posted
I know there has been other discussion on this topic, so please bear with me. I'm worried enough about this that it has me awake in the middle of the night in spite of my sleep meds.
I've been advised to get my amalgams removed. I'm definitely open minded about it, but...
I was told to expect about $10,000 in dental and detox treatments, and I know that little of that will be covered by my insurance.
I'm already four years and many thousands of dollars into this journey. I haven't gotten any better. (Worse, actually).
I've done oral abx, IV abx, tonsillectomy, homeopathy, body work, dietary changes, and much more.
I'm feeling worn down physically, emotionally, and very definitely financially. Like many of us, no doctor I see at this point takes insurance, and I've already invested thousands of dollars in my healtcare.
I'm going to have to take out yet another loan to do this, just when I'm thinking that I don't know how much longer I can keep working like I do.
I just need some reassurance that this has a good chance of being worth it.
monkeyshines
Posts: 343 | From Northern VA | Registered: Oct 2004
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luvs2ride
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 8090
posted
Monkeyshines,
I'm sorry you have not seen any improvement in your courses of treatment.
I too am looking at amalgam removal as well as root canals. The amalgam removal is not a concern for me. I've had some removed in the past and it is just really replacing metal fillings with a safer material. Not any more serious than that (except, of course, should be removed in a safe manner). Metal detoxing (which should definitely be done afterward) is worrying me more. I have heard it can make you sick. The extraction of root canal teeth that do not hurt is most frightening to me.
I have tested mercury toxic by two doctors and I do believe this is preventing me from getting well.
I'm so reactive to everything right now that I am not taking anything for lyme. I am taking low dose minocycline for mycoplasmas which is a Rheumatoid Arthritis treatment and does seem to help.
Thursday my teeth were tested electro-dermally for infections and for compatability with different dental materials. I was not in any pain until I went through this test. During the test, I kept yawning. When I got up after the test, my knees were stiff and it was hard to walk. I felt like all my energy had been sucked out of me. I placed a phone call to the dentist and had great difficulty recalling my cell phone number.
I got in my car to drive to the lab for bloodwork and could not figure out how to get there. I knew how before the test. I had to call the doctor's office and they gave me turn by turn instructions as I drove. Within 3 hrs of the test, I was in severe joint and body pain. Today is Saturday and I am hurting all over still.
Something I was exposed to during that test really set me off and that makes me feel the teeth really may be the source of my trouble.
I'm not sure if it stirred up the bacterial infection or if exposure to some of the dental materials caused it, but I do not believe this was a coincidence.
The doctor says I have so many things going on that he would not dare chelate me until we resolve some of the other stuff. He lists yeast, leaky gut, thyroid as issues I need to resolve before attempting chelation.
He is not LLMD and he isn't interested in pursuing Lyme. He feels if I straighten out everything else that is wrong, my body will deal with the Lyme.
The one part of that I totally agree with is straightening out everything else first. I have done 7 mths of aggressive Lyme treatment and have only managed to significantly increase joint pain. Once I was diagnosed with Rheumatoid Arthritis, I decided it was time to look for other causes and treatment.
What GiGi says about neurotoxins being trapped in your body long after the bacteria is dead sounds very reasonable to me. So I am going after the amalgams, the infected root canals, the gut, the yeast, bioidentical hormones if needed, chelation and then I will see what I may need to do next.
-------------------- When the Power of Love overcomes the Love of Power, there will be Peace. Posts: 3038 | From america | Registered: Oct 2005
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beachcomber
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I am having my amalgams replaced one at a time, as needed. This process is taking about 3 years. Your mouth carries the strept bacteria and stirring that up can be more dangerous than the mercury release. So, it is important to pre-medicate before you have the work done.
My opinion is that you should think this through and take it slowly. Otherwise you are going to shock both your body and your pocket book with one big slam. You do NOT need that kind of stress.
I respect Gigi's point of view and experience on this subject, as it really helped her and I have garnered much information from her posts. But, for me, taking baby steps, instead of drastic measures, is working much better.
Take deep breaths, think logically, and make a long-term plan that works for you, physically, emotionally and financially. JMHO.
Thanks for your reply. I'm sorry that you've been through such a hard time so early on in the process.
Your situation sounds very much like mine.
My current doctor also feels that I have so many different issues, and that while lyme may be part of the problem, it's not the whole picture. How it's been explained to me is that at this point I need to fix my body's ability to heal, and once that's done, I should be better able to get well.
This resonates with me because of my lack of positive response to such aggressive treatment to date.
I'm also worried about how much sicker this might make me. While I've had bad joint pain for years, I just recently seem to have gone into full blown "rheumatic" mode, with distortion in my finger joints.
While I'm willing to feel worse from treatment initially in order to get better, I don't want to exacerbate what seems to be the beginning of permanent damage.
I'm also worried about having my mouth open that long. I recently had some dental work done (relatively quick and minor compared to this) that resulted in excruciating TMJ pain that lasted about 10 days.
I'm seeing two different practioners right now (a naturopath and an M.D.), who in general are working on my case together. One thinks I should do this slowly, and the other feels strongly that all of the amalgams should come out at the same time, or maybe half at a time within a five day period.
Each thinks the other approach is more likely to make me sicker. Have you gotten any advice about the timing of removal yet?
monkeyshines
Posts: 343 | From Northern VA | Registered: Oct 2004
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Just saw your reply, thanks so much for the feedback.
Wow, that timing is definitely at odds with what doctor #2 has advised.
How do you know the right thing to do??
Could you explain about pre-medicating? My original LLMD pursued strep with me aggressively (ergo the tonsillectomy), but my current doc thinks that cell wall deficient strep may be my biggest problem.
monkeyshines
Posts: 343 | From Northern VA | Registered: Oct 2004
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luvs2ride
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
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posted
Monkeyshines,
We sound exactly alike and I, like you, are more worried about permanent joint damage than anything else.
Beachcomber brings up a good point about releasing strep bacteria. I am worried about all this activity making me even sicker although amalgams removed in the past did not seem to bother me at all. But then, I was not sick at the time anyway.
I do feel they need to come out and I feel the root canals need to come out too. Even though this doctor is not lyme literate, I like that he is wanting to get my body into a stronger position before he chelates.
I'm not certain yet if that also means wait to remove the amalgams. He and the dentist are going to have to advise me there. I sense that he is on the right track.
-------------------- When the Power of Love overcomes the Love of Power, there will be Peace. Posts: 3038 | From america | Registered: Oct 2005
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GiGi
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posted
The following words are part of an article in Explore (just published) covering Dr. K's approach to Lyme Disease and Chronic Disease - I have heard these verbatim often directly from him.
"Toxins and Microbes Hand in Hand
Microbes set up housekeeping in the matrix in areas which have become toxic. These areas are not patrolled by the cells of the immune system and yet are equally vulnerable to toxic substances as other healthy cells of the organisms are. Many microbes have learned to live and flourish in the presence of high levels of toxins. Nutrients pass into the cell easily when the matrix is clean. When defective, transport is impaired.
Microbes and toxins are the basis for most or all auto-immune diseases, said Dr. Klinghardt. Microbial by-products and toxic metals act as haptens. They attach themselves to the cell wall and mark the cell for the host's immune system as foreign. This cell will become a target for the immune system and will be attacked.
Mercury alone is toxic, said Dr. Klinghardt. Together with zinc it is many times more toxic. Add in a little copper and silver, as in dental amalgam fillings, and the detrimental effect to the body increases manifold.
The toxin-induced impairment of our immune system allows microorganisms to enter our system. Once established, they are hard to conquer and removing the causative toxin is no longer enough. According to Bechamp's milieu theory, for each equivalent of stored toxins there is an equal amount of pathogenic microorganisms in the body. The flare-ups of previously hidden infections occurs regularly during mercury detoxification. For example, patients who are infected with Borrelia burgdorferi, the spirochete that causes Lyme disease, are often unaware of their illness. They start to become more symptomatic during or after a successful mercury detoxification program. The same is true for infections with mycoplasma, streptococci, tuberculoses and others. It is important to anticipate the temporarily enhanced growth of microorganisms during a successful detox program.
Then there is a latent period in which the microorganisms are already recovered, but the host's immune system is not. During this time, the practitioner has to prescribe appropriate antifungal, antibacterial, antiviral and antimycoplasma medications in natural form. These include freeze dried garlic, bee propolis, colloidal gold and microbial inhibition microcurrent frequencies. Microcurrent frequencies help because bugs recognize each other through frequency, not through biochemical signatures. Microbial inhibition frequencies entrain the body to recognize the microbes instead of self.
It is also important to be aware that the immune system in a patient with unresolved psycho-emotional material and compartmentalized toxins isunable to recognize and eliminate the microorganisms present in the toxic areas of the body,. For each unresolved psycho-emotional conflict or trauma there is an equivalent of stored toxin and an equivalent of pathogenic microorganisms.
To successfully detoxify the body, the three issues have to be addressed simultaneously. The triad of detoxification, according to Dr. Klinghardt, includes detoxification of the physical body, treatment of latent microorganisms and parasites, and treatment of unresolved psycho-emotional issues."
Take care.
Posts: 9834 | From Washington State | Registered: Oct 2000
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posted
monkeyshines - back when I was 4 or 5 years into tackling this illness, I was at roughly the same point as you. My mercury was deemed high via hair and urine analyses.
Had the amalgams removed. The result for me: it made no difference, in fact, perhaps I was left even slightly worse, and my wallet thinner.
Only years later did I find a possible explanation. For optimum health, the Th1 and Th2 portions of the immune system are supposed to be in balance. Some research says Lyme results in an overexpression of Th1, and that in turn causes our symptoms.
OTOH, mercury is said to push things in favor of Th2. If you remove the mercury, the thing boosting Th2, the net result is your Th1 might become even more overexpressed relatively. If Th1 overexpression is at the root of your problem, then, like me, you might feel even worse after cleaning up the mercury.
Th1 overexpression is what the Marshall Protocol claims to address. You might look into it and consider having your vitamin D metabolites tested as the MP recommends.
Posts: 727 | From USA | Registered: Mar 2006
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posted
Shop around, for one thing. I had one quadrant done at a time, over a period of about 6wks [not sure about the time factor] and at a price of only $1,000. [no IV chelation though]
I think it helped. At least I feel better about having the mouthful of amalgams gone!
-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96227 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
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GiGi
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 259
posted
The most important part after removing your amalgams safely by a dentist you can trust is to detoxify your whole body afterward under the guidance of a professional who knows how to do it proerly. It usually takes a couple of years. You will save yourself pain, energy, money and above all keep your organs healthy.
Take care.
Posts: 9834 | From Washington State | Registered: Oct 2000
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liz28
Unregistered
posted
I'm going to get clobbered for writing this, but I went the middle route, and had most of my amalgams removed in a normal way for about $800. The rest will probably come out at some point in the future.
My insurance covered four months of DMSA detox. You could always have your doctor write you a one-week prescription, try it and see if it has an effect. This is not an antibiotic, mercury will not develop drug resistance if you stop early.
There are three aspects of your post you may wish to be cautious about. One is that you said you are about to take out this loan on the basis of advice, not research. If this detox did not cure you, and you were still sick, what would your financial situation be after you spent the $10,000?
The second is that you gave a detailed list of your alternative treatments, but a vague list of your antibiotics. It's possible that you have taken some "old paint" abx treatments from the frontier days, but have not yet tried the newer abx combinations. It's not that many alternative treatments don't rule, especially when used in conjunction with antibiotics. But for $10,000 bucks, you could buy some pretty top of the line insurance, or some high quality antibiotics.
The third is your statement that IV rocephin did not make a dent. I can identify with that, having spent seven months on rocephin, along with many other antibiotics. At one point, I was on rocephin, flagyl, plaquenil, zithromax, ceftin, and maybe doxycycline, at the same time. But none of these drugs worked, because I had babesia and bartonella.
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quote:Originally posted by liz28: But none of these drugs worked, because I had babesia and bartonella. [/QB]
Right on.
I also agree about being cautious of spending $10,000 on the amalgam removal when you can't afford it.
Do make sure you get TREATED for babesia before spending all that money. Babesia testing is worse than Lyme testing.
-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96227 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
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JimBoB
Unregistered
posted
Unlike many of you, I can not come up with the money, nor insurance to do it the "best" so-called way.
Also, because of that, I am having one Amalgam done at a time, WHEN I can come up with the money. I have had two done and four to go.
So far, so good.
BUT, I built myself up a LOT in the past four months with herbal treatment, so THAT helps a lot.
I don't know IF I would care to do it if I had been weakened by a lot of abx only treatments.
Right now, I am fasting, removing poisons from my body even more. LOTS of water. First time I have fasted for about 25 years. Forgot how tough it is to do. Been three days now. But need to stick with it to heal my skin by my stoma that got burned.
SOme things just work out of necessity to do them.
luvs2ride
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 8090
posted
Why is amalgam removal costing $10,000?
I'm removing 4 amalgams and one cavitation at a cost of $900.
BTW, I am reading a book titled "Whole Body Dentistry" and I quote: "Why is the mercury before it goes into the mouth a hazardous toxin, and why does the scrap amalgam, which is removed from the mouth, have to be stored in a special manner and taken away by a licensed hazardous waste company?" If you ignore all the science and just use common sense, you realize how absurd the postition of the pro amalgamists is. It seems they believe that the only safe place to store mercury is in the mouth!"
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beachcomber
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posted
Monkey:
I don't know the best thing to do, at least for you. All I know, for me, is that it is physically and financially insane for me to think I can handle all that dental work in one shot. It simply doesn't make sense to me. I know others will disagree.
I have been to various specialists, including a Lyme Literate Endodontist who told me a story of one of his patients who insisted on remaoval of all of her root canals and amalgams, against his better judgement. He complied with her wishes and she collapsed on the sidewalk after and is now in a wheel chair, sicker than ever. That tells me that it could be a devastating shock to an unhealthy body.
I have my metal levels tested periodically and have my teeth checked at least every six months or more. My dentist has me take 500 mg of either Amoxy or Zith before any procedure, including cleaning because of the strept bacteria. Guess what, I got a strept infection after my last cleaning anyway. Fortunately, it did not go to my heart, where I have a deviated septum. My LLMD monitored me to make sure.
You must be careful and must consider the amount of additional stress this might put on your body at this time. Gigi made the point that this takes time and must be done properly.
GiGi
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 259
posted
"I have been to various specialists, including a Lyme Literate Endodontist who told me a story of one of his patients who insisted on remaoval of all of her root canals and amalgams, against his better judgement. He complied with her wishes and she collapsed on the sidewalk after and is now in a wheel chair, sicker than ever. That tells me that it could be a devastating shock to an unhealthy body."
My humble opinion: It's the dentist or endodontist who messed up. No professional should do anything against his better judgment just because the novice patient does not understand the situation.
I tell the same thing here over and over again ---- don't go into a sauna when you still have a mouth full of amalgams, dental toxins, etc. Our body has a way to move things so quickly into the brain - we have no chance but suffer horrible consequences after. Our blood brain barrier is slightly damaged in many cases from the infections. Start shoving mercury around and you end up in deep trouble. On the sidewalk and in a wheelchair.
I have listened to these horror stories on this very board by the so-called experts who write books about rife machines and mercury detox. Who exploit people with their Salt & C regimen without giving the people the full picture.
The full picture is:
If you kill bugs, parasites, viruses, bacteria, which is what is happening when you start digging things up, they are bound to move on as quickly as anything into the body compartment where they feel safest. The amalgam stirred up moves right along with them. I heard this from Dr. K. many years ago.
It is not only dangerous what that endodontist did, if that is true. It is negligent and stupid.
I have said it many times before, many people in the dental profession have lost the ability to think because they are s mercury toxic. For the first few years of mercury exposure, people are in overdrive -- they accomplish the impossible -- then things start going downhill.
I know, I was one of these myself.
Go only to an expert. Yes, some take advantage of the situation because they put their license on the line. Many others do not and do good work for a fair price. But don't "go shopping" as Lymetoo recommends. Often you pay a lot extra afterward.
Take care.
Posts: 9834 | From Washington State | Registered: Oct 2000
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Thanks all for the feedback. I won't lie .. I'm probably just as confused and uncertain as before, but I really appreciate hearing experiences and advice from those who've been there or done a lot of research.
I should say that I don't *know* it will cost 10K...that's what the doctor who will supervise the process estimated.
For those who counsel against doing this, either for financial or medical reasons, what is next then? I'm not being facetious, I'm really stumped. I'm six years into this illness (2 undiagnosed).
I did 3 years of antibiotics (list below), I had sinus surgery, a tonsillectomy, and lost my gallbladder.
I don't have obvious symptoms of babesia (versus lyme), but still did a pretty long course of artemesia (no herx, no change). If I had other coinfections (and I've been tested multiple times), I *think* they should have been treated with the abx I've done.
I'm currently off antibiotics because I just couldn't continue to justify how generally toxic and how much worse I felt than when I started. So many more parts of my body were effected than when I started.
Basically, I'm just treating pain and insomnia, eating reasonably well, taking supplements and probiotics, and doing homeopathy and cranial sacral therapy at this point.
If I don't do the amalgams, which is the next thing my current LLMD suggests, what do I do?
monkeyshines
*Abx I've done to date: penicillin vk, levaquin, cefzil, cipro, augmentin, doxyciclene, ketek, and rocephin, in various combinations. I also was on diflucan 100 and then 200 mg daily for almost two years, and plaquenil for more than two years.
Posts: 343 | From Northern VA | Registered: Oct 2004
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JimBoB
Unregistered
posted
Okay, GiGi, that is fine for a lot of you. BUT what about me and others in MY situation?
Would we be better off just leaving the Amalgams in there, rather than have our dentist duck take them out?
I live in the boondocks here. AND do NOT have money to be flying around the country and paying HIGH prices. Right now if it wasn't for my wife paying MOST of our household expenses, we wouldn't even have a house to live in, nor food on the table.
And SHE absolutely will NOT go for governmental help. PERIOD. I am NOT that proud, but SHE is. The ONLY alternative would be a divorce, and I am sick and tired of them. Therefore, MY only alternatives IS to NOT remove the Almalgams, OR have them removed by my local duck, who is expensive, (for me), but considerably cheaper than the last duck that I used for years.
I already spend about 2/3 of my Social Security check to pay for these. I can not and will not spend the rest of it and NOT eat at all?
I am fasting right now, and have been since Wednesday, today is Sunday. IT is not much fun, but a necessity for my health because of ostomy/skin problems.
IT scares the heck out of me, thinking of NO herbs even for this time, as it is the FIRST TIME I have been without herbs since November 25, 2005.
So far, the Lyme does not SEEM to have taken over again, but who really knows WHAT is going on inside my body at this moment. I HOPE it is not a big setback.
Amalgam Removal or Cavitation Surgery - Which Should Come First? �2004 Suzin Stockton This is a question I'm often asked, and about which I've only recently begun to have a solid point of view. I would say that the majority of dentists today, influenced by the ADA party line, would respond that neither amalgam removal nor cavitation surgery is necessary! And I would guess that the majority of `holistic' dentists -- even those familiar with cavitations (and not all are) -- would answer that amalgam removal should be the top priority. I believe this perspective is born more out of greater familiarity with the amalgam issue than anything else. If we take a close look at the facts, several good reasons emerge for addressing the cavitation issue first, at least diagnostically.
First, let me emphasize that a cavitation is a hollow area of dead (necrotic) or dying bone in the jaw. While bacteria may exist at cavitation sites, more often than not, few, if any, are found there, according to oral pathologist Jerry Bouquot. Bacterial trauma may certainly initiate the cavitation process, but by the time a cavitation is fully formed, infection is usually not a dominant clinical feature. A jawbone cavitation is predominantly an ischemic condition, one involving compromised blood flow to the area. The presence of dead bone interferes with blood supply, and any tooth remaining at the site slowly dies from lack of nourishment, lack of oxygen and inability to rid itself of toxins. This being the case, the treatment of choice is thorough surgical removal of any dead or dying bone in the jaw, along with extraction of any teeth at such sites. This will remove the conditions that may give rise to infection and prevent the spreading of jawbone necrosis (cavitations).
Because jawbone cavitations are largely a result of trauma to the jawbone, and the majority of that trauma for most of us comes from standard dental treatment (drilling of teeth, extractions, root canal therapy, etc.), it stands to reason that the condition can be aggravated in the course of amalgam replacement, which involves more drilling, more trauma to tooth and bone. These lesions (cavitations) tend to spread, and their spreading may be a causative factor when the patient with newly placed mercury-free restorations complains of jaw pain or toothache where none had been before.
Because many people have widespread necrosis in the jawbone (as evidenced through bone sonography Cavitat scans), the reality is that some degree of tooth loss is often necessary in order to get at dead bone to remove it and stop the bone loss process. This (cavitational) process has been referred to as gangrene of the jawbone by Colorado Springs cardiologist Thomas Levy. I like that description because it conveys the gravity of the situation, as well as an image of spreading tissue rot - exactly what we have with cavitations. Now, come into my common sense corner for a minute: From what you already know about cavitations, can you tell me which teeth are likely candidates for extraction? Those that have been filled, root canal treated or capped! And, if those restorations happen to contain mercury, how much sense does it make to further traumatize the tooth (and bone) by removing the amalgam-containing restoration and placing a biocompatible material without first checking the condition of the jawbone?? If the patient first gets a Cavitat scan, s/he may well find that some (or possibly all) of the teeth that would otherwise have undergone amalgam replacement will have to be extracted to get at the underlying bone necrosis. Now, who wants to undergo the trauma and expense of amalgam replacement, just to have it followed by loss of the very teeth that were just restored? And this is what may well happen if the person has a chronic cavitation problem. Since cavitations are often silent (i.e., cause no local symptoms), the patient (and dentist) may be totally unaware of the presence of this serious condition, and so not take it into consideration when planning amalgam replacement. This oversight may set the patient up for more dental problems down the road, even though all concerned had the best of intentions.
Another consideration in amalgam removal with someone who may have cavitations is the effect it could have on the microbial population of the oral cavity. Mercury, with all its associated problems, was once used extensively in medicine (and still is to a limited degree -- some hemorrhoid preparations contain it). In the 1300s, it was used in the form of ore cinnabar to treat syphilis. It was also once used to treat tuberculosis and rheumatism. The metal has been used medicinally because of its antiseptic qualities, a result of the denaturing of the enzymes of microorganisms. The anti-fungal effects of mercury are well known today. That's why it's used in some paints to retard mold. Could it be that mercury plays a similar role when placed in the teeth, that its presence controls the microbial population in the mouth to some degree? While I'm all for amalgam removal because of the well-documented insidious effects of mercury on the body, IF that amalgam lives in a mouth where there is oral infection, and then that mercury-containing amalgam is suddenly removed, it would seem possible that a result could be a proliferation of microbes in the mouth, causing a worsening of the infection. Given this possibility, it would seem wise to remove the conditions giving rise to ``focal infection'' (a walled off area of concentrated toxins and necrotic and/or infected tissue -- a cavitation!) prior to removing the mercury. Please understand clearly that I'm not arguing against amalgam removal, simply speculating that it may be in the body's best interest to first treat cavitation sites (by removing necrotic bone). Far from protecting the body from microbes, over the long haul, mercury will do just the opposite by weakening the immune system. Mercury contaminated neutrophils (immune macrophages that consume microorganisms) lose their ability to ingest yeast, allowing Candida and other yeast and fungi to overtake the body.
Finally, let's look at what can happen if amalgams are removed, cavitations go untreated, and the patient embarks upon an oral chelation program using a formula that contains the sulfur-containing amino acids methionine and cysteine. It is known that gram-negative anaerobic bacteria (the kind that may be found at cavitation sites) desulfurate these amino acids, resulting in the formation of volatile sulfur compounds - hydrogen sulfide and methyl mercaptan. These compounds, in turn, form complexes with mercury that greatly increase its toxicity. While the anaerobic bacteria will also take sulfur from the amino acids in the protein food we eat, and we can't do without protein to starve out the microbes, we can avoid giving them extra sulfur through our ingestion of it in oral chelation products. So if you're undergoing oral chelation following amalgam replacement and think you may have cavitations, it may be wise to use a chelating agent that does not contain methionine or cysteine. If you haven't yet replaced your amalgams, you may wish to treat cavitations first to eliminate any gram-negative anaerobic bacteria. Then there should be no problem in using a chelation formula that contains sulfur-bearing amino acids.
With regard to all of the above considerations, I would conclude that it is imperative to assess the condition of the jawbone (through use of bone sonography) before embarking upon amalgam replacement - or any type of restorative dental work. If the jawbone is shown to be in good condition, I see no contraindications to proceeding with amalgam replacement. If some of the amalgam-restored teeth are living in necrotic bone, then the patient may wish to have those teeth extracted in conjunction with cavitation surgery and then proceed to have the remaining mercury-containing restorations replaced. OR the order may be reversed. I don't have a strong point of view about this, though I do tend to favor handling cavitations first. What matters most is that amalgam replacement is not initiated without regard to condition of the jawbone, so that money isn't wasted restoring essentially dead teeth. Whichever order of treatment the patient chooses, I do believe there should be as little time as possible put between the two events. Left untreated, cavitations will spread, and so should be promptly addressed following amalgam replacement. If the cavitation surgery is done first, and mercury remains in the mouth, then a significant source of toxicity has gone unaddressed, and this will impede the healing process.
Another point that many miss is that oftentimes, after proper amalgam removal, some teeth subsequently die, contributing to cavitation formation. So it's important to have the jaws re-examined with sonography after amalgam removal, especially if one or more teeth become or remain sensitive.
I believe it is very important that both patients and dentists become more acutely aware of the importance of assessing the condition of the jawbone prior to initiating any treatment that will traumatize it and possibly cause the spreading of cavitations. Since bone sonography is the most reliable and detailed method of doing such as assessment, it is imperative that the technology be made available on a larger scale than it is now. There is also a clear and pressing need for more dentists who are trained in diagnosis and treatment of cavitations. Dentists may contact Cavitat Medical Technologies (303-755-2688) for information on bone sonography equipment and Dr. Wesley Shankland (614-794-0033) for information on an in-depth surgical training course that offers instruction in clinical application of bone sonography and gives continuing education credits.
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Thanks! I am very glad you posted this. I was given a written order to get a spect scan to rule out cavitations, and was wondering if this was an expenditure of time and money that wasn't absolutely necessary.
If I decide to have the amalgams out, having the scan first definitely makes sense based on this article.
It also makes me more confident that this doctor knows what he's talking about.
When we were discussing the detox protocol, he also talked about the antimocrobial effects of mercury, and how it could be having a controlling effect on oral infection.
I have to admit I lost the train of that part of the discussion, so it's good to have further info.
monkeyshines
Posts: 343 | From Northern VA | Registered: Oct 2004
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luvs2ride
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 8090
posted
Wallace,
As I am about to embark on amalgam and cavitation work myself, I too want to thank you for sharing this article.
GiGi has warned us before that after removing mercury we may see a temporary increase in bacterial activity so we should be ready to jump on it.
Thanks again!
-------------------- When the Power of Love overcomes the Love of Power, there will be Peace. Posts: 3038 | From america | Registered: Oct 2005
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beachcomber
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 5320
posted
For the record, I agree that the Endodontist should not have worked on the ill patient. Hence, I did not have him do any work on my, just tests for infections of the bone. I moved on from there.
posted
monkeyshines - as to your next step, I'd recommend checking out the Marshall Protocol. I was very skeptical about the MP, but what I must say 6 months into it is that their predictions about what to expect have come true for me. It seems they are onto something.
The MP is picky about which abx work best on these bugs, and none of those you tried are the primary ones the MP recommends. They also recommend avoiding light and vitamin D intake, and that if you do not, the abx will not be as effective.
Their protocol is fairly simple to try, though of course it will cost you or your insurance for the vitamin D test and the initial meds. It sounds like you and I have been down very similar paths. I wish I had known about the MP years ago. If I had to do it again, I'd definitely consider the MP ahead of amalgam removal.
Posts: 727 | From USA | Registered: Mar 2006
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posted
This is a real individual decision. I took out the loan, about 8 or 9 thousand dollars, and had them replaced with ceramic crowns and partial crowns.
Some of this work needed to be done anyway, realy old failing fillings. And, we found an unknown problem, a cracked tooth, while removing a filling, which explained why I never chewed on that side of my mouth.
Poor dental health will effect your overall health. But,murcury fillings may or may not be your worst load to remove. You do need to remove loads on your immune system, but we as individuals do vary on which is the most important to tackle first.
My hair test was high for lead, 5x high for copper, and high for nickel, etc... It did NOT show high for mercury (it often doesnt, even if it is a problem, see book below)I most probably have mercury poisoning, but I definitelly have other metal problems, and I wouldnt chelate with a mouth full of metal.
You prbably should buy Andrew Cutlers Amalgam illness book http://www.noamalgam.com/ I found it very informative about how to narrow down if this is realy a problem for you.
Forgot to mention, I did NOT have them all removed at once. The work was done in quadrants, 2 or 3 teeth at a time, over the course of a year.
[ 28. March 2006, 02:32 AM: Message edited by: mountainmoma ]
Posts: 222 | From Santa Cruz Mountains, CA USA | Registered: Nov 2004
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I had two amalgam fillings removed from teeth that weren't bothering me until the silver was replaced.
Then I had pain in them for a year. I know, there could be many reasons for this--infection, toxins, etc. To me, I had just caused myself more suffering.
My LLMD said NOT to have any more done.
I know someone who has done quite well with MS who had all her restorations removed. I would never argue with success.
However, that being said, and I know many of you will disagree with me, and you have to do what's right for YOU--I am going to do what my doctor says.
For one thing, even the amount of time two yearly cleanings takes, my eyes and jaw and neck are sore for days after sitting in the dentist's chair staring at that bright light with my mouth open.
And, I repeat: (read below)
Posts: 353 | From Florida boonies | Registered: Nov 2005
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posted
Hi. My experience involved having mercury fillings replaced over the course of a year. I forget how many there were.
I can tell you what happened on the last filling to be replaced. I decided to try to save some $ and told the dentist to replace the old filling with the same material. I had hardly made it back to my office 3 blocks away when I had the worst migraine and all over achy feeling I've ever had.
I rushed back to the dentist and he took it out and replaced it with gold. Headache and ill feeling gone immediately.
Forgive me if this is a stupid question, but WHY would you have the silver replaced with gold?
It is MY understanding that gold is a heavy metal too, and it very detrimental to your health. As a matter of fact, if you had seen House on Fox tonight, you would have seen a woman was poisoning her husband with modified gold dust sprinkled on his cereal. I forget the technical name for it.
GiGi
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 259
posted
Anyone wanting to know more about heavy metals, detox, there is a lot of info on this site. I consider him a friend with a brain. I am not advocating his products. Just the most valuable information that is hard to find any other place.
P.S. The Cutler protocol as mentioned above in www.noamalgam.com --- be careful, hesitant, anything else but. Other doctors get his patients afterward.
posted
In my younger days, I took a course in dental assisting and worked as an orthodontic assistant (no mercury) for a short while.
We were taught that gold was the best restoration material, if you could afford it.
The good thing about gold is that it sticks together, and can be pounded into the tooth without cement. Also, less of the diseased tooth has to be removed to make room for the filling.
Neither one of my kids have a single filling, having been born in a place that fluoridated the water. Now, of course, we question the safety of that fluoride!
I am keeping my fingers crossed xxxxx!! that my main problem is borreliosis and not my amalgams.
Posts: 353 | From Florida boonies | Registered: Nov 2005
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JimBoB
Unregistered
posted
GiGi:
I went to the Melisa site and read up on the gold, or at least what little I could find on it.
From the little that I could find, and maybe I am missing a big part, I don't know; but it seems that GOLD ALSO is NOT a friendly metal for us to use. I would imagine especially for us Lymies, correct?
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