"The part of bacterial DNA that often carries antibiotic resistance is a master at moving between different types of bacteria and adapting to widely differing bacterial species, say researchers in Sweden."
"More and more bacteria are becoming resistant to our common antibiotics, and to make matters worse, more and more are becoming resistant to all known antibiotics.
The problem is known as multi-resistance, and is generally described as one of the most significant future threats to public health Antibiotic resistance can arise in bacteria in our environment and in our bodies.
Antibiotic resistance can then be transferred to the bacteria that cause human diseases, even if the bacteria are not related to each other."
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Breaking up a paragraph for easier reading for many here -
[ 12-06-2014, 07:04 PM: Message edited by: Robin123 ]
Posts: 8 | From San Francisco, Ca | Registered: Oct 2014
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Razzle
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posted
This is why it is so, so important to take in various herbs (such as basil, oregano, thyme, etc.) that contain compounds that can disrupt quorum sensing - it is quorum sensing that enables the bacteria to find other bacteria (either of the same species or different species) and build biofilm communities for protection.
If bacteria can't find other bacteria, they can't share genes that convey resistance to antibiotics.
-------------------- -Razzle Lyme IgM IGeneX Pos. 18+++, 23-25+, 30++, 31+, 34++, 39 IND, 83-93 IND; IgG IGeneX Neg. 30+, 39 IND; Mayo/CDC Pos. IgM 23+, 39+; IgG Mayo/CDC Neg. band 41+; Bart. (clinical dx; Fry Labs neg. for all coinfections), sx >30 yrs. Posts: 4167 | From WA | Registered: Feb 2011
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Brussels
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Antibiotic is a single-bullet gun (single chemical), bacteria are much more smarter than we think!
Think about that: plants took millions of years fighting bacteria, fungi, viruses in order to survive.
They developed a multitude of guns to fight these, so that they can survive. That is why they are here with us. Only the strong survived.
And it took each of them, millions of years to get those guns working effectively.
We humans grew with these plants, fed from them, we even evolved from plants ultimately!
Even though plants look weaker than antibiotics, when used in combinations, they can be much more powerful, certainly more intelligent, more complex, and in the end, more effective than single bullet man made antibiotics.
The only problem: what combination, what dosage do we need?
Posts: 6200 | From Brussels | Registered: Oct 2007
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posted
I took oral clindamycin for 5 years to keep symptoms down and then it stopped working for Lyme. I notice that I CAN treat other infections with it.
Question - I thought the whole purpose of hitting the spirochetes and the cysts was to knock out both versions, ala Dr B protocol. Doesn't that work for many?
And yes, we still have a cornucopia to play around with.
Serendipity - I know you want to help out here, re your Synergy discussion, but it is never one size fits all for Lyme patients. People need to experiment and see what works for them. If the Synergy protocol works, more power to it. But not everyone can do the same protocol. Many people for instance do not detox well and have to deal with that.
Posts: 13171 | From San Francisco | Registered: May 2006
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Lymedin2010
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posted
Great video on ABX resistance. This will be the norm & some of us will not be able to recover from Lyme with concurrent tertiary infections, for one of which can be Mycoplasma.
Razzle
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posted
Not everyone can take MSM or ALA... Those with methylation issues (for example, variants in CBS, SUOX, NOS, MTHFR, etc.) will need more than just the synergy protocol to get well.
-------------------- -Razzle Lyme IgM IGeneX Pos. 18+++, 23-25+, 30++, 31+, 34++, 39 IND, 83-93 IND; IgG IGeneX Neg. 30+, 39 IND; Mayo/CDC Pos. IgM 23+, 39+; IgG Mayo/CDC Neg. band 41+; Bart. (clinical dx; Fry Labs neg. for all coinfections), sx >30 yrs. Posts: 4167 | From WA | Registered: Feb 2011
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Razzle
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I'm not using methylation as a buzzword just because it's the big fad thing today. I'm using it because I know it is a big issue for me personally. I also know it is not a big thing for everyone, because everyone's genes are different & everyone's epigenetics are different (environment-genetic interactions).
I've treated the infections for almost 7 years with no significant improvement (the infections are still there - I get worse off treatment) - how do you propose I get rid of the infections if I cannot make immune cells because my methylation is messed up?
"You don't need methylation therapy, you need to get the internal inflammation under control by removing the toxins that cause it."
And how do you propose I do this if methylation is a major component of Phase II liver detox and I can't take the standard stuff that helps most with this (i.e., MSM, ALA, etc.) because of my sulfite allergy?
I've used anti-inflammatory stuff for years with minimal success. Mostly because I don't make enough T-regulatory cells to shut down the inflammation. So as soon as I wean off steroids, for example, not only am I experiencing rebound inflammation, the infections get worse from the immune suppression.
No, you can't tell me what will work for me is to take things I'm allergic to and to treat the infections only, ignoring everything else experience has taught me I cannot ignore. I've been there, tried that, as far as trying to reduce inflammation, deal with leaky gut, fix dietary issues, etc., and NOTHING has worked.
I need both infection reducing AND methylation support, but this requires me to compensate for the CBS & MTHFR variants I have. And I'm working on that now...it just takes time because it must be done slowly.
I have found benefit from using nutritional compensation for methylation defects. But since I'm ANAPHYLACTIC to sulfites, and MSM and ALA are BOTH sulfites, how do you propose I survive what you tell me to do?
So the only approach left to me is to nutritionally compensate for the methylation genomics (yes, this is epigenetics, and I believe the effects of the genes can be changed with careful attention to environment and nutrition) in the hopes that doing so reduces my reactivity to the sulfites.
I've already seen benefit, just takes a looooonnnggg time to recover from years of sulfite sensitivity I didn't understand until more recently.
Sorry, but you aren't going to convince me that the infections are the only thing I need to address, and to ignore methylation.
There is MUCH MORE to the picture for me personally.
-------------------- -Razzle Lyme IgM IGeneX Pos. 18+++, 23-25+, 30++, 31+, 34++, 39 IND, 83-93 IND; IgG IGeneX Neg. 30+, 39 IND; Mayo/CDC Pos. IgM 23+, 39+; IgG Mayo/CDC Neg. band 41+; Bart. (clinical dx; Fry Labs neg. for all coinfections), sx >30 yrs. Posts: 4167 | From WA | Registered: Feb 2011
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Razzle
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Yes. I agree mitochondria need to be fixed. But methylation genomics sit in the intermembrane space of the mitochondria and are at one end of the respiration chain (yes, I have done a lot of research), and if one's genomics alter the way these enzymes function, then does it not make sense to alter the inputs to the enzymes to help them function like they're supposed to?
BTW, if you really understood methylation, you'd realize that the CBS mutation can INCREASE glutathione production up to 40 times normal...
Guess what happens, though, when this enzyme cranks out that much more glutathione?
The down-stream enzymes get overloaded (such as SUOX) and the person's detox mechanism shuts down.
There is a lot of methylation info that is free to read, also...(hint, hint)
-------------------- -Razzle Lyme IgM IGeneX Pos. 18+++, 23-25+, 30++, 31+, 34++, 39 IND, 83-93 IND; IgG IGeneX Neg. 30+, 39 IND; Mayo/CDC Pos. IgM 23+, 39+; IgG Mayo/CDC Neg. band 41+; Bart. (clinical dx; Fry Labs neg. for all coinfections), sx >30 yrs. Posts: 4167 | From WA | Registered: Feb 2011
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Razzle
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Actually, it's working better than anything else I've tried for the sulfite issue. I ate a tomato for the first time in years, with no reaction. I used to get nasty reactions to the sulfites in tomatoes.
-------------------- -Razzle Lyme IgM IGeneX Pos. 18+++, 23-25+, 30++, 31+, 34++, 39 IND, 83-93 IND; IgG IGeneX Neg. 30+, 39 IND; Mayo/CDC Pos. IgM 23+, 39+; IgG Mayo/CDC Neg. band 41+; Bart. (clinical dx; Fry Labs neg. for all coinfections), sx >30 yrs. Posts: 4167 | From WA | Registered: Feb 2011
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GretaM
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Phantukk-I know you're really pushing people to go to your website. Hey, if the protocol you designed worked for you, that is great!
Most of us ignored the thread where you asked yourself questions, and then answered yourself in order to explain your protocol to another member. It did simplify the steps in starting the protocol and didn't seem to be selling anything directly, so did not break the rules of lymenet.
Lyme may diminish our mental stamina, but many of us are very educated; we're not dumb.
However, there is no need to be rude to people who have sulphite/sulfur allergies, or mock them and the research they have done on this topic.
Razzle is probably the most fluent regarding methylation and various genetic defects on LN. Probably in the lyme support community. If one wants to know how a gene works, and the chain of events in the body related to that gene, one will ask Razzle.
Let's think logically: If a sulphite allergy happens to correlate with a defect in the CBS gene...it makes sense that it could be the reason for the sulphite allergy.
The ruder you are to honest questions re: sulfur and MSM, the quicker you will be booted from here. Often, the rudest people are the ones with ulterior motives, ie: sales from their websites, or researchers employed by the NIH et al.
So if you are an honest person, who was helped by the research that you have done with the synergy protocol, and you don't know the alternative to MSM for people with sulfur allergies, it is OK to say so.
NO ONE here would judge or be rude to you if you said, "I don't know of a safe or effective alternative for MSM or ALA in this protocol"
But please remember this is a supportive learning environment. Not a rude one.
Thank you.
Posts: 4358 | From British Columbia, Canada | Registered: Jun 2013
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Razzle
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Thanks Greta - I PM'd you
-------------------- -Razzle Lyme IgM IGeneX Pos. 18+++, 23-25+, 30++, 31+, 34++, 39 IND, 83-93 IND; IgG IGeneX Neg. 30+, 39 IND; Mayo/CDC Pos. IgM 23+, 39+; IgG Mayo/CDC Neg. band 41+; Bart. (clinical dx; Fry Labs neg. for all coinfections), sx >30 yrs. Posts: 4167 | From WA | Registered: Feb 2011
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posted
Thanks, Greta - we expect and need respect and courtesy shown on the board.
We're happy when something works for someone, but anyone who finds that something works needs to keep in mind that it doesn't work for everyone. I've seen that myself, in the remedies that have worked for me, that it doesn't mean necessarily that it can work for someone else.
Phantuk, I am someone who cannot do MSM - gives me a bad headache. A lot of what I went through occurred before I even found out I had Lyme - ie before I had any information about what was going on.
Many people here cannot detox well. I've done the 23andme genetic testing which shows the polymorphisms that are blocking detox in me. My Lyme doc is going to work with me.
May I say, you are not a Lyme doctor and cannot prescribe to people what to do. All you can do here is make suggestions about protocols that have helped you and invite people to try them. But you cannot know whether it's going to work for the next person.
It's not particular to you and your protocols. This is a universal given, with Lyme patients, that we are all different, and some respond to something and some respond to other things.
Posts: 13171 | From San Francisco | Registered: May 2006
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If there was a one size fits all approach to healing, we would all be well. There are so many variables that are different in each of us.
Making recommendations based on what worked for you is part of what we do here. We we do not "push" our views on others and we are not to be disrespectful to anyone who does not agree with our personal view.
-------------------- Faithful
Just sharing my experience, I am not a doctor. Posts: 2682 | From Colorado | Registered: Oct 2009
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Razzle
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posted
phantukk,
We've tried to be patient with you, but I see it is not working. So I'll be blunt. I don't know if you are intending to cause dissent here, or if that is only the effects of your insistence on being right and pushing your way on us. But your posts on this thread are suggestive of troll-like behavior.
We don't need trolls here.
Mods,
Can this thread be locked?
Thanks,
-------------------- -Razzle Lyme IgM IGeneX Pos. 18+++, 23-25+, 30++, 31+, 34++, 39 IND, 83-93 IND; IgG IGeneX Neg. 30+, 39 IND; Mayo/CDC Pos. IgM 23+, 39+; IgG Mayo/CDC Neg. band 41+; Bart. (clinical dx; Fry Labs neg. for all coinfections), sx >30 yrs. Posts: 4167 | From WA | Registered: Feb 2011
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Brussels
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posted
Phantukk, I liked your website, with good suggestions of herbs and supplements.
But maybe you are still new in lyme treatment? In no way there is a one-fit-all protocol because our problems, infections, detox pathway blockades, are different.
While you can stand great dosages of herbs like cats claw, others, like me and my daughter, would probably die if we had continued on those high dosages proposed by Buhner.
Buhner also believed dosage was important until he published his first book Healing Lyme in 2006.
Well, after receiving thousands of emails of users of his protocol, he wisely concluded that not everyone needs to reach maximum dosages to improve. On the contrary, many would improve with MINIMAL dosages.
And now he thinks andrographis is out of the main protocol, for example (andro was a main herb initially). He probably said that due to many side-reactions of andro among his protocol users.
Are you on full remission for more than 3 years WITHOUT taking any anti-lyme treatment? I'm not doubting you, just asking a question to see where you are.
I am glad you shared what worked for you.
But please, let's be polite here. We're not fighting a war to see who is right or wrong.
MSM worked wonderful for me too, I still take it on and off when I get some infection. But I also take chorella (my favorite detox plant) and I had seen people almost die after taking chlorella (throwing up and having the worst diarrhea of their lives).
So I do know that what is a sacred medicine for some, is poison to another.
Suppose we were all the same, where is then evolution, natural selection etc?
Chlorella is very rich in aminoacids, that alone fight against some infections, plus nourish the body. It was thought as a perfect food some time ago. Well, while I LOVE chlorella, I know it is dangerous for some.
My lyme doctor would test substance by substance for each patient. He has many years of experience in treatment, and in no way, he will have a standard protocol that will work for all.
I guess experience makes people humble.
If you are in doubt about sulphur detox pathways being blocked for some, just do a search here. There will be more than a dozen people who posted about it, how bad they feel after taking sulphur supplements or even in food, etc.
You can tell all of them are imagining things, and they are lying? I wouldn't be that sure.
Posts: 6200 | From Brussels | Registered: Oct 2007
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Razzle
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Just to clarify, I am not a moderator of, nor am I paid by, HealingWell or any other Lyme forum.
This will be my last post on this thread.
-------------------- -Razzle Lyme IgM IGeneX Pos. 18+++, 23-25+, 30++, 31+, 34++, 39 IND, 83-93 IND; IgG IGeneX Neg. 30+, 39 IND; Mayo/CDC Pos. IgM 23+, 39+; IgG Mayo/CDC Neg. band 41+; Bart. (clinical dx; Fry Labs neg. for all coinfections), sx >30 yrs. Posts: 4167 | From WA | Registered: Feb 2011
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Brussels
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Member # 13480
posted
We 'know' you Razzle!!!
I think Phantukk is new, and is still amazed to see how he improved (or healed) with what he did and wants to share that with all.
I mean, after fighting this awful disease and finding guns against it, then finally coming back to life, it is a great event and I do understand why he (or she?) is very excited in sharing.
The only point is that, as I said, experience and time make one humble. We all get humbled when we see that, what works for one, can literally kill another or be nothing for another person....
How many medical doctors didn't tell us than 2 weeks doxy is all what we need?
But I agree that we need to go on talking politely. Or it's no fun at all for everyone who comes to lymenet.
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