posted
I am pretty new with lyme disease but I did just receive my 1st IGX results and wondered the same about the stars...
what I finally concluded was...
the starred bands are the indicative bands showing infection of that specific bacteria more so than the non-starred bands...
meaning the non-starred bands don't have as much clout, diagnostically speaking...
If anyone out there with more experience and wisdom than I ( which would be many of you... ) can clarify this...
I too would like to know if I am on the correct track with this ! thanks !
-------------------- "Gratitude is not only the greatest of virtues , but the parent of all others "....Cicero Posts: 254 | From new jersey | Registered: Jul 2009
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posted
Wow, what a lot to take in but such valuable info here. Thanks to everyone who has taken the time to post this information! I have a lot more reading to do but I am thankful for every drop! Posts: 50 | From Midwest | Registered: Nov 2009
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disturbedme
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 12346
posted
IMPORTANT INFORMATION ON BAND 41:
Read this, very important for people to read who have only gotten a band 41 or wondered what band 41 could mean:
The following two reports by Allen Steere and Yale state that if a person has band 41 (or flagellin), Lyme symptoms, and they do not have severe periodontal disease or syphilis, they have Lyme borreliosis:
1) Allen Steere in 1986, when he developed the first CDC Method to diagnose Lyme, recommended: '' Perform serial Western Blots to look for changing and expanding IgM and IgG antibodies,'' since Lyme is a borrelisis, a relapsing fever, and the changing antibodies is a reflection of the varying antigens- and that, THIS CHANGING phenomenon means ``the spirochete remains alive throughout the illness.''
In that full text report, Steere said one can distinguish between Lyme and syphilis, when one only sees band 41 (anti-flagellar antibody) in a person complaining of Chronic Fatigue Syndrome or Fibromyalgia.
-------------------- One can never consent to creep when one feels an impulse to soar. ~ Helen Keller
My Lyme Story Posts: 2965 | From Land of Confusion (bitten in KS, moved to PA, now living in MD) | Registered: Jun 2007
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posted
This has been stated here in different ways.. just making sure this version is here also:
All I got was a 41band!
The 41 band is non-specific. It is meaningless by itself. Haven't we all heard this. It cross reacts with other spirochetes. Maybe not.
Early studies, with Allen Steere as a co-author, showed that the 41 band was the band that was most prevalent and showed up earliest in the course of Lyme infection. The CDC considers it specific. It is one of only 3 IgM bands tested in their surveillance test.
IgeneX considers it specific, it is marked with a double asterisk. I have reviewing the literature. Cross reactivity studies were done with syphilis. This does occur.
How many syphilis patients have I seen in suburban practice in the last 20 years? One. Syphilis is easy to rule out.
What about other spriochetal diseases? Yes. It can cross react with leptospirosis, rat bite fever and relapsing fever. What did Steere have to say?
These diseases can be ruled out by clinical presentations. Not out only are these diseases very rare, but they cause a severe, sometimes life threatening illness which clinically looks nothing like Lyme.
I am quoting a paper co-authored by Allen Steere, circa 1984. Current papers like to say that the 41band cross may reacts with dental spirochetes. Does the evidence support this? The answer is no.
The primary dental spirochete is Treponema denticola. It is present in patients with periodontal infections. It is not particularly antigenic since it is protected within biofilms.
The DNA structure of this spirochete has beenworked out. It is very different from Borrelia.
The 41 band reacts to aflagellum protein of Borrelia, the Lyme spirochete. The flagellum proteins of T. denticola are quite different from those of Borrelia. They areantigenically different.
This was tough to find, but here it is: The WB or immunoblot bands that are specific for T. denticola flagelin proteints are: 38kd, 53kd and 72kd.
In fact, the best known dental spirochete does not react with the 41 band. Author after author continues to state that the Lyme 41 band may occur beause of cross reactivity with dental spirochetes.
It is always qualified with the word "may." There is no evidence to support this theory. All are in agreement that the 41band is specific for spirochetes.
The other spirochetes known to cause this cross reaction can easily be ruled out! To quote Carl Sagan: "When all the likely causes of an effect have been ruled out, then that which remains, no matter how unlikely it appears, must be the truth."
You only have a 41 band. The only question which has to answered is: How do you explain its appearance if it not due to Lyme disease?
from "Lyme Report"
-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96239 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
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posted
List of Western Blot bands and explanations (from various sources)
9 cross-reactive for Borrellia
12 specific for Bb (Lyme)
18 flagellin fragment (Lyme)
20 may be cross-reactive for Borrellia
21 unknown
22 specific for Bb, probably really the 23/25 band
23-25 outer surface protein C (OspC), specific for Bb. Can be an early band.
28 OspD. Specific for Bb (Lyme).
[23-28] Potential for Central Nervous System (CNS) involvement.
30 OspA- substrate binding protein- common in European and one California strain. Check for mycoplasma.
31 OspA, specific for Bb (Lyme).
34 outer surface protein B (OspB); specific for Bb (Lyme).
35 specific for Bb
37 FlaA gene product- specific for Bb (Lyme).
38 cross-reactive for Bb
39 BmpA- a major protein of Bb flagellin; specific for Bb- Sometimes found in those with joint involvement. It is the most specific antibody for borreliosis of all bands.
41 flagellin protein of all spirochetes. This is usually the first to appear after a Bb infection and is specific for all Borrellia. Can be positive due to relapsing fever, oral spirochetes and syphilis. Flagella or tail protein. Flagella is used to move Borrelia burgdorferi from point to point. Many bacteria have flagella. This is the most common borreliosis antibody.
45 cross-reactive for all Borellia (sometimes people with Lyme who have this band positive also have the co-infection Ehrlichiosis). Heat shock protein. This helps the bacteria survive fever. The only bacteria that does not have heat shock proteins is Treponema pallidum, the cause of syphilis.
50 cross-reactive for all Borrellia
55 cross-reactive for all Borrellia
57 cross-reactive for all Borrellia
58 unknown but may be a heat-shock Bb protein- Check for viral infections
60 cross reactive for all Borrellia
66 Oms66- cross-reactive for all Borrelia, common in all bacteria- Check for E-coli
83 high molecular mass protein. Specific antigen for the Lyme bacterium. This is the DNA or genetic material of Borrelia burgdorferi. It is the same as 93, based on medical literature. Laboratories vary in assigning significance to the 83 versus the 93 band.
93 an immunodominant protoplasmic cylinder antigen, associated with the flagellum. Possibly the same protein as in band 83, just migrates differently in some patients.
NOTES:
When reporting bands, the reporting laboratory marks bands with the following indicators of intensity: - Not present + Low ++ Medium +++ High +/- Equivocal = indeterminate (present, but not as intense as the "Low" reading)
Other bacteria besides Borrelia burgdorferi may produce the 45, 58, 66, and 73 kDa bands.
Some patients might have an IgM response at the time of the EM rash. The IgG response tends to start several weeks after infection and peak months to years later. In some patients, the IgM response can remain elevated- in others it might decline, regardless of whether or not treatment is successful.
Many Lyme disease experts believe it is a mistake to exclude 31 and 34 kDa antibody proteins from the list of significant bands.
Lyme disease patients may not test positive for exposure to B. burgdorferi because their antibodies to the organism are bound up in immune complexes.
An indeterminate number of patients with late or chronic Lyme disease are simply seronegative for unknown reasons.
-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96239 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
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Kudzuslipper
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 31915
posted
I wanted to up this tread...it is very informative. Is there more newer interpretations of the bands I couldn't find?
Just getting drips and drabs from my igenex test(sadly...llmd won't talk with me before my appt)
I have strong 41 both igm and igg. and a few other positive bands and a few indetermiate... I have not seen the results yet. Interestingly, my PCP is pretty certain I have lyme based on this and my symptoms and my reaction to abx.... The LLMD I am seeing is not certain. I am hating the abx...so not sure who I want to believe. LOL I would love some more current interpretation if someone can lay their hands on a thread for me.
Posts: 1728 | From USA | Registered: May 2011
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posted
Can anyone help me understand my son's Western Blot test? His test said band 23 reactive in bold letters. Nothing else was reactive.
Posts: 3 | From New Hampshire | Registered: Mar 2013
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Sammi
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 110
posted
Which lab did his test? Be aware that labs such as Quest and LabCorp do not list all the Lyme-specific bands that IgeneX does (bands 31 and 34).
Band 23-25 is a Lyme-specific band. Having this band is significant. How old is your son? He should be evaluated by a Lyme knowledgeable doctor.
If you need a doctor recommendation, you can post in "Seeking A Doctor."
Posts: 4682 | Registered: Oct 2000
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posted
Many think that even just one Lyme-specific band is enough of an indicator for the illness.
Posts: 13171 | From San Francisco | Registered: May 2006
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quote:Originally posted by Lymetoo: It says it's specific for borrelia. Dr C does not list it as one of the Lyme specific bands.
This thread is NOT about HIM....but just to ease your mind, he does not push products on people.
Who are these mysterious Dr. M and Dr. C? And which are the best labs for getting a correct positive result? I live in NYC area.
I'm new to all of this. I tested positive for the Lyme AB and then they said I was negative for Lyme because my Western Blot only came back with bands 41, 58. Also, positive for Ehrlichia IGM but equivocal for IGG so they said I am negative for that too.
Posts: 2 | From NY | Registered: Sep 2016
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