Brussels
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 13480
posted
Does anyone here think that Kefir has similar anti-candida effect?
I mean, as strong as fermented veggies?
How about Apple Cider Vinegar compared to fermented veggies? (I'm fighting candida....)
thanks for any insights.
Posts: 6199 | From Brussels | Registered: Oct 2007
| IP: Logged |
Brussels
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 13480
posted
Sonatina, thank you for your suggestions. But do you have personal experience with kefir for candida treatment? that is what I would like to hear from people...
Well, my husband takes apple cider vinegar and so far, it is the only thing that helped his gout attacks.
I was wondering if it was because it makes the body more alkaline. But after drinking my own fermented veggies vinegar (I mean, the acid liquid produced by fermentation), and almost getting my skin candida under control, I started wondering if his apple cider vinegar, produced by fermentation, wouldn't also help?
I know that German product called Rechtsregulat, which is basically the juice (vinegar) produced by fermentation of various things (fruits and veggies). It can make miracles, but it costs a fortune to be taken in great amounts.
The benefits for health are listed in hundreds (the book that explains its proved benefits is huge!). And people here in Germany keep buying the stuff for years despite the price.
So I'm trying to connect the dots, and wondering if the bacteria from Kefir would have the same effect of fermented veggies /fruits (like apple cider itself)...
Just because I can't imagine my life eating EVERYDAY fermented veggies in great amounts, and would like to vary at least 50 -50 % with something else sometimes...
Like Kefir, for example? any opinions?
Posts: 6199 | From Brussels | Registered: Oct 2007
| IP: Logged |
posted
There are many fermented foods that naturally contain probiotic organisms, including fermented veggies, fermented dairy, fermented grains, etc. You can use more than one kind -- it doesn't have to be one or the other. Variety can be helpful in terms of more diversity of strains.
If you decide to buy kefir or yogurt, make sure it is low-fat and w/o hormones. Fat & hormones are issues for yeast too, not only sugar. And so is iron, so please consult your doctor before taking any supplements/vitamins that contain significant amounts of bioavailable iron.
I don't know enough about apple cider vinegar to offer an opinion. Glad it is helping your husband though!
-------------------- Please consult your physician before making any changes to your diet, medications, or supplements. I am not a healthcare professional and nothing I write should be construed as medical advice. Posts: 166 | From USA | Registered: Dec 2014
| IP: Logged |
Brussels
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 13480
posted
I'm taking the awful apple vinegar for the last 3 days now. My new batch of veggies is not ready, so I gotta keep on drinking that awful vinegar.
Good news is that, it is also working, coupled with Kefir, that I take about 4 hours after my vinegar.
The apple cider vinegar works even faster than fermented veggies. But it tastes MUCH more awful.
after you suggested that candida diet should be low fat... I will try then to shift from my low sugar to low fat. I usually get fast candida symptoms after eating something sweet or white carbs. I'll try for a week, from now on, low fat, just to see.
I'm feeding on nuts, quark cheese (very fat), butter, creamy goat cheese, etc, just because I am avoiding carbs and fruits. I'll shift my whole diet just to see. At least, I'll try.
Thanks again for the suggestion.
Posts: 6199 | From Brussels | Registered: Oct 2007
| IP: Logged |
Brussels
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 13480
posted
First day low fat diet. It looks good! I ate an apple and a banana, and a piece of dark chocolate (not low fat, though....).
No meat, no butter (just a bit... cheated), still on bits of apple cider vinegar. I cheated on white carb (one loaf of bread at Xmas market), I did take sugar in my Veggie soup, still took a Kefir low fat glass, but avoided creams, even cheese or my lovely seeds (almonds, chia, flaxseeds, etc), that i consume in high amounts usually, when I get candida.
So yes, I'm doing a higher carb, higher fruit diet in opposition to high fat, high protein diet. Let's see. So far, it is looking fine!
Thanks for this suggestion, Sonatina!
and the apple cider vinegar is not even tasting as bad as first day.
Posts: 6199 | From Brussels | Registered: Oct 2007
| IP: Logged |
posted
I have seen some people say that kefir can aggravate their candida symptoms by provoking an histamine reaction.
I tried using kefir as part of a protocol to fix my gut a few years back but all my neuro syx got so intense I couldn't tolerate it after a few months. I started slow too. My legs and ankles got so tight and throbbing and crampy that I had difficulty standing. I am not sure if this was a histamine response or not. But it is something that happens when I eat many different offending foods. When I stopped kefir and other culprits, the legs slowly got back to normal.
I think, in my case anyway, the gut has to be much farther along before kefir will be helpful. I am currently trying to crowd the bad gi bugs out by eating soil-based probiotics and foods that are supposed to support their growth. It is too early to tell how it is working.
You might be interested in this guy's work. They are studying gut flora and diets in American and European guts, and comparing it to the flora in the guts of the Hadza, a tribe of hunter-gathers in Africa, and their diets . http://humanfoodproject.com/author/jeff-leach/Posts: 845 | From Eastern USA | Registered: Jul 2006
| IP: Logged |
posted
Oh, I forget to add that I was eating cultured veggies, that I made myself, too.
Posts: 845 | From Eastern USA | Registered: Jul 2006
| IP: Logged |
posted
hi Brussels, I didn't suggest eating sugar! Suggested low fat, low sugar, with plenty of dark leafy greens, high sulfur veggies, and herbs/spices.
All yeast also need iron and certain nutrients to reproduce. So consult your doctor re. any vitamin pills you take as they can sometimes do more harm than good. The body is wisely designed to take in micronutrients from food and iron is very tightly controlled to avoid making free iron available to microbes.
BTW yeast can sometimes be a factor in tooth decay and osteoporosis, as they can uptake calcium, vit D, etc.
S.
-------------------- Please consult your physician before making any changes to your diet, medications, or supplements. I am not a healthcare professional and nothing I write should be construed as medical advice. Posts: 166 | From USA | Registered: Dec 2014
| IP: Logged |
Brussels
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 13480
posted
Sonatina, I know I shouldn't be eating sugar, but this low fat diet makes me hungry, even after eating.
I realized it is harder to go on a low fat diet than I thought.
I somehow need to take something else than fat to keep my weight and heat... Without my usual high consumption of seeds, some meat, butter, quark cheese, cheese etc, .... I mean, I have as a choice carbs, fruits, beans, and low fat proteins (like chicken breast, which I never liked since a small kid).
I feel hungry without fats, that is why I ended up eating a whole waffle today!
I'll try to take some boiled eggs tomorrow, as I feel I won't keep my weight (unless I add sweets inside, which in normal days, I don't crave at all). It's been years on low sugar consumption, and I never felt I really needed sugar. Except for today and yesterday, on low fat diet.
Anyway, only this tasteless low fat kefir won't sustain me for very long. I am doing quite some physical activities, and it's winter. I also have low body temperature, which is what causes my candida infection to reactivate. In summer, I never have candida.
I need then to increase protein to compensate for low fat diet, or I will just disappear (I'm 6.2 pounds, about 5.2 feet).
I can't afford to lose weight.
I'll decide what to do tomorrow...
--------- No more muscles: I suppose any milk product can do that histamin increase?
I usually have no problem with digested milk products like cheese, yoghurt and kefir.
The more we read, we wonder, what is left for us to eat?
veggies, even organic, are also poor in minerals, they do not nourish well, we need supplements... Oils/fat are bad for candida. Carbs and sugar too. Meats are full of fats, so no. Cheese and milk products, double no as they are allergenic, and high in fats usually. No seeds, no grains (too oily). Fruits are too sweet, so no.
Well... I wish stone soup and sand would be somehow nourishing...
Posts: 6199 | From Brussels | Registered: Oct 2007
| IP: Logged |
posted
Sounds like you are taking this to too much of an extreme. There's a difference between LOW fat and NO fat!
I think eating lean meats as part of a balanced meal is perfectly fine; so are "good" grains like buckwheat, quinoa, wild rice, etc. Sourdough bread. There are plenty of low fat dairy products around too -- low fat kefir and yogurts are available, as well as lower fat cheeses. Lower glycemic fruit choices include tart apples, blueberries, etc. Adding herbs & spices to your meals helps curb the stimulation of microbial growth from your food intake, and adds other healthful benefits.
The foods that should be as much as possible avoided are: packaged/processed & junk foods!
Eliminating entire food groups isn't the objective, nor is it healthy. You don't have to starve yourself, nor should you. The idea is to shift the balance of gut flora towards the good guys and away from the bad over time ... not to hurt YOURSELF! Obviously you need to get enough calories to sustain your body.
-------------------- Please consult your physician before making any changes to your diet, medications, or supplements. I am not a healthcare professional and nothing I write should be construed as medical advice. Posts: 166 | From USA | Registered: Dec 2014
| IP: Logged |
Brussels
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 13480
posted
Lymetoo, I'm about 90 pounds! 6 pounds is my cat...
I must have done a wrong weight conversion. I'm not used to what you guys in the US and UK use, the prehistoric STONES and POUNDS as weight measurement!!!! ??
How many 'stones' do you weight, someone in Ireland asked me once... Which stone: a big one or a small one??, I said.
Since that, really, I wonder how can you guys stick to these old fashioned ways of counting, feet, pound, stone, whatever, when there are so many more advanced ways of counting!!!?
----------------
Sonatina, no worry. I'm in this diet trial for much longer than you are, probably.
I lost, well, 500 grams in 2 days in a low fat diet. Well, the online converter said, 1.1 lb. In 2 days! Nope, I can't afford that, really.
So I decided to follow the old theory about digestion: when I eat high fat, I eat low carb, low sugar, more acid stuff together.
Other meal, I eat low fat, low protein, and high carb, and possibly fruits.
The idea is that: proteins and fats are digested in acid environment and mostly in the stomach.
Carbs, sugars are digested in alkaline environment, and in the gut, not stomach.
If you mix the two, nothing works well because of a pH problem.
I am also supplementing with bitter herbs, to increase bile production after eating fats.
But I got to tell you guys, so far so good with the apple cider vinegar, and low fat diet though. Very interesting experience.
These two days proved to me that my pancreas do get overwork on having both carbs and fats together.
I'll see if I can divide into meals like I said above, or just divide into days: one day high fat, the other high carb, and let's see.
Posts: 6199 | From Brussels | Registered: Oct 2007
| IP: Logged |
Brussels
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 13480
posted
Just an update: I 'm had a great Xmas with almond cakes, brownies, Xmas cookies, wine and champagne. Well, i was tired this morning, but no candida flare so far.
Not recommending that to anyone, but just to say that kefir on and off, apple cider vinegar every day (about 2-3 tbspoons) is doing the job well to keep candida under control.
Somehow the apple vinegar is doing more than I expected. I am not consuming fermented veggies for the moment, even though I think my veggies are almost ready.
I need to take it on empty stomach, or I feel nauseous.
Today, no apple cider vinegar either, my skin is almost totally clear.
I think I drank a bit too much alcohol yesterday, today I was tired, but well, I'm not used to drinking alcohol and I am still herxing, on and off. I need chlorella every other day, then I feel pretty normal.
Apple vinegar does not kill fast, it's slower. Nothing like MMS, or oregano... Much milder. It's been about a week or more on it. I feel I'm going to continue taking it until cold season finishes.
Posts: 6199 | From Brussels | Registered: Oct 2007
| IP: Logged |
Brussels
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 13480
posted
Apple cider vinegar alone is not enough now for my high year end sugar consumption. Some symptoms are coming back.
My fermented veggies were ready, and I decided to go back to them, once a day, and another time take the vinegar.
Late in the evening, I was tired. I load myself now with chlorella twice a day, then my days get normal.
But the temperature dropped drastically here in Switzerland, and my skin is suffering again (still okay, but I can't afford taking so much sugar, wine, champagne), so I'm restraining sugar again.
I've been out in the snow a couple of hours a day, so I think that plays a role on my toe candida...
After a couple of weeks on the vinegar thing, I do feel I'm toxic (with herxes), so now, I'm trying to find a balance to keep on going during the coldest months....
Happy New Year everbody!!
Posts: 6199 | From Brussels | Registered: Oct 2007
| IP: Logged |
The Lyme Disease Network is a non-profit organization funded by individual donations. If you would like to support the Network and the LymeNet system of Web services, please send your donations to:
The
Lyme Disease Network of New Jersey 907 Pebble Creek Court,
Pennington,
NJ08534USA http://www.lymenet.org/
UBBFriend: Email this page to someone!
![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
Printer-friendly view of this topic