posted
I have been taking binders now for about 4 months. First Welchol, then for the last 3 months, cholestyramine(csm). Recently I started taking 4 scoops of the csm, which is a full dose per Shoemaker.
Initially, it seemed to be helping clear my head and mood was ok(I take Zoloft). Recently, I've felt a return of severe, crushing depression and brain fog, like the Zoloft was no longer working.
I do not have high cholesterol--about 160 or so before this, and wonder if I might have lowered the cholesterol to such a level that it's impacting my brain negatively. I read that low serum cholesterol can increase risk of suicide and that it can reduce serotonin receptors, which, if true, might explain why the Zoloft doesn't appear to be effective.
Now I'm at a loss to know what to do to detox. I have the 'post-Lyme syndrome' haplotype, so do not detox efficiently on my own. Sauna increases my fog.
Has anyone else experienced this? Any ideas on resolution? Perhaps just a lower dose--say one scoop a day and see how it goes?
Or a very high cholesterol diet, which might be fun?
Posts: 226 | From Princeton | Registered: Oct 2010
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Keebler
Honored Contributor (25K+ posts)
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posted
-
Q: Has anyone else experienced this?
Absolutely. In addition to Cholestyramine lowering the seizure threshold and the startle threshold, I do recall that I was just so sick and at the end of my rope when taking this.
[But as you say you are also taking Zoloft, that might be a factor, too. Zoloft, and all other antidepressants I tried also nearly took me to the edge, even a low dose. I swear I am chemically allergic to them all.
I also have the HLA gene and have trouble detoxing. Also have porphyria, so I now know WHY those kind of sedative or mood drugs clobbered me.
I just can't touch them. At all, at any dose. Hard lesson learned over the years and free of all those now for years. I've found many things that work so much better.]
Back to Cholestyramine, though.
I had a horrible time the whole couple months when taking Cholestyramine and then, tried smaller amounts but it seems that even small amounts also caused me horrible symptoms.
I just had to drop it and move to other things.
Salvia miltiorrhiza (that second word is essential, not all Salvia is the same),
Gotu Kola, Stinging Nettle, Smilax all help bind endotoxins in the gut. Guggul, too.
Spirulina can really help the liver be better able to detox.
And there are others choices, too.
A HIGH FIBER diet is good, too.
I would never take Cholestyramine again.
I know you are joking about a high cholesterol diet but, really, I think Cholestyramine might be pulling out too much cholesterol and we really do need some every day for our adrenal to work.
Grass fed beef & bison have CLA, a special kind of fat that is very important for us. Organic Ghee can be helpful, too. A little bit goes a long way.
Still, the majority of our fat is best from fish, nuts, seeds. Coconut oil, Hemp oil, avocado oil, also very good along with the other standards.
I think Cholestyramine can take out too much of all kinds of good fats. I really need those. -
Posts: 48021 | From Tree House | Registered: Jul 2007
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Keebler
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posted
- Backing up, be sure that the stuff you've been taking is totally free of aspartame or any other artificial sweetener.
Some of the "lite" versions contain additives that can really mess with the mood. Aspartame can cause horrible mood problems that can be all over the map. Details in the thread below.
Stevia is okay but then I think it's just best plain with nothing added. There is no way to make this taste good, anyway.
You probably are clear of additives but, just to be sure:
Links to many articles and books by holistic minded LL doctors of various degrees . . . . -
Posts: 48021 | From Tree House | Registered: Jul 2007
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I guess the benefit of the bile sequestrants is that they remove the bile which holds all the accumulated toxins that circulate forever in people like us.
Unfortunately, they get rid of the good stuff too.
Since it's removing toxins from the liver, perhaps the spirulina would help.
And no, I don't use the aspartame version. I use the one with sugar--which I don't like, but I can only imagine how much a compounded version would cost. Perhaps a low dose of Welchol might be a reasonable alternative.
Sue
Posts: 226 | From Princeton | Registered: Oct 2010
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Keebler
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posted
- Spirulina does not work in the same way but it can help lower porphyrins (and those, in excess, can cause terrible problems). See detail in the thread below.
Oh, Cholestyramine with sugar? That could also explain a few things as sugar is the best food for yeast and if you have candida, that can also cause so much pain and mood dysfunction.
Sugar can also cause problems with glucose levels and that affects pain and mood.
I am so sorry that your doctor did not tell you that you can get Cholestyramine without anything added from:
posted
Get your cholesterol checked before changing your diet to add more!
The sugar may be the problem. I hated CSM. I'll never take it again either.
PS .. call your doctor
-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96222 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
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Keebler
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posted
- Wondering if you are on a gluten-free diet? If not, that might really help mood a lot. Sure did for me (but it turns out that I do have genetic celiac).
Celiac can be triggered by various infections. Even if not diagnosed with a "true" celiac, many patients do better to avoiding gluten until out of the woods.
Gluten is in: wheat; kamut; spelt; barley; rye (and all their byproducts).
For those affected, even a trace can cause all kinds of gut, neurological & mood symptoms.
Google: Hidden+Sources+of+Gluten -
Posts: 48021 | From Tree House | Registered: Jul 2007
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posted
Thanks again everyone. What about activated charcoal and bentonite clay? Are they milder versions of the the Rx binders? If so, maybe they'd be worth a try.
I do try to be gluten free, but need to be more stringent about it. I'm a fair englishwoman with relatives with celiac's so might have some sensitivity.
I find it difficult to cut out sugar completely. I do limit myself to a bar of chocolate in the pm. It's something I look forward to and it's hard to give up everything pleasurable. Though, since I take abx, I know it's not a good idea.
I found when I've taken Cortef in the past, it's been easy not to eat sugar. My doctor wants me to start again, which I may do soon. Trying not to change too many things at once!
Sue
Posts: 226 | From Princeton | Registered: Oct 2010
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posted
I know this is an old post. I was glad to find it. I started CSM about 2months ago. It seems to be draining me of what interest i had in life. and it also seems to be pulling out the thyroid medication, although i have been trying to take that sublingual. how long are we supposed to be on this stuff for it to work?
Posts: 34 | From california | Registered: Jan 2015
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-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96222 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
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Keebler
Honored Contributor (25K+ posts)
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posted
- qkcam,
You say that Cholestyramine "seems to be draining me of what interest i had in life."
Sorry to hear that but it's a warning sign - a big red light that it's not right for you. Or, perhaps that your starting dose is far too high.
I would never in my whole life agree to use cholestyramine again - not even for one day . . . nor one dose. It was that horrible for me.
Tapering up slowly, I used it for a month, off and then two months on again. Misery every single minute - that I could directly tie to the cholestyramine.
Mine had neither aspartame (or any artificial sweetener) or sugar. It was plain from Hopkinton Drug near Boston.
So, I know it was not any additive but MY PERSONAL REACTION the substance, itself. I am sure of their quality and I know others do well with it. But I wish I had paid attention sooner to my red flags and not tried to tough it out so long.
And it caused me to have more seizures [likely from nutrient depletion] - now, if seizures aren't in your list of symptoms, it won't likely bring them on but for it to do that certainly is of concern in other ways, too.
Other than serious effects for me - it really sheered my nervous system - it robs the body of the very nutrients so very vital.
My body works better with options from the plant world so much better, food for the organs so they can do their jobs better. Great articles here that explain it better:
LIVER & KIDNEY SUPPORT & and several HERXHEIMER support links, too. -
[ 05-12-2016, 04:18 AM: Message edited by: Keebler ]
Posts: 48021 | From Tree House | Registered: Jul 2007
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D Bergy
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
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posted
I use cholysterimine on occasion but not for Lyme treatment. I have had or have Crohn's disease which resulted in the removal of my ilium and the valve in the ilium. I use it to slow down bowel movements when needed.
The other part of the equation is a had depression for over thirty years. I found out by accident my depression was directly caused by lack of omega three fatty acids. I had plenty of cholesterol but not the right ratio.
While attempting to treat my inflammation from the early symptoms of Crohns, I used Krill Oil. While its effects on the inflammation was difficult to measure, my wife noticed that my depression had not been around lately. She noticed before I did.
Through further experimentation, I determined that the Krill Oil specifically eliminated the depression. It cured it 100 % and I don't throw around that word easily.
Another aspect of the puzzle came to light much later when I found out I was loaded with mycoplasma. It was a major player in my Crohn's disease. One of four or five pathogens tied to the disease.
Guess what uses up cholesterol? Mycoplasma. Cholestyramine also binds to fats so it's a double whammy.
I would try either good fish oil or krill oil and see if it helps. It works quickly. I would also suspect mycoplasma could be involved in your Lyme disease. It's not exactly rare by any means.
Good luck.
Dan
Posts: 2919 | From Minnesota | Registered: Aug 2006
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Keebler
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Prof. Garth Nicholson's research in Mycoplasma is to be commended. Most LLMDs know his work well and some include mycoplasma assessment / treatment along with lyme, TBD. He has also presented numerous times at ILADS conferences so you can find DVDs of his here:
Healing Lyme Disease Coinfections: Complementary and Holistic Treatments for Bartonella and Mycoplasma - by Stephen Harrod Buhner - 2013 -
Posts: 48021 | From Tree House | Registered: Jul 2007
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Keebler
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posted
- For a good quality Krill Oil, and articles you might start with www.mercola.com -
Posts: 48021 | From Tree House | Registered: Jul 2007
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D Bergy
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
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posted
That's what I use.
You must have an incredible memory Keebler. I have forgot most of the resources you post although I have read it in the past.
Dan
Posts: 2919 | From Minnesota | Registered: Aug 2006
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