posted
I have a huge tooth nihtmare happening. My former dentist, who was expensive but seemed very good, didn't urge me to (couldn't schedule me to) fis a cavity he discovered in February, until today.. Well, now he tells me I need a crown and root canal, bridge with caps on the adjacent teeth,, or an implant. I saw another dentist, who also said that I would need (at least, now that the first dentist drilled through to the root...) one of these three things. I think it is the middle molar on the bottim right. I have heard much about the dangers of root canals, but the other options seem at least as bad, more invasive, and much more expensive. (the $$$ rival lyme treatment, and I'm totally out of money). What is the way I should go, if I can swing it? Are there different types of rott canals, etc? Alternatives I don't know about? Any thoughts would be welcome!
Posts: 4567 | From ithaca, NY, usa | Registered: Nov 2000
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axelrose
Unregistered
posted
shame you guys banished docdave from this site for misconduct. the post above has a full first and last name against the rules. gigi will tell you no root canals , they'll kill you ,so remove the tooth and get a little falsy to replace it. implants are bad ,crowns and bridges are bad, so leave the space, have your teeth slide and develop tmj and other problem, as per gigi. she post 3 pages of notes for you to read,directly from dr. mercola.,good advice. ask your dentist priot to doing anything
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posted
Careless Dave, I also have had alot of dental issues. A dentist told me that if at all possible not to get a root canal he was dentist of the year in his state and "fixes alot of other mistakes" He was not an alternative dentist per say. I have heard of hollistic dentists but haven't found one yet. However, I have removed my amalgams and had them replaced with the new "plastic" I think. Interesting enough 3 of them are now gray again like the mercury came back to the surface. I was and still use a rife. So I think maybe it pushed more up??????? I know some holistic dentist will test you for the right material to replace the other materials with. I have read that alot of our bacterias with lyme live in the teeth and if you have a crown it keeps the bacteria trapped and we know all of the bacteria from our teeth goes through our body. Sorry I do not have the answers I have read about the best ones I can look up their names but I am sure Gigi has the information about those people. Best of luck to you if you find one I'd like to find out where they are Take care
Axel, Gigi has been very helpful to alot of us I really feel that it is important for us to be able to help each other lately we have been hurting instead. Everyone must do what they feel is best for them she hasn't pushed her beliefs since I have been here but she does present alot of alternative treatments. Can we give peace a chance? Take care
and read all the articles as they are indicated on the top of the first page when you arrive. All the info is the most updated research. Dr. Boyd Haley is Registered Scientist of Record for the U.S. Congress testifying on autism. No doubt he knows what he is talking about.
Both my husband and I were victims of "modern dentistry" ---- and if I had to do it again, I would pull and c l e a n o u t the nasty tooth and go for a well made partial that you can have for years.
I attended a conference recently where the inventor of Cavitat, Bob Jones, who works closely with Dr. Boyd Haley said it clear and loud: Among the hundreds of root canal teeth that he has tested, he has not found one healthy one.
The toxins a root canal develops over time are the worst brain toxin known to man (mercaptans and thioethers) - it interacts with other body tissues, liver tissues, proteins change into new foreign proteins not natural to us and get attacked by the immune system = allergies, and a lot lot more.
That said, I would read and learn and use common sense. A lymed body is already in trouble; as Mimi indicated, the infections, all infections live in the jaw and jaw bone also. That's what makes it so difficult to get rid of them. If you decide to lose the tooth, make sure that when the tooth is pulled, the area is reamed out very thoroughly into the bone. No clue how a dentist would express that in technical terms.
You are the doctor. Do the right thing. Best of luck.
P.S. Axelrose, I have served this site for nearly five years and have given all I have from the knowledge gained, mainly due to a most generous doctor, my own. I really don't need you to speak for me, and I would call it bad etiquette on a board like this. Let's mind our manners a bit more. I am glad you are informed.
Maybe I am blind, but I do not see the name of a doctor spelled out in Haply's post.
Posts: 9834 | From Washington State | Registered: Oct 2000
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beachcomber
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 5320
posted
Axel:
We ("you guys") didn't bannish docdave from this board for misconduct. Dave's misconduct got him bannished. Yes, it is a shame but it is also time to move on from this topic. Can't undo it now.
Dave: Have you been to an Endodontist for a second (or third) opinion? Many Endodontists are pretty conservative about root canals and can do testing to see if the root is still alive, well and not infected. I saw an Endodontist who also treats some Lyme patients, at my dentist's urging. He determined that a crown could save the tooth and root for now. Half my tooth was missing from an old cavity and then a large crack that caused the tooth to split. The crown I have seemed to stop the pain and I don't seem to have any infection - has been 2 months so far. It did cost a bundle though.
ArtistDi
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 2297
posted
I am in a similar predicament. I will be seeing another dentist who does do compatibility testing, etc. My own llmd does not prescribe to root canals, and he had his own taken out as he also has lyme. I have chemical sensitivity issues, so the ei doctor that I have seen also does not advocate for root canals due to the materials used. He feels it could get into the blood stream.
I won't know more about my own case until Thursday. If you go to the web, type in Biological Dentistss, and I believe that there will be a listing of those, hopefully in your area.
I thought i would give you my own personal experience to help you make an informed decision. Please don't take this as medical advice, just my own personal experience that I try to convey when I see these questions come up because I almost lost my life because of a root canal.
I don't want to sound dramatic or scare you, but If I had known what I know now my life would be a bit different today. This all happend before anyone knew that I had lyme disease.
The brief story is that I had a root canal on a tooth that broke and fell out while I was eating one day. It was a my general dentist who performed the procedure.
The tooth continued to be painful and I asked my dentist about this - he said that was impossible because there was no root left. It festered for another 8 months until I realized there was an infection there. He put me on antibiotics and It seemed to settle down a bit. I
went to an endodontist because I knew something wasn't right though. The endodontist took a look at it and found remaining tissue that had not been taken out the first time and he did another root canal. Two days later I was a quadripeliigic. I had come down with a disorder called guillan-barre syndrome and this was due to the bacteria and infection in my tooth/jaw going right to my brain.
I said i made a miraculous recovery (still can't walk properly though, but I'll get there), but I honestly don't know how often this happens to others. My LLMD knew that I had four more teeth that needed root canals and he told me to have them pulled instead. I have had 2 pulled so far and am doing the next two when I can find a good biodentiist.
I wish you the best finding a solution to this problem.
------------------ best regards and blessings, paisley
ConnieMc
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 191
posted
axelrose, aren't you docdave? If so, I have a question for you. Or perhaps Gigi can also contribute to the answer...
I had a bad root canal in a big molar removed last week as it was causing me lots of pain, and was obviously toxic. The dentist said at the time that the tooth root was into my sinuses, and noted that once he pulled it out that there were actually 2 holes between my sinuses and my mouth. Now, I can feel a tiny bit of air crossing between the 2 areas, my month and my sinuses. Like when talking and even a small amount of suction is created during speech, or if I make any sort of slight sucking motion while eating.
This is weird and I am wondering what this means. Will this have to be repaired? If so, how is this done? Does this ever heal up by itself?
The root removal was last Thurs. Is it too early to tell if this will resolve on it's own?
The dentist told me at the time of the extraction that he typically does not see patients back for follow-up after this procedure, but since I had these holes, I have to return for follow-up 2 weeks post procedure.
If this needs repair, who does it, a dentist, or an ENT?
Frankly, I have been scared to call the dentist to report this. Should I?
posted
Docdave hasn't gone anywhere he's still here! he is using an alias. i thought someone woud figure it out by now. here is a hint, welcome to the jungle.
welcome back
Posts: 94 | From Maryland, USA | Registered: Jan 2005
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posted
So 1tick3victims, what do you do with the empty spaces after the removal?
I have 7 root canals and 3 wisdom teeth. A DDS in NY told me I had to have all but 8 teeth removed. This seems drastic, but my sx are drastic, too.
My LLMD recommended Cavitat, but I read questionable things about that. What does one to do?
I have to admit I was considering it until I read Docdave's input and my walking has gotten worse on abx. INPUT PLEASE?! Everybody, Anybody?
Posts: 830 | From Colorado | Registered: Mar 2005
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ConnieMc
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 191
posted
docdave, please come back to answer our questions! We need you! I value your advice. But now I am worried about the situation in my previous post on this tread. And noone to ask but you!
Thanks!
[This message has been edited by ConnieMc (edited 12 July 2005).]
posted
connie: this is called an oral -antral fistula is is extremely dangerous havig an opening between nose and mouth. the oral surgeon must go bak into the area, falp the tissue back, currette and pack the area , and the cover the fistula with 100% coverage of gum tissue. this must be closed.
sinus infections of the midface go right to the brain and can cause serious infections and encephalitis.
must be on second abx also prior to surgery, clydamycin or keflex for 1-2 weeks.
ConnieMc
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 191
posted
quote:Originally posted by axelrose: connie: this is called an oral -antral fistula is is extremely dangerous havig an opening between nose and mouth. the oral surgeon must go bak into the area, falp the tissue back, currette and pack the area , and the cover the fistula with 100% coverage of gum tissue. this must be closed.
sinus infections of the midface go right to the brain and can cause serious infections and encephalitis.
must be on second abx also prior to surgery, clydamycin or keflex for 1-2 weeks.
Thanks for answering. Just what I didn't want to hear. But suspected this was not a good thing.
Strange, I decided to call the dentist's office today to report this, and asked them to report my concerns to the dentist, and have him call me back if there was any reason for concern or if I should be seen earlier than my 7/25 appt. Nobody called me back.
posted
Well, thanks for the thoughts. everyone! My options are seriously limited-- I have discovered that I cannot even begin to afford any of the possibilites. I guess if it gets bad I can sterilize the vice grips. What a, um, ...'great'... (trailing off with a VERY hollow echo..) place to live, 'amerika'... I' m checking out the possibility of having it done at a dental school, kind of as a guinui pig; has anyone had experience with that sort of thing? DaveS Posts: 4567 | From ithaca, NY, usa | Registered: Nov 2000
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ConnieMc
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 191
posted
quote:Originally posted by 1tick3victims: The tooth continued to be painful and I asked my dentist about this - he said that was impossible because there was no root left.
I had a dramatic decline after having the only root canal I ever had. At the time, my Lyme was pretty much in remission. But after my root canal, things changed and I went downhill fast. Same as you, I kept asking my dentist why I had pain in the tooth, and he looked at me as if I was crazy, and said the same thing your dentist said - it is impossible as there is no root there.
I didn't get the root tested after my procedure last week (I didn't want to pay $150, which in my mind is totally unnecessary since the tooth is gone) but the dentist said he has never had one come back which didn't show evidence of being toxic.
Your story is quite amazing and scary to hear. The holistic dentists seem to be totally anti-root canal these days, and I can see why.
So now I learn I probably have an oral-antral fistula following the tooth extraction, and that also seems scary. I will certainly keep your experience in mind and pursue doing something about this quickly. It stands to reason that I could easily develop an infection which could be dangerous, as docdave says.
posted
it is totally wrong what your dentist said about the root canal. you can certainly have pain after a root canal for many reasons:
1) hairline crack in tooth, tooth needs extraction not root canal, can check with blue dye. 2) abscess on non-vital tooth has anaerobic bacteria( no oxygen living) that do not respond well to abx and sometimes are aggrevated by root canal treatment. always premed abx 2-3 days prior to root canal. 3) i am starting to belive that long standing teeth with large abscesses must have root canals and apical surgery to clear up the infection. after alot of reading, i don't think a large >.5mm abscess can be healed with root canal and the lymphatic system , as originally thought by the dental profession. Curretage or cavitation as you laymen call it is necessary to remove infection at the root. 4) vital teeth needing root canals don't have this problem since there is imflamation of the nerve but usually not infection of the nerve, premed anyway. 5)wrong statement, " tooth is dead after root canal" false. the tooth sits in a periiodontal ligament suspended between the tooth and the bone. in this ligament the tooth gets blood suplly and nerve supply, however, it it quite reduced from before the root canal, but it is still alive and has feelings (don't make it watch a sad movie it will cry). so that's why you can have pain after root canal dd
posted
Thank you so much for the helpful thoughts. I definitely need to do something-- though I've got good balance, you can only walk along a fence so long before you fall to one side or the other. I am consuling several dentists to try to figure out what to do. There's a horrible problem with the dental part of the health ...'care'... system that makes it incredibly hard to come by any factual info. All of you have helped greatly. Of course, the cost is still going to play into it a bit, but I have discovered some new possibilities. In any case, thanks again, everyone! DaveS Posts: 4567 | From ithaca, NY, usa | Registered: Nov 2000
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