posted
I'm going to offer this one up .. just for conversation sake:
It didn't do anything, and you didn't need it in the first place.
Posts: 339 | From Outer Space | Registered: Aug 2009
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seekhelp
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posted
I think there are lots of docs who love to push this as a money making scheme honestly.
Posts: 7545 | From The 5th Dimension - The Twilight Zone | Registered: Mar 2008
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posted
I felt SIGNIFICANTLY better after chelation!!!
Previously, before I knew I had Lyme, I went into remission for 12 YEARS after chelating!! This was after years of fibromyalgia and chronic fatigue.
-------------------- sixgoofykids.blogspot.com Posts: 13449 | From Ohio | Registered: Feb 2007
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mojo
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posted
My sister had to continue chelation after her first round and then tested OK. She had a higher load of Candida than I did and since Candida binds to mercury it can be tougher to get rid of.
What chelating agent are you using? My dr. did a DMPS push and he also had me on Chlorella (still on Chlorella)
Posts: 1761 | From USA | Registered: May 2006
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What minerals did you take while you were chelating?
My son is doing IV chelation now.
Mary
-------------------- Son, 26, Dx Lyme 4/10, Babs 8/10 Had serious arthritis, all gone. Currently on Valtrex Daughter, 26,bullseye 7/11 arthritis in knees, cured and off all meds. . Self:Lyme, bart, sxs gone, no longer treating. Posts: 496 | From Washington, DC | Registered: Jul 2010
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posted
The time I mentioned was back in 1991 and I don't remember.
When I chelated again with my LLMD, I was taking a good multiple and magnesium. Later I found out that zinc is important. When people start on KPU, it's the zinc that makes them start dumping metals.
-------------------- sixgoofykids.blogspot.com Posts: 13449 | From Ohio | Registered: Feb 2007
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TerryK
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posted
Six wrote: When people start on KPU, it's the zinc that makes them start dumping metals.
I can attest to that.
Did you have all your amalgams out first? If not, you will continue to leak heavy metals out of them.
Also, as you kill pathogens, they release heavy metals which adds to the load of heavy metals that your body needs to get rid of so you may have been adding heavy metals even as you were taking them away IF you were killing pathogens at the same time as you were chelating heavy metals.
The metals need to be pulled out of the tissues + they need to get out of the body. There can be a problem getting them out of the body which will mean that the body will tuck them away into tissues again.
Usually the chelating agent will have the ability to help escort the heavy metals out of the body but i addition (at least woth EDTA)I need a LOT of binders to get the metals out of my body because I have methylation issues + I'm allergic to the metals and my body does not respond normally.
It takes someone who really knows what they are doing to safely get heavy metals out of the system.
3030club wrote: It didn't do anything, and you didn't need it in the first place.
When you test for heavy metals, you typically take a chelating agent to pull metals out of the tissues. If you tested high with that test both times, then you have heavy metals in your tissues and you still need to get rid of them.
What other toxins were you tested for that tested the same and how were they tested? Were you doing something to get rid of these other toxins too?
GIGI is the heavy metal expert so hopefully she will come by and give her expertise on the subject.
Terry I'm not a doctor
Posts: 6286 | From Oregon | Registered: Jan 2006
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Tammy N.
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posted
Echoing some of the things above.
I would look into safe amalgam removal, if needed. And KPU (this really screams out to me.) I am about to go down these paths myself.
Hope you find the answers that are right for you.
Good luck!! Tammy
Posts: 2238 | From East Coast | Registered: Jul 2010
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posted
Honestly, I have to dig out the file to tell exactly what agent we have been using.
Actually the chelation was for my wife who is very sick, and even with the best llmd available for treatment, she continues to go down drastically. I do have to say that, since she is on IV rocephin about a month ago, for the first time in a long time I have seen some improvement on her mental side. But physically she continues to slide downward.
Yes, she has the test with high of many heavy metals - mercury, lead, and the list is about 20 of them. Some of them are so high that her llmd thinks she would have to be exposed in a manufacturing accident, but she has never worked in any such factory in her life, though the family did grow up within 1000 feet from Hilton Davis' 40-acre-chemical-dump-ground for something like 13 years. Soon after the family moved away, her mother came down the MS symptoms, and she eventually was diagnosed and treated for MS and died a vegetable for the last 7 years of her life.
She did take some zinc but it was quite a low dose, something like 50mg. I know Dr. K talked about high zinc intake but she has never got treatment from Dr. K. She is seeing a llmd out of east coast in NY.
Any further thought will be great...
Posts: 822 | From midwest | Registered: Apr 2009
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posted
Oh yes, she does take chlorella, chelet, MedCaps, magnesium...
She does not have amalgam but she does have a metal bridge. I have to call her dentist to find out the specifics of that metal bridge (Maryland bridge - anyone knows about that?). I know her dentist does not believe in the interference of that bridge with any of her health issues, but I will find out if she can tell what specific mental they use for the bridge...
Posts: 822 | From midwest | Registered: Apr 2009
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TF
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 14183
posted
wtl, so sorry to see this post--that the chelation did not help.
If her metal levels tested that high, it makes sense to me that she will need longer treatment than most. Metals are VERY difficult to remove from the body, from what I understand.
I will lift her up in prayer specifically for the metal levels in her body. Dear Lord, help her!
Posts: 9931 | From Maryland | Registered: Dec 2007
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GiGi
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posted
From my own experience and that of my husband who is at this very moment going through all of this:
If you are not effectively getting rid of allergies to eliminate them, no matter how much CORE or Zinc plus B6 replacements you take, you cannot get rid of any metals or chemicals. If you attempt KPU without eliminating the allergies toward the substances, i.e. toxic metals and chemicals you must unload to get well, it will cause crashes that are very uncomfortable and still not be able to clear your system of these devils.
When the immune system is no longer able to recognize the toxins for what they are, it cannot deal with them, but simply store them away wherever it finds a convenient spot, in whatever body compartment. You may actually be putting it back into places you really do not want them, the central nervous system causing major neurological symptoms.
Doing KPU while still having major dysregulations, aka allergic reactions, causes a lot of crashing if the body is not alert to the toxins that are mobilized.
You will be deficient of the needed minerals no matter how much you take to supplement because the body needs the good minerals to keep up with the toxic metals/minerals. There seems to never be enough, and so we accumulate more and more toxin. There comes a point where the body will have accumulated enough toxins, when it can no longer deal with the burden. Chronic Lyme Disease is one of them.
Our way of life is such that we cannot avoid the exposure. The toxic substances are in the food chain and will probably remain there until we change our way of life.
Pretty soon we will have nothing but genetically engineered foods. http://www.garynull.com/s510 Please read this and pass it around.
I started to do AI when I realized how much toxins, mainly toxic heavy metals, mercury, nickel, lead, and dental carcinogens still remained in my body, even though I was very well and long over Lyme Disease. Although I had a very special doctor (Dr.K.), yet he did not know about the existence of Allergie Immun. He is on the AI therapy himself now and celebrates his own success with AI.
Challenging the immune system with metal (DMSA, DMPS, etc. etc. )mobilizers is absurd if the immune system does no longer know how, or remember how to deal with the toxins. Per Dr.K. and others, there is no such thing as chelators as they are often referred to. There are only metal mobilizers, and the rest is up to the doctor and the patient to do the right thing to help the metals move out of the body all the way. It takes not only one agent, but several. Reabsorption and redistribution is not a solution and only adds more stress to organs and different problems and continued misery.
I will state here once more: you cannot get rid of the majority of toxic metals, chemicals, food allergies unless the DNA is corrected. Allergie Immun is the only therapy that I have found in 12 years that will do it permanently. I corrected all mine that were quite minor, with no food allergies, and I am still "dumping" metals every day; a short pause, and more are found.
I wasted years by not having done AI. Although I had been told by Dr. K. and as Dr. Daunderer (recent post) : if allergic, the body cannot release it. If allergic to incoming nutrients, the body is not able to absorb them. You can take a bath in minerals and it won't absorb or help your metals out if the body doesn't know any longer what it is supposed to do with it.
Some people during metal detox are also releasing all the other occupants that come with Lyme: viruses, pesticides, insecticides, parasites and remaining neurotoxins stored by Lyme and Co. itself feeling as if they had Lyme all over again. I call it letting go of stored neurotoxins and could never establish any relapse whatsoever. Yet what we feel most is the effect of remaining neurotoxins. Fungi in the brain or elsewhere can feel as bad as Lyme. Metals can give you a major headache and to this day I cannot distinguish one neurotoxin from the next. They all feel similarly nasty.
A gradual approach is needed, matched to the patient's tolerance level. My husband is dumping metals and ddt right now and during energetic testing after a long period of fungal toxins being released, now shows viral toxins and even tests for XMRV. All that was in hiding until the metals are finally finding their way out. He is long from done and I hope and pray that his body holds out and his organs cooperate because he is older than most of you.
Be extremely careful and learn all you can before you attempt detox medicines. But most of all, make sure you eliminate all dysregulations/allergies, the ones you are aware of and the many that you are not aware of. This puts the body on notice that it now has to deal with the toxins.
As long as we hold toxic metals in our body, it will create fungi. Fungi create their own neurotoxins 24/7 -- they also live and die. More toxins. You can starve yourself to death by staying on a certain diet, your body will go right on creating more fungi/candidas because it is his sure-fire-way of protecting itself and to survive the lethal mercury and other toxins. But you will have to deal with the ongoing production of neurotoxins by fungi, etc.
Mercury is incredibly toxic and when your body has enough of it, it will eventually cause to be very ill. Mozart and Beethoven both died from mercury toxicity -- they were treated with mercury for syphilis.
I also learned that most people from this board who have done or are doing the AI therapy - with nearly 0 exception were all allergic to all fungi, mucor, penicilin, etc. A majority has a blocked enzyme production. The list of blockages is long. I always wonder - how can anybody ever get well. I think that DNA dysregulations/allergies are the major reason. The good thing is that Allergie Immun deals with them quite successfully.
Take care.
Posts: 9834 | From Washington State | Registered: Oct 2000
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canefan17
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posted
I have half a mind to say chelating is overrated.
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GiGi
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posted
"I have half a mind to say chelating is overrated." -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Please explain, Canefan.
Posts: 9834 | From Washington State | Registered: Oct 2000
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posted
50 mg elemental zinc is not a low dose. I take Depyrrol and it only has 28 mg elemental zinc. It's confusing because the bottle says 210 mg of the form of zinc it has, which is only 28 mg elemental.
I have also used homeopathics for heavy metals. Metox (and Chemtox for meds) seem to work pretty well. I've used them with my photons, but they are intended to be used orally.
-------------------- sixgoofykids.blogspot.com Posts: 13449 | From Ohio | Registered: Feb 2007
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posted
Thank you, GiGi. I will forward this information about allergies and immunity to her doctor and see if there is anything that will result in the next phase.
In the mean time, what do you suggest her to do? Perhaps some kind of allergy treatment? How to go by correcting DNA?
You might have explained it clearly, but I am confused...
six - How can I find out the elementary zinc content from the bottle? I think all it says in lable is 50mg of zinc.
Posts: 822 | From midwest | Registered: Apr 2009
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posted
Oh, GiGi, I now see the link for Allergies Immune site. I will read through it. Thanks again.
Posts: 822 | From midwest | Registered: Apr 2009
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posted
That is the elemental zinc content. My bottle has it labeled differently because I ordered it from Europe.
-------------------- sixgoofykids.blogspot.com Posts: 13449 | From Ohio | Registered: Feb 2007
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canefan17
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posted
GiGi,
When people start messing with moving heavy metals around in the body they tip-toe a fine line.
A good diet, normal bowel movements, supplements like Apple Pectin, chlorella, minerals, etc are effective.
But you start talking about DMSA, EDTA, DMPS... and you start messin with fire.
But maybe I'm wrong. I've just read A LOT of stories from people who say they regret ever getting into chelating.
It's an art, not a science. And you run the risk of depositing metals in the brain.
So unless it's life threatening... imo I'd steer clear. Treat Lyme and Co and let the body deal with metals on its time.
Posts: 5394 | From Houston, Tx | Registered: Aug 2009
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posted
canefan - What happens with those few whose bodies don't take care of the issue by their own?
My wife has done all the things you have mentioned - good diet, regular schedule for all thigns possible, and supplements of all good theory...Only she continues to suffer from not improving, even with heavy handed treatment for Lyme and co-infections...
But I do have concern wiht moving the metals around and end up depositing them in the brain.
Posts: 822 | From midwest | Registered: Apr 2009
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canefan17
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posted
wtl,
I'm not convinced that heavy metals are holding your wife back from getting better.
But again that's just my opinion.
You say heavy-handed treatment for Lyme and Co's.... you'll have to expand.
For how long? What co-infections? Has she treated for viruses?
Posts: 5394 | From Houston, Tx | Registered: Aug 2009
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GiGi
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Member # 259
posted
Canefan, when you become permanently symptom-free, you do not have to worry about Heavy Metal toxicity. Until that happens, it is a good idea to keep it in mind.
Some people with permanent metal toxicity have no choice but to seek the best they can find to detox successfully. It may take days, months, but more likely quite a bit longer. When the body can no longer regulate the metals, there is no choice left, if one wishes to have a decent life because things will go from bad to worse.
Once a poor soul is living the misery, with MS, ALS, Parkinsons, FM, CFS, pain, etc. etc., your comments/opinion are out of place and stale.
Yes, it is not easy to accomplish, but it has been done successfully many times and saved many. I am one of them.
Take care.
Posts: 9834 | From Washington State | Registered: Oct 2000
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canefan17
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GiGi,
I don't think my comments are out of place or "stale" at all.
And in fact I even said... " unless it's life threatening... imo I'd steer clear."
Posts: 5394 | From Houston, Tx | Registered: Aug 2009
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sammy
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posted
Acupuncture should also help restore the body's ability to recognize and respond appropriately to allergens, infections, stress and such. It might be something to look into.
Not sure if it would directly help eliminate the metals and toxins but it could enable the body to take care of problems more easily. This is something that I am considering right now, not for metals specifically but for general support and wellness.
Posts: 5237 | From here | Registered: Nov 2007
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posted
canefan - She has been tested positive for Lyme, bartonella, RMSF, Cpn, and probably something else that I don't remember at the moment so I am not doubting she has infections. What I don;t know is if these infections are actually the culprit to her symptoms which had prompted some of her doctors to look into ALS, MS, and Huntington's Disease, and Alzheimer's. Ironically all of them were ruled out (well, no one says any definite thing about Alzheimer's).
She has been under Lyme treatment for all infections including babesia since April 2009. And have recently treated with IV rocephin, and several high dose of oral antibiotics (rifampin, azithromycin, minocycline, plaquenil).
So on one hand, she seems to be definitely have Lyme issue, and yet, on the other hand, she does not respond...
Posts: 822 | From midwest | Registered: Apr 2009
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posted
And she has just finished 12 or 13 sessions of IV glutathione with little improvement on all front (I didn't remember the actual agent for the IV chelation until six mentioned it in another thread). And she takes something like several hundred dollars per month supplement in the past several months now.
Posts: 822 | From midwest | Registered: Apr 2009
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posted
sammy - she has done some acupuncture before her Lyme treatment so maybe it is time to look into it again.
Posts: 822 | From midwest | Registered: Apr 2009
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posted
I can only second Canefan. I had troubling lyme symptoms prior to a minor oral DMSA chelation round. It may have just been a coincidence, but after one round my neurological symptoms significantly worsened and have yet to fully recover. I would not mess with chelation unless it is perceived to be the only way out - we all know that mercury is powerfully immunosuppressive. In many circumstances, it may be best to not perform chelation if you have lyme because it will only make your immune system response significantly weaker.
-------------------- long road since 2010 abx got me over the hump diet, detox, and herbs have got me to heal Posts: 174 | From CT | Registered: Jan 2010
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seekhelp
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posted
Chelation sounds acceptable only if you got a Dr. K on your side who is an expert. Everyone else seems light years behind him in regards to expertise.
Posts: 7545 | From The 5th Dimension - The Twilight Zone | Registered: Mar 2008
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posted
Boy, that sounds discouraging.
Posts: 822 | From midwest | Registered: Apr 2009
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sparkle7
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posted
If I recall correctly - IV glutathione - is not a chelator... It's an antioxidant. I wouldn't expect it to chelate heavy metals.
Some people doubt that it really helps. You may want to do a search on google for the pros & cons.
Posts: 7772 | From Northeast, again... | Registered: Oct 2006
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canefan17
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posted
I take a product called Liver Defend and it has NAC and ALA. I've been told it helps increase glutathione in the body which is necessary to open certain detox pathways.
I also take the herb sarsaparilla which has documentation that it can bind mercury and lead.
Posts: 5394 | From Houston, Tx | Registered: Aug 2009
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Yes, she is also taking NAC and ALA, among others. None has much effect on her as far as I can tell.
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