posted
I am new to this site, but I am concerned regarding recurrent shingles. In the last three months I have had them twice. I had them once as a child and then again after college. I have had lyme disease for the last five years but only began treatment a month ago.
I'm wondering if anyone else has had recurrent shingles, how they think (if at all) it relates to lyme disease and what their doctors have told them. Mine just say, your immune system is stressed -well, I guess so....but why???
Brodius
Posts: 78 | From connecticut | Registered: Jan 2005
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lymiecanuck
Unregistered
posted
Hello and welcome to the site.
I answered your post b/c I thought I had shingles diseminated for about 18 months b/c of a rash I had.
Turns out I did not have shingles. They were lyme rashes. I have tested negative on shingles and chicken pox. This may not appy to u as you actually know u have shingles as where i was only guessing and diagnosiing myself cause i could get not answers.
I have seen people talk about recurring shingles with monthly herxs and should get better with time and when the lyme infection gets control.
Chocolate can bring it out. Not saying u will get it a lot, maybe just happened b/c of just starting treatment or maybe u have been around someone with chicken pox cause that will bring it out as well.
Do a search on Shingles with the button on the right hand corner and posts will come up with others talking about it.
Lymiecanuck
[This message has been edited by lymiecanuck (edited 07 February 2005).]
Premise 11: Long-term 'Lyme disease' sequelae are autoimmune-induced or the result of past infection damage This premise is a corollary of premise 10, where longterm infection sequelae are used to rationalize lack of infection persistence. Very few 'Lyme disease' CDC-referenced studies conclude that long-term sequelae are a result of chronic infection (17,18). Several hypotheses, nevertheless, have been advanced to address the nature of 'late' sequelae. Autoimmune effect is one proposed mechanism derived from indirect evidence (145-147). Another is anatomic damage assumed induced by Bbsl in earlier infection (148). Both positions are hypothetical and use unsupported assumptions. On the other hand, substantial data suggest that late sequelae are the result of persistent infection (see Premise 3). We believe this large number of published studies supporting that a high probability of persistent Bbsl infection casts doubt on the above two mechanisms as primary determinants of pathology. They may, we believe, be included within the context of persistence as potential contributory mechanisms of ongoing pathology. A search for other clinical outcomes of prolonged Bb infection in published data yields no clear answer. The CDC position in 2001 is limited to a few sentences: 'Infrequently, Lyme disease morbidity may be severe, chronic, and disabling. An ill-defined post-Lyme disease syndrome occurs in some persons following treatment for Lyme disease. Lyme disease is rarely, if ever, fatal.' (17). Most published research avoids comment on longterm sequelae (149). Because of the present dearth of relevant data, we propose use of another perspective to address the question of sequelae from late active Borrelia infection. Late effects differing from early effects is used as a rationale that, because of this difference, support that active infection no longer exists. Examination of other persistent infections contradicts this argument. Many infections often present with dissimilar acute and late effects. Examples are Chicken Pox later appearing as 'Shingles', and 'strep throat' manifesting eventually as Rheumatic Fever. Some chronic infections have no acute phase. An example is the virus HHV-8 later manifesting as Kaposi's Sarcoma. Thus, there exists the possibility in late Bbsl infection of not recognizing the presentation. Asymptomatic patients with late infection may also be easily overlooked, and assumed non-infected (20,30-54). Further, ill patients presenting with disseminated symptoms without meeting defined 'Lyme disease' endemicity criteria are also at serious risk of not being considered Bbsl infected.
Posts: 10564 | From PA Where the Creeks are Red | Registered: Jun 2003
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treepatrol
Honored Contributor (10K+ posts)
Member # 4117
posted
WELCOME To LYMENET
Here's more goodys! A typical response to newcomers.
Hi and WELCOME! Get a LLMD or at least Dr that is willing to learn about lyme. Borrelia Burgdorferi is a clinical diagnosis, based on symptoms and on your response to treatment. Good Luck, bumpy road ahead.
( No you don't always see a bite and if there's no bullseye the only way your going to be able to tell is (symptoms) and (((Maybe))) WB or lyme dot blot 3 day urine banged with abx's to free your antigens up for the test. ) See this ( . )thats the size of the larva stage tick... Next nymph size... ( * ) Next is adult ( o ) to ( 0 ) Pretty small????? HUH
posted
hi, thanks for your reply. I will figure out how to do a search for that...at least it's good to know other people get recurring shingles also (although not for them!!!).
Posts: 78 | From connecticut | Registered: Jan 2005
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posted
I have a nasty rash associated with my lyme that has been the bane of my existence. I think there are a whole host of skin conditions that go along with lyme that are being missed and people dont even realize it. pattiecake
Posts: 687 | From PA | Registered: Oct 2004
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posted
Thanks treepatrol - that is so interesting to me b/c the first outbreak of shingles this time followed what seem to be strep - both of which are mentioned in this article...the strep led me to the doctor who diagnosed lyme and ehrlichia. thanks for all the new reading material also!
Posts: 78 | From connecticut | Registered: Jan 2005
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posted
THis won't answer your question just my experience. I had my first outbreak of shingles or what the doctors called shingles after about 4 months of therapy. It was a spot on my back right dead center of my spine about the size of a half dollar.
No test were done to make sure it was shingles but everyone said it "looked" like shingles and the ER doctor said so he put me on valtrex and gave me a cream which I used and it didn't phase it.
The rash finally just ran its course and healed up completely no scar or anything.
My doctor said my immune system was weak so I could get anything at this point. This is my family doctor speaking, I was told the longer I stayed on abx that the harder it was going to be for me to get rid of an infection if I got one because they would have a hard time finding a medication that would work on it.
As for if they where shingles or not I had that to happen before but it would go away in 3 or 4 days this time it didn't go away so quickly took me about a month and I think it was because like my doctor said my immune system is weak! Stacie
Posts: 220 | From Louisiana | Registered: Jun 2004
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posted
well because I had shingles as a child - I wonder if something is a bit hay-wire in the immune department - which has made contending with lyme particularily difficult - maybe now with antibiotic therapy all the immune system harborers are stirred up? I was also given valtrex but antibiotics have been enough for me to deal with right now!
Posts: 78 | From connecticut | Registered: Jan 2005
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During lyme apperently past viruses rear there ugly head. My LLMD tested me for viruses and came back positive for parvo and EBV. She has me on antiviral, Valtrax.
posted
Ditto for me. This is interesting. I had chicken pox as a kid. Last April, I got two big blisters on my abdomen. I happened to have an appointment with my LLMD that week. I showed them to him, and he and the nurse immediately sprang into "action" when I raised my shirt. He recognized it as shingles. The nurse prepared to take a culture. Valtrex cleared it up.
I had been on antibiotics for about six months for my chronic Lyme and babesia. The correlation is interesting especially with the data from others here at lymenet. I don't know if there's a causal relation, but keep the Valtrex handy.
Scott
Posts: 112 | From St. Petersburg, FL USA | Registered: Aug 2003
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