I will try to keep this short, but I just need to update everyone to get it out in the open...
I had an ultrasound done at my regular OB's office last week. She could see the gestational sac, and also the "yolk sac" inside of the gestational sac.
This is how I understand it: at 5 weeks you just see the empty gestational sac. Then, at 5 1/2 weeks you can see the yolk sac, but still can't see the baby at all.
But by 6 weeks you are supposed to be able to see the baby a little (called the fetal pole)
So the first OB saw a yolk sac (I saw it too, it was very clear).
Today, over a week later, you should be able to see the fetus, or at least the vibration of the heartbeat. That was not there, and neither was the yolk sac.
The doctor said that because there was a yolk sac last week and this week there is not, that he is 95% sure I had a miscarriage.
He wants me to go back in a week for another ultrasound.
He was really nice, but I do trust his expert opinion. I think there is probably still a very tiny chance that I am still pregnant, so until the next ultrasound we won't know for sure that the pregnancy failed.
He said it was probably not due to the Malarone I was taking before I knew I was pregnant. He really seemed to believe it was just a random occurance.
He said it is amazing how many things need to go right to make a baby. He was basically implying it isn't that something went wrong that anyone did, but just that not everything went right when the baby was trying to establish.
I am still having pregnancy symptoms today like sore, growing breasts, but I guess that can be normal in this situation.
[ 05-08-2009, 05:27 PM: Message edited by: Hoosiers51 ]
Posted by Hoosiers51 (Member # 15759) on :
If this doesn't belong in Medical, just tell me and I'll move it. I thought I would see if any Lyme moms had a similar experience so that is why I put it here.
Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
I'm sorry Hoos. I know you were both worried and excited.
I also believe it was a random occurrence. I have had plenty of friends have early, and even late miscarriages and go on to have a healthy baby later.
Posted by Hoosiers51 (Member # 15759) on :
Thanks six. I was starting to get excited, but I guess it was not the right time. God works in ways we don't understand I guess.
Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
That is very true.
Posted by Looking (Member # 13600) on :
Sad for you -- I know how this feels.
It is very difficult for the doctors to know exactly what went wrong. Could have been a combination of many things.
Posted by Lymetoo (Member # 743) on :
I'm very sorry to hear this, Hoos. Please keep us posted. If it is indeed a loss of the baby... I'm VERY sorry.
Posted by mazou (Member # 15319) on :
Hoosiers, you are in my thoughts. Please keep us posted.
Posted by Hoosiers51 (Member # 15759) on :
Thanks, I will keep everyone posted.
Just by looking at the ultrasound, it didn't look very promising. I could tell when I looked at the sac that something didn't look right, because it was empty this week and something was in it last week.
I have a planned vacation with my family and I am leaving this Saturday, and I will be gone for over a week. Not sure if I will bring my computer or not.
I will have to wait until the week after next to get the second ultrasound because of the vacation, so it will be hard to wait that long.
Thank you for keeping me in your thoughts.
Posted by carly (Member # 14810) on :
I'm sorry to hear this.
You're right, God works in ways we don't understand.
It's hard, I know. You'll continue to be in my prayers at this difficult time.
[ 05-08-2009, 02:36 PM: Message edited by: carly ]
Posted by lymeberry (Member # 20102) on :
Sorry to hear about your possible loss and I do believe when you are feeling healthier you will have a very healthy baby. Hang in there it is just around the corner for you. I can't wait to hear you are feeling healthier and excited. You will be a wonderful mom.
Posted by TerryK (Member # 8552) on :
So sorry to hear this. Will be looking for the update. Keeping you in my prayers.
Terry
Posted by Keebler (Member # 12673) on :
-
Hossiers,
So sorry to hear that. And it must be hard not knowing 100% for sure yet, either.
Whatever, I hope you will be feeling better soon. Nature does bring some interesting and challenging things into our lives. It is true that many women (even very healthy women) often miscarry for no apparent reason and then, later, can become a Mom.
Hey, and since this Sunday is Mother's Day, I suggest you guard your feelings around all that. Celebrate Spring and Hope and Love. Just shift it around to make the day work for you.
Hugs.
-
Posted by Starfall1969 (Member # 17353) on :
I'm so sorry.
I lost a baby--long before I even thought about Lyme and co.
The doctor told me at that time that it just happens sometimes, and there's nothing you can do to prevent it.
I still can't understand why it happened, but it did,
and I have 2 beautiful boy now.
So there is hope and happiness after.
Timing was hard for me, too.
I miscarried on my birthday, and then I had to preach at my home church that Mother's Day.
It was sooooo hard getting through that time, and I had some rocky days for quite a while.
So, yes, keep us updated, and feel free to PM if you need to talk.
Deb
Posted by Geneal (Member # 10375) on :
I am so sorry.
Can your OB pull an HcG level?
I had this happen with my first pregnancy.
Didn't even know I was pregnant until I was about 6 weeks along.
Went to the Ob....everything was fine.
Started bleeding.
I never saw a heart beat either.
I was devestated. I know you must be too.
If there is anything I can do besides pray please let me know.
I've been there. Then had two beautiful, healthy children later.
I am so very sorry.
Hugs,
Geneal
Posted by sammy (Member # 13952) on :
Oh Hoos, I wish I could reach through this computer screen and hug you right now.
Please know that you are in my thoughts and prayers. I hope that you are able to relax and enjoy time with family next week. Sounds like you could really use a vacation.
Posted by opus2828 (Member # 15407) on :
Praying for you. I am sorry to hear this news.
Posted by Jasmin (Member # 19959) on :
Posted by Carol in PA (Member # 5338) on :
Hoos, I'm so sorry, and I'll keep you in my prayers.
Carol
Posted by Hoosiers51 (Member # 15759) on :
Thanks everyone for the prayers. Prayers for my husband James would be appreciated too. He was really excited about the pregnancy (more than I was, because he is the eternal optimist as opposed to me who just worries all the time) so now he is going through the same emotions I am, and I hate to see him upset. He has been very supportive though.
I am still holding out a small glimmer of hope, though I know that may set me up for disappointment. I am trying to be realistic, but I know there is a very small chance that there could still be something there. So I am not going to stop taking my Prenatal Vitamins and my pregnancy-safe meds yet.
I don't want to get anyone or myself excited because he said he is 95% sure I miscarried. Maybe I am just in denial. But I am not going to consider this over until it's really over.
It took awhile for me to get on board with this pregnancy, and now that I am on board with it, I am not going to stop holding out hope and taking care of my body just in case.
I am glad that I made the decision to keep the baby. That way if God takes the baby up to heaven, it would have been His decision, and it would have been for a good reason I'm sure.
Thank you again for the prayers. I know I will be okay in the long run.
Posted by AZURE WISH (Member # 804) on :
(((( Hoosiers)))) I am so sorry for both you and your husband.
Posted by disturbedme (Member # 12346) on :
Oh, Hoos. *hug*
I am keeping you and your hubby in my thoughts and prayers. I am so sorry. This must be so hard for both of you. Maybe the baby is still there but was 'hiding' or just very hard to see this time around? Did you ever get a period which usually would also be a signal of a miscarriage?
Whichever way it turns out, it was meant to be. As hard and odd as that sounds. God knows what's best.
Posted by asummers (Member # 18068) on :
Hoos - Sorry you & your husband have to be going thru this right now. Please know I am thinking about you Posted by Tracy9 (Member # 7521) on :
I am really curious why the doc didn't do HCG levels? It is so common and most surefire way to know if you have lost the baby.
When I was about 5 ish weeks with Ryan, they told me they thought I had a "blighted ovum" which I think is kind of the same thing? They didn't see anything there.
But Ryan is 19 now to prove he sure was there. I cried for the whole week until the next ultrasound.
What a rollercoaster. I will pray for a miracle for your baby.
Posted by Tracy9 (Member # 7521) on :
Oh also, when I miscarried, my symptoms LITERALLY disappeared overnight. On the third miscarriage, as soon as I woke up and the nausea, sore breasts , etc were gone, I knew. I'd learned from the first two. I called the doctor and told her I was sure the baby had died. And I am not kidding when I say they went away overnight.
I'm still holding on to hope for you.
Posted by maureen2174 (Member # 11471) on :
Awww.... I am sorry for your possible loss.
I also had a miscarriage and it took me a year to actually get up the nerve to try again and now I have a happy, healthy 4 year old!
I know it is hard though, but lots of women have miscarriages and then go on to have children later.
My thoughts are with you and your husband.
Posted by feelfit (Member # 12770) on :
Hoosiers & James in my thoughts and prayers.
Feelfit
Posted by Hoosiers51 (Member # 15759) on :
What's weird is that I did pee in a cup so they could check my hormone levels when I first got there, but then after the ultrasound, I'm not sure if they did.
It is one of the vaginal ultrasounds, so it is supposed to be pretty accurate, but I read online that if you have a flipped uterus (which I do), they can be less accurate.
Yes, Tracy, the "blighted ovum" is what I am thinking he thought it was based on what I read online. He didn't use too much medical terminology with me. I think he was either afraid of misdiagnosing and thus misleading me, or he was just worried about upsetting me by using so many "labels."
He seemed to be trying really hard to put it delicately since I must have seemed really upset, I spilled water all over myself, etc.
I think the only reason this might be more definitive is that when blighted ovum is misdiagnosed, it's because they see nothing there, but it's because it was still too early.
But with me, something was there last week, now it's not, so I think that is what made him more sure.
They spent a REALLY long time looking for anything on the machine....a yolk sac, etc.
But, I HAVE read online, in rare cases....things get missed, and having a flipped uterus raises those odds.
And yes, I still have the pregnancy symptoms. Even this evening I still have them....I am ravenously hungry.
But I also read that sometimes the hormones can stick around for awhile.....so who knows. Maybe that is why they didn't bother testing the urine?
Holding out slight hope, but either way, I am coming to terms and have realized that I will be okay no matter what.
PS---never passed blood, but did have spotting in the 4th week. But that was light.
Posted by Dekrator48 (Member # 18239) on :
Praying for you and James and the baby....so sorry you are going through this.
Posted by wtl (Member # 19883) on :
Terribly sorry, Hoos.
This reminds me a lot the miscarriage my wife had about 2 1/2 years ago. It was about 6 weeks. One day everything was silent. A week later, she went back and was confirmed and operated to take the remaining tissue out.
Of course it would take another 2 1/2 years before she knew she had Lyme disease. Now, everything is clear...
This must be the hardest thing one has to go through. I am so deeply sorry.
Posted by gemofnj (Member # 15551) on :
Hoos,
I am so hoping that there is a chance that maybe the doc misinterpreted something.
My third pregnancy was a miss at 3 months and I totally understand how you feel. We can never question why He decides for us sometimes.
My thoughts will be with you and your husband.
Posted by kelmo (Member # 8797) on :
I'm so sorry Hoos. I had the exact same type of miscarriage. Don't think it was anything you did. I have heard that 50% of all pregnancies end in misscarriage, some lose it the first month and never know.
Just to let you know, that your body will grieve. I remember being awashed in depression afterward that felt more physical than emotional.
Take it gentle with yourself for a while.
When the time is right, it will happen again.
Love ya Kelmo
Posted by MariaA (Member # 9128) on :
I'm so sorry to hear that, hoos.
wtl- there are a LOT of miscarriages at 6 weeks- if the body detects any problem at all with the embryo it miscarries. I don't recall the statistics but they're really high, and your wife's miscarriage probably had nothing to do with her Lyme.
everyone- as for hormones and 'feeling' pregnant- when I had an abortion last year it took a few weeks for the tiredness from the pregnancy to disappear, along with other hormonal signs like sore breasts etc. I think this all varies depending on the woman.
Posted by CD57 (Member # 11749) on :
I;m sorry to hear this too, Hoos. My doc said the same thing as yours about how hard it is to make and grow a baby. Things will come round again.
Posted by Larkspur (Member # 5131) on :
Sorry Hoos - I'm thinking about you and your husband.
I know things will work out the way they are meant too
lots of love, Abby
Posted by lymednva (Member # 9098) on :
Hoos, so sorry to hear your news. I will keep you and your hubby and parents in my prayers.
Posted by cantgiveupyet (Member # 8165) on :
sorry to hear your news. You will be in my thoughts and prayers. Posted by linky123 (Member # 19974) on :
You and James are in our thoughts and prayers, and we know that God will sustain you through all this. Take care.
Linky
Posted by heiwalove (Member # 6467) on :
sending love. i'm so very sorry. Posted by bettyg (Member # 6147) on :
devin and james
devin, i'm so sorry to read this. i know you had accepted this occurence and were planning things, etc.
as you've read above, many lyme patients have miscarried or had stillborns due to lyme/co-infections. never know it until you are diagnosed and 2 and 2 equals 4.
may god comfort you both during this time and your week of vacation is at a good time to share w/family/friends.
12-12-07, my 20 yr. old niece, ashley, lost both her twins; identical !! she started bleeding and got into the bathtub in the water to calm down. her sac came out.
she took it w/her to ER; admitting nurse was told by her she miscarried, and rn kept saying she had an ABORTION! she had lots of tests.
then 2-3 weeks later, she stopped to visit us. RN called her saying they thought she had a triplet still in the TUBE! was 1-2 wks. later; nope; but her tests showed something was there.
so as you said, 5% says the baby is still there...
best wishes to you both during this time; leave the pc at home unless you chose to have it there IN CASE...
bettyg
Posted by chrissyparks (Member # 19655) on :
I am so sorry you are going through this.
I gave birth to 3 babies in the mid 90's and in 2005 began trying again for a 4th. I miscarried twice. This was all before knowing anything about Lyme.
My doc said that it was common and had nothing to do with my mystery illness, but if it happened a third time we would have to look into it more.
I became pregnant again and I told my doc this was it...I can't go through it anymore and if I lose a third baby I want my tubes tied. We did the usual tests and my doc found something she had missed the first two times.
My progesterone level was very very low. I asked her why and she said, (of course) sometimes that just happens.
I was put on progesterone for the first few weeks of pregnancy and delivered a healthy baby boy in 2007.
I really am getting to a point here...
Recently after reading everything I could get my hands on to do with Lyme, I stumbled onto something very interesting. Some women with Lyme have been documented to have unusually low progesterone levels,(among other hormone imbalances).
Hmmm, something for us Lyme Ladies to think about anyway.
I don't suppose this helps much at this point, but for future...please ladies know your progesterone levels when pregnant and don't just assume your doc will catch these things.
Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
Good point, Chrissy, I had a friend who miscarried if she was not treated with progesterone early in pregnancy.
Posted by hiker53 (Member # 6046) on :
You and James are in my prayers. Hiker53
Posted by nenet (Member # 13174) on :
I'm very sorry, Hoosiers, and I wish you and your husband the best, no matter what happens.
Posted by maureen2174 (Member # 11471) on :
Yes, Chrissy- good point. After my miscarriage, I had my progesterone levels tested- I can't remember, but it was a certain time in my cycle and my progesterone levels were very low.
So, when I got pregnant with my son, I took progesterone- started 3 days after ovulation when I was trying in case implantation did occur (which it did first attempt thankfully).
The thing is, I actually asked for this progesterone test, otherwise I probably would have had another miscarriage.
I am going to try to conceive in a few months from now and I already have my script for the progesterone. I asked my OBGYN about testing my levels again and she said it is not even worth the chance of not taking the progesterone anyway.
I think (lyme or not) a lot of miscarriages occur due to low progesterone. I know so many women who had miscarriages and later on went on to have healthy babies and they did take progesterone in those pregnancies!
Posted by Julie F. (Member # 15956) on :
So sorry, Hoos, to hear your news. I'll be keeping you and your husband in my thoughts. I hope you are able to find some peace with it. Hang in there and know that there is a lot of support out there for you.
Julie
Posted by Jill E. (Member # 9121) on :
Hoosiers,
I'm not a mom so I cannot give any advice based on medical experience. I can only offer my prayers to you and your husband.
Jill
Posted by luvdogs (Member # 9507) on :
Hoosie,
I know I sent you a PM also, but I am thinking of you, ok? I think that everybody has said what I would like to say here. Also, I tend to concur with Tracy - when I miscarried a few years ago my sx went away pretty much overnight. So I will hope for a miracle also!
But, regardless of what happens with this pregnancy, I think that the beauty in it is that you realized that you really do want to have a baby. And next time it happens, your body will be more ready for it, because, as I told you, they say that after a miscarriage or pregnancy, the body is much better equipped to handle a pregnancy. Also, you know so much about meds etc that you will immediately know what to do next time (in terms of meds etc) bc you have been through it all.
Anyway, I hope you have a wonderful vacation and can relax! I am here if you need - even if you don't bring your computer you can call any time.
Hugs, me
Posted by dguy (Member # 8979) on :
many (most?) lymies have Th1 overexpression, which can lead to pregnancy troubles
Since progesterone is the first hormone used during stress, it would make sense that we are all very low in progesterone.
My daughter and I have used a good bio-identical cream for years.
So, if you really want to attempt another pregnancy, progesterone is what keeps it in.
Your body normally creats 20mg/day. During pregnancy, it ramps up to 400mg/day.
So, if you do use it to get pregnant, keep using it until the 5th months when your body will make that amount.
Posted by kelmo (Member # 8797) on :
I want to add an BUT...sometimes we lose a baby because it was so deformed it wouldn't have a chance of survival. In that case, it's a blessing to lose it early.
If you have repeated miscarriages, then it's most likely hormonal.
Posted by dguy (Member # 8979) on :
progesterone making a difference fits for us... since progesterone is a steroid, it can damp down our excess immune response
Posted by Hoosiers51 (Member # 15759) on :
Thank you for all the replies. They really mean a lot.
I read some of the replies earlier before I went out. While I was out, I was thinking about the progesterone thing.
I think that there is definitely a chance that progesterone could have something to do with all this. Maybe it does, maybe it doesn't, but there's a chance.
I know this might sound like a bad idea, but there is already a 95% chance things aren't going well anyways....so I decided to pick up some progesterone cream at the health food store while I was out with a "what have I got to loose" sort of attitude.
I thought maybe I would take it for a few days, since I still am having pregnancy symptoms. Maybe if the baby is barely hanging on, it would help something.
Does that make any sense? I mean, it is now the weekend so I don't know how practical it is for me to go get my levels measured at the doctor. Should I go to a walk in clinic and ask to have them measured?
I'm sorry if I sound desperate, etc....but I feel like doing anything I can will at least give me closure if this pregnancy doesn't work out.
If I feel like I tried, I think I will feel better about it. Or should I just take the cream for the whole week I'm gone? Could it hurt me?
If anyone has advice that would be great.
Like I said, I still realize there is a 95% chance everything is already over, but I just don't think I can relax on vacation not doing anything/not knowing anything, because I haven't passed any blood yet or lost my symptoms.
If I passed blood, I would feel like there was closure, but there is absolutely no closure right now. So it will be hard to do nothing.
So my question is, should I use the progesterone cream or should I not? Or if the pregnancy is over, would this be really bad because it would affect my immune system so I should think of my own health first? But if it won't hurt me at all maybe I'll do it.
Thank you.
Posted by Hoosiers51 (Member # 15759) on :
PS--my breasts are a little less sore today, but they are still sore.
I am also incredibly hungry, hungrier than I have been in my life. I am eating moderately, like a normal person, but not a ton b/c of my appetite.
I am also starting to get soreness over my abdomen, but even way up high like almost under my rib cage.
Don't know if any of those are just pregnancy symptoms or miscarriage symptoms but I thought I would throw it out there for those who have more experience with this kind of thing. Google isn't super-helpful.
Posted by luvdogs (Member # 9507) on :
Hoosies,
I think that progesterone is partly what kept my baby going this time. I was using it anyway to deal with horrible pms and I tend to use it in the days / 2 weeks preceding my period as needed. Of course, the month that I got pregnant, I had more sx, so I used it more without knowing that I was helping to prevent miscarriage.
My sister who has Lyme also just used it throughout the first part of her pregnancy.
I use the EMERITA pro-gest - get it from whole foods. I used it for the first 14 weeks and so did my sister.
In addition, when one miscarries, they tend to do it at the time they are supposed to have their regular period. So, if you are going to, it will happen at the 8 or 12 week mark, most likely, unless your body has absorbed all of the tissue already...
Hope this helps.
Thinking of you, me Posted by Starfall1969 (Member # 17353) on :
When I had my miscarriage, my pregnancy symptoms continued for several more weeks.
My miscarriage finally completed itself (passing the whatever they call it, sac?) at 12 weeks.
(I chose not to get a D & C--just couldn't get it out of my head that doing that was like an abortion--irrational, I know).
Interesting what was said about progesterone--I had to be on progesterone for both viable pregnancies.
That's why I just can't help wondering how long I've had Lyme...
Posted by Hoosiers51 (Member # 15759) on :
Thanks Luvs and Starfall.
Sorry have to keep this short....I am SO tired right now I am barely awake.
I did do the progesterone. Shortly after, I became really really tired. (sort of like the pregnant tired I guess).
Would the progesterone do that to me so quickly, or is this a coincidence?
I have a couple more errands I need to run before the trip, but I am so exhausted that I don't think I'll be able to do them.
Feeling very emotionally overwhelmed right now. I anyone knows about the progesterone and the fatigue it would be nice to know. Feeling really down too but I suppose that is normal. Mostly it is the fatigue.
Posted by luvdogs (Member # 9507) on :
Progesterone can exacerbate pregnancy symptoms from what I know. I think that half of pregnancy symptoms are caused by the increase in progesterone. Can't write right now... More in a bit!
Posted by sparkle7 (Member # 10397) on :
I don't know anything about this issue but I would like to say I'm sorry you had to go through this.
I hope you will come through the pain quickly & that your heart will heal in time.
Posted by bettyg (Member # 6147) on :
glad you are getting a lot of personal feedback from other members. xox
Posted by kelmo (Member # 8797) on :
Hoosiers, if you are misscarrying, you may have lost most of the conents, and you probably don't want to use the progesterone to hold it in. Just my opinion.
Have you had another pregancy test to confirm if you are still pregnant? I thought you completely miscarried.
There is a time to use the cream, and a time not to use the cream.
If you have a period. You count from day one of the start of your period. On day 12, you apply the cream (1/2 to full pump twice daily on clean skin).
On day 26, you stop and your period should start within 48 hours.
If you do not have a period (hysterectomy, menopause), you start on the first of the month, end on the 25th and give your body a five day rest, just like you did when you had a period.
For the person who said they didn't have a D&C. It's a personal choice. I'm prolife, but after my miscarriage (at 12 weeks), I didn't want any leftover tissue in there that might become infected.
The second miscarriage I had was so early, I didn't even have it confirmed I was pregant, but I just "KNEW" I was. Didn't bother with the D&C that time.
![[Frown]](frown.gif)
He was basically implying it isn't that something went wrong that anyone did, but just that not everything went right when the baby was trying to establish.![[group hug]](graemlins/grouphug.gif)
![[Smile]](smile.gif)
![[kiss]](graemlins/kissing.gif)
devin and james