (Member # 9507) on :
Thank you Mo! Yes, there have been a few tears lol!
I am contemplating the C-section possibility because my sister just had to have an emergency one also. She also has Lyme by the way.
Ok I just edited out this paragraph. Lol I am having a rough night here!
My body is so sensitive that I do not know if I could survive this type of operation, never mind the meds. I don't meant to be gross or freak anybody out here, but I am concerned.
I walk such a fine fine delicate line of health and trying to stay functional with Lyme. I have multiple chemical sensitivites and any vitamin or drug can send me into a whirling crash without a moment's notice. Under normal circumstances I have to live almost a perfect life and eat perfect foods and exercise every day etc. just to stay alive. Never mind what this pregnancy a pregnancy can do, and never mind what the labor and possible drugs and possible c-section could be like. So these are things that I need to consider, aside from just the basic "can Lymies get pregnant" questions.
I had made the decision not to have children for the above reasons. But things happen and it always seems that there is a reason for everything, so I have to go with this one and embrace it!
I do not want to scare anybody away from getting pregnant with Lyme, because I can and am living through all of this and I am sure it will all be worth it. And I am still able to work so I should not complain! But it has not been an easy road. I am sure that everybody's experiences are different.
The good news is that many of my symptoms are not even seemingly Lyme related, except the first trimester which brought about a complete exacerbation of Lyme symptoms for me. Mostly I seem to be having a huge exaggeration of normal pregnancy symptoms. But, overall, I do not see the "complete remission" that people seem to talk about! Oh that would be sweet
Anyway, thank you Mo. I went off on a tangent there. I will definitely try and learn about C-sections since that is the scariest possibility for me.
Edited when I started to feel better a little bit later in the eve
[ 03-20-2009, 10:59 PM: Message edited by: luvdogs ]
Posted by Hoosiers51 (Member # 15759) on :
maureen2174 said: "I dont like posting about pregnancy too much here either because a few times, I was actually sent pms more or less telling me it was not the right thing to do, I was being selfish, etc....."
and Mo said: "it's so great that you placed the topic here, i have been dismayed at the lack of realistic pregnancy dialogue here on LN, when it is such an important topic for most women. (i believe that is why the yahoo group was started.)"
Maureen, I have had similar experiences on Lymenet about six months ago. It was like some people went out of their way to make me feel bad for even wanting to gather information, people who had no objective facts to offer, only hurtful vibes to throw my way. (there were a few people that were good about it however).
Women deserve to have access to this information without being ridiculed by others.
I am SO glad it is becoming a more accepting and open climate here with the topic of pregnancy, so keep it up, everyone!!!
This very uplifting and positive thread is a step in the right direction!
I have high hopes that Lymenet can and will be a great resource for women who are pregnant or considering pregnancy.
And shame on those people who choose to be judgemental!!!! I hope they keep their mouths shut if they have nothing constructive to say!
Luvs, hope you are still hanging in there and doing okay!!!! Posted by Carol in PA (Member # 5338) on :
Congratulations!
Posted by luvdogs (Member # 9507) on :
I agree Hoosiers! This is important stuff and we need to be able to talk about it. And thank you and CarolPA and everybody else for the support! You guys are awesome...
Posted by pab (Member # 904) on :
luvdogs,
Have you talked to the hospital where you will be delivering the baby? I would let them know about your specials needs.
Hang in there! I know it's harder when you are alone. You can always post here if you need anything.
When is your baby due?
Posted by DadOf2 (Member # 3189) on :
quote:Originally posted by bettyg: LYME IS COMMUNICABLE BY TINCUP
Maybe we all better stay away from TINCUP then!!
Posted by luvdogs (Member # 9507) on :
Peggy,
I am due on June 17th but my hunch is that I will go a little bit earlier.
I am meeting with an anesthesiologist and I plan to take the Bradley class that starts in a few weeks. The instructor has offered to be my doula.
So, hopefully I will have the bases covered - and then when I drag Tracy and Melissa and Allie along, they oughta keep the doctors up to date on my needs Posted by Hoosiers51 (Member # 15759) on :
Luvdogs,
Thanks for not minding me going off on my "treat us (women wanting to talk about Lyme and pregnancy) with respect or else" soapbox on your thread!
I was having a "moment" earlier..... Had to tell the world how I really felt!
Didn't mean to detract from the point of this thread which is your specific concerns...
I have actually had you on my mind lately, since my best friend is also pregnant (she is due in August), so when I think of her I think of you too....
So please continue to keep us posted along the way!
Are all those people all really going to be there when you give birth? WOW! That's great!
Posted by luvdogs (Member # 9507) on :
Hoosies,
I am going to kidnap them all and make them be there!
I loved your soapbox... it is very true. We were talking about that very subject on chat tonight but, alas, you were not there with us - but our ears must have been ringing or vice versa!
I think about your friend also and I hope that she is doing well too.I hope that your friend is doing ok and keep me posted on her as well, ok?
I did not feel like you were detracting from my concerns at all! This is a thread for this subject as a whole - not just about me and my experience.
Posted by Mo (Member # 2863) on :
it's absolutely vital that this subject be allowed as much freedom of discussion and information as possible!
squashing that in any way is utterly absurd. i saw the same thing years ago here, hoosiers. tho, it was most definitely not the attitude of the majority of women here, a few turned it into a very sore subject. that was distressing to many.
yes, there have been complications due to lyme for mothers and babies in pregnancy.
however, it's clear that when mothers are educated and appropriately attentive to these concerns, all goes very well. which is precisely why it is critical that open support is available on the subject. doc j has seen huge successes time and time again when the situation is monitored with cognizance.
there are health concerns in any pregnancy, and many health conditions that require extra care.
so -- anybody else gets negative pm's on this subject, just forward them to me.
take extra special care of you, luvs. pamper yourself, learn all you can, get lots of rest and know that all will be well.
if you get stressed, share your questions here or on chat..there are many who can help, and you will be helping others as well.
m
Posted by bettyg (Member # 6147) on :
quote:Originally posted by DadOf2:
quote:Originally posted by bettyg:
LYME IS COMMUNICABLE BY TINCUP b]
Maybe we all better stay away from TINCUP then!!
dadof2, that was a good laugh dad!
amazing of not showing link does; isn't it! Posted by Tracy9 (Member # 7521) on :
Kidnap us???? HEH!!!
We didn't give her a choice. We fought like alley cats (no pun intended Allie) over who got to be there ..... and finally just decided we would ALL attend this birth!!!
She is going to have to have the doors padlocked to keep us out.
Nothing like three Lyme advocates there for you....oh boy......watch out!!!!
I'M HOLDING THE BABY FIRST!!!! (After Luvvy of course, and David, maybe, if he behaves.)
Posted by luvdogs (Member # 9507) on :
ROFL Tracy! Ok, you can hold the baby firstish...
Posted by Hoosiers51 (Member # 15759) on :
Tracy-- You guys are too funny....
Amen, Mo!!! Posted by dbourne (Member # 13833) on :
I am a member of PregLyme on Yahoo and it does work a bit different. I don't log onto a site like I do here on Lymnet. All posts come directly to my hotmail account. If I have a question or want to respond to a post I do it directly through my email. If you aren't getting lots of emails directly from PregLyme users go back and make sure you have your email address in the set up and that it's unblocked from your email account. I usually get a half dozen or so emails a day related to pregnancy and Lyme. I have really enjoyed that Yahoo group. I hope that it can be great for you too! Best of luck with everything. Sending great thoughts and prayers your way...
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Maybe we all better stay away from TINCUP then!! ![[Smile]](smile.gif)
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