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» LymeNet Flash » Questions and Discussion » Medical Questions » recommendations for antibiotic challenge for WB test?

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Author Topic: recommendations for antibiotic challenge for WB test?
MariaA
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Hi all,
I have a couple of friends with possible Lyme Disease who are going to go to their local doctor for a Western Blot. One might be able to get an IGenex test- he's tested negative through the 'mill' lab (ie quest or labcorp or whatever the clinic uses) once before, but this might or might not be a new infection. Another will probably use a 'mill' lab.

I was recommending that they try to get some antibiotics first, and to do an 'antibiotic challenge' for a couple of weeks first. Their doctors are cooperative with the idea of Lyme testing this way, they just don't know anything about Lyme (but are at least willing to come right out and say 'i don't know', which is a great thing)

Which antibiotics are recommended for this, for people who don't have obvious coinfection symptoms but merely joint pain/fatigue/memory issues/brainfog?

--------------------
Symptom Free!!! Thank you all!!!!

Find me at Lymefriends, I post under the same name.
diet: http://lymefriends.ning.com/group/healthylowcarbrecipes
Homemade Probiotics thread
Herbal Links Thread

Posts: 2552 | From San Francisco | Registered: Apr 2006  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Karen Mc
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My LLMD suggested Doxy 100 mg (Bid) for my son. which I was able to get from our Fammily Doc (for acne). I plan on getting him tested next week through IGenex. Its just been upsetting his stomach real bad (even with food) but what you are describing about your friends is what my son is going through except hes getting headaches as well....not sure about the brain fog/memory issues though cause hes a 17 yr old teenager--lol---so thats anyones guess (:

Good luck,
Karen (:

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sutherngrl
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I tested before antibiotics and got nothing. Tested while on antibiotics for 2 months got IGM band 41, then tested a year later while on antibiotics and got IGM CDC positive.

But when all is said and done, Lyme Disease is still a "clinical" diagnosis.

Thats why you really need a LLMD to make a determination clinically. The test can always back it up then or later down the road.

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robin_wachs
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MariaA,

It appears the other posters are missing your question and may not know what you mean by antibiotic challenge.

I have always been a proponent of antibiotic challenge, especially prior to a first WB test. I believe and have experienced that it gives more bands than without the challenge if a person is actually infected with Lyme and makes antigen.

Antibiotic Challenge was the norm when I first started this adventure 12 years ago, But seems to have fallen out of favor with the LLMD's, I believe due to not wanting to take anyone off of antibiotics who is on them just for testing purposes. But what the LLMD's fail to fully understand, even though it is a clinical diagnosis, that is not how insurance companies work, They want to see positive tests, and if we can make them positive by tweaking our immune system, all the better.

The idea of an Antibiotic Challenge is, that if you have never been on antibiotics, that you should start antibiotics and get the little buggers riled up and your immune system will show antigen, IF you are an antigen maker. For those that have been on antibiotics long-term, this does not work in the same way. According to the antibiotic challenge for WB testing, those allready on antibiotics should stop them, again, so the little buggers will come out and your immune system will make antibodies in numbers again.

It's hard to remember the specific antibiotics from so many years ago, but it should be a a high powered antibiotic like Zithromax for about a week, sometimes 3 days is enough. I remember my LLMD had me take zith for only 3 days but don't remember which day I was actually tested, the 4th day? the 7th day? Any antibiotic used to typically treat Lyme will work but something like Doxy should probably be taken for at least a week prior to testing for a challenge.

Back in the day, Igenex actually included directions in their kit on how to do the antibiotic challenge.

Robin

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Dekrator48
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I would suggest calling Igenex and asking for their recommendation.

--------------------
The fibromyalgia I've had for 32 years was an undiagnosed Lyme symptom.

"For I know the plans I have for you", declares the Lord, "plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future". -Jeremiah 29:11

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MariaA
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My impression is that some doctors have you stop and then test, and others (including mine) say to just test while on antibiotics (for the kinds of cases that Robin_wachs just described- people who are new to treatment). I'll certainly call IGenex on Monday. It sounds to me like there's not firm agreement about whether to stop before testing, or not (It makes sense to me to just do it while on the antibiotics).

Doxy rings a bell as being one of the drugs different people have reported as being their 'challenge' drug.

--------------------
Symptom Free!!! Thank you all!!!!

Find me at Lymefriends, I post under the same name.
diet: http://lymefriends.ning.com/group/healthylowcarbrecipes
Homemade Probiotics thread
Herbal Links Thread

Posts: 2552 | From San Francisco | Registered: Apr 2006  |  IP: Logged | Report this post to a Moderator
Pinelady
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I think what most are saying it nothing is set in stone with Lyme.

Everyones immune systems are different and for various reasons.

I have read it used to takes some 5-10 trys to get enough bands to say positive.

So now if you have even one it should be pursued. Which is why I was told to always get copies of old tests that may show things to be suspect.

--------------------
Suspected Lyme 07 Test neg One band migrating in IgG region
unable to identify.Igenex Jan.09IFA titer 1:40 IND
IgM neg pos
31 +++ 34 IND 39 IND 41 IND 83-93 +
DX:Neuroborreliosis

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LymeXtu
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My son was put on Zithromax for fluid on his lungs ( we did not know about the Lyme at that point ) it caused a HUGE herx reaction, mainly BAD leg pain.

It was at that point his doctor ran more blood work, I insisted on a Lyme test too. He tested positive from ARUP lab and was on the Zithromax at the time of the test but had not been tested prior to that so I don't know if he would have tested positive before the antibiotic but he sure did while on it.

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robin_wachs
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Igenex will not make a recommendation for or against antibiotic challenge anymore. They will simply tell you to ask your doctor.
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Lymetoo
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Three weeks on doxy at 400mg is what I used. Then went off abx for 10-14 days. Helped more bands to show up.

--------------------
--Lymetutu--
Opinions, not medical advice!

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