posted
Green smoothies are all the rage these days with many people consuming them every day or at least several times a week in an attempt to get healthy and “alkalize” the body.
Whenever I visit the cafe of my local healthfood store, there are usually several people in gym clothes lined up to order a green smoothie to sip after their workout.
Green smoothies are made by blending large amounts of raw leafy green vegetables with fruit to soften and sweeten the taste. Typical vegetables included in green smoothies are kale, spinach, swiss chard, collard greens, celery, broccoli, and parsley.
Is the green smoothie fad a truly healthy habit over the long term or can consumption of these seemingly healthy drinks in fact contribute to serious health problems? Raw Leafy Greens Contain High Oxalate Levels
Frequent consumption of large quantities of raw, leafy green vegetables as occurs when a person drinks green smoothies can be deceiving at first as a person will probably initially feel great after adopting this habit particularly if he or she is coming off a highly processed, nutrient poor diet.
The vegetables used in green smoothies are almost without exception high oxalate foods. Over time, a high oxalate diet can contribute to some very serious health problems particularly if you are one of the 20% of people (1 in 5) that have a genetic tendency to produce oxalates or if you suffer from candida or other fungal challenge. In those cases, a high oxalate diet can deal a devastating blow to health. Oxalate Toxicity Not a New Problem
Humans have suffered the effects of oxalate toxicity since ancient times. A 2000 year old mummy from Chile was discovered through x-ray analysis to have an oxalate kidney stone about the size of a golf ball!
Oxalates can be deposited almost anywhere in the body and wherever they land, pain or worse is the result.
75-90% of kidney stones are oxalate related with 10-15% of Americans afflicted at some point during their lives. As the star shaped crystalline stones pass from the kidney, they cause pressure and pain in the bladder and urethra and can actually tear up the walls of the urinary tract. Oxalate Stones Can Form in Any Tissue
Oxalate stones can show up in any body tissue including the brain and even the heart.
Oxalate crystals resembling shards of glass which become lodged in the heart cause tiny tears and damage to this vital muscle with every single contraction pumping life giving blood to the rest of the body.
Oxalate crystals which end up in the thyroid can cause thyroid disease by damaging thyroid tissue.
A frequent location for oxalates to end up is skeletal muscle which will cause pain with even normal movement and make exercise nearly impossible. Dr. William Shaw, Director of The Great Plains Laboratory for Health, Nutrition and Metabolism who has studied oxalates extensively, is convinced that oxalate toxicity is a factor in fibromyalgia the pain of which can absolutely devastate a person’s life. Vulvodynia – Painful Sex
Cases of women experiencing painful sex are on the rise with oxalates a possible culprit.
Vulvodynia, a condition causing pain in and around the vagina, is linked to oxalates deposited in this delicate reproductive tissue. Oxalate crystals are very acidic and they cause irritation, burning, and stinging sensations for affected women with an accompanying feeling of rawness whenever they engage in sexual relations. Oxalates Are Fungal in Origin
A surprising finding is that oxalates are produced in large amounts by fungus. Large stones have been found in the sinuses and lungs of people suffering from systemic fungal infections such as candida or Aspergillus.
Therefore, anyone who suffers from any sort of candida or other fungal challenge like fungus nails or dandruff would be wise to be very concerned about oxalate intake via the diet.
Consumption of green smoothies would not in any way contribute to improvement of health in these situations. Given that the majority of people today suffer from gut imbalance/fungal issues caused by antibiotic and prescription drug use along with consumption of processed foods, a high oxalate diet which includes green smoothies is an unwise practice for virtually everyone. Does Cooking Destroy Oxalates?
Would it be safe to prepare green smoothies with leafy greens that have been lightly steamed first?
Not really, because oxalates are extremely stable and while cooking high oxalate foods like leafy greens (and discarding the cooking water) does reduce the oxalate level, it remains quite high.
Since green smoothies are consumed so frequently by those who swear by them, a light steaming of the veggies first would not make a significant difference over the long term. Healthier Alternatives to Green Smoothies
The best course of action for health, then, is to opt out of the green smoothie fad.
If you enjoy green leafy vegetables, enjoy them in moderation in salads or cook them and carefully drain and discard all the cooking water – never use it in soups and sauces! Be sure to serve cooked leafy greens with a healthy, traditional fat like butter (not margarine or any factory fats synthesized with rancid and/or GMO vegetable oils) for maximum absorption of minerals.
Another option is to drink raw cultured vegetable juice or eat raw cultured vegetables. Not only will you get enhanced nutrition from the culturing process which adds enzymes and nutrients, but you will also get a beneficial and therapeutic dose of probiotics to help balance gut function and improve digestion.
Another option is to do shots of fresh, green wheatgrass juice. Wheatgrass juice is very low in oxalic acid. Click here for my favorite green juice recipe using wheatgrass juice.
If you already are suffering from some of the ailments described in this article and suspect a high oxalate diet which includes green smoothies or a daily spinach salad may be the cause, stop this practice immediately and consult with a holistic physician who can guide you on the road to recovery and how to best rid your body of the oxalate crystals that are potentially irritating one or more of your body tissues.
Sarah, The Healthy Home Economist
Author, Get Your Fats Straight
Sources:
The Role of Oxalates in Autism and Chronic Disorders, William Shaw PhD
-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96222 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
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Tincup
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Hey TuTu,
I tried getting this link yesterday- at least 4 times- but it kept jamming up my computer to where I had to shut down and reboot. That has never happened before. Before and after trying that site though, I was able to go to many other sites with no problem.
Tried it again today and same thing happened. I can see the page, but if I try to scroll down to read the page it locks up everything. ????
Any way you could copy and paste article here? That would be nice!!! Tanks!
-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96222 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
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Silverwolf
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posted
Hi there <<<<< Lymetoo, and Tincup >>>>>,
It happened to us yesterday, that's why we went to the Facebook site, and TxC' got it up and readable there.
I am not tech savvy, so didn't know if it was just our laptop. It has been okay so far tho' other than the 'green smoothie' site here on this thread.
Jus' Silverwolfi
-------------------- 2006,May-August2006 Dx w/ Lyme/Bartonella/White Matter Lesion Disease on Brain. [ Clinical Dx w/ two positives and several IND's on the tests from Igenex ], Prior Dx of CFIDS/CEBV 1992, and FMS '93-'94 Diabetes*2 Dx 10/'08 Posts: 3581 | From SE Idaho | Registered: May 2006
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glm1111
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posted
Same thing happened to me. My computer said it was due to a long running script. So, does anyone know why the green smoothies can devastate our health? Too much oxalate acid in some greens maybe?
Gael
-------------------- PARASITES/WORMS ARE NOW RECOGNIZED AS THE NUMBER 1 CO-INFECTION IN LYME DISEASE BY ILADS* Posts: 6418 | From philadelphia pa | Registered: Jul 2008
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posted
I went to my FB page and tried again.. The link is still "bad".. so I was finally able to cut and paste it.
I left out the link so it doesn't cause problems for anyone else.
-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96222 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
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Tincup
Honored Contributor (10K+ posts)
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posted
VERY interesting. So glad you copied it here. Thanks TuTu. And good to know it wasn't "just me" with the computer problems. I was getting to feel rather stupid, ya know.
This food deal! It's getting frustration- actually way beyond frustrating- to find stuff good for me that I can eat, that tastes good, that fits my low budget, that slips carefully down my touchy throat without getting stuck, that requires little to no cooking, etc!!!
So many limitations, low-fat for this, high fat for that, no salt, need more salt, no sugar, organic only, no artificial colors, high protein feels good, but not good for me, etc. GEEZE!
And I can not find a dietician that will even consider helping me. One doc chewed a dietician out for refusing to assist me and saying- "no one can have this much stuff going on- there is no diet plan for you."
Getting to the point I am going to have to settle for having nothing but oysters and beer and then just lay around being lazy and happy.
posted
I know.. My list of foods gets shorter every day.
-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96222 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
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Catgirl
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posted
Good stuff Lymetoo, thanks for posting!
-------------------- --Keep an open mind about everything. Also, remember to visit ACTIVISM (we can change things together). Posts: 5418 | From earth | Registered: Mar 2011
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posted
I recently finished with the "Clean Gut" diet in which there are green smoothies. After a little over 2 weeks on this 3-week diet, I had quite the herx. If I recall correctly, the author regards greens as purifying and cleansing.
Since then, I've been adding a small amount of greens in a smoothie once a day after soaking in produce wash. I can see how large amounts of anything would not be a good idea but how about small amounts of greens?
Posts: 705 | From WA state | Registered: Jul 2011
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posted
I tend to gravitate to smoothies in the summertime, but otherwise, I try to vary between eating cooked greens and raw greens.
Too much of anything can be bad ... but I believe cooking fixes the problem.
Terry Wahl's diet recommends 3 cups of greens per day either cooked or raw and hers is based on science and mitochondria. I think they're good, it's just maybe smoothies EVERY day is not the way to do it.
-------------------- sixgoofykids.blogspot.com Posts: 13449 | From Ohio | Registered: Feb 2007
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posted
Thanks for posting this. I didn't know about the possibility of oxalates forming crystals in other parts of the body besides the kidneys (although I have heard of crystals in the inner ear causing Meniere's--not sure if that's caused by the same problem).
Yes, spinach is a very high oxalate food, so it should only be consumed in moderation. and with lots of water, especially in summertime.
However, other leafy greens and green vegetables don't have nearly the amount of high oxalates in them as spinach does (from what I've read and heard).
There is a lot of misinformation about the oxalalte content of green foods.
As far as green smoothies are concerned, if one varies their consumption of greens each time (a few per week up to one smoothie a day), then there shouldn't be a problem.
If a person has a predisposition towards kidney stones, then they should definitely limit their spinach intake, but other leafy greens are ok (also avoid too much rhubarb).
Drinking at least eight 8 oz. glasses of water should help a person flush out their system any of the bad debris, too.
Sugar-sweetened beverages are linked to a higher risk of stones. However, I don't know if that is only in relation to drinking soft drinks or also fruit juice (probably mainly colas, etc.)
Apparently, green tea and other tea and coffee is also ok to drink and not a cause for higher incidence of stones.
Posts: 35 | From Eastern U.S.A. | Registered: Feb 2015
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poppy
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posted
Kale irritates my stomach big time. None of the others in the list have ever bothered me. Don't think I have eaten swiss chard, though.
Posts: 2888 | From USA | Registered: Mar 2004
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It looks like some greens/vegetables are a lot worse than others.
I was wrong about the colas and soft drinks being protagonists in the oxalate camp. I've heard, though, that sweetened beverages can exacerbate stone formation, I guess for other reasons than high oxalate content (although on this chart, some fruit juices are in the high category).
Coffee and teas are associated with a lower risk of stones, according to "Nutrition Action Newsletter" source.
A mix of salad greens and lettuces once a day is a great idea and shouldn't pose a problem for most.
Variety is a good course of action in making the green smoothies. They really are helpful as a detoxification strategy and shouldn't be discounted overall without more thorough research.
Posts: 35 | From Eastern U.S.A. | Registered: Feb 2015
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Tincup
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Ah HA! Skunk cabbage.
Grows in really wet places- pops up in early spring because it produces its own heat to melt surrounding ice. Stinks to the high heavens. Contains some of the worst oxalates it appears.
What I now know to be these oxalate crystals were thought by old-timers (and myself as a result of talking with them) to be equal to invisible shards of glass due to the harm they caused if eating the raw leaves.
Heard of people dying from them, supposedly because the glass shards would get imbedded in tongues, throat and the belly of those eating it, would cause swelling and eventually infections.
However, once the plant was cooked in multiple baths of water it was declared to be safe to eat. You wouldn't catch me anywhere near being willing to eat it though. It stunk so bad I didn't want to get within a mile of it, much less eat it.
Since I got my information from old-timers and native Americans and there sometimes was a communication gap- I didn't always speak their language- I kept my distance from the skunk cabbage.
Interesting this post allowed me to see what I hadn't before. I now know what they were telling me about the skunk cabbage is basically true. I learned something today. That's great!
Here is a random picture of the skunk cabbage. Notice here they claim the leaves are "poisonous", but don't describe the full story behind them.
Tincup
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posted
Now I'm concerned. I crave spinach. I eat it raw at least once a day or more. My salads are almost all spinach based unless it is early spring and I can get fresh garden lettuce.
I was told recently by someone NOT to eat spinach due to already overload of iron, however, then read something that said spinach blocks iron absorption, so I am ok there.
And now this other thing- the oxalates.
So what am I craving in spinach that I don't get elsewhere and is the amount I am eating a problem?
Tincup
Honored Contributor (10K+ posts)
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posted
Sacredheart- I am laughing. Never even considered eating kale raw, but I see you eat it raw in salads daily. As a lover of cooked kale, who never even tried to eat a raw leaf (never even thought to)- it seems strange to do that. Guess it is good?
Any specific kind better than another? Smaller leaves sweeter and more tender I guess? Tell me more!
posted
Tincup, I've got your answers re what's in spinach! From the internet -
Spinach is high in Vit A (a group of chemical compounds, including lutein in spinach), Vit C, Vit E, Vit K, Mg, Mn, folate (B9), betaine, iron, Vit B2, Ca, potassium, Vit B6, copper, protein, phosphorus, Zn, onions*, selenium, omega 3 fatty acids.
Also a recently discovered opioid called rubiscillin found in spinach.
The iron requires enough Vit C and Ca to be absorbed.
Calcium absorption is not so great from spinach; better from broccoli.
So regarding your question as to what you think you crave in spinach, what do you think?! I suggest an elimination diet...
*I just threw that in there to make sure you're paying attention...
Posts: 13116 | From San Francisco | Registered: May 2006
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posted
Right now I'm eating dandelion greens from my lawn - putting them in the Vitamin with other stuff once a day. I'm also starting up my veggie garden. I've discovered that eating my own food fresh from my garden makes a big difference in how I feel.
Not for everyone but good if you can do it.
Posts: 705 | From WA state | Registered: Jul 2011
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posted
I think oxalates are ok in moderation. The Gerson Institute in San Diego, for example, has people half on fruit juices and half on green juices all day long, and they're still in business!
Posts: 13116 | From San Francisco | Registered: May 2006
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Tincup
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posted
Here I am stomping my feet up and down saying, "SHE GOT ME AGAIN!"
onions* ??? I did see that and was looking at the word on the computer screen almost cross-eyed with my head tipped far to the side, trying to figure it out.
I'll get you later, little miss gator.
HA! I'm studying your post Robin5555888 like I've never read anything before. I thought at first I am dehydrated and need potassium? Been thinking that's a problem for a good while, but get ill if I drink GatorAide (even dye free).
Took some since- not since, ZINC- this spell check sucks- recently and it didn't sit well. ALWAYS need lots of protein and calcium so that could be it?
Then I thought Vit C, as it makes me feel bad if I take supplements with it, so maybe natural is better? Then I figured it was everything in spinach, as I don't get much healthy (raw, organic, etc) food, especially in the winter.
THEN I saw your note about the "opioid called rubiscillin". I found "rubiscolin" by doing a search, and that must be it?
Pain relief does make sense. I have pain; often think I should be called the Queen of Pain. And, for everyone's delight, I'll admit I am a pain! HA!
Nice deal- eating spinach to get a high. Wow, I am stupid special! Duh! Anyhow...
Very much appreciate you doing a search for me. That is so nice. Thank you.
I'll keep thinking on it. There is something in the spinach that I "need", just curious as to what it is? You gave me a starting place. Tanks berry mush.
-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96222 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
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Tincup
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posted
LymeNot,
So nice to hear you are eating the dandelion greens! Didn't know many others did that, just thought it was me being weird! (Not that YOU are weird!) Good source of vitamin C. I sometimes freak out people when passing a tiger lily (wild) and pulling off a petal to eat. Also put them in salads to brighten them up and add instant vitamins.
Glad you also have a garden. I would love to have one of my own- I'm just too far from the ground to reach it much these days, so living off others labor.
Tincup
Honored Contributor (10K+ posts)
Member # 5829
posted
Sorry SacredHeart. Had to take care of TuTu first.
That sounds sort of good, I think. I use hot pepper vinegar on kale (cooked) so trying that might be good. It just seems strange I guess. After all the kale we've grown and eaten, it never occurred to me to eat it raw.
Thanks for the suggestion. I will be brave and try it soon!
Rumigirl
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posted
TC, I haven't heard anyone mention Skunk Cabbage in aeons!!! Used to see it all over the woods & swamp when I was growing up. Eating it??!! Whoa, can't imagine that, given the smell.
Anyway, TC, you know your favorite diet: ice cream!! (Well, I do love it myself, just have to moderate that one, sadly). Although, one summer, we got food from an Amish farmer regularly. He made ice cream from the raw milk & cream of his cows, and some with Stevia----heavenly! Sorry, getting off topic, couldn't resist.
On the green smoothies, etc., NOTHING is right for everyone! Each person has their own Metabolic Type and requirements, which may change sometimes. There are foods that are good for some and not others.
There will never be a particular diet or foods that are right for everyone. The idea that everyone should "alkalize" is absurd! Some people are too alkaline!
Plus, the same food will make one person more alkaline, and another more acid, depending on their metabolism. (This is what I've been doing professionally for decades, it's complex).
Plus, the oxalate issue IS a big one, esp for some Metablolic Types (This is NOT meant as an ad!)..
Posts: 3771 | From around | Registered: Mar 2008
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posted
Rumigirl, do you know anything more about metabolic types and oxalates, as in are there some metabolic types that would not do well with oxalate foods like spinach?
Ok, must be rubiscolin then - can't read my own writing...and I've never heard of it either...the magic ingredient...
Ha, so you all found my spinach-with-onions-in-it comment. I meant to say garlic. Spinach grown with garlic in the soil. That kind of spinach tastes the best.
And speaking of recommendations, I think we needs some kale ice cream, so we can eat ice cream and not feel guilty. Don't know that I can go as far as to recommend skunk cabbage ice cream (Chunky Skunky?), but kale ice cream could possibly fly if they pulverize the kale first.
Posts: 13116 | From San Francisco | Registered: May 2006
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Tincup
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posted
Rumi,
Glad to know you have heard of Skunk Cabbage and can verify the stink! Pretty plant, but P-P-P- U-U-U-U-U!!!!
I will confess. I use to tease the kids that we were having skunk cabbage for supper if they didn't behave. I made them all find and learn about one edible plant each time we ventured out, and then prepare or cook them and eat them when we got back to camp or home.
Thanks for the other info you shared. I don't feel as anxious about it now. And yes, we are all different. Glad you reminded me!
And yes, when all else fails, it is ice cream that saves the day!
PS- Not kale ice cream little bird. There is a time and place for everything, so keep your crushed kale out of my ice cream!
posted
Oh my .. how could I have forgotten about the raspberries?? I guess it's because TC hasn't been around lately and I haven't be able to harrass her!!
-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96222 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
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