LymeNet Flash: Need advice on how to beat babeosis?

LymeNet on Facebook

LymeNet on Twitter

Follow @LymeDiseaseNet

The Lyme Disease Network receives a commission from Amazon.com for each purchase originating from this site.

When purchasing from Amazon.com, please
click here first.

Thank you.

Dedicated to the Bachmann Family

LymeNet needs your help:
LymeNet 2020 fund drive

The Lyme Disease Network is a non-profit organization funded by individual donations.

»	LymeNet Flash » Questions and Discussion » Medical Questions » Need advice on how to beat babeosis?

UBBFriend: Email this page to someone!

Author

Topic: Need advice on how to beat babeosis?

KH
LymeNet Contributor
Member # 4170

posted

Brief history on me: I got lyme from my husband last Feb and started treatment in March 2004. Husband tested positive for babesia in April 2004, and we both did 5 months of mepron/zith (6 bottles each). We also added in artemisin the last month and a half. I did not test positive but decided to treat just in case.

For the last few months I've have bab type symptoms and today I got my Bowen results and it was positive for babesia. My lyme count is way down to 1:8 (it was 1:132 in March 2004).

What else can I do to get rid of this?? What has worked for others? I know there are people who keep relapsing but I know others were successfully treated. I was hoping that because I've not had this for years it might be easier to treat. I feel my body won't be able to keep the lyme in check if I have babs in my body as well.

Posts: 101 | From Houston, Tx | Registered: Jul 2003 | IP: Logged |

DiffyQue
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 3317

posted

Hello KH,

Quick response:

Pancreatin, as an adjunctive agent, has some factors, enzymatic and/or others, that alone, or in combination might inhibit and/or kill off babesia.

Malaria is the treatment-model for babs.; one comparative analysis, Hog Pancreas vs.Bee venom, showed both inhibitory and killing profiles of ea. agent.

Hog P. effected P. Falciparum at two stages in develop. the second stage being the adult stage.

Bee venom, if I recall correctly got only one stage.

Search this site in med.abstracts with
"Hog Pancreas vs Bee venom" ; it should come up.

[This message has been edited by DiffyQue (edited 24 January 2005).]

[This message has been edited by DiffyQue (edited 25 January 2005).]

Posts: 1172 | Registered: Nov 2002 | IP: Logged |

david1097
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 3662

posted

From everything I could find, unless you did a blood transfusion with your husband, you could not have gotten babesia from him.

Could you have had it before and been asymtomatic?

It is VERY tough to get rid of (some say impossible) It is very similar to malaria and despite the claims of "cure" for malaria it is always still there, just not noticeable, all the drugs do is knock it back to a low level.

I am almost a year on atavaquone based drugs + artiminisin + macrolides. I stopped at 6 months and relapsed with babesia so am now back on it.

There has been a paper published on the use of heprin as a reproductive inhibitor for babesia, but it is only in a test tube, although there has been some discussion on this board regarding heparin treatment for Lyme (and what ever else might be unknowingly mixed it.)

As far as Bowen goes, I am skeptical as they apparently use a florescent antibody to tag the various organisms and then view them. Babesia should be readily visible in the red blood cells as piroplasms (cross shaped things). the problem is how to spot them out of a whole bunch of red blood cells, most of which are OK. I guess the florescence is supposed to do this but I don't know if they then look for the piroplasms in the identified cells.

The big issue I have with bowen is where did they get the highly purified antibodies from and are they specific enough to give no false positives.

Good luck.

Posts: 1184 | From north america | Registered: Feb 2003 | IP: Logged |

liz28
Unregistered

posted

The combination I'm on is artemisinin 400-500 mg/day, mepron 10ml/2x day, and ketek. And also septra, which is prescribed for bartonella, but may have an effect on babs as well.

Don't have a clue if I'm cured, but I do feel much better.

IP: Logged |

minoucat
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 5175

posted

I haven't seen anything conclusively citing babs as an STD, but since it is blood borne, and since blood can be ejaculated by the male during sex, I don't see why that isn't a likely method of transmission.

KH, I did the mepron/zithromaz/artemesinin therapy for 7 months. I was clearly symptmatic at least through the 5th month. I've been off it for 3 months, and symptom free for babs. My husband has had to do 10 months of this tx -- we'll see how it comes out for him. Mepron has not worked well for some people. I think the long-term and fairly high-dose artemesinin (we stayed on it, with breaks, at 600 mg daily for the whole treatment period) was very important for us.

Alternative abx treatments include Mepron, Biaxin, & Septra DS; Doxy, Cipro, Plaq & Malarone; Clindamycin and oral Quinine .

Good luck. This is a very frustrating struggle, and the coinfections seem to strengthen each other.

Posts: 2331 | From WA | Registered: Jan 2004 | IP: Logged |

GiGi
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 259

posted

Maybe you can get a couple of rounds (48 pills total, or 24 in each package) of Riamet at an International pharmacy in Germany or Europe. That fixed Babesia for me as well as for my husband. The cost about 90 Euros for both. With the poor exchange rate, it is a little more now, closer to $140. for both courses. Maybe a friend of a friend can get it. There is an international pharmacy in Munich. If you need help, e-mail me. I think I have their phone #.

As an aside, I transmitted all Lyme, all 6 co-infections (Babesia, Ehrlichiosa, Bartonella, Rickettsia, Chlamydia, Mycoplasma) to my husband. All in one neat package. Thankfully he is also well now. So no one should take a chance. Protect yourself.

Take care.

P.S. Forgot to say, one course of Riamet takes a total of 60 hours. In other words, you take the 24 tablets at a specific interval, 4 each time, all within a total of 60 hours.
If not all symptoms are gone, repeat a couple of weeks later.

[This message has been edited by GiGi (edited 25 January 2005).]

Posts: 9834 | From Washington State | Registered: Oct 2000 | IP: Logged |

lymelady
LymeNet Contributor
Member # 6207

posted

I thought you had to take mepron with either quinine or clindamycin to really "get" babs.

Babs I think has caused my more trouble than the lyme, although like love and marriage, they go together.

My horrible vertigo is only eased with taking babs medication. Also someone on this forum said their doctor said babs settles in the lower back, which along with the vertigo was my first and most painful symptom (one leg actually dragged for awhile).

Don't know if it true. But Malaria symptoms come every other day; my symptoms flare every other day. Even though there does not seem to be a correlation here sciencewise, it makes me wonder.

I am on mepron, clindy and artesiminin, second month and have had a little bit of success. (also ramping up on mino very slowly).

Babs is a "B"
Lymelady

Posts: 484 | From Fredericksburg, Va USA | Registered: Sep 2004 | IP: Logged |

KH
LymeNet Contributor
Member # 4170

posted

Any others out there with advice as to how to rid ourselves of babesia?

Has anyone tried artiminisin alone, at high doses?

Is there anyone else with experience with Riamet or helparin?

Thank you for all of your comments, insight.
KH

Posts: 101 | From Houston, Tx | Registered: Jul 2003 | IP: Logged |

GiGi
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 259

posted

Suggest you search here: "Bpeck" going back at least a couple of years re babesia and artemesinin --- there was extensive talk about all.

Riamet is made by Swiss company Novartis. Read up on it. Every patient that I know who has taken it, has improved or cleared Babesia. We did and Riamet did the trick. Just talked a patient of my doctor who took the first round over 2-1/2 days, and he says he is much, much better, and will do another round later on, as determined by ART.

If you are heavy metal toxic, etc., since the protozoa settle with the metals, improvement is hard to come by, no matter what you take. When the metals are forced out or helped out, that's when things start to happen, not only with Babesia, but many other microorganisms that are not wanted.

Take care.

[This message has been edited by GiGi (edited 25 January 2005).]

Posts: 9834 | From Washington State | Registered: Oct 2000 | IP: Logged |

KH
LymeNet Contributor
Member # 4170

posted

How does one get a hold of Riamet? I have read about this drug last year and was hoping it would become available in the US soon.

I have read all of BPeck's postings many times. What she took is also not available in the US. Artemos, I think it was called.

Do you think taking 500 mg 3 times a day of Allergy Research Artiminisin would work?

Posts: 101 | From Houston, Tx | Registered: Jul 2003 | IP: Logged |

ConnieMc
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 191

posted

quote:
Originally posted by GiGi:
Maybe you can get a couple of rounds (48 pills total, or 24 in each package) of Riamet at an International pharmacy in Germany or Europe. (edited 25 January 2005).]

Gigi, what exactly is Riamet? Is it dangerous or risky? Does it require monitoring by a doctor, specific lab studies, anything?

Someone also mentioned that it may eventually be approved for use in the US. What is the status of this? Anyone know?

Thank you...

Posts: 2276 | From NC | Registered: Oct 2000 | IP: Logged |

James H
LymeNet Contributor
Member # 6380

posted

Riamet is one of the Artemisinin derivatives combined with another anti-malarial drug, for a two pronged attack. I don't remember the specifics, but it should be easy to find if you do a search.

One thing about the malaria drugs in general... You do not want to take these without medical guidance as most are quite toxic and some can kill you if taken at higher than recommended doses or for too long... Something people seem to do with Lyme and co-infections.

These are intended only taken for a few days when treating malaria.

Be careful with these.

Personally I would want to be careful even with the herbal artemisinin, as there may be a point where it does damage if overdone.

Posts: 714 | From San Antonio TX | Registered: Oct 2004 | IP: Logged |

GiGi
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 259

posted

My doctor limits Artemesinin to 4-6 weeks and then a long break. If artemesinin tests positive with ART in the weeks following, he may repeat it. But only then. We also did not take Mepron any longer than as ART determined. Neither one worked completely. Riamet did. Some people repeat the Riamet several weeks later if needed. But after the first 24 tablets taken within 60 hours, that's it. No second course right away.

Here is the introduction by Novartis of RIAMET in 2001. in pdf. bpeck posted it in April 2003. I have a paper copy, but I think like many of the more important material, it has been wiped off the board permanently.

MEDIA RELEASE ? COMMUNIQU� AUX MEDIAS ? MEDIENMITTEILUNG (PDF)
... International Society of Travel Medicine. annual conference, Novartis Pharma A.G Basel introduces Riamet. (artemether plus. lumefantrine) in Europe. Riamet ... travel medicine and director ...
biodiversityeconomics.org/business/handbook/documents/hand-01-20b.pdf - 24k - View as html - More from this site
Congress material
... 17th September 1998. Novartis Satellite Symposium ... Riamet� (artemether and lumefantrine) as standby emergency treatment. 6th Conference of the. International Society of Travel Medicine ...
malariaandhealth.com/professional/drug_therapy/11_congressmaterial.htm - 9k - Cached - More from this site
Poster presentations (PDF)
... Interaction trial between artemether-lumefantrine (Riamet. ) and ... in the Novartis Information zone at the 8th Conference of the. International Society of Travel Medicine (CISTM8), 7 ...
malariaandhealth.com/professional/download/posterbook/Posterbook.pdf - 999k - View as html - More from this site
Malaria and Health - Public information
... Malaria Foundation International site provides all ... International Society of Travel Medicine is an ... of professionals dedicated to the advancement of the speciality of travel medicine ... www.riamet.com/public/hotline.htm - 8k - Cached - More from this site
Pharmazie 3 - Translate this page
von Ulrike Wagner, Innsbruck. Malaria war ein Schwerpunkt des 7. Kongresses der International Society of Travel Medicine (ISTM) Ende Mai in Innsbruck. ... Novartis hat mit der Weltgesundheitsorganisation (WHO) eine Abmachung getroffen, nach der das Unternehmen Riamet ... www.pharmazeutische-zeitung.de/pza/2001-24/pharm3.htm - 10k - Cached - More from this site
Africa news
Information about Africa in general and Business Development Center for West Africa ... from the International Community Liberian ... Civil society representatives will ... Novartis launched COARTEM, a new drug to cure malaria. It has been used extensively by Netcare Travel ...
us-africa.tripod.com/news.html - 113k - Cached - More from this site
BESZ�MOL� AZ ISTM VIII. KONFERENCI�J�R�L
BESZ�MOL� AZ INTERNATIONAL SOCIETY OF TRAVEL MEDICINE VIII. NEMZETK�ZI KONFERENCI�J�R�L. 2003. M�JUS 7-11. K�Z�TT NEW YORKBAN TARTOTT�K A T�RSAS�G (ISTM) NYOLCADIK NEMZETK�ZI KONFERENCI�J�T. ... is gazdagodott a k�n�lat. Riamet [(Novartis) arthemether/lume-fantrin] n�ven �j ... www.antsz.hu/oek/epinfo/szoveg/Heti2003/heti321.htm - 30k - Cached - More from this site

In order to show you the most relevant results, we have omitted some entries very similar to the ones already displayed.
If you like, you can repeat the search with the omitted results included.

Posts: 9834 | From Washington State | Registered: Oct 2000 | IP: Logged |

GiGi
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 259

posted

Do you think taking 500 mg 3 times a day of Allergy Research Artiminisin would work?

My doctor prescribes 5 mg per 1 kilogram (approx. 2 lbs) of bodyweight two times a day, taken either one hour before meal or 4 hours after a meal. For a 120 lbs person, this would be 300 mg in the AM and 300 mg in the evening. No longer than 6 weeks.

So unless you weigh 300 pounds, 1500 mg a day would seem out of line. Don't you think you should ask your doctor?

Take care.

So sorry, I am not an optimist when it comes to FDA approval of anything. And if they do approve it, what then ----- has anyone listened to the news lately????

Posts: 9834 | From Washington State | Registered: Oct 2000 | IP: Logged |

Lymetoo
Moderator
Member # 743

posted

quote:
Originally posted by KH:

Do you think taking 500 mg 3 times a day of Allergy Research Artiminisin would work?

That's triple the usual dosage.

------------------
oops!
Lymetutu

Posts: 96239 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001 | IP: Logged |

Beverly
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 1271

posted

Hi KH,

I have been treating Babesia with Malarone, Plaquenil and Zithromax, so far so good. I hope it keeps working for me.

Good luck to you.

Posts: 6641 | From Michigan | Registered: Jun 2001 | IP: Logged |

ConnieMc
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 191

posted

quote:
Originally posted by GiGi:
There is an international pharmacy in Munich. If you need help, e-mail me. I think I have their phone #.
(edited 25 January 2005).]

Gigi, is it possible for me to get the phone number from you? Did you have any difficulty dealing with getting this through the mail? Wouldn't it be illegal for an international pharmacy to send something through the mail that is not approved in the US? Just curious if ordering something like this puts me at any legal risk.

Thank you!

Posts: 2276 | From NC | Registered: Oct 2000 | IP: Logged |

Aniek
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 5374

posted

I've been treating babesia with Ketek, Artemisinin (300mg/day) and Plaquenil. I've been clinically diagnosed, with one equivocal test.

Babesia symptoms, particularly lightheadedness and vertigo, increased quickly in starting the Artemisinin. So have menstrual cramps, which have always been more of a lower back pain for me.

If we decide I need Mepron, I won't start it until end of May. I'm in the midst of what will be my most stressful semester of law school, I don't need Mepron on top of it.

Posts: 4711 | From Washington, DC | Registered: Mar 2004 | IP: Logged |

Printer-friendly view of this topic

The Lyme Disease Network is a non-profit organization funded by individual donations. If you would like to support the Network and the LymeNet system of Web services, please send your donations to:

The Lyme Disease Network of New Jersey
907 Pebble Creek Court, Pennington, NJ 08534 USA
http://www.lymenet.org/