Topic: What can you do about a root canal? - Update about calcium hydroxide -
sparkle7
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I know people have posted alot of info here about this issue. I'm just wondering whether to get the teeth removed or to "bite the bullet" & get root canals...?
I had a cavity & the dentist screwed it up & drilled too close to the nerve. They can't fix it so they are telling me I need a root canal... What now?
Someone close is having big problems now due to cavitations because of root canals... My dentist is saying - you really want to try to save the teeth if you can. I think it's kind of dumb to have these dead teeth in your mouth but I might need them one day.
What's the percetage of risk involved with a root canal in that the bacteria/pathogens will cause bigger problems in the jaw or under the gums? Does anyone know?
The dentists is also saying that the teeth can move around if you get some pulled & cause problems or you may not be able to talk properly if you are missing teeth.
If they do pull them - I've read there are problems there, too. If the ligature (I think that's what it's called) is not removed properly - that could be a problem, too...
posted
PULL the tooth and pack the site with homeopathic Sanum remedies. I had this done by a biological dentist and it worked beautifully! no post root canal complications.etc cases like this can lead to further stuff like an apicoectomy, look at what the dentist isn't telling you,. saving the tooth at all costs is BS dished out by the self governing ADA!!!!!
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lpkayak
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i agree with dal...root canals make you sick and unable to get well
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sparkle7
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Thanks guys! You are the best!
I'm upset about the filling. Now I have to have the tooth removed... I don't know if it's the dentists' fault or not but it's a hassle in any case. There's no infection so far - it just hurts because it was drilled too close to the nerve.
I have another tooth that needs work - so, it's not the only one.
I read that even if you remove the tooth it can cause cavitations, too...
Is it better to remove the tooth/teeth in question?
Thanks for the Groton link. I'm going to study it. I'm a little suspect of "holistic" dentists, too. I had some bizarre experiences with a number of them.
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GiGi
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Google tuberose and you will find several other articles on the subject, biological dentistry, etc.
I had twelve root canals. I traded them in, including the cavitations, for getting rid of Lyme. Root canals are dead teeth and drip a nasty poison (thioeters/mercaptan) into the system 24/7. If I had to do it over again, I would get a partial for that tooth to which others can be added if another one is lost. One root canal often leads to the next.
Best to you.
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tickled1
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Shoot! I just had a root canal
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posted
Removing teeth will make a space that your other teeth will try to 'move' to. This is what he was saying as far as movement of upper teeth they will try to 'find' the lower and if it is a space, they will elongate to find the opposing tooth to 'chew' with.
If you have too many teeth extracted, you will have a mess of a mouth of teeth moving into spaces.
I have many endo treated teath and no problems what so ever.
You will need to 'fill' those spaces with a partial or something... which then you will need to find out if you are allergic to the composites of what they are made of.
To me saving the tooth is the lesser of it all.
I have worked in the dental industry for over 25 yrs. If a root canal is done correctly, you can keep the tooth forever..... and NOT be sick from it.
I'm living proof of that.
-------------------- Lyme, Babs, Fry Bug..... Whatever it is, may a treatment be discovered to make us all whole again! Posts: 941 | From AZ-MT | Registered: Oct 2004
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sparkle7
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Thanks hadlyme. The teeth in question are a lower left front one & a molar in the very back upper right. So, the spaces will not be too noticable or next to each other.
Can you suggest any filling to put in the root canal to prevent problems. I do like to hear all sides of the issue before making a decision. I haven't had to deal with root canals prior in my life.
This dentist (not my dentist - the one in the article below) suggests using Calcium hydroxide (Note: This is NOT...NOT...not Biocalex, which is now sold under a new name which I believe is Endo-Cal).
Given that, then, what can be done to respect and acknowledge the kinds of issues raised by Drs. Price and Meinig (and others), and yet treat diseased teeth?
Apparently Dr. Price did not work with all the root canal medications we have today. Calcium hydroxide is a simple salt used to make lime water. It was around in Dr. Price�s time, but it seems from Meinig�s writings (page 197) that it was not used in root canal treatment then as it has been used subsequently. Today calcium hydroxide is recognized by root canal specialists as being one of the most - if not the most - potent sterilizing agents that can be placed in the root canal space.
Also, it is non-toxic and it stimulates the bone to repair around the infected root. (Note: Calcium Hydroxide is NOT...NOT...not Biocalex, which is now sold under a new name which I believe is Endo-Cal)
Root canal specialists all use calcium hydroxide, but only occasionally, for special and difficult situations. Their thinking has little to do with the issues raised here, however. Dr. Meinig discusses calcium hydroxide in his book on page 197, acknowledging its potency. He comments that it kills even the most resistant bacteria in about a minute.
Dr. Price was skeptical that anything would be able to sterilize the tiny tubules especially as they go further and further away from the main large nerve canal space outward toward the outside surface of the root.
He said (as reported by Dr. Meinig on page 111, 1993 edition) that "It is practically, if not entirely, a physical impossibility to sterilize infected cementum [ the outside surface of the root ] by treating through the dentin [ that is, by placing a disinfectant inside the main nerve canal space in the center of the root structure ]. It is like trying to sterilize infection in the label on the bottle by putting disinfectants in the bottle."
There has been some very interesting research in the use of calcium hydroxide. We have learned that when calcium hydroxide is placed inside the tooth, the cementum [outside root surface] can be monitored to see the change in pH. The pH measures acidity or alkalinity, where 0=strongly acidic, 7=neutral, and 14=strongly alkaline .
Calcium hydroxide is a strong alkaline and within 3 days of filling the root canal space with it, the pH measured out at the outside root cementum surface goes from about pH=7 (neutral) to pH=9. After about 18 days the pH is 10 and that pH will be maintained up to at least 120 days, which is as long as the research continued to measure it. It was found that this change in pH was observed everywhere on the root outside surface which would suggest that all the tooth structure was affected by the calcium hydroxide. Keep in mind that Calcium Hydroxide was not used in root canal treatment until after the time of Dr. Price's reasearch and writing.
Does this guarantee that every single tubule in the tooth was affected and that every single bacteria cell in the tooth was definitely killed stone dead? No, it doesn�t, but it suggests very strongly that it probably is so.
There are other significant benefits to calcium hydroxide. It will dissolve any tissue remaining in the root canal space. That�s important because the mechanical technique used by dentists to clean out the nerve canal space leaves lots of bits of tissue behind, especially in the little offshoots and accessory canals which usually cannot be reached with dental instruments. So the calcium hydroxide dissolves it out chemically, provided it is left in there for a long enough time.
Additionally, the calcium hydroxide stimulates bone repair which is usually damaged if the root canal problem has been going on for more than a short time. In the mouth the calcium hydroxide disperses not only out from the nerve canal space to the surface of the root, as in the research experiment mentioned above, it continues out and goes into the ligament that holds the tooth to the bone socket, and further out into the bone itself, helping to decrease inflammation, ease pain, counteract the altered chemistry from infection, stimulate the bone repair processes and kill bacteria along the way.
----
I respect different opinions about this issue. Please keep posting.
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beaches
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Sparkle, Thank you SO much for posting this information. My daughter just had a root canal. I questioned the endodontist about what he would use to fill in the canals and he told me he used calcium hydroxide. I am much relieved after reading your post. I was debating whether or not to just pull the tooth, but that just didn't seem like an appropriate thing to do for a young person. Hadlyme, thanks so much for your insight as well. I do think that tooth extractions bring another set of issues.
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sparkle7
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Yes. All of this takes alot of consideration. I think each case & each tooth should be considered in an individualistic manner. It's not the same thing for everyone.
I think it's good to be as informed as possible to be able to ask the right questions & consider all the options before deciding to remove teeth.
In any case, removing teeth can also cause problems - so we have to reveiw all the options first. I wish I knew how important all of this was when I was younger.
Luckily, I haven't had some of the severe issues regarding teeth that some people here & elsewhere have had. It is a really important thing to consider & to learn about - especially for us with Lyme or related ailments.
I'm sure the pathogens can be in our jaws or below the gums. I never realized how important dental health was until I started reading up on all of this.
Some of the problems may be genetic or not related to root canals per se but it's important to know about this.
I'll post some further info that I found a little later... It's very late & I'm tired. I did find alot of interesting info that may be of help to some of you out there with these issues.
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sparkle7
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PS This is the article I wanted to post. I think it's important to know about cavitations & the concepts surrounding them -
This dentist makes a good point about the article he posted from Business Week & the Cavitat machine...
I think some people may be prone to dental issues or it may be genetic (?) - so we can't jump to conclusions & think everyone should pull all their teeth that need repair or remove all their root canals - unless there is a serious issue warranted.
Partials & bridges may not necessarily be the answer... I'm still giving it all some serious thought.
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Carol in PA
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I had nerve pain in a tooth, that I treated with pulsed electromagnetic therapy...using the SOTA Magnetic Pulser.
This was simple and noninvasive, and worked right away.
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sparkle7
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Thanks Carol. I've been wanting to get a Mag Pulser at some point. I really like my LightWorks!
I spoke to the dentist & I think it's infected... It didn't show up on the X-ray but it makes sense from how I feel today. She prescribed some abx & pain meds until I can see the endodentist.
I'm going to see the endodentist on Monday. I guess I'll make a decision then. It's either got to come out or get a root canal. It's all the way in the back on top so I my just have it removed to prevemt further complications. I'll hear what they have to tell me on Monday.
Thanks for your thoughts everyone!
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tickled1
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Take your S. Boulardi Sparkle to prevent C Diff. I now have C Diff from taking Clindamycin for my recent dental infection.
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sparkle7
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Thanks tickled1! That's a good idea. I'll have to get some. I was taking the Jarrow stuff & I got some of that Good Belly drink. Figured I'd try that for a change.
I had some kefir but I just ran out.
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Catgirl
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This is really good to hear Hadlyme!
"I have worked in the dental industry for over 25 yrs. If a root canal is done correctly, you can keep the tooth forever..... and NOT be sick from it.
I'm living proof of that."
I really like Carol's idea too (pulser).
Sparkle, what kind of light did you get from LightWorks? Is it for SAD?
-------------------- --Keep an open mind about everything. Also, remember to visit ACTIVISM (we can change things together). Posts: 5418 | From earth | Registered: Mar 2011
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sparkle7
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No, it's not directly for SAD but it may help with that condition in other ways. It's called the LightWorks. It's a paddle with red & infrared LEDs. It also has the Nogier frequencies. It can be used for a number of different things.
I think it can also be used like some people are doing with the Bionic 880 but I haven't experimented with it alot in that way. I think it's been a great tool for the money. I think it was around $300 when I got it.
I've been using it on my tooth problem at the E setting. I don't know if it helps with all things. I think it depends on the problem. It's good for pain & to use on the pulse points or accupuncture meridians.
I would be a bit careful with blue light. I read some troubling things about exposure to blue LEDs.
I don't think we can completely discount modern medicine in relation to dental issues. It's been a big problem with in alot of areas- especially mercury usage, fluoride, etc. but they must have a few helpful ideas, too.
We just have to thoroughly research the issues ourselves to be able to make the best decision. I think Dr. G from the link above that I posted made some good points, too - we should try to save the teeth if at all possible.
It does take alot of consideration, though. You don't want to be a young person going through life with no teeth if you don't have to. Having the teeth removed & not getting root canals doesn't necessarily guarantee that you won't have any further problems.
I think each case is individual. I'm sure alot of people have gotten ill from bad dental work but we can't just throw the baby out with the bath water, either...
I've seen a few "biological" dentists & some of them were really crackpots. They wanted to do extensive work that did not need to be done & charge exorbinent amounts of money for things I could do with a regular dentist at 5 times less.
I know some of them must be good but the few I've seen were more like criminals than doctors. I agree with alot of the biological dentists work in theory but I don't feel it's right to charge 5 times more for their work.
Most of them you had to pay out of pocket, too... They were very adept at telling me I could get a loan to pay for the dental work. I don't know... It's a sorry state of affairs.
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Carol in PA
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Sparkle, I used the SOTA LightWorks on my teeth too.
The tooth with nerve pain stopped hurting quicker with the Mag Pulser.
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sparkle7
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Interesting.
The problem is that they drilled it too deep & the filling is resting on the nerve. I think it's infected now... So, it's a technical issue that the filling is on the nerve. I have to get it removed & redone - either with a root canal or to pull the tooth.
I guess the cavity was too deep & the filling didn't work. I think the tooth was fairly healthy prior but now it's infected, I think. I can't just leave it & use a mag pulser - I wish I could do it that way.
I'm sure it's helpful... The LightWorks is helpful, too. It's probably a good idea to use things like this on our jaws regularily in any case. Alot of bacteria & pathogens live in the jaw & under the gums. I'm just learning about all of this.
I think GiGi used to post that Dr. K felt that babesia was sequestered in the jaw. Now I understand how it happens to some extent. We really need to watch our oral hygeine & try to keep the circulation good in the jaw & around the gums & teeth.
I think devices like the LightWorks & the MagPulser can help.
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Catgirl
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Are the LightWorks and MagPulser similar to cold laser treatments that chiropractors offer?
That makes sense (Dr. K felt that babesia sequestered in the jaw) since parasites love metal.
-------------------- --Keep an open mind about everything. Also, remember to visit ACTIVISM (we can change things together). Posts: 5418 | From earth | Registered: Mar 2011
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posted
There is a very good book on this topic. It's called "Diagnosis Unknown" and it's about someone who got very, very sick after a root canal. The book is out of pring but you can get it for free on line if you google "Diagnosis Unknown." The best solution for root canals (in my opintion after much reading), is to get a bridge instead. There is a biological dentis who invented something called the "Carlson Bridge" which seems to be a good option. If I ever had a problem, I would probably opt for a Carlson Bridge rather than a roon canal.
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posted
There is a very good book on this topic. It's called "Diagnosis Unknown" and it's about someone who got very, very sick after a root canal. The book is out of pring but you can get it for free on line if you google "Diagnosis Unknown." The best solution for root canals (in my opintion after much reading), is to get a bridge instead. There is a biological dentis who invented something called the "Carlson Bridge" which seems to be a good option. If I ever had a problem, I would probably opt for a Carlson Bridge rather than a roon canal.
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sparkle7
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Catgirl - the mag pulser uses electro-magnetic pulses from what I understand. Like a magnet on & off at a specific frequency. The LightWorks does the same only with red or infrared LEDs.
The light from LEDs is more diffuse - lasers are more directed. It's safer for home use.
I don't think they are allowed to have the health benefits listed where they sell the devices. You can look elsewhere for the studies. I think the Elixa website has some info about these things. Alot of websites are removing info about these technologies because the FDA is hounding alot of people who sell alterative healing methods.
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sparkle7
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The book is free & you can read it on the internet -
Calcium hydroxide has limited effectiveness in eliminating bacteria from human root canal
Conclusions Based on the current best available evidence, calcium hydroxide has limited effectiveness in eliminating bacteria from human root canals, when assessed by culture techniques. The quest for better antibacterial protocols and sampling techniques must continue to ensure that bacteria can be reliably eradicated prior to obturation.
-------
So - it doesn't seem to be such a good option after all. Seems most of the people who posted here had a negative experience with root canals. Maybe best to just have the tooth/teeth removed after all.
That's the direction I'm leaning in now. I know what people report here is not a guarantee of effectiveness but it's something to consider.
It seems the long term effectiveness of a root canal is problematic. I don't want to do something now that will have worse consequences later.
Please keep posting... Thanks.
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beaches
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Well DD just had her root canal using the calcium hydroxide. She is a very young adult so losing a tooth just didn't seem like a viable option. I took her to the best endo I could find.
I hope this was the right decision as she has already been through way too much with these dds. She sure doesn't need anymore "stuff" to go through.
The treated tooth is still sensitive, which I do think is problematic. She has a good dentist so hoping he is able to assess whether or not the tooth is viable to crown. Of course, he'd make $$ if that were the case, but this guy is moral and wouldn't steer her in that direction unless it was a good and viable option for her.
So sick of having to deal with things that should be no-brainers and everything else for such a long time. """sigh"""
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sparkle7
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I understand. I just wanted to post this since I was looking into it for myself. In my case, I don't know. I just had a regular filling that turned into all of this. I had some other opinions about the tooth - so I did get an "alternative" view.
They wanted to put some kind of crown on the tooth which involved casting the tooth & bonding the crown to the tooth. I don't know if that would have been a viable answer since it involves some kind of adhesive, etc. & alot more money to fix. Who knows how toxic the adhesive is...?
I don't know if there's a "correct" answer here. I just know that someone close to me is dealing with the cavitation issue. i don't want to have to go through that in several years from now due to infection below the gums.
I don't know if there's any easy answer with all of this. I found this article, as well-
In my case, it may be better to lose the tooth but in someone else's case - it may be better to try to retain it. It depends on age, what tooth is having problems, general health... So, each case is different.
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GiGi
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At my last visit to the dentist in the spring, I was told that stem cell teeth would be available in about 5 years. I've seen them online growing these teeth so it is already a fact but maybe not ready quite yet. All the drilling has left structural problems and teeth more likely to chip.
I used a SOTA machine on my one tooth that now has a root canal and it did not work. I think that my tooth was already gone.
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Judie
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Sparkle7 - I would like to PM you some info on dental stuff, but your box is full
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sparkle7
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OK. Thanks. I'll empty it out... Thanks for all the info everyone! I'll look it over very soon. Just got in...
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sparkle7
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Thanks lymenotlite - that's amazing! Thanks for the info. Also, thanks again GiGi. I'm going to watch it.
I had an appointment with the endo... He's strongly encouraging that I try to save the teeth with root canals. He's quite nice & he's studied at the best schools around. I don't know what to do. The tooth is hurting like he[[ & it's hard to think.
I made an apointment for next week but I'm still giving it some thought. It's expensive & who know what will happen with it. I'm going to dowse it & see what comes up tomorrow. Right now it's really killing me...
Thanks so much for posting about this. Like I said - someone close to me is having her teeth removed due to bad root canals. She has bone damage due to them...
So, I'm not favoring the idea of them but my endodontist was pretty reassuring today that my teeth were in good condition & that it was a waste to lose them when they can be salvaged...
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