Many of you know my DD's situation. I'll refresh...
Treated for lyme 7 years ago with 2 weeks of abx, diagnosed with GERD, Hiatal Hernia and Barrett's esophagus 2 years ago, abx treatment for Bartonella/Lyme for 9 months now.
The first time she took Rifampin, early in treatment, it caused crazy acid which her 80mg of Protonix could not control.
We're trying her on it again (Rifampin, Zith, Bactrim DS) and it's much better this time. She's been on it now for 5 weeks.
But she gets stomach "pain" for a few hours almost everytime she takes abx. She can't describe the pain (don't know why - she's terrible at that and won't try).
Rifampin did wonderful things for me so I'd like to try her on it for a few months.
So, my questions... Have any of you had stomach problems/acid, took Rifampin and had stomach pain? Did it get better? Did it get worse? Should I be worried about this pain? Did rifampin get rid of your acid altogether?
Thanks for your help, friends!
Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
up?
Posted by momlyme (Member # 27775) on :
I wish I had an answer for you. When my son was on Rifampin/Zith he was in such bad shape I couldn't tell whether he was doing better or worse because we could barely keep medicine or food in him he was throwing up so much... stomach hurt all the time. He just couldn't tolerate the oral abx.
Are you giving the rifampin by itself so that you are sure this is what is causing the stomach pain? She doesn't have it any other time?
I guess you have to weigh the potential benefit of the drug against the level of pain she is having. Is it tolerable?
Posted by dsiebenh (Member # 5353) on :
I'm not taking Rifampin but I do have stomach pains from abx. What works fairly well for me is only taking abx with a meal, and taking a Pepcid before dinner (which is one abx dose.) Reduces acid stomach and pain considerably.
Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
Hi momlyme,
Thanks for replying. She's on Rifampin, Zith, Bactrim but has been on Zith and Bactrim before with no problems. So I'm convinced it's the Rifampin.
My husband has had acid for years and it stopped completely after 3 weeks on Rifampin. He hasn't taken anything for the acid since then - amazing! He never mentioned that it gave him stomach pain either.
I guess I'm wondering if the stomach pain is a good thing or a bad thing. Is it something she should go thru to get well or will it hurt her somehow?
Who ever knows about this stuff...
The pain doesn't keep her from going to school or anything. She just holds her stomach and tells me it really hurts.
I guess I'll just wait and see. Famous last words, right?
Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
OK, today she came home from school and said she'd had burning acid all day. What does this mean?
It's helping? Or making things worse?
Should she stick it out or stop?
Opinions? Advice? Experiences?
Posted by Starfall (Member # 26795) on :
I have occasional stomach pain whether I'm on abx or not. My pain feels like a gnawing pain, almost like there's something inside my stomach just chewing on me.
With rifampin, I sometimes reflux it--just a few minutes after I take it, if I don't eat a little something right after I take it, it's not a burp or a barf, but it just shoots up my throat, sometimes into my nose.
Then my esophagus burns terrible for a few hours till I get it setlled down.
For me it's not all the time, but when it happens, it's pretty bad.
Posted by momlyme (Member # 27775) on :
*Take each dose with a full glass (8 ounces) of water. Take isoniazid and rifampin on an empty stomach one hour before or two hours after meals.
If nausea occurs, ask your doctor if you can take isoniazid and rifampin with food.
Use caution with the foods listed below. They can interact with isoniazid and rifampin and cause a reaction that includes a severe headache, large pupils, neck stiffness, nausea, vomiting, diarrhea, flushing, sweating, itching, irregular heartbeats, and chest. A reaction will not necessarily occur, but eat these foods with caution until you know if you will react to them. Call your doctor immediately if you experience any of these symptoms.
Eat the following foods with caution:
*cheeses, including american, blue, boursault, brick, brie, camembert, cheddar, emmenthaler, gruyere, mozzarella, parmesan, romano, roquefort, stilton, and swiss; *sour cream and yogurt; *beef or chicken liver, fish, meats prepared with tenderizer, bologna, pepperoni, salami, summer sausage, game meat, meat extracts, caviar, dried fish, herring, shrimp paste, and tuna; *avocados, bananas, figs, raisins, and sauerkraut; *soy sauce, miso soup, bean curd, and fava beans; *yeast extracts; *ginseng; *chocolate; *caffeine (coffee, tea, cola, etc.); and *beer (alcoholic and nonalcoholic), red wine (especially Chianti), sherry, vermouth, and other distilled spirits.
____________________
I hope she feels better!
Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
That's helpful to know, Starfall. Thank you. I guess I won't panic yet about the pain.
momlyme, that is awesome info and I hoped I would find the missing link in that food list, but I didn't.
And she takes her meds immediately after eating breakfast and dinner so she's got food in her stomach.
She took her DGL licorice tonite and felt a little better afterwards.
Posted by KaitlinB (Member # 11718) on :
I happened across this post from Elaine G, which was posted on this site April 15, 2010.
I think it is a brilliant idea to try for those whose stomachs are bothered by abx. I have copied her post & here it is (in quotes).
"My LLMD has me put all my meds in gel caps. This way the meds don't dissolve in the stomach but in the small intestine.
Even though Dr. Z chinese medicine has better gel caps now, I still enclose Artmesia and HH into another gel cap.
The only med that I have to split is Malarone, I then take the two halfs and put in one gel cap. Even Biaxin fits into a 000 gel cap.
I get the gel caps from a compounding pharmacy but it does add to the cost that I spend every month. I don't need a script for gel caps.
If unsure of the gel cap size, bring your meds and the pharmacy should help you determine the gel cap size.
I've been doing this for 9 months and have NOT had any stomach problems.
I find that 0, 00, 000 size fits almost all my meds.
Get about 50 gel caps in different sizes and try it to see if this helps.
I don't know why more LLMD's don't recommend this. It does work and saves the stomach. Just my opinion since it works for me."
I am excited to try it...hopefully it will be helpful to others.
Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
update, my LLMD told me to stop Rifampin completely for 3 days, continue zith and bactrim.
then start rifampin again but only in pm for 3 days and if all's well, start again 2 x a day.
she's feeling much better
except for the flu she's had this whole holiday! she catches everything that comes around...poor thing.
(i am definitely getting gel caps for future episodes though. thanks kaitlin!)
------------------------------------------ a starfall by any other name is still a starfall - it took me a while but I caught on! Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
Well, my daughter took Rifampin w/ dinner at 6pm last evening.
This morning she told me she woke up at 5am with terrible heart burn.
What the...????
Kaitlin copied a post that said, ""My LLMD has me put all my meds in gel caps. This way the meds don't dissolve in the stomach but in the small intestine."
So I just came from the pharmacist where I had asked them about gel caps.
The pharmacist said that Rifamipin is already in a capsule so that it breaks down in a certain place and if i were to put it in a gel cap, it would decrease the effectiveness of the drug.
Sheesh. So the Bart gives her acid and the Rifampin that kills the Bart gives her acid. Back to square one...
What's a girl to do?
Any more ideas, anyone?
Posted by lymegal23 (Member # 28573) on :
I'm experiencing stomach discomfort and acidy feeling with biaxin. so i kno how it feels but i honestly cant offer any insight Posted by momlyme (Member # 27775) on :
My son puked & had stomach issues... a lot. He still does sometimes! He did not tolerate oral abx. well... but that's not all of it, we had to cut out a lot of foods.
Even with that, he was still having some major issues... acid, like you said. His LLMD suggested Apple Cider Vinegar for this kind of acid in the chest feeling. I thought this was crazy and I said so... she explained, I researched... Here is one site I bookmarked: http://www.apple-cider-vinegar-benefits.com/vinegar-and-acid-reflux.html
Cullen and I decided to try buy some Braggs Apple Cider Vinegar and give it a try.
That first night, I tried making a drink with it and he wouldn't touch it. He said how much of this do I have to drink? I said, one tablespoon... He said, Give it to me straight.
Warning!!!!! Do not give in a serve it up straight.
I put it in a shot glass. He was gasping and grabbing at his throat--"what was that? GASOLINE?!!" Never again. I can't blame him. You have to draw the line somewhere. He has to tolerate a lot with this disease. I know you know what I mean.
It took me a while to disguise it as something an 11 year old would not recognize as apple cider vinegar. But I eventually managed.
Unfortunately, I have no recipes. I am a mix it and taste it kind of gal. I don't measure anything. A little of this, a little of that. Taste.
Make a apple cider (vinegar) drink with it by combining water, vinegar, lemon juice and stevia to taste. If your daughter tolerates honey, use that. My son cannot digest honey right now.
Make a salad dressing with frozen blueberries, apple cider vinegar and stevia with a dash of your favorite oil (olive, sesame, walnut). This is delicious. My husband says I should market this one!
I hope she feels better soon!
Posted by LymeXtu (Member # 24590) on :
17hens - Just wanted to say I am thinking of you - in a mood tonight about all our kids have to go through with this. Seems there is no end to it.
Sorry for all she is going through.
My son has not taken it - so sorry I have no useful advice.
Posted by 17hens (Member # 23747) on :
lymegal,
sorry you feel like this - it's yuck, isn't it!
go to your local healthfood store and get DGL licorice.
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