My 6 year old was started on Rifampin last night. He continues to also take Biaxin. This morning both his hands have red splotches on his finger tips and palms.
Has anyone had this reaction? Is it a side effect/allergic reaction or a herx? Otherwise he is acting fine, maybe a little tired but he is really congested from allergies.
Thanks for any help, the llmd is not available until Monday.
Posts: 34 | From California | Registered: Mar 2011
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posted
My guess would be Rocky Mountain Spotted Fever -- it is one of the very few infections which cause a rash on the palms of the hands and soles of the feet.
Rifampin is used with doxy to treat RMSF if doxy alone does not work.
Bea Seibert
Posts: 7306 | From Martinsville,VA,USA | Registered: Oct 2004
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I am not sure because with RMSF the spots are small petcehial red dots, I think, and my son has splotchy, larger red spots. Is that still like a RMSF rash? But he has had dotted line rashes that were petechial spots lined up in a row in the past couple months that come and go?
Thanks again... just trying to see if we can figure out what this reaction means as he has not yet responded to lyme treatment.
Posts: 34 | From California | Registered: Mar 2011
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I had the same type of rash with my second dose of rifampin but then I also got very very sick from it. I had to stop it right away since it was one of hte side effects.
I also could not sleep at all (not for a minute) and had twitching and body shaking with heart racing and high bp...it seemed to happen worse even after I stopped after 2nd dose. It lasted about 3 weeks on me with the fist week the worst.
I would let the Llmd know before giving it to him again! I had to stop all my abx to get over it for a week. Please just chekc on it with his doc. I dont want him feeling like I did from rifampin.
Hope he gets well quick Ann
-------------------- Diagnosed with chronic neuro lyme 12/10 after 30 years of vertigo.2 tick bites in 3 yrs from upstate NY. Was on omincef for nine mths..zith and rifampin stopped.Remission~ All the pain and symptoms are back and I am not treating now with biaxin. Posts: 788 | From New york..queens | Registered: Nov 2010
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Rifampin side effects: Diarrhea; dizziness; drowsiness; gas; headache; heartburn; menstrual changes; mild upset stomach or cramps.
Seek medical attention right away if any of these SEVERE side effects occur when using Rifampin: Severe allergic reactions (rash; hives; itching; difficulty breathing; tightness in the chest; swelling of the mouth, face, lips, or tongue); bloody or dark urine; change in the amount of urine produced; confusion; dark, tarry, or bloody stools; fever, chills, or sore throat; joint pain or swelling; muscle pain or weakness; nausea; pain, swelling, or redness at the injection site; red, swollen, blistered, or peeling skin; severe diarrhea, stomach pain, or cramps; shortness of breath; swelling of the arms, face, or legs; symptoms of liver problems (eg, dark urine, loss of appetite, pale stools, yellowing of the eyes or skin); unusual bruising or bleeding; unusual tiredness or weakness; vision changes; vomiting.
-------------------- Diagnosed with chronic neuro lyme 12/10 after 30 years of vertigo.2 tick bites in 3 yrs from upstate NY. Was on omincef for nine mths..zith and rifampin stopped.Remission~ All the pain and symptoms are back and I am not treating now with biaxin. Posts: 788 | From New york..queens | Registered: Nov 2010
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Do you mean that you had a rash on your fingertips and palms of red splotches? I just find the location of the spots seemingly specific and wondered if that was also where your rash was?
I agree with you, my husband immediately said no more doses until talking to the llmd... rifampin doesn't seem like a drug you want to mess with, especially in a 6 year old!
Thanks again
Posts: 34 | From California | Registered: Mar 2011
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posted
Yes, I had the blotches same spot. Very noticeable on the palms of my hands. I couldnt figure out what it was. My hands were feeling numb and tingly too, but that is hard to ask a child.
It is a very hard drug and many on here told em the same while I was going through the weeks of getting it out of my system. I am really surprised they put such a young child on it?
I am sorry you baby is sick with this horrible disease. There are many other abx they can try beside rifampin. Much love and Happy moms day!!
-------------------- Diagnosed with chronic neuro lyme 12/10 after 30 years of vertigo.2 tick bites in 3 yrs from upstate NY. Was on omincef for nine mths..zith and rifampin stopped.Remission~ All the pain and symptoms are back and I am not treating now with biaxin. Posts: 788 | From New york..queens | Registered: Nov 2010
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posted
Thanks for sharing all that information. My son wss started on Rifampin to treat Bartonella. Were you given it for Lyme or a co-infection? I guess we'll have to try something else in combination with the Biaxin. Thanks again for your help!
Posts: 34 | From California | Registered: Mar 2011
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map1131
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 2022
posted
I thought Rifampin and Biaxin where somewhat the same abx??? Biaxin was one abx early( 6mths to year mark) into all this that got me somewhere for about a year.
Then everything changed. I don't know what changed but biaxin quit working and I started going backwards and then didn't find abx that helped but for 2-4 mths.
I was doing lots of switching to try to stay ahead of the lyme bacteria building up.
Rifampin will also go after the lyme when one is taking it for bartonella. Well I should say that was my experience just since '10.
I've seen others say the same about Rifampin.
I hope you are able to help your 6 yr old. So so sad for me to hear about children and this illness.
Combo of the two might have brought out the "strep" ???? bacteria that can cause rash and the peeling of hands and feet. I had peeling hands and feet during early illness.
I tested + for EBV which is adult mono. It wasn't adult mono....it was lyme or co's.
I'm glad you have LLMD for your young one.
Pam
-------------------- "Never, never, never, never, never give up" Winston Churchill Posts: 6495 | From Louisville, Ky | Registered: Jan 2002
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In such a young child, bartonella can be fatal. Rifampin is THE best antibiotic for bartonella, hands down, but he better be on a very low dose of the drug, because it's strong. (Though I'd imagine him being six, he should be, right?) The worst herxes occur when someone has had it untreated for a long time, like annier, or myself (I ended up in hospital a week from bartonella herxing).
I've dealt with several different types of rashes before and during treatment, with different antibiotics. I had the petechial red dots on the tops of my feet for two years. I find it funny you mentioned how they would come and go, because mine did as well! I've been on Rifampin four months and they are no longer there. I also got (temporarily) these.. stranges lines on the bottom of my feet. I wasn't in treatment during that. During the days of my bart flares I also used to get a random, itchy bump that would spring up. Usually just one, somewhere on my hand, and it would take forever to clear up. I thought it was odd, but apparently a lot of other bart sufferers experience it.
I agree that I usually hear people talk about rashes on soles of the hands and feet as being RMSF, though. I've had a relative who started to develop BLISTERS on his hands and feet that were incredibly painful, and that was an allergic reaction to the drug. But a regular rash? It sounds like a herx, and I think it's a good idea to stop the drug, and speak with your LLMD immediately. Your LLMD might get a clue from it, and want to tailor treatment for RMSF, which is more dangerous than bartonella.
Either way, make it a priority to treat all the coinfections first. They replicate faster and will do damage more quickly. Bartonella really likes to attack the heart and the brain, causing extreme anxiety and mental disturbance.
little olive
-------------------- Myalgic encephalomyelitis, 2002 | Viral onset, following Hep B vaccine Lyme since '06 | Bartonella since '08 (cured) | Mycoplasma pneumoniae since '08 IGeneX: IgM 31IND 34IND 41+ | IgG 39IND 58+ 41+++ IgG deficiencies and MTHFR 677TT mutations Posts: 512 | From USA | Registered: Sep 2010
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quote:Originally posted by map1131: Rifampin will also go after the lyme when one is taking it for bartonella. Well I should say that was my experience just since '10.
I've seen others say the same about Rifampin.
Yes it treats the cyst form of Lyme as well Posts: 512 | From USA | Registered: Sep 2010
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My son was prescribed 150mg twice daily of Rifampin, which is a good dose since he is only 40lbs.
I will post what our llmd says but we have been trying to figure out what, if any co-infection, is present since his presentation is of having motor and vocal tics. All Igenex co-infection testing has been negative. Bartonella seemed like a likely cause due to the neuro component and that on Biaxin/Omnicef he kept having petechial rashes that would sometimes be in the form of dotted lines looking like scratches or red marks. However after a previous post comment about RMSF having a rash on the hands, we started researching and see that anaplasma/erhlichiosis tends to have rashes in children and it can be petechial or flat red rash like he had on the Rifampin. http://www.sjhsyr.org/sjhhc/hidc07/Encyclopedia/1/001381.htm
Anyway not sure what this all means but I so appreciate all the advice and feedback. Thanks!
Posts: 34 | From California | Registered: Mar 2011
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posted
if your llmd thinks it's a herx (and i'd like to think he sees these things every day?) then I would restart it...based upon the reason he's even on it, that is. again, if you're on it for suspected coinfections like bart, then it's a must. and you only herx if something is dying, so if the rash is a herx, that means tehre's something there that needs to be killed.
i've no idea what to say abotu the biopsy--that seems like a painful thing to put a 6 year old through!?
Be warned that you can't stop and restart Rifampin multople times. Skipping doses or starting/restarting will quickly lead to bacteria resitance, and the drug will then be useless because the infections will be immune to it.
Good luck in whatever you decide to do
little olive
-------------------- Myalgic encephalomyelitis, 2002 | Viral onset, following Hep B vaccine Lyme since '06 | Bartonella since '08 (cured) | Mycoplasma pneumoniae since '08 IGeneX: IgM 31IND 34IND 41+ | IgG 39IND 58+ 41+++ IgG deficiencies and MTHFR 677TT mutations Posts: 512 | From USA | Registered: Sep 2010
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