posted
Hey guys, I've searched past topics regarding chronic Ehrlichia in dogs and it seems like a few people have some knowledge or experience with this but sent info in pm's. If you are willing to share with me, I'd be really grateful.
When we rescued my Australian Shepherd 7 years ago, she was virtually feral. She'd been left in the woods to die by some horrible people. She had over 90 ticks on her and tested positive for Ehrlichia.
We treated with a couple rounds of doxy, but she developed some strange persistent issues- what looks like blood pooling in the gums, blood shot eyes, occasional grand mal seizures, and neurological problems.
Because this poor animal was also hit by a truck before we got her, the vet said it was probably dementia onset. She's been on Selegiline ever since but continues to test positive for Ehrlichia and has the remaining issues.
I've asked repeatedly if Ehrlichia could be chronic in her and the vet said "No." And that her titers have changed so that means the treatment worked even though several years later the test is still positive.
Now that I'm educating myself regarding my own tickborne illnesses and co-infections, I hate to think I am neglecting the needs of my dog and want to make sure we can make her as comfortable as possible in her older years.
Anyway, if you have any info or experiences you could share, I'd be very grateful. I'm having some trouble finding much on anything but acute Ehrlichia...
Thanks! Denise
Posts: 428 | From Midwest | Registered: Dec 2012
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posted
Thanks Lymetoo!
Posts: 428 | From Midwest | Registered: Dec 2012
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nefferdun
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posted
What a dumb vet. You can search online and find plenty of information that Ehrlichia can become chronic in dogs if it is not caught in the acute (early) stage.
It goes to the spleen where it become dormant and then it comes back later. It can kill the dog. Some dogs are kept on lifetime maintenance abx.
I have wondered if that might be why my eyes never get better. Dr. S told me horses carry ehrlichia so I could get infected over and over just getting bitten by flies. He said ehrlichia can also cause your shins to hurt.
Your poor dog. See another vet.
-------------------- old joke: idiopathic means the patient is pathological and the the doctor is an idiot Posts: 4676 | From western Montana | Registered: Apr 2009
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posted
I took her back in this morning and demanded they run another test for Erhlichia and full blood panel.
She was diagnosed with Chronic Erhlichia- finally her results are "positive enough" again to count.
They gave me doxy but told me that what we do now only buys her some time. Since now all her other positives count, she's had this for 7 years and only had 2 rounds of doxy.
I am so heartbroken. Can't stop crying. Need to get my **** together and figure out what to do- what's best to do for her...
Posts: 428 | From Midwest | Registered: Dec 2012
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posted
Daynise, our pets are so important to us. I am glad your dog finally found a family who cares. I lost an Australian Shepard Mix (shelter pet) several years ago and I know how important "Milo" was to me.
Posts: 482 | From Oregon | Registered: Feb 2011
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nefferdun
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I am so sorry. I adore dogs so I understand how devastated you must feel. From what I have read you can keep her on ABX to keep it inactive. You should see another vet - one that knows how to diagnose and treat it.
-------------------- old joke: idiopathic means the patient is pathological and the the doctor is an idiot Posts: 4676 | From western Montana | Registered: Apr 2009
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posted
One of our old girls had Ehrlichia. Our girl's only neuro problems was balance & twitchy muscles, doxy helped to keep her symptoms in check. I did some "trick" training with her to help her rear legs from trembling so much. That helped her balance more than anything. We inherited her just before her 11th birthday. Cancer finally took her at the age of 15.
Hope the specialist can get you some answers & relief for your companion. PM me if you want more info on the exercises I did with my old girl. Best of luck.
Posts: 25 | From N. Texas | Registered: Oct 2012
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desertwind
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I know you are not but do not give up on her! Dogs are resilant and respond different to chronic lyme then we do (according to mt Vet).
My 7 yr. old golden has been on Doxy for more then half of her life. Pretty much 6 months out of the year due to some re-infection or relapse of a TBI.
We run the 4DX and C6 Peptide on her and at this point just use it as a scale to compare one result to another. She is always positive but we can see if her vlaues have increased. Our Vet treats based on clinical - even if her values remain the same or go down.
She is back on abx.s again.... IMO she has a chronic TBI - just like my husband and myself.
I always have a stash of Doxy for when she relapses or gets reinfected.
She is 60 lbs and we treat with 500 mgs. of Doxy for Erlich. for at least 6-8 weeks and lyme at 400 mgs. Within 2 days of being on Doxy she is like a pup again and able to walk and down the stairs. Sometimes she is good for about 6-8 months and other times needs to go back on in a couple of months.
I sometimes wonder about Babs and Bart..
I am blessed to have a great LLDVM.....Be sure to load her up on probiotics as well. Best of luck....
Posts: 1671 | From Tick Infested New Jersey | Registered: Apr 2010
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posted
Maybe we should all go to the vet so we can get tx!
-------------------- "Sometimes you're the windshield; sometimes you're the bug." Mark Knopfler Posts: 111 | From East of Eden | Registered: Mar 2012
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desertwind
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Yeah..I have said that so many times over the years. My dog gets agressive tx ASAP. I wish my Vet was an MD.....
Posts: 1671 | From Tick Infested New Jersey | Registered: Apr 2010
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posted
Thank you all so much for sharing your experiences with your dogs. Makes me feel hopeful to think maybe her case can be managed with doxy and that we aren't "just buying time."
I'm definitely switching vets.
Desertwind, would you mind sharing which probiotic you use on your pup?
Fieldbred, I'd love to hear about your exercises. My dog is 12 and her back legs are very weak. It'd be great to be able to help her with balance and strength. I'll pm you.
Nefferdun, thanks so much for the support. I haven't even begun to process how upset I am at my vet and hopefully the internist on Friday will give me a better prognosis.
Milo, so sorry for your loss. I know you guys really understand. My 3 dogs are my babies.
Posts: 428 | From Midwest | Registered: Dec 2012
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desertwind
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I give my Golden FortiFlora by Purina. I give her 3 packets a day and her gastro is stellar. Knock on wood she has never had any gastro issues - even on 500mgs. a day for months/years on end. I am jealous:)
The relationship with have with our animal companions is like no other - the connection is magical...Best wishes to you
Posts: 1671 | From Tick Infested New Jersey | Registered: Apr 2010
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posted
Oh wow. The idiot vet is so lucky I can't think fast enough to tear him up. I'll just have my husband do that later... My vet has called twice leaving kiss ass messages about why years of positive results isn't actually an Ehrlichia infection. He just told me chronic Ehrlichia and Lyme infection does not exist.
I feel so awful- I just sat there dumbfounded instead of screaming his face off. I asked him, if she doesn't have a persistent infection, why in two days on doxycycline has she gone from barely being able to walk to yesterday running and playing in the snow. He told me there's no Erhlichia bacteria in her system and that her body is attacking itself.
Also told me she'd do better on prednisone than doxy.
Specialist tomorrow. Never. ever. ever. taking my animals back to that vet again.
Posts: 428 | From Midwest | Registered: Dec 2012
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Dsynise, maybe she is "malingering",hah hah. This is the IDSA battle cry as to why lyme infected people continue to be ill. Dogs can't fake it and agree with ripping him a new one, if you know what I mean. Here's hoping you find a new, ll veterinarian.
Posts: 482 | From Oregon | Registered: Feb 2011
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desertwind
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Another example of how dangerous it is when "doctors" don't know what they don't know...
I ALWAYS know when my girl has either lyme or co-infection because within 24 -48 hrs. of taking doxy she is completely normal again! Able to walk, run, fetch, go up the stairs ect....She is back on doxy. again and back to her old self. Yes, she has a chronic infection and I will give her my own doxy if I need to...
Go with your gut and best of luck with the specialist - she will be in good hands.
Posts: 1671 | From Tick Infested New Jersey | Registered: Apr 2010
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posted
Our old girls who had Erlichia did have a flare when her food was changed (the maker's formula changed). She had a sensitive gut.
Daynise, good luck with the perch work & box work. And the specialist tomorrow. You can file a complaint vs. your state board of DVM examiners too.
Posts: 25 | From N. Texas | Registered: Oct 2012
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D Bergy
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posted
A coworker of mine had a dog with chronic Erlichia. I gave him a bottle of MMS and told him I did not know if it would work, but it was worth a try.
He put one or two drops in its water dish and after a few weeks the dog was much better. He said the dog had never wagged its tail in years, but now it did again.
He continues to put it in his dogs water and he has not had any more tick borne disease problems.
The funny part is the dogs won't drink their water if it does not have MMS in it.
Dan
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nefferdun
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It is so infuriating when you come across a doctor like that. If it wasn't for the internet we would probably all be dead - and our critters too.
That is really interesting about the MMS.
-------------------- old joke: idiopathic means the patient is pathological and the the doctor is an idiot Posts: 4676 | From western Montana | Registered: Apr 2009
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My Aussie just army crawled using the muscles in her front and back legs across the floor chasing her toys! I haven't ever seen her have such strength and control in her legs!!
It's only been like 3 weeks on doxycycline and this dog who we had to carry up and down steps and who could barely stand to be touched has been playing with toys and our other dogs, the blood pooling in her gums has lessened significantly, and her back muscles have loosened and relaxed down her entire spine. Also, fatty tumors on her abdomen are shrinking.
I am ecstatic!! Thank you so much to everybody who helped me with information about dog tick borne illnesses and shared their experiences.
Neither the specialist (internalist), nor my vet would agree to treat her because her platelets were normal this test, but they could offer no explanation for her symptoms other than she has mild arthritis in her hips.
So I am doing it on my own and seeing amazing results. She's on probiotics, doxy, herbal supplements, and weekly doses of deramaxx,.
I'm not letting anything get in the way of us being better anymore!
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nefferdun
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That is really wonderful news. I am glad she is feeling so much better. I wonder how long you should treat her. If like humans, 3 months after she is symptom free.
Be careful of sun exposure in the summer. It might burn her skin that is exposed or even her eyes.
-------------------- old joke: idiopathic means the patient is pathological and the the doctor is an idiot Posts: 4676 | From western Montana | Registered: Apr 2009
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Thanks for the reminder on doxycycline and sun. We usually keep her coat short because it's easier, but it's longer now and hopefully that offers her an amount of protection. I hadn't thought of her eyes getting burnt. I wonder how long is too long for her to be outside? She's mostly indoors anyway, but we do sit outside occasionally and today we went on a short walk.
I was thinking of treating 8 weeks? And then pulsing her as we see symptoms recur?
As soon as I get myself a little more stable I need to aggressively try to find a LLDVM for her. Does anyone have a suggestion on how to search for one? I could try to see if the Lyme Association in the area would know...
Posts: 428 | From Midwest | Registered: Dec 2012
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Nefferdun could you please elaborate in regards to chronic Ehrlicia and the eye problems? My 9 yo DD tested + for this but I have found almost no information on it. Undiagnosed for ~ 2 years. Treating now for bart/lyme etc. She has ongoing eye issues. My understanding was that after 30 days of Doxy, Ehrlicia goes away. She took 60 days. She also horseback rides. your post worries me. BTW she had a horrednouse respitory episode right after what I know now was the onset of Lyme. Woke up one morning and could not breath.
Posts: 92 | From New Yorl | Registered: Jan 2012
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