I have a constant dull pain in my back and lots of pressure.
Sharp pains off and on on lower right side that radiates to my back, but there is a constant ache there as well.
Also, lots of burning feelings in my heart.
Abdomen is very bloated and tender.
I have stopped all meds as of today.
Have had cardo workup - all is fine. CT of lower right abdomen looking at appendix, ovaries, intestines and bile ducts - alls well in that area.
Been on prescription strength antacid medicine that doesn't do anything.
Tested for H pylori and its negative.
Any ideas at all??? The Dr's just keep scratching their heads.
I felt like this leading up to my gallbladder being removed when the pain got severe. That was over 5 years ago.
Thanks for any suggestions.
[ 04-16-2010, 01:21 PM: Message edited by: momintexas ]
Posted by massman (Member # 18116) on :
Is it typically after eating ?
If yes, how long after ?
Posted by momintexas (Member # 23391) on :
The pain gets worse after eating yes. (I'm on a strict gluten free diet, no dairy, no red meat, no fried foods, I have a very clean diet).
The very sharp pains occur about 2 hours or so after eating.
The dull pain hangs around all day.
Posted by meanlene (Member # 25265) on :
You may want to be checked for gastroparesis. Gastroparesis causes your stomach to empty more slowly than normal and it causes pain, bloating and can cause nausea and vomtiing in some patients as well. I had similar problems after the removal of my gallbladder and they did a gastric emptying study which showed gastroparesis. There are various treatment options available, but no cure. Were you on IV Rocephin? I think that may have shut down my gallbladder, but am not sure.
Posted by Lymetoo (Member # 743) on :
Did you get a special CT scan of only the bile duct?? I THINK it's an MRCP or something like that.
Three years after my GB surgery I got sludge and a stone in my bile duct. It was all exacerbated by ANTIBIOTICS I was taking for a sinus infection.
I'm now very sensitive to abx.
You could also have something called "sphincter of odi."
If I spelled that right, you can Google it.
I ended up with an ERCP procedure to clear the stone and my dr clipped the end of the duct. No big problems since then.... but pain is not uncommon for me in that area.
Posted by Ticked (Member # 24336) on :
You still get stones in the liver even if the gallbladder is removed. Here's a link to a cleanse that will probably help you. It'll clean the liver naturally and painlessly. I've done 16 of them!
PM me if you have any questions!
Posted by psano2 (Member # 11711) on :
try eating some beets.
Posted by momintexas (Member # 23391) on :
Interesting answers - thank you.
I have not had my pancreatic enzymes checked. I haven't had any vomiting or weight loss, but the rest of it fits.
I've had unexplained weight GAIN though.
Posted by Marnie (Member # 773) on :
Ticked is correct...stones can still form in the common bile duct.
However...is your pain due to pancreatitis?
Important to rule that out!
Ongoing inflammation is not healthy.
If female...keep up scheduled mammograms.
Posted by momintexas (Member # 23391) on :
I guess I should ask to have my liver enzymes checked.
Beets?? Really?
Lymetoo - I don't know what the test was called, but I do know they were looking for stones in bile duct. All clear.
Posted by Lymetoo (Member # 743) on :
That's good! I lost about 20 lbs in about 5 wks while going thru this. Finally lost 25 lbs... and really was at my proper weight at the beginning of all that!
Posted by kday (Member # 22234) on :
Does the pain wake you up out of deep sleep in the middle of the night? Typically about 3-5 AM?
Posted by Marnie (Member # 773) on :
"2am to 4am is the peak time where the pineal gland naturally produces vast amounts of this melatonin."
Tryptophan converts to serotonin and then to melatonin but,
The same enzyme converts tryptophan to niacin.
Niacin can trigger hyperglycemia.
So if the body is busy during 2- 4am making melatonin, do niacin levels drop -> hypoglycemia?
Then...
"Because some people (as in hypoglycemia and diabetes) may lack the first enzyme - delta-6-desaturase - they cannot produce the anti-inflammatory substances and they suffer constant pain.
To bypass the faulty enzyme people should take Evening Primrose Oil or ***Fishoil*** and thus produce their own anti-inflammatory substances. They can replace NSAIDs without any side effects."
Δ6-desaturase is the rate-limiting step for transforming linoleic or linolenic acid into the longer EFA metabolites, GLA and EPA, respectively, and Δ6 is also used to make DHA out of EPA.
Many people have less than optimal delta-6 activity. Infants have no appreciable Δ6 activity until about 6 months of age and must get DGLA, AA, EPA and DHA from breast milk and the diet.
As we age, Δ6 activity declines progressively. Dietary factors, including alcohol, trans-fats, and saturated fats will each inhibit Δ6 and, interestingly, so too will excessive dietary linolenic acid.
Epstein Barr virus and HIV have been shown to inhibit the desaturases, and other viruses likely do the same. People experiencing post-viral fatigue syndrome have
[ 04-11-2010, 12:54 AM: Message edited by: Marnie ]
Posted by massman (Member # 18116) on :
IME the bloating may indicate food rotting in your stomach.
You may need more acid, not an antacid. We are supposed to have strong stomach acid to digest protein. If I recall correctly very few people have too much acid.
If the food does not digest correctly then it can rot. If this makes sense I can tell you about a cheap test tou can do at home to check for too much / too little acid.
Posted by momintexas (Member # 23391) on :
It's worst at night when I'm laying in bed trying to sleep. Then it usually wakes me up during the night, yes between 4-5 am usually.
And I do have hypoglycemia.
Massman - tell me about the test please.
Posted by kday (Member # 22234) on :
Well, I was having similar pain as you describe. It was after some of the worst stress I ever had. I was supposed to have a scope, but I didn't make it. I ended up treating myself with supplements for a duodenal ulcer. I wouldn't say I cured myself yet, but the pain is greatly diminished and I don't wake up at night from it. I also had lots and lots of belching. I had it for a long time, but my psychiatrist said it was anxiety/panic. Wrong!
I drink coconut water every day and my belching is gone and it keeps my stomach feeling much more comfortable throughout the day. I'm not sure if you have belching or not, but I did it literally hundreds of times a day. I have a little bit of aching still, especially after a larger meal. I just have to eat smaller portions for now.
The antacid medication may take a while if something needs to heal. If you take pepto-bismol with an antacid it may promote healing faster (even though the bottle says not to for ulcers). If you don't like the pink grossness of pepto-bismol, Slippery Elm Bark will also protect the mucosal lining to promote healing. You can have ulcers without h pylori.
If you had your bile ducts scanned, and you don't even have a gallbladder, it's not likely that you are experiencing pain related to the gallbladder. It's probably just something that feels similar.
Posted by momintexas (Member # 23391) on :
Thank you for your response.
I never belch. Seriously. I never do. I think I'd feel better if I could, but for some reason I never do and can't seem to do it.
Posted by kday (Member # 22234) on :
By the way, my pain eventually got to the point where I was vomiting food I ate days before, and then after every meal. Don't let yourself get to that point.
And I was on a gluten free sugar free diet. I gave up for a while when I couldn't keep things down, but now I am trying to get back on it.
Posted by massman (Member # 18116) on :
Need Apple Cider Vinegar - good stuff like Bragg's - it is acidic Baking Soda - it is alkaline 2 empty cups Small spoon
Put 2 - 3 tablespoons of the vinegar in one cup Fill other cup 3/4 full of water
Drink vinegar quickly Wait a few minutes Stomach OK - great - you are done Stomach starts to hurt / burn - quickly put 2 to 3 teaspoons baking powder in water and stir Drink quickly - this should neutralize vinegar in stomach
If the Apple Cider Vinegar helps, you probably need some supplements with acid in them - like Betaine Hcl with each meal
If it makes things worse, you probably need supplements to decrease acidity. Decrease, not shut off entirely.
Clear enough ? Questions ?
Posted by Lymetoo (Member # 743) on :
Mom... did you Google the sphincter of odi thing yet? You may be having spasms in the duct.
Posted by azdaisy (Member # 25357) on :
I had this exact same thing! Gallbladder out in 94 and sudden onset of symptoms in 2000. Crazy wind sucking pain and I gained 20 lbs eating chicken soup, it was all that would go down.
Ursidiol is very helpful RX that reduces bile sludge as a result of ABX and many of our other meds. I too am sugar free, flour free and if I have butter fat...I hurt!! so, it's bile duct related for me. The bilary tree and the lobes of the gallbladder make it possible to have a retained stone that may never be detected but can be helped with meds like ursidiol. Also, I was dissuaded from surgical intervention since Lyme LOVES scar tissue and I didn't want to make more and risk it! The test mentioned way at the top MRCP has big consequences and you should do it only as a last resort as it may cause pancreatitus or can make you diabetic for life- that's why I turned it down and manage my pain with Ursidiaol and diet and it is now a rarity!
Posted by Bluemoon (Member # 25255) on :
Make sure your pancreas is checked out.
Posted by momintexas (Member # 23391) on :
Massman - thanks, I will try it.
Lymetoo - I did Google it and its a good thing to ask about at my next appt.
azdaisy & Bluemoon- thank you for the info.
These are all great suggestions that I will bring up. I plan to try a GI Dr next.
I started a liquid diet on Saturday because I felt so miserable and also stopped ALL meds.
Some of the symptoms seem to be getting less painful. Chest and back pain are significantly less, pain in my lower right abdomen is slightly less.
I'm still very bloated and tender though.
Posted by momintexas (Member # 23391) on :
Update:
Thank you Massman for the test. I did it and had no reaction.
I have since started taking HCL and feel MUCH better.
My abdomen has gone WAY down too.
I really appreciate everyone's advice.
Thank you all very much! Posted by massman (Member # 18116) on :
Very welcome !
Those BigPharma acid reflux ads annoy the beejeepers out of me Posted by klutzo (Member # 5701) on :
Just a couple of corrections.
There is no danger in having an MRCP. It is just an MRI of the pancreas. I had one and did just fine, and it is almost as accurate as the ERCP.
It is the ERCP that is dangerous and can often cause pancreatitis. It is the most accurate but is an invasive test.
Also, the spelling of the bile binding drug is Ursodiol, known as Urso for short.
I take Ursodiol, Sucralfate, Librax, Pancrease MT20, and L-Glutamine for my problem. It has stopped my stomach spasms, totallly cleared up my pre-Barrett's esophagus, and stopped my bile reflux gastritis. But, the gastroparesis is getting worse. I wish I could take ABX like most of you can.
Hope you all find the help you need.
klutzo
Posted by Pinelady (Member # 18524) on :
You might try a little coconut oil to slick the pipes up a bit too.
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