-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96239 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
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SForsgren
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 7686
posted
DMPS is probably the better option. Read the Articles on Dr. K's site at www.neuraltherapy.com. Be well.
-------------------- Be well, Scott Posts: 4617 | From San Jose, CA | Registered: Jul 2005
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Foggy
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 1584
posted
Scott, are you familiar with any ins cos who will pay for DMPS? Some will cover Chemet/DMSA
Posts: 2451 | From Lyme Central | Registered: Aug 2001
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posted
I work at a chiropractor's office where we see literally dozens of mercury and heavy-metals poisoned patients every week. Unfortunately, there are numerous products touted as effective metal-pullers but the only proven process is chelation with DMPS or DMSA and Lipoic Acid.
Chlorella, which has been promoted heavily by a well-known doctor with a heavy-traffic natural website (one that I visit regularly and from which I have benefited tremendously), is a very weak chelator. Same goes for cilantro, MSM, and L-Methionine. They form a weak bond which can stir up metals such as mercury but often break off before the metals safely exit the body. This merely redistributes the metals and can make you worse.
DMPS, which became popular in WWII for US Naval sailors who were getting poisoned from all the lead in the paint on warships, is an extremely powerful chelator that can pull mercury and lead (the two metals we most often see in neurotoxic individuals). Unfortunately, it is extraordinarily expensive and difficult to obtain.
DMSA is a somewhat safer and much less expensive alternative with very comparable results, which is why we use it in our practice. It is a strong chelator which pulls mercury and - if I remember correctly - lead.
Neither DMSA nor DMPS crosses the blood/brain barrier. Enter Lipoic Acid, which when taken in combination with DMSA (or DMPS), can effectively remove mercury and lead from the areas of the brain where it concentrates.
EDTA is great for chelating lead but should not be used if signifcant levels of mercury are present. In addition, any person with amalgam fillings should have these replaced with ceramic or porcelain by a biological dentist before starting a heavy metal detox protcol.
For really toxic individuals, this process may take up to two years, but we have seen numerous people with heavy metals toxicity, autism, Lyme, and other neurotoxic 'syndromes' get better with a proper DMSA/Lipoic Acid protocol (which must be taken every four hours and must be cycled on and off).
See Andrew Cutler's book on Amalgam Illness. It is a great source for dealing with mercury issues, particularly those related to dental fillings. You will not beat the Lyme until you've addressed the metals in your body.
Posts: 45 | From Pittsburgh, PA | Registered: Nov 2005
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posted
Thanks, Bob! Would you look at the link above and tell me what you think about this product's efficacy?
I have Andrew Cutler's book but it is SOOOO technical!
-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96239 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
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GiGi
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 259
posted
You need to understand more about heavy metal toxicity if you want to be successful in getting it out of your body.
I am afraid there is a lot of misinformation to go around the world twice.
You might want to do some reading here. This is already an older publication and a few things have been learned and added to protocols in the interim. It is Dr. K.'s approach basically and has not changed much over the years.
The key as to which mobilizing agent to use because there is really no chelating agent that does it all is totally dependent on the condition of the individual patient. What works well for one may be detrimental for another one.
Let me add here, a blood test is not conclusive for determining heavy metal/mercury deposits in the body, because the mercury does not "live" in the blood. It resides in body tissue anywhere in the body.
Take care.
Posts: 9834 | From Washington State | Registered: Oct 2000
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GiGi
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 259
posted
Mercury Detoxification: Perpetuating Factors, Problems and Obstacles
This is from a Klinghardt lecture in 1999 at the American College for the Advancement of Medicine. Basically the factors, problems and obstacles have not changed -- a few smaller ideas have been added since then. The toxicity is the same as it was a hundred years ago.
After having successfully overcome many problems in that regard: Learn all you can before you do. It will pay off in the long run.
Take care.
Take care.
Posts: 9834 | From Washington State | Registered: Oct 2000
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posted
I agree, Gigi. There is a lot of misinformation out there. Also, you are right that heavy metal detox is not something you should pursue unless under the guidance of a qualified practitioner.
I read the Dr. K/Dr. M article on the link you posted and it made a number of good points. Not to throw the baby out with the bathwater, but chlorella, cilantro, MSM, and sulfur-rich foods are not good chelators. The problem is that they only have one Thiol SH group. They absolutely can grab onto heavy metals but can't always safely escort them outside the body. That's why in our practice we only use chelators with two Thiol SH groups, e.g., DMSA, DMPS, and lipoic acid (used to pull mercury out of the brain).
One other point made in that article that I would like to clarify. The protocol for DMSA suggests taking 500mg twice a day for two weeks. This is simply not often enough, as DMSA has a half life of four hours. Fail to take it every four hours, and your blood levels will drop and it will cause further problems. Again, find a practicioner who understands proper chelation (and a dentist who understands the Huggins protocol for proper amalgam removal if you still have amalgams).
Cave76: in response to your question, again I must agree with Gigi. Blood tests for mercury - much like hair analyses - are poor indicators of chronic mercury toxicity. Mercury usually finds its way into brain and tissue, so blood levels are normal (this is one reason the ADA can make the claims they do for the 'safety' of amalgams).
Mercury vapors released from amalgams in the oral cavity travel directly to the brain, where they can lodge in the hypothalamus and pituitary (which is partially responsible for the weak endocrine systems of mercury-toxic individuals). Remember, mercury vapor, like organic mercury and methylmercury, are able to cross the blood/brain barrier (unlike other forms of mercury).
Once in the brain, the vapor converts to inorganic mercury, thus sealing it away for a minimum of 20 years. So you can have your blood tested for mercury the 'right' way and still come up negative because it's locked in your brain and tissues. Some neurotoxic patients with heavy metals come up negative on the urine and stool tests (the best tests for ascertaining mercury toxicity), even when taking a chelating agent! Typically the sicker a person gets, the more they hold on to mercury, making it a real challenge for the practitioner. Mercury is a master of deception (much like our old friend Lyme).
As a side note, the only way for your blood mercury levels to be significantly elevated is from acute exposure, e.g., workplace contamination, which is where the blood-level standard comes from anyway.
Finally, in our office we use a questionairre similar to the one found in Cutler's book to screen potentially mercury-toxic individuals. The symptoms of mercury toxicity are so specific that a good patient history and physical can reveal a lot. It's a good starting point, particularly if you still have amalgams and cannot take a challenge.
Good luck.
Posts: 45 | From Pittsburgh, PA | Registered: Nov 2005
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Foggy
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posted
Big B, I've been on 3 day on 10 day off DMSA protocols. How does your Chiro and Cutler's compare?
Posts: 2451 | From Lyme Central | Registered: Aug 2001
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GiGi
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 259
posted
Big B,
"chlorella, cilantro, MSM, and sulfur-rich foods are not good chelator,"
are not and have never been employed to be "chelators".
If you read Dr. K's old articles thoroughly, you will note that neither of these are used as "chelators". In reality, the fact is that there is not a single "chelator" for mercury that picks it up like a robot and moves it all the way out of the system. That would be absolutely wonderful.
Most drugs used simply are able to mobilize, stir up, some of the heavy metals from their hiding places, if they reach the pockets and compartments, and the rest of the "journey" out of the body has to happen with other agents and means.
There is not one agent that moves mercury out from the various body compartments all the way out of the body.
Each body compartment may need a different agent to mobilize it and may need different agents or therapies to move it out of the gut and kidney, etc. In order to accomplish this, it has to be known where in the body the deposits are and then the work has to begin from there by applying the right agent, accompanied by the right therapy, often Neural Therapy serves beautifully. ART is a perfect method to find the pockets where the toxic stuff is hiding.
Once successfully mobilized, then other agents have to be in the system, such as chlorella and others, to prevent the metals from being reabsorbed and redistributed in the system. Same mop-up agents as are needed to prevent any of the other neurotoxins (from microbes, etc.) from reabsorption and redistribution.
I have met some of the patients that have done the Cutler program and years later are still sick and end up at a medical doctor's office to seek help for their pain and suffering.
I will not go into any of your other statements, because I know this subject is not for debate with anyone but a medical doctor who sees a patient through a chronic disease, all the way to the final cure.
This post is simply meant to be an alert for those who want to attempt heavy metal detox without the help of an experienced medical doctor. Don't do it!
Take care.
Posts: 9834 | From Washington State | Registered: Oct 2000
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janet thomas
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posted
My post under the "chelex" topic may help.
-------------------- I am not a doctor and this is not medical advice but only my personal experience and opinion. Posts: 2001 | From NJ | Registered: Mar 2005
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