bcb1200
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 25745
posted
So...day 18 of Rifampin for me. I seem to have settled back in to my "pre Rifampin" symptoms, which overall are mild.
There are a few exceptions. Yesterday my ears started to get sensitive to sounds. I haven't had this since April. And my vision is a bit odd...mild, but odd. Ditto..not since April.
I know it is common for symptoms to resurface during treatment.
My questions is...is this a GOOD thing? Does it mean the Rifampin is hitting something?
I worry of a relapse. Can you relapse if you are on Meds?
-------------------- Bite date ? 2/10 symptoms began 5/10 dx'd, after 3 months numerous test and doctors
IgM Igenex +/CDC + + 23/25, 30, 31, 34, 41, 83/93
Currently on:
Currently at around 95% +/- most days. Posts: 3134 | From Massachusetts | Registered: May 2010
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CD57
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 11749
posted
I wonder about this too
Posts: 3528 | From US | Registered: Apr 2007
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Keebler
Honored Contributor (25K+ posts)
Member # 12673
posted
- " . . . ears started to get sensitive to sounds" is called hyperacusis.
That is NOT a good sign at all. Never.
However, it can subside - but if caused by medicine that is not the usual case. You may need a different RX - or you may need much better liver support. Better liver support might turn it around.
Hyperacusis often goes along with lyme and lyme treatment often helps. However, when caused by an Rx, that can be a sign of ear damage. Aggressive liver support must be considered if you must continue the medicine.
The over toxicity in your body has likely gone too high for your ears to handle. Or the specific Rx (or another one) has met its limit regarding what your ears can take.
Hyperacusis is most often a sign of ear damage (or too high levels of excitatory neurotransmitters - but that is a sign of toxicity).
Or - you are getting hearing damage from another source: noise ?
If you use in-the-ear pods to listen to music, or even regular headphones, for those on certain medicines, these can cause hearing damage even at lower levels than normal.
Ear plugs need to be worn even when around a blender, vacuum, etc. and especially around lawn tools, etc. and in traffic. Loud venues should be avoided. Even talking on the cell phone should be minimized.
Now, of course, lyme and TBD are toxic, too. They can cause hearing and vestibular damage. So they have to be treated.
But some of those treatment drugs are ototoxic. To offset that, liver support can help, sometimes and to a certain degree. If meds are equal, it's always best to choose the one that is least ototoxic (so many are that sometimes there is no good choice).
And when an ototoxic med outweighs the risk (unchecked lyme), then all other ototoxic meds or ototoxic OTC products should be dropped if at all possible. That even includes aspirin as it is ototoxic.
In addition to liver support, detox methods also must be employed - but only those that support, never those that push the liver too fast or too hard.
From book: "Ototoxic Drugs" by Bauman
p. 164 - Rifampin is on the ototoxic list
I'm too tired to check others now but do recall that Flaygl can be ototoxic. You can check a partial list but I also urge everyone to get the book mentioned. It is full of good advice far too detailed to post here. Every family should have this.
Not in the thread below, as I've been needing to write this up but I just got a news letter the other day that suggests vinpocetine has protective effects against an ototoxic drug in a test. I'll see if I can extract the details and post it later. In the meantime, you might want to add that supplement to your liver support.
For now, you can do a search at Google and at PubMed:
Hyperacusis (Sound Sensitivity) and Lyme Disease -
[ 10-22-2010, 12:54 PM: Message edited by: Keebler ]
Posts: 48021 | From Tree House | Registered: Jul 2007
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bcb1200
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 25745
posted
Well...Rifampin affects the liver, so perhaps that is the cause. Either that or the Rifampin is hitting Bart and the dieoff is causing a buildup.
I'll up my Milk Thistle and keep and eye on it. The only reason why I'm not as concerned as you is I had this early early on as one of my main symptoms which went away a few weeks into treatment. In the last 2 weeks since starting Rifampin I have revisited almost every original symptoms I had...this is the latest. All of the others subsided after a few days. If this is still here a week from know I'll know.
Plus I just had my CBC done today with full metabolic panel. Will see what it says about how my liver is doing.
Thanks Keebler...you are always looking out for me!
-------------------- Bite date ? 2/10 symptoms began 5/10 dx'd, after 3 months numerous test and doctors
IgM Igenex +/CDC + + 23/25, 30, 31, 34, 41, 83/93
Currently on:
Currently at around 95% +/- most days. Posts: 3134 | From Massachusetts | Registered: May 2010
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posted
bcb, I have on several occasions seen posts here and elsewhere that describe "peeling the onion". This is a reference to peeling back layers until all one's symptoms are experienced in reverse.
I know, it sounds pretty crazy, but I'm hoping its true because 2.5 years into treatment, I'm now experiencing my very first original symptoms again.
Posts: 152 | From West Palm Bech, FL | Registered: May 2008
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bcb1200
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 25745
posted
Thanks...me too. Boy...I hope my vertigo / dizziness / anxiety doesn't come back. That is something I do not miss.
The stuffy ears and hyperacusis is just plain annoying.
-------------------- Bite date ? 2/10 symptoms began 5/10 dx'd, after 3 months numerous test and doctors
IgM Igenex +/CDC + + 23/25, 30, 31, 34, 41, 83/93
Currently on:
Currently at around 95% +/- most days. Posts: 3134 | From Massachusetts | Registered: May 2010
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bcb1200
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 25745
posted
I should also mention I started my weight / exercise routine this week,so maybe its a herx of sorts. Yesterday Am was fine. Hit the weights at lunch. Afternoon / evening...ears were bothersome.
-------------------- Bite date ? 2/10 symptoms began 5/10 dx'd, after 3 months numerous test and doctors
IgM Igenex +/CDC + + 23/25, 30, 31, 34, 41, 83/93
Currently on:
Currently at around 95% +/- most days. Posts: 3134 | From Massachusetts | Registered: May 2010
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Haley
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 22008
posted
If I started to have problems with ears on day 18 I would assume it is the medicine that is causing it.
This is just my own personal experience now that I have been at this for about a year and 1/2.
If I cut back the ear problems subside. I had this when I increased Zith, Rifampin and Flagyl. I think that my body is able to tell me now when I have too much medicine in my system.
Milk thistle increases bile. I don't know if this would stop the ear problems.
Posts: 2232 | From USA | Registered: Aug 2009
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Keebler
Honored Contributor (25K+ posts)
Member # 12673
posted
- When total body toxicity is high, ears can be damaged, sometimes permanently.
Milk thistle provides key nourishment to the liver and that helps the liver to work better, to decrease the total body toxicity. And that may help the ears.
It may not be enough though, depending all all the variables involved (particular Rx, other Rx, other OTC, toxicity of infections, environmental factors, overall health of liver and kidneys, self-care with diet and with ear protection when around noise, past noise exposure, etc.).
Past noise exposures can take a stressful time to "collect for past damages" - so to speak. And then permanent damage can occur - but partly as damage from the past finally hit its last straw.
As important as milk thistle (or other liver support supplements or gentle "detox" supplements or activities - stressing the word gentle) -- well, they are vital but they are not magic. Liver support (or detox) cannot always protect us in all ways or to the degree needed. So we have to be as proactive as possible with all the ways to save our ears. -
Posts: 48021 | From Tree House | Registered: Jul 2007
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bcb1200
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 25745
posted
I'm going to give it a week to see if it clears. Everything else has.
When I started Rifampin it was like I was "restarting" my lyme. Had many original symptoms now gone. Hope the ears clear too.
It could also be a common cold as I have some post nasal drip yesterday / today.
Of course I'm just about to broard a 14 hour flight to asia so we'll see how I do. They were fine getting to the west coast this am. Stuffy pn right side but fine.
Will ask my LLMD on Monday.
-------------------- Bite date ? 2/10 symptoms began 5/10 dx'd, after 3 months numerous test and doctors
IgM Igenex +/CDC + + 23/25, 30, 31, 34, 41, 83/93
Currently on:
Currently at around 95% +/- most days. Posts: 3134 | From Massachusetts | Registered: May 2010
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bcb1200
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 25745
posted
Here is an article I found on retracing symptoms
posted
I notice I seem to be retracing through symptoms too. The good news is that I've seen some symptoms go away, or get so mild I can't hardly tell they are there.
Posts: 256 | From Texas | Registered: Jun 2010
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Symptoms seem to be clearing much quicker than before though.
Posts: 233 | From Hudson Valley | Registered: Jun 2010
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bcb1200
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 25745
posted
So..just an update for everyone.
Hyperacusis is gone. Right ear is clear and not stuffy. Today left is a bit stuffy, but I am no longer worried. It is either a herx or due to the small cold I'm getting over.
-------------------- Bite date ? 2/10 symptoms began 5/10 dx'd, after 3 months numerous test and doctors
IgM Igenex +/CDC + + 23/25, 30, 31, 34, 41, 83/93
Currently on:
Currently at around 95% +/- most days. Posts: 3134 | From Massachusetts | Registered: May 2010
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