She is no longer listed as a member...I find it hard to believe she was banned....so that leads me to believe she may be one of the new moderators who chose to go incognito?
I dont' see anyone else asking about this, is it the big elephant in the room or am I missing something?
Posted by madge (Member # 13704) on :
a few days ago she posted that she was fed-up with things that was going on...and if things
didn/t change she was leaving...well i guess she left...i went back a week in post and can't find it...she was upset about something i don't
know what....i will miss her...she was the best thing about this site...she help everyone...please someone who knows whats going on...help us....
we need Betty....
please Betty know i miss you....Madge
Posted by catskillmamala (Member # 12536) on :
Betty has left the board, she is not a moderator. She was unhappy with the tone of posts directed at her and the actions of the new moderators. But rather than continually complain or cause strife, she removed herself.
I feel her loss has been tremendous. I can honestly say that I'm not sure my family would be well without her.
I see posts way down in the list with zero reponses, she would have responded.
I see posts by clueless newbies without a welcome post in their thread and although her welcome post was looooong, it was kind and comprehensive.
I see posts that are huge blocks of text and no one is breaking them up or explaining to the poster that short paragraphs with lots of white space are easier on the eye.
I truly believe that fewer people will get the help and insight they need from lymenet because she is not with us here.
It would take ten of us to make one Betty G.
Posted by madge (Member # 13704) on :
thank you so much...you are right on...Betty G was the Best of Lymenet....it won't be the same...
you are soooo missed Miss Betty G...
thank you soooo much for all your help....
i will miss your kindness and knowledge here...
Mande
Posted by lou4656 (Member # 10300) on :
"I truly believe that fewer people will get the help and insight they need from lymenet because she is not with us here."
I couldn't agree more!
Posted by 2roads (Member # 4409) on :
I feel so sad about loosing Betty to the board....
and a bit angry at those that contributrd to her leaving.
If you know who you are, you had better get your act together, because we can't afford to lose the love and kindness and guidance of people like Betty....and there aint alot of'em.
I pray she reconsiders and comes back. She is a senior member of this family and belongs here to be given upmost respect, courteousness....yeah, and some love in return.
Ditto to all that was prior said, especially catskill.
2roads
Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
It is our understanding that Bettyg is taking a break from the board. We all appreciate all that she did, and if she needs a break, she certainly deserves one. I think all of us who have been here any length of time have taken a break at one point or another.
Thank you for your concern, Tracy. Posted by joalo (Member # 12752) on :
Ditto what catskillmamala said!!
I couldn't have said it better.
Posted by ping (Member # 6974) on :
quote:Originally posted by joalo: Ditto what catskillmamala said!!
I couldn't have said it better.
Me too. There have been numerous times when bettyg was the first person to post to my thread and ask about my welfare. She's the best traffic cop in the business.
bettyg, if you're reading this, please reconsider and come back after the Holidays; it's such a stressful time of year. I think we get stressed out and possibly don't realize where all the pressure is coming from. My Lyme friends keep phoning me and the story is the same: "It's that I can't participate in ways that I used to do. Cooking, shopping, family and friends. I'm tired and there's nothing I can do and they don't understand..." Everyone is very frustrated and emotionally challenged to the edge of sanity.
Rest for now and have a wonderful Turkey and Tree!
ping "We are more than containers for Lyme"
Posted by Keebler (Member # 12673) on :
- Betty's goodbye post was removed and she was banned, actually. She is no longer able to post anything.
She has shared the details with me and is sad that her thoughts were taken down so soon after she posted.
There was some very harsh treatment of Betty that was not fully addressed and she felt she had to leave. But she did not expect her goodbye letter (and her request to have the bullying to be adequately corrected) to get her banned.
She and I email now and then and I will let her know that she is missed. -
[ 11-24-2009, 05:56 PM: Message edited by: Keebler ]
Posted by feelfit (Member # 12770) on :
Thanks for the truth Keebler. I saw betty's 'goodbye' letter and felt terrible for her.
We are all different people. It is our intentions that matter. And whether or not some did not like Betty's long welcomes, or her policing....I don't think that there was EVER any malice in Betty's intentions.
This board meant a lot to her and I am sure she is hurting. So Betty, all of that is for you in case you're around here and reading.
Feelfit
Posted by Robin123 (Member # 9197) on :
BettyG was often the first person to take action here with new people, let alone any of her responses to the regulars and also her activism postings, which I always found valuable.
I hope she comes back here after the break.
Posted by ping (Member # 6974) on :
Speaking of Newbies...HELP! Many are slipping thru the cracks.
I miss you bettyg-baby. Posted by Keebler (Member # 12673) on :
- Messages left here cannot be read by Betty.
I passed along the good wishes to her via email and gave her the link. She asked me to convey a thank you and explanation of her inability to read your posts because of having been totally banned from the site:
"No longer even having the ability to VIEW the board in any manner - and no access to any of over 31,000 posts or lists of links" that she provided -
She wants to make it clear that she's ``NOT taking a break; left LymeNet for GOOD!!''
``please thank everyone for their very kind comments and their missing me; it does help knowing I MADE A DIFFERENCE.
thx for thinking of me. Betty''
-
Posted by WildCondor (Member # 434) on :
Why don't the moderators explain to us why all her explanation was deleted! This should be public info...things just keep getting worse here, all the long time members are leaving for a reason. I think it's ridiculous that a member cannot access his/her posts. She made them, she has a right to see them to help others. If she told us why she left, why can't we see that? Betty was a long time valuable member...you might all not agree with some of the way she did things but she did try to help, and she deserves respect. The patients are the ones suffering here! Explanation please!
Posted by glm1111 (Member # 16556) on :
I just moved into a new apt and experienced some adrenal exhaustion so haven't been able to post. Betty was a very valuable member and contributor here to many.
I just find it very upsetting that she was banned for expressing her opinions about how she was treated. Betty was very efficient and an organizer in keeping this board in order to help people navigate and be able to read.
I think that when she did that it was misconstrued as being bossy. She made order out of choas. I am very sad to see her go. Another VERY VALUABLE member lost who made a difference.
Gael
Posted by randibear (Member # 11290) on :
i don't have a clue as to what happened and didn't read any posts. guess they were deleted before i saw them.
i agree. i may not have agreed with some of her methods but she was a member of this board and a very long standing one, surely some explanation would be helpful.
it would put to rest any speculations.
Posted by Jenifer (Member # 697) on :
If Betty's post was not deleted, that would be a double standard. She demanded I remove posts that bashed her (obviously, I would not intentionally leave a post up that bashed another member), but her "Goodbye" post went on to bash members, as well as moderators.
So, that is why it was removed. Rules apply to everyone. Also, disrespecting the moderators is not tolerated.
And please keep in mind that you only know one side of the story. The moderators and myself see all sides.
In any disagreement, it's easy for someone to paint a great picture in their defense for all to see, in an effort to get you on their side. Moderators have to see beyond that and make tough decisions.
Members who are banned, I believe, can still be able to view the forums, but can't log in to do so.
Betty requested time away from the board, so we hope she is enjoying her down time and looking forward to the happy holiday season ahead.
Posted by ticked-offinNc (Member # 15420) on :
Keebler,
Thank you for the truth.
I have not cried from the heart in a long time,but the loss of Betty is too much. I am so sorry for you Betty,you do not deserve such treatment,for giving so much of yourself.
I am equally sorry for all of us, and the loss of your great value, and knowledge.
There will be a hole here that can not be filled.
And honestly, it makes me not want to be here anymore.
What has happened to all of us on this board, that this can happen? We are family,and friends, when others have abandoned us with lack of understanding.
What happened to the respect we had for each other,even in disagreements.
We are all different, but we used to be united by such a huge common cause, and life stealing disease.
What happenes to our kindness towards each other,even though we were all facing the biggest challenge of our lives?
What happened to us? Where did my best friends go?
Posted by Lymetoo (Member # 743) on :
I'm really shocked that her goodbye was deleted. I never saw it either.
Posted by randibear (Member # 11290) on :
jennifer, thank you for the explanation.
yours is a tireless and often painful job. such is evidence by this latest episode.
i'm sorry you have to go through this.
Posted by WildCondor (Member # 434) on :
Thanks Jenifer,
So it was deleted because Betty G bashed the moderators and other posters. That makes some sense. I have seen posts deleted for no good reason however, so she does have a point. Was there content in the post besides bashing? Betty was helping me organize all of these links and now she is gone...so I cannot do this alone. Everyone is gone who was helping. I need a vacation too.
Posted by Keebler (Member # 12673) on :
- What was perceived as bashing was really someone who had been bashed asking that all the slams at her be deleted. She just wanted to be heard.
It was a very complex series of communications back and forth with finally, the bullies saying "well, we WERE nice."
It would have been hard for anyone to keep up with the dizzying manner in which comments were slung but I know - because I read all of it - that Betty's criticism was directly related to the manner in which she had been treated.
And that had not been resolved, even in many emails back and forth between a couple moderators. It's the emails that probably tipped the scales. She never felt heard and the emails tried to spell it all out but it just got too complicated. She also was not addressed very kindly in emails and then the volume increased.
She was hurt and angry and did "raise her voice" and that was perceived as disrespectful. As for her bashing, she was simply pointing out inconsistencies and where insults remained that were hurtful to her.
But that was so much to sort through - for anyone. The fire had to be put out as fast as it could.
In the end, bullies will always have passive aggressive tactics and wrap their barbs in syrupy compliments all the while declaring how very nice they are and how much they really love someone. But the wounds from these barbs run deep. And the terrain changes.
Bottom line: there was a struggle of power and Betty lost because of complications and because she asked posters to post so that all could read and some just didn't like her asking for that. That started it. It was not the request but the attitude of those wanting to smash her and her finally standing up against them.
I read all the emails back and forth and this is my perception.
She helped many here and LymeNet will be poorer in her absence. But she may be better off for it's really hard to know just when the bullies will strike out again. Maybe that's human nature but who needs that?
If we can stick to the matter at hand - helping others - LymeNet might still have a chance.
-
Posted by LuluBellesMama (Member # 22583) on :
I read the post, and responded. I didn't see anything as bashing. Maybe people were being too sensitive (lyme does that to us, no?)
I am a moderator on many boards and lists, and didn't see anything but the mods cya-ing by deleting her message. I know some people cut and paste and post the messages on this board publicly elsewhere on blogs. I thought to myself perhaps this was one they would be deleting and maybe i should have saved it....
I have not been here long, but it seems there is always a "I am leaving post."
"Supposedly," there is a lot of GREAT information here. But, this forum has not been the one that helped me as greatly as others.
Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
Betty should have no problems reading the board. Anyone can read it without signing in, they just cannot post. I read it for weeks prior to joining.
Keebler, I was never unkind to Betty and I wrote several of the emails you are referring to. I resent the implications. I even posted a sticky in seeking a doctor to help make things easier for all involved and edited it to add suggestions made by two different members. You make it sound like we moderators did nothing to accommodate Betty, when in fact, we tried to reach agreement with her.
I will not publicly discuss what the problem was. I don't publicly say negative things about people. You say that in the end Betty lost a "power struggle", the truth is, in the end, it's the webmaster who has the power. We spent many, many hours of our time trying to come to a compromise with Betty. She chose to leave and announced it on the board. That was the end of the compromising. We did not give up on her.
I do hope that at some time in the future she comes back to the board.
Posted by 2roads (Member # 4409) on :
How is that done?
Does she just log on as someone new?
How do you go about coming back to the board once you have been banned?
I think we all need to understand that. I feel like I'm treading in shallow water expressing my feelings.
I would like to know what the options are?
I did not fight your fight, but I cannot imagine losing what she offered for much more then alot of hell....but that's just me.
2roads
Posted by Keebler (Member # 12673) on :
- Sixgoofykids,
Betty can't read the board. For some reason, her computer will not connect to this site.
Sorry if you thought I meant you with the emails. In no way did I mean you. It is not you to whom I was referring. There were others - many others from many different people. I named no names on purpose. It would serve no need. Everyone knows if they've been nice or not.
The power struggle I was describing was between posters - that is want escalated it and it just blew up into a big mess. I do wish it could have been handled better but it was chaos and I would run screaming into the jungle to escape it, for sure.
SGK, You are one of the ones who have maintained a professional demeanor around all this and your welcome note in "seeking" does incorporate Betty's suggestions.
That request made sense and it's good to see that mentioned.
It was probably not so much that it alone was the fight, but that it was used as a springboard for some who just didn't like this or that about someone. -
Posted by seekhelp (Member # 15067) on :
She'll be back someday hopefully. She's a Lyme activist. Time heals wounds. They all return eventually. I hope she enjoys her time off. This board really can be a soap opera at times.
Posted by lymemomtooo (Member # 5396) on :
WE may not know everything that happened but from all that I have seen, Betty is a strong asset to this board and I hope those who are in POWER will find it in their hearts to reconsider.
I became a member a little before Betty, but she has many thousands of messages. She is always trying to help and save lives. That must be considered.
My lymie has once again become a danger to herself and Betty is even helping me while off this board..
Everyone doesnt always agree with her methods but her heart is better than most and she will help until her last breath if possible.
Again, please reconsider. lymemomtooo
Posted by seekhelp (Member # 15067) on :
Lymemomtoo, you have 38,000+ posts more to catch up to BettyG. Posted by Silverwolf (Member # 9196) on :
<<<<< Betty' >>>>>,
I miss you,and hope you can come back someday!!!
Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
quote:Originally posted by Keebler: - Sixgoofykids,
Betty can't read the board. For some reason, her computer will not connect to this site.
Sorry if you thought I meant you with the emails. In no way did I mean you. It is not you to whom I was referring. There were others - many others from many different people. I named no names on purpose. It would serve no need. Everyone knows if they've been nice or not.
The power struggle I was describing was between posters - that is want escalated it and it just blew up into a big mess. I do wish it could have been handled better but it was chaos and I would run screaming into the jungle to escape it, for sure.
SGK, You are one of the ones who have maintained a professional demeanor around all this and your welcome note in "seeking" does incorporate Betty's suggestions.
That request made sense and it's good to see that mentioned.
It was probably not so much that it alone was the fight, but that it was used as a springboard for some who just didn't like this or that about someone. -
Thanks, Keebler. I *thought* you probably meant it this way but that is only because I have read all the emails that were exchanged. I agree that it is best to keep names out of it, but when you do, it can make some look bad who were not. The struggle was between posters and we were "moderating," but in your post that wasn't clear. Thank you for clearing that up now to the others who are reading who have not read all the correspondence.
That is strange that Betty's computer cannot connect to the site. There is nothing we can do on our end to do that, the admin can make it so people can't post. On our end, this is temporary until things calm down. On Betty's end, I don't know. Hopefully, she will reconsider.
Posted by kam (Member # 3410) on :
Wasn't able to read what others post. Just responding to the question.
In my minds eye Betty is off on a much needed cruise and vacation.
In another world other than the lyme world.
Not even thinking about us because she is having so much fun living her life.
Posted by springshowers (Member # 19863) on :
There are always two sides to every story. Its too bad that there could not be a compromise made. That is all I think anyone .. wanted.
I think everyone has value.
I have seen lots of good things from her and I have seen some not so good things.
It is really up to the moderators. I think we really have to just trust they know things that the rest of us do not and they did their jobs.
I also think they DO NOT HAVE TO and even SHOULD NOT post the specifics here. It is not nor should be public knowledge.
It is between her and the forum. And that is it. The forum and moderators in my mind are breaking confidentiality if they post specifics.
IF I got banned I surely would not think I would have to worry about the moderators going on and telling everyone why I was banned and specifics that are not something I already disclosed on the board.
I think the that curiousity is normal but that it is not our business really...
I know she is active on other boards as well using the same screen name....she was quite active and I am sure will remain so..
Posted by seekhelp (Member # 15067) on :
I want moderator power for a day just to know the excitement of hitting the giant delete button. Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
Thank you, springshowers, that is correct, we should not be revealing what happened. Everything that has been revealed has been revealed by people BettyG has spoken to.
Seek, it's just like your delete button but we can edit anyone's post .... it's not an exciting, giant delete button! And you can't delete without taking all the rest of the job. Haha.
Posted by lou (Member # 81) on :
We have lost other lyme activists on this board who never came back. Thinking of Californialyme, Cave76, Joe Ham, and others. I always hate to see the oldtimers leave as they have a lot of institutional memory and we need them to balance all the newbies who show up lost and helpless.
Posted by WildCondor (Member # 434) on :
Exactly Lou...I have one foot out the door too....it's really a bad situation. Newbies helping newbies. I wish things would be fixed, really badly. I have too many emails from people begging me to stay so what to do!!! Ahhh!
Posted by Tracy9 (Member # 7521) on :
Well said, spring showers, and thank you for answering my questions, sixgoofykids.
As a moderator on another board, I will say when things get very heated, I have had to ban members when they are about to leave because when they are very angry, they will sometimes make a damaging grand exit that is hurtful to all the other members.
I am in no way saying Betty was going to do that, but I have seen it happen and therefore sometimes it becomes prudent to ban someone when you know they are heating up and planning to leave anyway.
I honestly had no idea what happened, and was just wondering where she went! Thanks for answering. Sounds like it was handled very fairly, and that she will be welcome back after a cooling off period.
That is about as fair as fair can be.
Posted by Lymetoo (Member # 743) on :
I know what you mean, WC. Every time I think I've done my time here.. someone leaves and I feel I am needed even more.
The newbies need us all to step up and not let them fall through the cracks!!
Posted by randibear (Member # 11290) on :
ok, ok, i'm going to step in. anything i can do?
i haven't a clue tho i should warn you...
Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
Randi - Posted by randibear (Member # 11290) on :
hey listen, you may live to regret this!!!
Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
You're assuming I'll live through moderating Lymenet!!! Posted by randibear (Member # 11290) on :
touche!! good one.
hey, maybe i am better qualified. civil rights specialist/mediator...hmmm
Posted by Geneal (Member # 10375) on :
Keebler,
Please let my sister know that I am praying for her for now and always.
Thanks.
Hugs,
Geneal
Posted by Robin123 (Member # 9197) on :
Six, I think you're doing a good job - honest, balanced, and gentle with folks. Even tho you've volunteered to moderate, which can be a tough job, everyone still needs people with good heart. Maybe you should call yourself SixGoofyKidsPlusZillionsMore...
CaliforniaLyme was not banned. She left because she was being harassed in her personal life.
Posted by seekhelp (Member # 15067) on :
I don't know Cave76, but after the stuff I read this poster put on LNE, I'm shocked there's any regret Absolute ruthlessness and attacks on many.
quote:Originally posted by lou: We have lost other lyme activists on this board who never came back. Thinking of Californialyme, Cave76, Joe Ham, and others. I always hate to see the oldtimers leave as they have a lot of institutional memory and we need them to balance all the newbies who show up lost and helpless.
Posted by Ocean (Member # 3496) on :
Wow! I am in shock! I didn't know any of this went on!!
I too had become friends with Betty and I am so sad that she is gone...she was an asset to the site and to newcomers...she helped me several times with lists of doctors and their numbers...I can't imagine how upset she probably is with all of the thousands of hours spent trying to help people.
Betty...I hope you have a wonderful holiday season and that somehow you are able to come back to Lyme.net if you are able.
Hugs,
Ocean
Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
Thanks, Robin, LOL!
Ocean, we hope, too, that BettyG will come back after this passes ... that truly is what we are hoping for. Posted by opus2828 (Member # 15407) on :
I too am surprised by this. I do hope BettyG comes back. I will miss her.
Posted by Keebler (Member # 12673) on :
- Betty has asked me to say that she "will never return." She does not think the matter was handled fairly at all (by two of the many moderators) and that her concerns were not heard. Nor do I.
She was told by one moderator that they just didn't even want to hear another word out of her and she could not even point out problems with some of the posts that attacked her.
I followed the insults and bashing (and Betty shared emails for advice). I don't feel like she was treated fairly, either. Some of the insults and bashing was harsh (and only some removed) but those were not the people who got banned. Instead, it was the person who just didn't want to take snide remarks anymore and she raised her voice, making it appear as if she was the problem. She was pointing out the problem and got swallowed by it. The trouble makers had an uncanny way of wiggling out of it.
Enough said.
-----
SixGoofyKids, I know you are working hard and I don't know how much of this you saw as I can't assume the moderators all confer. Regardless, this is not about anything you have said or done. I appreciate your work here. I do home LymeNet grows in professionalism.
Good luck. -
Posted by MusicMan (Member # 11966) on :
Well Betty
You can always come visit us at LymeLand any time ya want. It's quiet and very peace loving.
Steve
Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
Thanks, Keebler. I saw it all. There are two sides to everything, and mistakes made on both sides. It also came at a bad time ... with the new mods and all.
I hope she reconsiders once everything cools off.
Posted by seekhelp (Member # 15067) on :
I stil think BettyG will be back. Lymenet's the biggest stage in the Lyme world and she's the biggest Lyme advocate. Time heals wounds.
Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
quote:Originally posted by Keebler: - Betty has asked me to say that she "will never return." She does not think the matter was handled fairly at all (by two of the many moderators) and that her concerns were not heard. Nor do I.
I just wanted to clarify that by two sides to every story, I was referring to this part of your post when I said that.
I know you read the emails regarding the one issue. Also, you are free to pass on information about what happened from Betty's side. On the other hand, I can't tell the story from our side and destroy people's confidence in myself and the other moderators that we have discretion in keeping private issues private.
Even though there were emails you have read, you may not have read every correspondence, we don't know, and it doesn't matter. I am sure you didn't read the emails we received from other parties that Betty never saw. We were "moderating" and trying our best to be fair to all involved. Betty chose first to distance herself from the board, we agreed, especially when she took her grievances public.
I just want to be sure that people understand, the mods aren't perfect, we're just one of us, just one of the board members (sorry to burst some of your bubbles, some of you probably thought you were perfect, LOL!) and we're doing the best we can. It's a difficult job. Many of us are also dealing with illness, so get frustrated at times, just like you do.
In the end, there were differences, as you said. Everyone on every side thinks they were right. Everyone needs a break from the discussions, and that's what we're doing. Betty was not permanently banned. She needed a break and so did we. That's all. We've all been there in our own personal lives. Time to simmer down so we can discuss more clearly. That's all.
I'm sorry Betty got hurt. I can't really tell more about the whole story. I'm glad you're there for her and I hope that you can help her to calm down about it so she will come back in the future. She was a great asset to the board, gave many hours, and all of us would hate to lose her.
I hope everyone has a Happy Thanksgiving. I also hope this discussion can be put to rest .... we've had the answer to the original question. Thanks to you all for keeping within certain parameters so that we didn't need to edit or delete ... honestly, it's not as fun as seek thinks it sounds.
Posted by joalo (Member # 12752) on :
I did read what happened and I think the wrong person left lymenet.
Betty was very frustrated and was only trying to defend herself and ask for fairness.
What happened to her wasn't fair and it saddens me. I'm afraid she won't come back....
Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
quote:Originally posted by joalo: What happened to her wasn't fair and it saddens me. I'm afraid she won't come back....
We weren't done negotiating .... she left ... we knew we had not reached an agreement between all parties
Posted by glm1111 (Member # 16556) on :
Thanks Keebler for being so articulate and speaking up for Betty when she couldn't. You are a true friend.
As much as I would like to see her return, it would be like returning to an abusive spouse and I think she knows that the attacks could come again. She is a very wise woman. She knows she deserves better and I wholeheartedly agree.
Gael
Posted by Tincup (Member # 5829) on :
"Betty has asked me to say that she "will never return."
If I had a nickel for every time I've said that ... oh my!
Or a nickel for each time I've heard others say that...
And what I've learned after I exploded and said that is...
The problem wasn't with the members or the moderators... although at the time you couldn't convince me of that .....
Heck, a whole post of mine was deleted just last week by a moderator (you suck it up and get use to it and try not to do it again)....
Anyhow.. it wasn't them that was the problem.....
It was me.
I've learned that although I may THINK I am right and think that I'm right very strongly and sincerely ... sometimes I'm not.
And.. what the moderators say is the final word. No matter what, it's their baby and they are the boss.
I also figured out when things went bad what I needed was a time out to reflect ... and I've learned to take it. It does help.
I hope once BG has some time to think and gets some rest she will come back and be with her friends.
BTW- If BG has a desk top link to this site that she is using ... tell her to remove it and instead have her go to google and type in LymeNet... and go to the site that way.
That should allow her to see the comments and navigate the site if she can't already.
Posted by joalo (Member # 12752) on :
Thanks sixgoofykids for all of your effort and for being the "voice of reason". We appreciate you taking the time to explain things to us. Posted by randibear (Member # 11290) on :
good heavens, i'm glad i don't say i'm leaving!!!! LOL......
and my posts are ALWAYS within polite boundaries... uh huh....
besides ya'll know if you're mean to me, i'll cry...
Posted by lou (Member # 81) on :
My point was not that all the oldtimers I mentioned were banned, just that they left and had previously provided help to newbies. Having been on lymenet for ten years, when other oldtimers leave, I feel it personally.
The other thing is that ticks bite all different kinds of people, and when they come here, they bring a lot of different personalities. Plus, chronic illness, sometimes brain problems that affect behavior, and all the terrible problems lymies have in getting treatment....well it has got to show up sometime in anger and other destructive emotions. This is a website occupied by desperate sick people, and a few who are now better but have stuck around to help, out of the kindness of their hearts.
I have sometimes decided to write off lymenet, because it is repetitious and my situation seems unsolvable. But it is difficult to get support anywhere else. So, I am still here.
Posted by just don (Member # 1129) on :
Having never been banned,,,but info from others is they CANT read or come here at all when banned.
I thought there IP addy was blocked from accessing the site at all.
I read that last post of Bettys and didnt think it sounded like her at all,,,she was indeed stressed.
I said to myself,this post wont stay long,,,it didnt.
there was some bashing going on there,,at least accusing nature remarks
as to some of the old timers like me,,,some have died,,,like Joe Ham passed away a while back,,,if your wondering.
some have left voluntarily, some not,,,may they all find peace!!!
Posted by Lymetoo (Member # 743) on :
Doesn't make sense that she can't get to lymenet.. maybe Tincup has the answer there.
Posted by randibear (Member # 11290) on :
i thought you can re-register using another name.
i'm really ignorant about these things, but when my computer crashed i just logged on differently when i got it working.
hmm, unless there's someway somebody can block your id thingy from getting access to it.
???
sounds like she needs a long break tho. it maybe good for her. you cannot put your entire life and soul into this board. at some point you have to crash and maybe this is what happened to her.
saw it at work a lot.
Posted by EllieP50 (Member # 15936) on :
I don't know what has gone on in this situation, and I haven't been involved in any of it in any way, but I do want to say that sometimes it's good to have change in viewpoint.
I began visiting this site when I was extremely ill with multiple rashes and neurological issues. I found it difficult to write coherently, but with effort, I wrote a post. I immediately got an email telling me to break the lines up and instructions for doing that (which at that time I couldn't even begin to follow) - I know people are effected differently, but I had extreme neurological issues (including Bell's Palsy,) and writing anything was difficult. In addition, in my case, breaking up the print into two lines at a time made it unreadable to me (once I'd get to the end of a line I couldn't track it if there wasn't anything there and couldn't skip lines - I'd lose the thread).
I felt as though I couldn't post at this site without getting criticized for the format and felt unappreciated when I made the huge effort to post and got a slap on the wrist and instructions to modify it (so that people with neurological issues could read it - I had neurological issues and couldn't read print with the lines broken up - there didn't seem to be any recognition that neurological problems can effect people differently.)
While I don't wish anyone to be hurt, and I'm sure that Betty G. did a lot of good, I think the site can benefit from a change in viewpoint and from realizing that it's important to let people who are having enough problems expressing themselves do it in their own way. I am much better at this point (although not problem free) and can deal with all of this better than I could initially. I have gotten valuable links etc. from this site,and a lot of information so I've appreciated it, but I will never forget how disconcerting that email was.
I hope to hear whether or not anyone else shares these feelings and had this experience. I know a lot of people have been helped, but I wonder how many people wandered away from this site because, of all things, criticism of the format and line spacing they used to post heartfelt problems. I am hoping that the moderators will think about this. I'm assuming that the emails that Betty G. sent out re: post format were approved by the moderators but I think it would be good to reconsider that policy.
Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
quote:Originally posted by EllieP50: I'm assuming that the emails that Betty G. sent out re: post format were approved by the moderators but I think it would be good to reconsider that policy.
No, PM's, whether they be doctor list or instructions to break up a post are done privately, they do not get moderator approval or disapproval.
I'm glad you've made so much progress. Posted by springshowers (Member # 19863) on :
quote: I hope to hear whether or not anyone else shares these feelings and had this experience. I know a lot of people have been helped, but I wonder how many people wandered away from this site because, of all things, criticism of the format and line spacing they used to post heartfelt problems. I am hoping that the moderators will think about this. I'm assuming that the emails that Betty G. sent out re: post format were approved by the moderators but I think it would be good to reconsider that policy.
Your hoping to hear if anyone else shares your feelings. I do and had the same experience and tried to express that a few times in the past. Your not alone that is for sure.
I think the moderators will and are thinking about this subject but in the past there were no changes to this.
Your last comment about assuming moderators approve the emails and format requests etc. Well that is not true from what I heard. I think the requests were just from this person who felt this way and not directed by moderators. I am sure it was not something that was outwardly intended to affect people negatively, but I know it did so for many and many times over.
I feel that it does and will make a big difference, without those requests, for new people and for people in distress to express themselves without fear of that slap on the wrist. The problem was it did not feel like a request based on how it was written. Sadly just talking about this and asking for things to be said differently caused a lot of problems and was taken personally when it was not.
It was to benefit exactly those people like you and I and many others who experienced the exact same thing.
Sometimes its hard to see the other side of things and esp when your ego is hurt. We got to keep an open mind. And as someone above posted. There are times when it is Us who is the problem even when we do not want to see it. I have gone through a similar experience.
We are all human.. and we are part of the problem and should be part of the solution both..
I hope your post is heard as well.. I appreciate your honesty and your comments about this that will help others coming through this forum
Blessings...
Posted by 22dreams (Member # 17846) on :
When I rec'd the same message, I didn't take it as a criticism. I don't think it was meant to be. I think the emphasis is on how You felt.
I, myself, with the neuro symptoms more advanced later on could appreciate when ppl broke up the paragraphs.
otherwise, I still can't manage to read. Which means that I could lose out or that I can't then share and someone else may lose out.
I remember someone, maybe her, asking me to use tinyurl to reduce the size of a link as it was making the thread incredibly Wide.
and for the life of me, I tried to follow the instructions that day--
couldn't manage coz of my severe cognitive hurdles. And I just stated that I was sorry, that I was not in a cognitive space to handle learning how to do that now.
On any given day, I wouldn't even have replied to the request because of lack of energy.
I eventually did figure it out one day. when I remembered to.
So, if you can't manage, you can't manage.
I dunno. I just see it as etiquette is in place for a reason. different forums is like visiting a different culture.
You want to know the customs when visiting other countries to make yourself understood by the natives and make things easier for yourself too?
I realize some of us have psych and anxiety issues so something like could be perceived as pressure...etc...
Different take.
And if things change, and folks on Lymenet do start posting in whatever format they wish, I doubt I'd be able to continue to use it as a resource. Unfortunately.
The moving icons are difficult enough to contend with some days.
Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
The compromise we reached regarding the format issue, because for many of us we cannot read unless it's broken up, is that there is now a sticky in seeking doctors.
If a new poster does not see it, someone can post or PM referring them there - something like, "I'm sorry, due to neuro-Lyme I cannot read your post. Please see this thread (link) for instructions on posting that make it easier for us neuro-Lymies to read."
It is information that needs to go to new members in order for them to get answers to their questions, but at the same time, we don't want to scare away new members, so we came up with a consistent way to pass on the information.
Posted by randibear (Member # 11290) on :
cool. good idea...
Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
Thanks. These are the ideas and compromises we have been working on.
Posted by Lymetoo (Member # 743) on :
Six.. your PM box is full!
Posted by lou4656 (Member # 10300) on :
Six -- I just spent 45 minutes writing a detailed message to you -- and your box is full and now my message has disappeared.
UGH!!!
Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
Sorry, it fills up so fast these days! I'll take care of it now.
Posted by lou4656 (Member # 10300) on :
Not a problem. I'll rewrite the message when I get more time. I know you are busy.
Posted by Ann-OH (Member # 2020) on :
One thing we all need to remember is that most of us are ill and have incredible ups and downs.
It is amazing to me that people here manage to express themselves well and acurately and that others of us manage to respond in a helpful way.
People post here around the clock, often in the middle of a painful night, or in a foggy-minded afternoon. And, if you are like me, often forget that we posted anything at all!
We are all amazing. Many have taken offense when none was intended, or completely mis-read what the poster said was trying to get answered, and yet most of us remain and try to help.
The moderators have impossibly difficult work to do and most of them while they are ill as well! We should be grateful for them.
I hope Betty gets some rest and some more sleep - she was one who posted all night.She needs and deserves it.
Ann- OH
Posted by stymielymie (Member # 10044) on :
there seems to be a great issue of respect on this forum. many if not all oldies have left due to nasty responses from new members. there have been at least 20 members with much info and help that have left due to the attitude of others. i myself is one. i try to give a moderate response to a question and get blasted for my views. i still answer some questions ,but the ones i know i will get abused i pass on by, which is not good ,since the other side of the answer should and must be told.
this has been going on from at least a year and it is very difficult to stay here and help ,when people blast you for the facts the you give.
as far as i know all of us are semi healthy and still helping from afar. my research and treatment have helped many. my collection and distribution of money for the needy is still going on. and yes i DON'T NEED TO BE HERE. I AM LYME FREE AND IN REMISSION FOR NOW 4 YEARS. so these gestures and abuses i tolerate so that i may help others that WANT MY HELP. I WILL ALWAYS ANSWER, BUT I MAY NOT POST ANY LONGER. I HAVE NOT BEEN BANNED FROM ANY SITE BUT HAVE LEFT VOLUNTARILY.
DOCDAVE
Posted by lou4656 (Member # 10300) on :
DocDave -- Losing you is a huge loss to Lymenet. You have been missed.
Losing Betty is a huge loss also. I am hoping that the circumstances can be right, at some point, that she will feel comfortable returning. Only time and attitudes will tell.
Thanks for all the beautiful advice, care and concern that you have given to people.
Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
If you are blasted, please report the post. I am also in remission so no longer read all the posts that are made every day. If you see something and wonder why it's "allowed", it's probably that we haven't seen it.
Posted by Keebler (Member # 12673) on :
- SGK,
I know you are doing the best you can, but this issue involves other moderators - my note is not written in reply to yours but I've just finished my work here. I was not going to say anything but since StymieLymie said what he did, it may be of interest to know that he's right. People who supply good information have left and are still leaving.
-----
The point is that several of those who have bashed repeatedly, remain. They will find new targets. No one is safe. The attitude will go on. It was the person being verbally abused that was banned, not the abusers.
I can't be a part of such an organization that allows such unfairness and veiled abuse.
It has taken me many days but I have just finished deleting all threads that I started. However, two of my main sources of interest can still be found by searching for porphyria and for many of the inner ear issues such as tinnitus and other terms. I leave links there as a gift to those yet to come along.
As for why I deleted past threads which often contained extensive links and abstracts - in good conscience, I could not leave the body of my work with a group that I would not want to be associated with due to the way people are treated by its own members.
I have not been banned but leave voluntarily. I've received a bit of bashing for the way I post or the extent of my research - wanting people to have what they need to proceed. I could deal with that but it was the way Betty was treated (repeatedly, over time) that led me to this decision.
I am not well - far from it - yet, from my own search I've much research to share in 3 or 4 particular areas, it takes everything I have to write. It's just too stressful of an ordeal to remain in this opinionated clique that has blossomed. It makes me sicker.
I used to be a professor of journalism. I used to love to research, teach and share the wonder of learning. I hate that I have had to research to save my own life since there are no LLMDs in my state. Still, for a split second here, I enjoyed sharing with others some of what I've found to be of value - to make their search for health - for life - easier. I do hope it helped. -
[ 11-29-2009, 02:45 PM: Message edited by: Keebler ]
Posted by Snailhead (Member # 18091) on :
Hi Doc Dave,
I just wanted you to know that you helped me prepare for my tooth extraction earlier this month. I took your suggested abx Clindamyacin to my LLMD and he wholeheartedly agreed.
Thanks, I really appreciated the help.
Posted by lou4656 (Member # 10300) on :
Keebler -- We have lost Betty, and now it seems that we have lost you too. Such sadness.
I am beginning to feel that soon I will be the only old timer left. It will be me against the abusers. But I can't in good conscience walk away yet.
God only knows who the next target will be. It could be me. I've chosen to turn my back on the abusers rather than be sucked in by their nastiness. But who knows how long I can keep doing that.
It may be just a matter of time before I too feel the need to throw in the towel. Time will tell.
Hugs to you and Betty both. We miss you.
Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
Keebler, I'm sorry to see you go. Truly, we want no abuse on here. Like I asked, please report it.
There is more to the story about Betty being temporarily banned. I am not going to divulge the whole story. You all are missing parts of it though (even the ones who have many of the emails).
You are welcome back anytime Keebler. I hope after a break you decide to return.
Posted by Wonko (Member # 18318) on :
I'm going to add a comment here from the perspective of someone who is "outside of the loop."
While I don't deny that abuse occurs between members, I don't see it. Either the moderators are removing it before I see it, or it is happening behind the scenes such as through PM and/or email.
I'm not even sure what is meant by "abuse" as the term is being used here.
I've seen posts with conflicting opinions, but I accept that there is no resolution when people disagree at a fundamental level. That's when it's time to live and let live.
I know first hand how being sick and not feeling like myself makes me overly sensitive to criticism. And again I know the issues causing people to leave could be behind the scenes. Regardless, it's possible that people could let things cool down before taking irreversible steps to distance themselves.
Support is crucial during recovery and I'm sure it's a passion for some who are healed. Support and ideas come in different shapes and forms and there is no one-size-fits-all answer to most questions. I treat this site like a buffet: I take what I like and skip what doesn't appeal to me.
Wishing everyone good health.
Posted by lou4656 (Member # 10300) on :
Something that I was taught and continue to pass on to others:
"No matter how much you think that you know about someone, or about a situation, and no matter how justified you are in supposing that you know all there is to know, there is always and inevitably more to the story."
We need to feel compassion for everyone involved. And I try. I am just sad that this has happened.
Posted by JR (Member # 16898) on :
So Betty WAS banned. I thought you said she just left for a break of her own free will?
quote:Originally posted by sixgoofykids: Keebler, I'm sorry to see you go. Truly, we want no abuse on here. Like I asked, please report it.
There is more to the story about Betty being temporarily banned. I am not going to divulge the whole story. You all are missing parts of it though (even the ones who have many of the emails).
You are welcome back anytime Keebler. I hope after a break you decide to return.
Posted by JR (Member # 16898) on :
And I quote:
quote:Originally posted by sixgoofykids: It is our understanding that Bettyg is taking a break from the board. We all appreciate all that she did, and if she needs a break, she certainly deserves one. I think all of us who have been here any length of time have taken a break at one point or another.
Thank you for your concern, Tracy.
Posted by Lymetoo (Member # 743) on :
Keebler ... I wish you would stay. I'll miss you terribly.
Posted by pab (Member # 904) on :
quote:I am beginning to feel that soon I will be the only old timer left. It will be me against the abusers. But I can't in good conscience walk away yet.
Lou,
There are a lot of "old timers left". I've been here since 2001. I don't get involved in the drama.
Posted by seekhelp (Member # 15067) on :
I can't believe you deleted all the threads Keebler. Not good IMO. For every bad person, there are 20 good ones. You doing that may have hurt others who desperately needed it. I'm sorry you felt you needed to do something that drastic. That action just seems wrong.
Maybe I should just leave too. Really, don't take it all so personal. It's the Internet. it blows my mind because I've read nothing but peopel praising your efforts since I've been here. Doesn't that mean anything to you?
What should concern everyone so much more is these members of Lymenet Europe posting real people's names, keeping blogs about members here, and other outright unbelievable actions. THIS makes me not want to post. While I don't agree with some stuff here, I am in shock members there actually review every action on here to turn into gossip there. BEWARE WHAT YOU ALL WRITE because you're being watched like hawks. That is serious IMO. Every post you make, every comment, thought all is recorded there. When a thread vanishes here, it's saved forever there.
Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
quote:Originally posted by JR: So Betty WAS banned. I thought you said she just left for a break of her own free will?
That is how it started. It is true that she left of her own free will. She cannot post at this time, as has been discussed on this thread, but that was after she left ... after she wrote her post that had to be removed. We were still in dialogue with her when she decided to leave and we do want her to come back after a cooling off period.
Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
quote:Originally posted by lou4656: "No matter how much you think that you know about someone, or about a situation, and no matter how justified you are in supposing that you know all there is to know, there is always and inevitably more to the story."
Very, very good! And very true in this case! Thank you!
Posted by sixgoofykids (Member # 11141) on :
Seek, I agree, this is a PUBLIC message board. You should only write information here that you want PUBLIC.
Posted by seekhelp (Member # 15067) on :
I know Six, but others may not be aware how cruel it gets. I was quite shocked at stuff I read lately and I'm not thin skinned.
Posted by sutherngrl (Member # 16270) on :
I haven't seen anything shocking on here lately but then I'm not here all the time. But I wouldn't be surprised since most of us are very ill, irritable and an explosion waiting to happen.
From what I can tell, those that have been here a long time and have gotten better tend to move on eventually anyway. It makes sense. Some stay and offer their knowledge, while others have other callings and other directions to go in.
Everything happens for a reason, so maybe it was just time for some ppl to move on. I am sure some of us that have been here a year or two will also have our time to move on too in the future. Life goes on!
I hope that those that have left us find health and happiness. Maybe this is where a new journey begins for them.
Posted by Robin123 (Member # 9197) on :
I am really sorry to read of this latest exodus, that of Keebler, who has been so helpful to everyone here.
And Stymie, and Betty -
I think any bashing, meanness, cliques etc need to end! People come here for help. We shouldn't be losing our helpers, who also can use help too, from time to time.
I was actually surprised to read that Stymie thought his information had been attacked. It's my impression that he has been our Lyme dentist-in-residence and extremely medically knowledgeable!
Are we in need of another process to handle grievances here, so we don't have to lose longtime members every time there's something going on that bothers people?
Posted by tonysgirl (Member # 11202) on :
I have been a member for several years now and post rarely. I feel that I have learned much, but can pick the information that I need and move on. I truly believe that spending too much time on this board is not healthy. Especially when you have to deal with the politics of this disease.
Since this subject is taking place, I would like to mention that many of the "old timers" are very well intended, but some, come off rather harsh. I also had the experience with Betty telling me to break up my sentences so a lymie can read them. While I will be the first to state, I do not believe I was as sick as some, I was in a terrible way when I first found Lymenet. That initial encounter just upset me more. As a newbie, I was seeking help, not a berating incident over something that would be considered nonsense elsewhere. We are not speaking face to face and this is a public forum, but there are ways to speak in a more polite and less accusatory manner. I was totally unaware that this was an issue when I first arrived and it didn't bode well for an initial impression. If the intention of this site is too provide others with information and get our word out, doing it in that way is definetly not successful.
As I mentioned above, I post rarely, but look often. I will search for whatever my question is and get out of here. That approach has served me well and allowed me to stay out of the drama that seems to hover around here. I know many of the people here have extensive experience and divulge their knowledge when they can and I greatly appreciate that. Unfortunately, while I do believe Betty has a great heart and was well intentioned, I do believe that she expected full recognition for what she did and expected to never be questioned. That included when she sent her responses regarding the spacing. She could say whatever she wanted and expected to get away with it, yet she would never stand to be spoken to that way. At least that is how I saw it. I saw many of her uffda's in response to some.
As an example, many old timers will remember when she was asked to redo the newbies forum. I believe initially, she was upset that she was asked to do something over. For someone who requested people to break up their spacing, it was almost inconceivable to think that someone with neuro lyme could read the newbies column. I for one, could not. After she did it, she spoke of how it took her days to do it.
I know what a great advocate she is for the Lyme community, but when the same story is posted on every comments section for every article written on the internet regarding Lyme, it loses its sting. If I was just a person with an interest in Lyme but who was not ill and read several articles and saw the same story of Lyme for 34.5 years from my Christmas tree, I am sorry, it loses its validity. No matter what article you read it was the same story over and over. Many of you know what I mean. I would look something up and see that people posted regarding some type of symptom. There would be a response from Betty stating she had it and it was caused by her XYZ affliction. Again, this does not help the Lyme validity factor when we have doctors who are looking at some of these posts. I know many others who have PM'd me over the years and have had the same feelings, but have never spoke on it. They had no reason too because they took what they wanted and left. We didn't stay and look for the drama.
I am not trying to be harsh and have never spoken of this before, but I believe it is the time to mention this now. With all of the attention Lyme is getting in the media the last year or so, we need to show some validity that people are suffering, not suffering to gain attention. All of this infighting just makes us look like the bunch of wackos that the IDSA says we are. We need to stand together and put a face on this horrible disease and show how many of us are suffering and that we are not going away.
[ 12-01-2009, 01:33 PM: Message edited by: sixgoofykids ]
Posted by treepatrol (Member # 4117) on :
Its all disappointing.
Posted by kitty9309 (Member # 19945) on :
quote:Originally posted by tonysgirl: I have been a member for several years now and post rarely. I feel that I have learned much, but can pick the information that I need and move on. I truly believe that spending too much time on this board is not healthy. Especially when you have to deal with the politics of this disease.
Since this subject is taking place, I would like to mention that many of the "old timers" are very well intended, but some, come off rather harsh. I also had the experience with Betty telling me to break up my sentences so a lymie can read them. While I will be the first to state, I do not believe I was as sick as some, I was in a terrible way when I first found Lymenet. That initial encounter just upset me more. As a newbie, I was seeking help, not a berating incident over something that would be considered nonsense elsewhere. We are not speaking face to face and this is a public forum, but there are ways to speak in a more polite and less accusatory manner. I was totally unaware that this was an issue when I first arrived and it didn't bode well for an initial impression. If the intention of this site is too provide others with information and get our word out, doing it in that way is definetly not successful.
As I mentioned above, I post rarely, but look often. I will search for whatever my question is and get out of here. That approach has served me well and allowed me to stay out of the drama that seems to hover around here. I know many of the people here have extensive experience and divulge their knowledge when they can and I greatly appreciate that. Unfortunately, while I do believe Betty has a great heart and was well intentioned, I do believe that she expected full recognition for what she did and expected to never be questioned. That included when she sent her responses regarding the spacing. She could say whatever she wanted and expected to get away with it, yet she would never stand to be spoken to that way. At least that is how I saw it. I saw many of her uffda's in response to some.
As an example, many old timers will remember when she was asked to redo the newbies forum. I believe initially, she was upset that she was asked to do something over. For someone who requested people to break up their spacing, it was almost inconceivable to think that someone with neuro lyme could read the newbies column. I for one, could not. After she did it, she spoke of how it took her days to do it. That doesn't play well with me.
I know what a great advocate she is for the Lyme community, but when the same story is posted on every comments section for every article written on the internet regarding Lyme, it loses its sting. If I was just a person with an interest in Lyme but who was not ill and read several articles and saw the same story of Lyme for 34.5 years from my Christmas tree, I am sorry, it loses its validity. No matter what article you read it was the same story over and over. Many of you know what I mean. I would look something up and see that people posted regarding some type of symptom. There would be a response from Betty stating she had it and it was caused by her XYZ affliction. Again, this does not help the Lyme validity factor when we have doctors who are looking at some of these posts. I know many others who have PM'd me over the years and have had the same feelings, but have never spoke on it. They had no reason too because they took what they wanted and left. We didn't stay and look for the drama.
I am not trying to be harsh and have never spoken of this before, but I believe it is the time to mention this now. With all of the attention Lyme is getting in the media the last year or so, we need to show some validity that people are suffering, not suffering to gain attention. All of this infighting just makes us look like the bunch of wackos that the IDSA says we are. We need to stand together and put a face on this horrible disease and show how many of us are suffering and that we are not going away.
Well said, I agree.
[ 12-01-2009, 01:35 PM: Message edited by: sixgoofykids ]
Posted by AliG (Member # 9734) on :
I guess I missed another on my fellow Neuro-lyme sufferers, judging by the latest comments I see posted here.
Why can't people submit their complaints & personal attacks to the moderators, instead of posting them publicly on the board?
Lymenet would probably lose a lot fewer old-timers & it seems to me that SOME newbies might be able to glean SOME benefit from people who've been fighting this battle longer than they have.
SOME newbies might even have appreciated what the people who are being driven away would have had to offer and SOME people have just caused THOSE people to lose what THEY may have considered to be valuable resources.
Then again, I may be wrong.
Why can't people just take what they need & leave the rest? Why the need to criticize? Does it make us feel better about our own flaws to point out flaws in others?
It's hurtful & it really needs to stop, IMO.
It really makes me sad to see people who've cared so much, for a bunch of people that they've never met, driven away by cruel & hurtful words being directed either at them or at others they identify with.
While I'd really like to respond to some of the negative comments made here, I'm choosing to SOB and hope that the moderators will address it.
I was always happy to break up my posts so that those who were worse off than me might be able to offer me the benefit of their own research & experience and so that they might also benefit from any information I provided.
I've had to delete much of what I wanted to post here. I am simply posting this instead:
I've missed the old timers who were banned & those who stopped posting because of personal attacks. It will not be the same here without Betty & Keebler.
IMO, those are some pretty big shoes to fill. Good luck to those of you who will try. I hope you are able to.
Happy Holidays everyone.
Posted by glm1111 (Member # 16556) on :
Ali,
So well said. I wanted to say something similar, but I was afraid it would come across with anger and I didn't want to do that. I totally agree with what you are saying.
I too was very appreciative of Betty asking me to break up the posts and also happily agreed to do so. I understood that she was trying to make an assemblance of order for the board.
Betty and Keebler were great assets to this board and will be sorely missed. And as Doc Dave put it there is a lack of respect.
You don't always have to agree, but sometimes being a little humble and giving the old timers the benefit of the doubt would show some class. I for one feel the void already,
Gael
Posted by springshowers (Member # 19863) on :
I really feel that there are certain old timers who got very set in their ways and have a hard time bending or changing or taking new ideas as a way to improve what they have been doing.
Also the fact that it is taken so personally creates the tension. I think any of the response to the new ideas is coming from an Ego and not from the subjects at hand.
The subjects were very simple and easily worked out and through. Very simple.
But the person was not able to see that and only saw the suggestions as a personal attack on them.
I think real leaders and representatives of this sort of forum should be able to listen and converse and come up with compromise and new plans forward that make everyone heard and be included.
I think there is always need for improvement in some way and it should be collaborative.
In my opinion the "leaders" on this board should be much more than willing to listen but should be anxious to do so because it makes the board feel like a group effort and a unit.
As opposed to a group of leaders and the followers.
Posted by springshowers (Member # 19863) on :
PS
If you go to Lymenet Europe.
The only thing you might get out of it is appreciating that this site does not allow the rath that they type there.
And maybe that perspective will help you realize how minimal the things are here....
Go to that site at your own risk.
Posted by Anna Lee (Member # 22992) on :
The moderators have received numerous reports on this thread from both sides of the issue for the past week. The original question posed has been asked and answered and the topic is now closed.
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on my fellow Neuro-lyme sufferers, judging by the latest comments I see posted here.