I suppose this could differ from person to person, but in case knee pain caused by Lyme, etc., is always the same, I thought I'd ask.
I was on doxy for a total of two months this summer following numerous deer-tick bites. I've been feeling okay (as okay as I ever am), but then 11 days ago both knees started hurting suddenly and without any obvious cause.
In both knees the pain and swelling are below the knee cap, toward the inside of the leg.
It's reached the point now where I can barely walk. I'm thinking of trying doxy to see what happens, but I realize even if it is Lyme I might start herxing and not know if the antibiotic is helping or not.
I called a knee doctor, but he can't see me until January. Not sure what to do at this point. Does the location of the pain sound like Lyme?
Posted by LymeSwimmer (Member # 40540) on :
My Knee pain is in the same place below the knee cap on the inside - and it affects my walking when I have a bad herx.
So it definitely could be Lyme - but the knee is such a tricky thing. Exercising, stepping wrong could also tweak the knee
My guess though seeing how you have been treating for lyme that this is what is causing the knee pain
Posted by Alisandne (Member # 27304) on :
Thanks! And I also think it's significant that both knees presented with symptoms at the same time.
Posted by Keebler (Member # 12673) on :
- Looking over your posting history, it appears as best I can scan it that you've never been able to see an ILADS educated LLMD.
You've been on doxy at rather low doses, alone or maybe with just some Samento. I know you may be doing the best you can but just one antibiotic is not enough to address lyme.
Other coinfections must also be assessed. Most importantly, though, is the nearly perfect chance that chronic lyme develops from inadequate treatment. Sorry. It's a shame but most doctors just don't know this.
And, while your knee could have various things going on and a knee specialist might be able to help assess in some ways, they will not know about lyme.
After you assess your erogonomics (shoes, posture, the way you carry yourself, etc.) and fine tune whatever you can there, you also must be certain you understand this (before consulting any other doctor because most do not know this) - so that you can finally get on the right path in a combination approach:
How just doxycycline (or other antibiotics, alone) can cause chronic lyme:
WHY you need an ILADS "educated" or "minded" Lyme Literate doctor (whether MD or ND, or both) - starting with assessment / evaluation for lyme, OTHER tick-borne diseases, and other chronic stealth infections - and all that goes along for the ride.
Medical "models" explained here, as to differences in the ISDA & ILADS models of assessment & treatment - and exactly why it is so very important to know the differences.
Now, within that set is also a set for "How to find a LL ND" -- if you cannot afford a LLMD or LL ND, see the articles and books and other links for various ways to approach a combination treatment.
Helpful links to for things like the SOTA LIGHTWORKS to help relieve pain while lyme is being fully addressed are in that LL ND thread.
Best of luck to you. -
Posted by Keebler (Member # 12673) on :
- The pain can be anywhere, in any joint, and migrate, too. In addition to lyme, which needs more thorough support . . . there may be some food changes that can help relieve pain. Anything that acts as an "excito-toxin" can intensify or cause pain by overaction of the nerve fibers.
Anything that can cause inflammation, also adds to pain load. Avoiding certain foods has helped many to better manage their comfort levels while treating lyme, et.al.
Excitotoxins; MSG; Aspartame; & "Natural" Flavors (that are not likely natural at all);
GMO foods that destroy the GI Tract; Gluten; Dairy. -
Posted by Lymetoo (Member # 743) on :
Also consider candida/ yeast. It can cause knee pain and swelling.
Posted by Keebler (Member # 12673) on :
- If your insurance covers seeing a PODIATRIST, I would do that so they can assess your footwear needs. Often, knee pain can come from the wrong footwear.
Just don't count on a podiatrist knowing much about lyme so don't let them shoot any kind of steroid into any joint (that can make lyme so much worse and harder to treat).
But a podiatrist can certainly help with your foot foundations. Take in a couple pair of shoes so they can assess them for YOUR needs. -
Posted by Alisandne (Member # 27304) on :
Keebler, I really appreciate the time you took to post and share this information. I thought at first a food might be responsible (I am dangerously allergic to solanine, for one thing, present in the nightshades, among others), but I've been super careful about what I eat and the pain gets worse every day. Right now I'm in so much pain I can't think. I need to do something, but I can't even imagine how I could get to my car, much less drive.
Posted by ukcarry (Member # 18147) on :
My knee swelling and pain is largely in the area you describe too.
Posted by map1131 (Member # 2022) on :
My knee pain, yes in both knees, never ever just one knee is in the same area. Under the knee cap.
I've never had swelling of knee that I noticed. I know some people have severe swelling.
Knee pain was my first symptom. I had early stage lyme for 6 mths, knees, wrists, hands pains that would come and go.
But the knees are the only sx that sent me to my doctor to complain. I had always ran up steps. All mgrs. offices were up long flight of steps and I would run up to speak with them in their stores.
I had 2 flights of steps in my home. I could barely walk up and down the stairs and it was so odd?
Why would I be creeping up and in horrible pain for a couple weeks and then I felt nothing and it had a cycle too? My doc called it arthritis. I didn't even mention my hands, wrists.
Gave me some med. It didn't help and I just thought I'd live with arthritis. More ticks attacked me.
Three weeks later I was chronic and it was Lyme Disease and a doctor that recognized the symptoms.
When I have a lyme flare or cause a herx by using my rife machine......my knees scream.
Pam
Posted by Alisandne (Member # 27304) on :
I just read on the website of the Hospital for Special Surgery that swelling of the knee is common with Lyme, but not much pain is involved. So hard to believe the experts....
Posted by GretaM (Member # 40917) on :
Haha...
"Not much pain is involved" if one has lyme arthritis.
Who are these "experts" who write this drivel?
If it didn't hurt, it would be diagnosed as edema...
My goodness. What a bunch of yahoos at some of these hospitals.
Of course lyme arthritis hurts. The joint is inflamed, and therefore swells.
Sorry, had to go on a rant there about "experts" who design these obstacle courses for lyme patients to run through.
Posted by map1131 (Member # 2022) on :
Shoot, not much pain my a$$. I could be hurting from head to toe, but the loudest and the worst would stand out like a throbbing hammered finger, that stops throbbing within hours, but the lyme in the knees goes on and on and on.....
that's lyme in the knees. Just when you think hey my knees haven't bothered me in a few weeks. It's back. That's after 3++ yrs of abx and 12 yrs of constant tx to kill the bad guys.
I wouldn't let that Hospital for Special Surgery touch me. That must be run by Dumb and Dumber.
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