posted
This question is for people who have had very successful outcomes using herbs and supplements. How would you prioritize the products you would buy?
Herbs and supplements can become quite expensive quite quickly. Even spending $100 per month can be a stretch for some of us.
For simplicity's sake, let's start with a monthly budget of $100 treating only clinically diagnosed CLD with no test results.
So my question is, if you had a budget of $100, or $200, or $300 how would you prioritize your purchase of herbs/supplements?
What products would you buy first and which would you add as your budget grew? Please include approximate prices?
Please specify what use(s)the product has, i.e, what it treats. [/b]
I will make a list under each poster's suggestions, User #1 (suggestions, User #2 (Sugestions) and etc. etc.
This could be an interesting and informative exercise for many of us -- to hear from those who have had successful outcomes with herbs/supplements and the how and why of their experience.
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[ 03-08-2011, 12:45 PM: Message edited by: rajon ]
Posts: 81 | From Rhode Island | Registered: Nov 2010
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Tincup
Honored Contributor (10K+ posts)
Member # 5829
posted
You might want to specify what conditions the herbs would be used for so folks can address this question if they want to.
Also... you can do a search here and read about the successes with various herbs if you'd like.
What you are asking is a lot of figuring and effort for folks with limited energy, especially for a hypothetical situation.
posted
I am only six months into my treatment, but have had very positive response from the Bar1 by Healthy Directions for Bartonella. I know they make other herbal blends for lyme as well and other coinfections.
The Bar1 is expensive, costs about $40 per bottle. But it has really helped me a lot. No more fingers curled up into the palm of my hand, no more space-outs (or not as frequent or as bad) and no more left foot dragging, facial stiffnes improved a lot, etc. The fingers do still fall asleep but it's been 6 months so I can't expect full recovery, of course! I think that's pretty good for 6 months, wiht very few herx's along the way. Even those were bearable, not even half as bad as I have had on the abx
We all respond to different things so I have to qualify that. For me, this has been the right product.
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chiquita incognita
Unregistered
posted
PS I also think activated charcoal caps are important to help with toxin neutralizing, and epsom salt baths have helped me a lot.
I add milk thistle seeds to this tea. You can buy the herbs in bulk inexpensively at the healthfood store.
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bcb1200
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 25745
posted
I've been treating with antibiotics and also take a lot of supplements. The best ones being GSE and Oil of Oregano. I take 2 capsules of each daily. I think they have helped me.
-------------------- Bite date ? 2/10 symptoms began 5/10 dx'd, after 3 months numerous test and doctors
IgM Igenex +/CDC + + 23/25, 30, 31, 34, 41, 83/93
Currently on:
Currently at around 95% +/- most days. Posts: 3139 | From Massachusetts | Registered: May 2010
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gwb
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 7273
posted
I would not really classify the protocol I'm on as a "herbal" protocol, however, it does indeed involve herbs among other things. I got better on the Jernigan protocol. I'm not 100%, but still making good progress.
There's a thread here that I started in January 2010 (I think), titled "Hansa Center--Update".
You can buy the remedies from jernigannutraceuticals.com/ . Dr. J wrote the book, "Beating Lyme Disease" which has the full protocol in it. You can get his book at his website.
By the way, to answer your question about cost. A 4oz remedy (bottle) is $48.00. You usually need to take three-four remedies together which will last you a month and a half or so.
The big thing with this protocol is detox, detox and more detox. Just finished my detox bath and it felt great! I feel invigorated, energized and relaxed.
"You might want to specify what conditions the herbs would be used for so folks can address this question if they want to."
I did this, I laid it out in my post.
rajon said:
"For simplicity's sake, let's start with a monthly budget of $100 treating only clinically diagnosed CLD with no test results."
But people should feel free to lay out their own parameters as long as we know what they are treating.
-- --
This is strictly voluntary, and I don't expect anyone to make sacrifice's in order to answer.
The fact that I asked people who have had good outcomes means that I am actually asking the more healthy among us to answer.
But thanks for caring enough to respond, tincup, your contribution is noted.
-- --
Chiquita incognita, thanks for the "Bar1" referral and for noting your experience with it over six months. The Activated Charcoal Caps and the detox tea sound like cost effective treatments, especially buying the herbs in bulk.
I added that link to my favorites for reviewing later. That is one way this discussion can help. I've been gathering so much information I can't possibly digest it all momentarily but, I save it for future reference and research.
bcb1200 says GSE and Oil of Oregano along with the antibiotics. And he's functioning at 95% most days.
User #1 (CI)
Build up immmune system 1st. Detox wiwth Milk thistle (Paridise brand - $16.75) Activated Charcoal Caps Epsom salt baths Detox tea w/milk thistle added Bar 1 (Healthy Directions) Herbal abx
User #2 (bcb1200)
GSE and Oil of Oregano (w/antibiotics)
User #3 (gwb)
Jernigan protocol (from Beating Lyme Disease, book) 3 or 4 remedies X $48, per six week course. Detox, detox, detox.
Hey, looks like we got us a list going. Thanks for your contributions.
[ 03-08-2011, 06:42 PM: Message edited by: rajon ]
Posts: 81 | From Rhode Island | Registered: Nov 2010
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momindeep
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 7618
posted
Number one thing, Spiro from Raintree Nutritionals.
Posts: 1512 | From Glenwood City WI | Registered: Jul 2005
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posted
This is a good list so far, but there must be other successful herb/supp users who wish to put in their two cents worth on what supplements worked for them and would be high on their list if they were forced to adhere to a strict financial budget as suggested in the original post.
So far we have an antibacterial against Bartonella, we have detox agents, one doctor's protocol . . . let's build this list up further.
User #1 (CI)
Build up immmune system 1st. Detox wiwth Milk thistle (Paridise brand - $16.75) Activated Charcoal Caps Epsom salt baths Detox tea w/milk thistle added Bar 1 (Healthy Directions) Herbal abx
User #2 (bcb1200)
GSE and Oil of Oregano (w/antibiotics)
User #3 (gwb)
Jernigan protocol (from Beating Lyme Disease, book) 3 or 4 remedies X $48, per six week course. Detox, detox, detox.
User #4 (momindeep)
Spiro (from Raintree Pharm)
[ 03-08-2011, 06:43 PM: Message edited by: rajon ]
Posts: 81 | From Rhode Island | Registered: Nov 2010
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chiquita incognita
Unregistered
posted
Hello Friend I would not recommend doing all the lyme-killing herbs all at once. No way. It could be too much for you.
Instead, I would suggest doing one at a time, alongside a really good detox protocol.
I think a strong milk thistle product would be really important. The tea, you would need to drink about 3 cups every day and given how intense lyme die-off can be, it still may not be enough by itself.
I highly recommend the Paradise Herbs brand of milk thislte (at www.iherb.com at discount). THis has no binders, fillers, etc and is highly concentrated, no alchohol or glycerin, etc. It's the herb which was originally extracted in alchohol, is sprayed in a fine mist down a lit-up tube to evaporate the alchohol and leave only concentrated herbal constiutents behind. And they have really high-quality herbs to begin with. Excellent!
I would do this alongside the charcoal caps and tea. I know the list grows and gets expensive, but a really good detox protocol is truly important. The beauty about milk thistle is that it aids the generation of new liver cells and also protects the liver from toxin uptake, so it really protects you during detox. It also has been shown to protect the nervous system from toxins.
See these pubmed studies here to confirm milk thistle's constituents' ability to protect the nervous system from toxicity (important in lyme therapy): http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20868716
NOTE: I also think that we may make a mistake in not building up the body first prior to starting a lyme-killing regimen. Think of how much better equipped the body would be to deal with herx's if we built up detox and immunity in the body first.
The above information has not been evaluated by the FDA and does not diagnose, cure or prevent any disease. This is for your educational purposes only. Drugs and herbs may interact, talk to your doctor.
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But remember (and I hope people read the original post) that this is not a list of what herbs people should use and in what sequence.
The list I'm compling in this thread is a list of what products the people responding would buy first if they had various budgets for herbs/supplements.
[ 03-08-2011, 06:44 PM: Message edited by: rajon ]
Posts: 81 | From Rhode Island | Registered: Nov 2010
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MichaelTampa
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 24868
posted
Interesting question, really tough to prioritize so many useful things. Let's see:
Enula (NutraMedix) good for babesia and worms/parasites
Gamma Rizole for 1-2 months then Zeta Rizole for 1-2 months good for worms/parasites
Avoiding onions/garlic/mustard during treatment of parasites very helpful, and nothing to buy for that (except alternative food)
With limited budget, I'd go about 3 months like that just working on parasites, then add in Byron White formulas (A-L, A-Bart, and/or A-Bab, depending on what coinfections).
For detox, chlorella is good for many, but what's cheapest--charcoal (but then need more probiotics)? Two not-way-expensive homeopathic remedies are Radinex and Sy-Detox, but maybe still need a binder?
As affordable, probiotics, vitamin B, C, magnesium, calcium, zinc, selenium, somewhat in that order.
Possibly forgot something important, but there's some ideas anyway.
Posts: 1927 | From se usa | Registered: Mar 2010
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Paul
Posts: 925 | From Connecticut | Registered: Aug 2010
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sparkle7
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 10397
posted
It's important to know what your symptoms are. CLD is sort of general. Usually, there are co-infections & viruses, mycoplasmas, toxins, mold exposure, etc. It's kind of like peeling an onion.
I think it's popular now to do a parasite cleanse, first. I think it's a good idea.
Definitely good to have a detox strategy. I like Dr. Schulze's Intestinal Cleanse #2 product. It's got psylium, clay, charcoal & some herbs.
Drink plenty of water or green tea. I like green tea iced when it gets hot. Ginger or mint tea is good for nausea.
I don't know if it's necessary to go with an expensive herbal tincture blend. Some herbalists advocate to use the whole herb as a tea. It can get pretty complicated picking & choosing herbs, though.
I think people have different affinities for different herbs. Lyme & the co-infections are systemic & seem to effect people & organs differently. What may help one person, may not help you.
I have learned to dowse my supplements. I think it has some rationale to it. Some people do energetic testing. I like dowsing since I can do it myself, at home for free.
Liver support is important. I use NAC (a supplement) for that.
There is something to be said about thaking one or two herbs at a time rather than a whole bunch of stuff. You can see which herb effects what. Some blends create a synergy, though.
Some of the best things for me have been the least expensive. The Byron White formulas seem good but I don't know why they are so expensive & you have to buy them through a practitioner.
Good luck!
Posts: 7772 | From Northeast, again... | Registered: Oct 2006
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posted
The list grows and priorities are revealed and warnings should be taken to heart.
Thanks to all who are participating -- it is quite informative for many of us I am sure.
Remember, this is only a list of how people using herbs would prioritize the buying of them within a budget, it is not a treatment plan.
The list so far
User #1 (CI)
Build up immune system 1st. Detox with Milk thistle (Paradise brand - $16.75) Activated Charcoal Caps Epsom salt baths Detox tea w/milk thistle added Bar 1 (Healthy Directions) Herbal abx
User #2 (bcb1200)
GSE and Oil of Oregano (w/antibiotics)
User #3 (gwb)
Jernigan protocol (from Beating Lyme Disease, book) 3 or 4 remedies X $48, per six week course. Detox, detox, detox.
User #4 (mid)
Spiro (from Raintree Pharm)
User #5 (MT)
Gamma Rizole for 1-2 months then Zeta Rizole for 1-2 months good for worms/parasites, avoid onions/garlic/mustard during treatment of parasites -- very helpful.
After 3 months add in BWF, A-L, A-Bart, or A-Bab, depending on co-infections. Detox? For detox, chlorella is good for many, but what's cheapest--charcoal (but then need more probiotics)? Two not-way-expensive homeopathic remedies are Radinex and Sy-Detox, but maybe still need a binder?
As affordable, probiotics, vitamin B, C, magnesium, calcium, zinc, selenium, somewhat in that order.
User #6 (PM)
A-Babs -- $90, one or two month supply.
User #6 (sp-7)
Detox 1st. I like Dr. Schulze's Intestinal Cleanse #2 product. It's got psylium, clay, charcoal & some herbs. I have learned to dowse my supplements. I think it has some rationale to it. Some people do energetic testing. I like dowsing since I can do it myself, at home for free. Liver support is important. I use NAC (a supplement) for that.
There is something to be said about taking one or two herbs at a time rather than a whole bunch of stuff. You can see which herb effects what. Some blends create a synergy, though.
Great stuff, learning from the experience of others.
To summarize so far, I think it is safe to say that many experienced supplement users think it is important to 1) boost the immune system, and 2) detox for parasites before moving into aggressive treatment of CLD symptoms.
Do some of the BWFs help in detox and immune boosting at the same time as treating the symptoms -- I wonder?
More details, please, the devil is in the details, and keep those cards and letters coming in. Dean Martin said that (I saw it on the DVD.). (;>)
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