Aniek
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 5374
posted
It looks like I may have chronic pancreatitis. We are still in the diagnosis world, but gall bladder is ok, endoscopy and colonoscopy were ok.
My enzymes have been up for a few months now. I've had upper right obdominal pain that radiates up and to the back for a number of months now. Twice I had what appeared like a typical gall bladder attack, the second caused by the colonoscopy. But no gall stones, and HIDA shows gall bladder is working fine.
My LLMD has seen pancreas issues in 3 other patients, we all happened to have had babesia. But that's not enough to make any findings.
I did a search, and it's been a year or so since anybody asked this question.
Thanks, A
-------------------- "When there is pain, there are no words." - Toni Morrison Posts: 4711 | From Washington, DC | Registered: Mar 2004
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it doesn't look like our cohort has changed since you asked in 2004 and i asked in 2005.
Posts: 689 | From western MA (we say buttER and pizzA) | Registered: Nov 2004
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posted
I have been using a person who does energenic testing using a biofeed device. My LLMD sent me to him to get under the surface of what some of the blodd testing can't get to. My blood sugar has been rising alone with my Eso blood counts. High Eso react to allergic responses and parisites. The biofeed showed big pancreas issues> I had thought that the pain in my gut was only from gastritis, but no. My pancreas is getting hit by parisites, blood flukes. You might want to check into looking at parisite issues. From what I have learned about the process of this darn lyme is once you start to get some progress on the infections, parasites start to rear their ugly heads. I have been making some real progress on the infections but have come to realize that the parasites are now what are making me feel so bad.LOL
Posts: 582 | From milwaukee wi | Registered: May 2005
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Marnie
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 773
posted
The toxin from Bb belongs to a family of toxic proteins known as "zinc endoproteinases" or metalloproteases, and includes the toxin from the organism causing tetanus as well as those from many other well-known infectious diseases.
The structures of this family of toxins are all very similar, as determined by x-ray crystal analysis.2
They all contain zinc and perform the same proteolytic function, namely, cleaving the chemical (covalent) bond between two specific amino acids in a particular protein found in nerve cells.3
The substrate for this enzyme is very large, implying that any inhibitor of enzyme activity blocking the entry of the substrate into the active site must also be very large.
One reason for learning the structure of the toxin (including the active site) is to determine the geometry of this site, the exact positions of the atoms that bind other atoms in the substrate. Knowing the arrangement of these atoms permits the development of inhibitors of the toxin, substances that compete with the normal substrate for active site occupancy.4
Action of Toxin The action of botulinum (as well as the toxin from the Lyme spirochete) is to prevent, through its action as a proteolytic enzyme, the release of the neurotransmitter acetylcholine.
The average body contains a total of 1.4 to 2.5 grams of zinc, where it is stored primarily in muscle 65% of the total is highly concentrated in red and white blood cells.
Other tissues with high zinc concentrations include bone, skin, kidneys, liver, pancreas, retina and prostate
Consider a far-infrared or an ozone sauna. Need to trigger acetylcholine (constricts vessels) RELEASE via stimulating NO (nitric oxide - dilates vessels) release.
Re: the protozoans...
Am J Trop Med Hyg. 1999 Aug;61(2):249-52. Related Articles, Links
"Nitric oxide, malaria, and anemia: inverse relationship between nitric oxide production and hemoglobin concentration in asymptomatic, malaria-exposed children"
Posts: 9424 | From Sunshine State | Registered: Mar 2001
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Aniek
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 5374
posted
Marnie,
I appreciate it, but I have absolutely no idea what it means. Can you translate into non-science for me?
Thanks
-------------------- "When there is pain, there are no words." - Toni Morrison Posts: 4711 | From Washington, DC | Registered: Mar 2004
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Thanks so much for posting the link to the Townsend Letter for Doctors article -- the health food store where I used to buy this magazine no longer carries it.
This is the most exciting news I have read in a long long time!!!!!
This info on the Lyme neurotoxin confirms everything hubby has experienced regarding the acetylcholine connection.
Dr C (LLMD)in Missouri says hubby is his only patient who had positive results from the Kane protocol -- I feel that the reason for this may be because at the time he did that he was taking all the nutritional supplements listed in the article with the exception of the Lysine.
Going to try this again in a couple of months when we get the Social Security disability settlement.
Just last weekend put hubby on Licorice again at a very low dose-- trying the real stuff this time not the DGL (deglycerized form)-- for ongoing G.I. problems. This was before I read this article.
Also have been experiementing with colloidal silver (Argentyn 23) for several weeks. More on that in another post soon.
I am so excited and think everyone should read the article so I am going to post the link as another thread.
Bea Seibert
Posts: 7306 | From Martinsville,VA,USA | Registered: Oct 2004
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posted
I was treated on this protocol in hospital in Mexico.
I still have Lyme.
An MD friend of mine also was treated. She was on cloud nine. Thought she had been cured. Six months later, she got sick again.
I'd be glad to share my experience and/or opinion about this through private messaging.
-------------------- Jeff Posts: 533 | From CA | Registered: Mar 2006
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Marnie
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 773
posted
Length of treatment is important as well as dosages.
The body does not heal in a matter of days. Infections have to be eliminated while at the same time, restoring the nutrient imbalances.
Since inflammation of the pancreas increases your RISK of cancer, I hope the following provides some additional "clues" as to how this might be avoided. Also please note: smoking and alcohol use are very related to pancreatic cancer RISK.
(A close friend was recently dx'd with pancreatic cancer. I have been researching for her.)
Here is some info that you may find interesting (I will try to translate below):
Since pancreatic carcinoma show strong tumor neoangiogenesis, overexpression of vascular endothelial growth factor (VEGF), a key mediator of angiogenesis,
in pancreatic cancer and consequently are highly vascularized, the role of anti-angiogenic therapies is under exploration at present.
Hence, this review covers the summary of the development of anti-angiogenesis as anti-antitumor therapy in pancreatic carcinoma, including matrix-metalloproteinase inhibitors (MMPIs), such as marimastat and BAY 12-9566, anti-VEGF agent, bevacizumab (Avastin, Genentech, South San Francisco, CA, USA), celecoxib (a cyclooxygenase-2 inhibitor), thalidomide and others. Role of markers of angiogenesis in predicting response to therapy is also discussed.
PMID: 16525200
Angiogenesis is the development of new blood vessels.
"ANG II-induced stimulation of angiogenesis." (See what triggers ANG II below.)
Now...cancer is caused by DNA damage resulting from a pathogen...viral, bacterial. We're pretty much finding that out...
Hydrogen bonds are damaged due to some type of initial infection. The cells "go wild"...multiplying. There is damage to the cells lining the blood vessels, so the body tries to make more...develop a collateral circulation...likely to deliver the nutrients needed to fight. It is believed blocking the new blood vessel formation will "starve" a cancer tumor.
Now...
When Mg is low, this triggers calcium influx (good and bad) which triggers ***proinflammatory*** TNF alpha (also good and bad), which triggers angiotensin II which triggers angiogenesis.
The statin drugs...the cholesterol dropping drugs... block angiotensin II...stopping cholesterol formation in the liver....put the brakes on. The body will begin to use whatever stores of cholesterol it has. Cholesterol should not go too low (increases the risk of bowel cancer...NK cells need Mg and Ca)though.
Now, Mg (in high doses) can do the same...inhibit an enzyme called HMG CoA reductase...stopping cholesterol production...via blocking angiotensin II.
Just in the news...the statin drug, Crestor, used in high doses...I repeat, high doses...not only lowered cholesterol, but the researchers found that the clogged arteries (triggered by LDL) actually cleared...healed themselves!
Beware that if going this route...the statin/arbs drugs deplete CoQ10. Drug companies are supposed to be adding CoQ10 to the formulation, but they haven't so far.
These drugs can be hard on the kidneys...which is my main concern about the MP.
That's not to say it doesn't work...it does.
Bb locks onto a heparin receptor (likely using/binding zinc) in the endothelial cells that line blood vessels and lymph vessels. It is after our choline...which impacts the neurotransmitter, choline. It uses a PKC inhibitor to destroy endothelial cells.
Mg levels dive very early on in lyme disease for many protective reasons.
The body tries hard to put up a good fight...it is trying to find alternative pathways to do so.
Bb loves and needs sugar (as well as choline). Insulin (acidic - produced by the pancreas) is the response that happens after we eat sugar and cause insulin SPIKES. This is a situation that makes Bb particularly happy since Bb is "PFK dependent" and insulin ACTIVATES this enzyme. Complex carbs do NOT cause insulin SPIKES...and this is what we all need to avoid.
Hydrogen, Mg-ATP, citrates, et al. INactivate this enzyme (PFK).
Which is why hydrogen...raising your pH is so important. Next...vitamin E to release hydrogen and CoQ10 to carry it into the cells. ONGOING. This is one reason why Vitamin E drops in lyme.
Once a day...doesn't "cut it". This pathogen is replicating q 20 min.
CONCLUSION: Our results suggest that increased intake of folate from food sources, but not from supplements, may be associated with a reduced risk of pancreatic cancer.
PMID: 16537833
Folic acid also helps prevent prostate cancer...just in the news.
"Folic acid is needed for protein synthesis, cellular reproduction, *choline synthesis*, red blood cell formation...
Like many nutrients, choline works with B12 and folic acid...
Folic acid levels normally elevate when someone is "undermethylated". This is one of the "protective" routes the body takes.
Integr Cancer Ther. 2006 Mar;5(1):83-9. Related Articles, Links
The long-term survival of a patient with pancreatic cancer with metastases to the liver after treatment with the intravenous alpha-lipoic acid/low-dose naltrexone protocol.
Berkson BM, Rubin DM, Berkson AJ.
Integrative Medical Center of New Mexico and New Mexico State University, Las Cruces.
The authors describe the long-term survival of a patient with pancreatic cancer without any toxic adverse effects.
The treatment regimen includes the intravenous alpha-lipoic acid and low-dose naltrexone (ALA-N) protocol and a healthy lifestyle program.
The patient was told by a reputable university oncology center in October 2002 that there was little hope for his survival.
Today, January 2006, however, he is back at work, free from symptoms, and without appreciable progression of his malignancy. The integrative protocol described in this article may have the possibility of extending the life of a patient who would be customarily considered to be terminal.
The authors believe that life scientists will one day develop a cure for metastatic pancreatic cancer, perhaps via gene therapy or another biological platform.
But until such protocols come to market, the ALA-N protocol should be studied and considered, given its lack of toxicity at levels reported. Several other patients are on this treatment protocol and appear to be doing well at this time.
posted
If you want a damaged and very clogged liver, take statin drugs!!
--------------------------------------
Aniek, I'm very sorry you are having this pain. I lost my lovely gall bladder last summer and had the pain you describe. I hope they can find something that helps you very soon.
-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96222 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
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Marnie
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 773
Yes, it doesn't seem to make a lot of sense to take statins when (safer) Mg accomplishes the same...INactivate HMG CoA reductase.
But some here prefer the "traditional" Rx route.
There are 2000 mitochondria PER LIVER CELL...these are the powerhouses of the cells where Mg-ATP is stored. We have a lot available, but it isn't (doesn't look like) being released.
The liver, our major "detox" organ, SHOULD be able to "come to our rescue", but can't likely due to a choline deficiency (thanks to Bb)-> fatty liver -> less bile acids -> gallbladder sludge -> heavy metals not eliminated.
The enzyme CHAT is also likely being impacted...this is where B5 comes in.
Looks like restoring our liver function might be the #1 priority.
To do this...for a very toxic mushroom poisoning, the recommended nutrients are: ALA, SELENIUM, and Milk Thistle. Little mineral, lots of acids -> hydrogen.
Now...if it works...if Mg is once avail. from the liver stores....then the health of our own antibodies would be restored (no more damaged fab portions), the cholesterol pathway brakes back on, the brakes for glycolysis also restored...and Bb would be destroyed -> herx (acidic time) response as the outer cell walls are destroyed.
This might be a good time to take an electrolyte "drink" or focus on the alkaline foods too.
Likely also need to really, really focus on maintaining the #s of beneficial bacteria which are likely destoyed by the "acidic" ongoing condition.
Healing begins in the gut (so we can absorb and make nutrients) and this also includes the vital digestive organs (their health).
Posts: 9424 | From Sunshine State | Registered: Mar 2001
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posted
hi my name is whitney im 14 and got my gall bladder out 1 month ago and im the youngest kid they have seen with such a messed up gallblader my attack lasted 1 1/2 years i would have them every week then every 3 days then every day they said that i passed so many stones and my gallbladder had blown a bubble out the side so it felt like having 40 baby within a year and after getting it out i am starting to get the pain again so hopefully i don't have to go in again .ive already had 16 surgurys getting a tumor out,hip sugery,i broke my leg femer surgery,sycttaken out and more i allso havelyme disease and hallucinate,faint,etc..
i would get a ct scan because they didn't find mine till the ct.the bad thing is you have to drink 2 jugs full of milky tooth paste berry stuuff its hard to get down : good luck the surgury is like a cecarian cection
Posts: 6 | From MN | Registered: Nov 2005
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posted
certain meds.,inclu. abx, esp. some i.v. meds., can cause pancreatitis. could "...jelly the pancreas...", a quote from some radio doc.
Posts: 2708 | Registered: Feb 2005
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I have extreme tightness/discomfort right around the gallbladder/liver area...my upper abdomen area right below the ribs...i also have babs. I had a CT scan of the area but was fine. What are the symptoms of pancreasitis?
Posts: 187 | From Gaithersburg, Maryland | Registered: Feb 2006
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Aniek
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 5374
posted
Jwenny,
I am not sure what the traditional symptoms of pancreatitis are. We are thinking mine is pancreatitis because my enzymes are up and all other tests have been negative, for gall bladder and other gastrointestinal issues.
Have you had a HIDA scan? This tests how well the gall bladder is functioning.
Additionally, you can be having a spasms in a duct right near the gall bladder. My LLMD says this causes symptoms very similar to a gallbladder attack, and sometimes people get their gallbladder out only to still get the attacks because it's the duct.
-------------------- "When there is pain, there are no words." - Toni Morrison Posts: 4711 | From Washington, DC | Registered: Mar 2004
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I never had a HIDA scan. My tightness is predominantly in my gall bladder area, but it's pretty much most of my abdomen area and sometimes on my back.
Posts: 187 | From Gaithersburg, Maryland | Registered: Feb 2006
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I never had a HIDA scan. My tightness is predominantly in my gall bladder area, but it's pretty much most of my abdomen area and sometimes on my back.
Posts: 187 | From Gaithersburg, Maryland | Registered: Feb 2006
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ArtistDi
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 2297
posted
I have chronic pancreatitis and I am not sure if a drug combo caused it. sigh. At any rate, my enzyme levels can get elevated and right now they are high normal.
I do not eat fats, careful with meats, low-fat there as well, as doctor said meat, cheeses, milk, etc. can promote the pancreatitis. I have learned from other llmds that some patients do have pancreatitis with lyme. I feel it is almost an autoimmune attribute of the illness, and I do have autoimmune issues along with lyme.
Eat sensibly. I did HIDA, cat scan, etc, etc, and it is not gallbladder.
Posts: 1567 | From Hatfield, MA, USA | Registered: Mar 2002
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I have left upper quad pain for years now and really don't know the cause. I think it is related to lyme/coinfection, but it is hard to be certain.
Keep looking!
-------------------- --- Rachel ---
Please accept my resignation. I don�t care to belong to any club that will have me as a member - Groucho Marx Posts: 26 | From Washington DC | Registered: Jan 2006
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