Melanie Reber
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 3707
posted
Good morning all,
I apologize for being such a pest with questions recently...I do not have a local doc as of yet, so can't bother anyone but you right now
For the last 2 days, I am experiencing an ache in the kidney areas...or what I think are the kidney areas (lower back, both sides, just at the bottom tips of the ribs, behind the muscles)
I have been parched, so am drinking plenty of fluids. Am not on ABX yet, only ART and Oil of O and Theralac.
Since this is another new one for me, I was wondering if this is common just because of Lyme and friends...or if it is something that I should be concerned about?
And I was also wondering if this could be something else in that area?
Do our adrenals hurt when they aren't working up to par? (LLMD stated at my last apt. that my adrenals were shot)
BTW, this started with my latest severe bout of edema.
Thanks so much for any insights, Melanie
Posts: 7052 | From Colorado | Registered: Mar 2003
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TheCrimeOfLyme
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Member # 4019
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Hi mel,
It COULD be something in that area. You mentioned edema. Your kidneys can actually get water on them as a way of retaining the water. I had this happen to me in the past on my L kidney and it HURT bad, to the point I couldnt MOVE. I was pregnant at the time though and for some reason, my kidney decided that retaining was a great thing to do.
Or... it may not be a kidney thing. Are you peeing ok? Do you feel nauseated? Do you have a fever? Headache? Does it ache when you lay down as well? Are you extremely wiped out and fatigued, more than normal? Sorry to ask, but does your urine smell? Sometimes a kidney infection can make your urine smell odd too since it is connected to the bladder.
Some of those are symptoms of kidney infections. My daughter has kidney disease, so I have to unfortunately become too aware of the symptoms of these darn infections.
NOw, when I herx, my kidney area hurts me now days to the point of just laying around with ice or heat on it. I as well have shot adrenals. Are you taking anything for the adrenals ? I take some supplements for support and it has seemed to work a BIT. Your adrenals are located on top of your kidneys...
Have you been bending over gardening or anything lately? Maybe pulled those muscles in there?
And I really really hate to ask this one, but believe it or not, constipation can actually make your back hurt there. Having any problems there?
My daughter suffered with severe kidney pain for two years ( which is normal because she has kidney disease) but it was OUT of the normal, it wouldn't go away. Here, her neurogenic bowel had taken it's toll and all the constipation
was actually making her kidney hurt! She just had surgery and had a built in enema put in, and no more kidney pain. Obviously, you don't need this, but just showing the connection. LOL
I hope this helps some.
-------------------- You want your life back? Take it. Posts: 3169 | From Greensburg, Pennsylvania | Registered: Jun 2003
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Carol in PA
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Melanie, When I first started the herbs in Buhner's protocol, I wasn't having any problems, so I ramped up to three capsules of each, three times daily.
Then I started taking the Resveratrol, and when I was ramping up, I experienced a wonderful clearing of my head. I could think again! Not only that, I could think about two things at the same time, something I had forgotten that I used to be able to do.
Right at the same time, I developed back pain, located about 5-6 inches above my waistline, and a couple inches from the center of my spine. The left side really ached, and the right side too, but a little lower, and not quite as much.
I was pretty sure that's where the kidneys are located. I spent alot of time in bed, meditating, but the pain did not abate.
After two days of this, I decided to stop the herbs. The pain subsided. I tried taking Resveratrol again, and damned if the pain didn't start again!
One friend suggested that the kidney ache may be part of a herx.
One of Gigi's posts explained that when the bacteria and yeast are killed, they release metals, and this may overload the kidneys.
I purchased some urine test strips, so that I could test for blood, white cells, high protein, etc.
I think that the increased blood flow to my brain may have flushed out more of the bacteria. Since I'm taking cat's claw, this stimulates the white cells to kill the bacteria. This would put more of a strain on the liver and the kidneys, to detox the dead bacteria.
If your Artemisinin and oil of oregano are killing bacteria, you might be having the same thing.
Carol
Posts: 6956 | From Lancaster, PA | Registered: Feb 2004
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lymemomtooo
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Melanie, you have some really good replies..I also suffer with the kidney issues frequently but always seem to think yeast may be to blame somehow..
I get the cranberry juice out and chug..I also have chronic UTI issues because my rt kidney does not properly do it's job..A partial blockage.
If you have more severe symptoms, find a Dr or go to the ER..You do not want to mess around with kidney issues..Better to know and look the fool instead of causing some problems.
Posts: 2360 | From SE PA | Registered: Mar 2004
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trails
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Member # 1620
posted
Funny you should mention this, I have been having this as well. Is it a welcome pain for newcomers to CA? Some strange CA allergy we new CA transplants have?
I have never had an ache or pain in this part of my body before. On May 23rd I ended up going to the urgent care to get some blood work and urinalisis done. Everything was completely normal.
But I still get this strange ache slightly below midway on my spine a bit to the left and right of it.
It feels deeper than the muscles, but maybe it is just muscles???? We later figured out I did go for a bike ride that would have been easy for most, but was more than I usually do---so maybe I was sore from this and maybe it was a new sore?
Maybe you are sore from your travels? Did you have lots of waiting and standing or sitting in different positions than usual? lifting luggage?
THing is for me--the pain/ache has started again. And I have NOT done any physical stuff.
Your LLMD should be able to order a simple urinalisis for ya. I know, it is a pain, but usually it is worth it---to get the orders faxed to you and get the test done for piece of mind. They dont cost much---my urgent care place charged $15 to insurance for the infection part of the test. I think the other part was $40.
Or else a VERY nice excuse to find a GP--they love stuff like kidey issues. MUCH easier for them to deal with than LYME.
Anyhow---I am going to follow this thread, coz I have yet to really figure out what is going on with my own kidneys. Take care, Trails
Posts: 1950 | From New Mexico | Registered: Sep 2001
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Melanie Reber
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 3707
posted
Hey there Jodie, Good to see you again, but sorry it is under the circumstances of us both doing a bit of relapsing.
I actually am having most of those symptoms too that you described...but not the constipation. I haven't been able to do ANY physical stuff recently, so it shouldn't be sore muscles. Yes, I was lugging a heavy laptop through the airports but really don't think that has anything to do with this right now.
I am urinating fine, and no, it isn't any different than usual. Yes to nausea, fevers, fatigued, etc...but I am also thinking that is related to the TBDs in some manner...but who knows at this point.
The ache isn't a sharp pain, but is dull and fluctuates in intensity.
No, I am not doing anything for adrenals specifically, hopefully, when I begin Babs meds this weekend, this will clear up...we shall see.
Thanks so much for sharing your expertise!
Carol, I suppose this could be herx related. I began a pretty strict diet, Diflucan, Oil of O, and Art in the last couple of weeks. Something sure is getting to me, as I am not doing all that hot right now.
Thank you so much for the info.
LMT, I haven't allowed myself any sort of juice because of the sugar content...but I do enjoy cranberry, so maybe I could splurge a bit?
No, I won't let it get severe...at this point it is just a bit painful, but I can handle it. Thanks!
Trails, You and I do seem to be traveling down the same road here. I think that is a good sign, perhaps, together we can work out the problems. As I mentioned above, I really don't think this is muscular, it is too symmetrical, and located in a distinct spot, not throughout the back muscles.
I dread going to a new doc, but will have too soon I know for other stuff. If this doesn't subside by then, I will ask for a urinalysis. Hope you are feeling better soon.
Thanks again, now it is back to work for me, M
Posts: 7052 | From Colorado | Registered: Mar 2003
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posted
my kidney experiences: i had three incidences of kidney pain, moderate to severe.
incident 1, second episode: oral ceftin-induced. Bromelain X 1500mg(powdered cap. form) quelled pain and hot-cold sensation by 90%.
incident 2: went to e.r. Wobenzym X 3 tablets taken. Pain and other Sx. quelled by 40% within 2hr., and by 70% there after. this was witin first yr. of infection, and i was largely ignorant of tick-borne illnesses.
my "state" at the time: largely ignorant. no insurance. had been financially erased by these infection(s).
my "feeling" tone: convinced of kidney failure...death within a month. hours-long panic attacks. all bodily systems severly affected, inclu. cns and pns lyme- borreliosis, and perhaps other tick-borne infections.
for at least 2mo.+, kidney sensations, as indicated by flank,and back sensations over kidney area, crescendo'd to a peak of,hotness, coolness, finally spasticity, and pain. since this was my first time taking enymes i was conservative about the dose. should have taken 5 tablets.
incident 3: hospitalized X 4 days. dx = lyme encephalitis(confused,delirium...at my worst). ctscan,and mri of head; spinal tap, and s.tap,3 week headache afterward). kicked out of hospital after 3 days of i.v. rocephin. standing on street corner,outside hospital--and for brevity of the story-- i went into some kind of total body "thing," inclu. severe kidney sensations, and pain. convinced i'd be raked raked off the sidewalk then and there...dead witin day(s) to a week.
with this, i made a "B-line" on nj path train,and nyc trains to a chinese med. doc.(TCM) in nyc, bought my herbs, and saved my own butt, again! all sensations and pain quelled by 90% over next 2-3 days, but took effect witin 2 hours. in my minds eye...the "bird" flipped in direction of the nj hospital ducs, inclu. to one internationallly 'famous' one whose name appeared on my chart(i later saw when i got a cp of my records), and whom i don't recall ever seeing, let alone having been physically examined by.
relatedly, the adrenal glands may also be affected, as particularly, i think, there are two in-going blood, and or lymphatic vessels, but only one out-going blood and/or lymphatic vessels. so, given that only 1/2 the fluids are moving out than are coming into the adrenals, this would imply problems with micro-circulation particularly since i think immune complexes would embed thenselves, in the adrenals, as well as the kidneys.
http://www.mucos.de the maker of wobenzyme, rutozym, and other multi-enzyme formulations. this site, other sites, and hard copy lit. is where i got the idea to do the enzymes for the kidney problem, and immuned complexes.
caveat: if doing any other meds, avoid high dose enzymes, and consult with your doctor, or doctor knowledgeable in the concurrent use of enzymes with meds, whether prescriptive, or otc.
posted
I was having such pain over the area of my kidneys that I finally succumbed to having a CT scan several months ago.
Kidneys are fine. Everything looked pretty good, they said.
The other possibility was my colon. Well, now that I'm having major problems with my colon, I guess that's the reason for my pain in that area.
I did a colon cleanse by www.drnatura.com that you may want to try. I think all of us Lymies need them anyway with all the CRA* we have in our bodies from all the chemicals!!!! [abx, etc]
Anyway, the back pain was 90% better after a few rounds of cleansing and then a few colonics to boot.
Hope you find the solution soon!
-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96239 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
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Our kidneys can get backed up easily as the body deals with debris from all the past meds and/or infection die off debris and the like. Generally, you could be simply 'clogged'.
Whenever I start an effective or new infection regimen -
I get the low back pain and always a good kidney cleanse tincture and/or tea relieves the pain and I can continue the infection regimen.
So - at least for me -- it's connected. I would say the edema is connected too. Also, watch the lymph system (swollen nodes, neck and under arms)
Now I make sure I do regular kidney cleanse (usually about 6 weeks of a good tincture or tea)
The kidneys work allot harder than we realize, and you want to keep them nice and clear. If not from infection die off, it could be from general overload over time.. infection related or not, pain can be a sign that they are not clearing.
The good news is, effective kidney cleanse herbs are gentle and effective, so can be used with other therapies.
I use Dr. John Christopher's reccommendations -
Juniper, parsley, uva ursi, marshmellow root.. along those lines.
If our kindeys are in good function - our pee should be somewhat goldish (not babesia dark, tho, or unhealthy dark) in the first morning - not clear or light - because some normal denseness indicates they are doing the filtering, or that the filter is not clogged. If it's 'clogged', your system can back up pretty quick.
Within a couple of days of the cleansing, I will have a bit more 'frothy' morning pee, and the back pain subsides fairly quickly, but it takes weeks to actually achieve a good cleanse. In any event, should you try this - you'd know soon of that is the ticket as the pain would abate.
Personally, I would not work on moving the lymph until a ways into clearing the kidneys.. or you might suffer more back-up.
Just M.O.
Mo
Posts: 8337 | From the other shore | Registered: Jul 2002
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GiGi
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 259
posted
As a general comment re kidneys: As Dr. K. recently posted here (via me), any die-off of microorganisms is often falsely misinterpreted as a herxheimer. I suppose in a way it is. But when the die-off happens, some of the heavy metals that are then freed/mobilized with the die-off, a certain portion of them travel through they kidneys. The kidneys react with swelling of the basal membranes and decrease in filtration rate.
I learned long ago that yeast/fungi is the body's attempt for protection from the heavy metal, etc. damage. Our body means well, but we then also have to deal with yeast/fungi consequences/ their output as another living organism.
I learned that the kidney has a filtrating surface equal to a ping-pong table; the gut that of a soccer field. The nephrons - like brain cells - live long and cannot be replaced once damaged. The gut membranes are renewed every 3 days.
It is therefore foolish to push toxins and toxic metals through the kidneys and wise, to push them out through the gut. Chlorella pulls toxic metals through the mucosal surface of the intestines from the blood and protects the kidneys.
To prevent damage to the kidneys, lots of water with Electrolyte solution.
A good added supplement to help the kidneys is Renelix from BioResource. I frequently got segmental therapy/Neural therapy (very superficial) that quickly stimulates the kidneys into action with a few pricks of the needle with procaine plus possibly an agent that gets the kidneys to go to work. The KMT also works great for activating these body functions.
posted
My left kidney has ached intermittently since I think I have had lyme -- that's 6-8 years.
Now since on antibiotics it aches more. I had thought that I was just sensitive to the antibiotics. My creatinine even went up from 0.8 to 1.1 when it hurt the most. Urinalysis was normal.
Wonder if it is a small stone, or the dying bacteria releasing heavy metals, or a direct effect of the antibiotics.
We need studying!
Posts: 211 | From NC | Registered: Dec 2005
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Melanie Reber
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 3707
posted
Wow PQ, I am so sorry for your experiences of dealing with this. Thank you for the enzyme information, I will try to absorb it as soon as I have a chance.
Hey Miss Toots, I have been reluctant to do the colon cleanse...but do know that it has helped many patients to feel better. I am glad that you were one of them!
Why Miss Maureen, I began the low carb/sugar thing on the 1st... the Diflucan and Theralac on the 7th... the Oil of O on the 12th... and the Art on the 18th.
I don't generally pay that much attention to my urine color, but will try to remember to do so in the morning
Yes, I had a very hard and swollen gland the same day the kidney pain began under my chin on the left side. This worried me a bit, as I haven't had swollen glands in quite sometime...but it did go away after a day.
How do you feel about the lemon juice- oil kidney cleanse? I am trying not to take too many additional supplements right now. Thanks so much for your help.
Gigi, Thank you for sharing doc K's info with us. Where does one find the electrolyte solution that you mentioned? Anything mixed in water, I can do easily.
Mtn, Yes, we do need studying
Thanks again to each of you...your wisdom is priceless! M
Posts: 7052 | From Colorado | Registered: Mar 2003
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GiGi
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 259
posted
Mountain, these studies have all be done over and over and over again. I can list you a thousand references if I had the time and the will to convince people that heavy metals are everywhere when you are chronically ill and living on earth. I won't, because it is like trying to convince school medicine that there is such a thing as Lyme Disease. Some people, thank God, hear me and are doing something about it and are getting well taking the proper steps.
Don't wait for more studies - the results are not going to be on the front page of any Times publication. The doctors get shot down before they have a chance to tell.
Take care.
P.S. I hope you understand why I am angry - my own child died from mercury poisoning.
Posts: 9834 | From Washington State | Registered: Oct 2000
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Melanie Reber
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Member # 3707
posted
Oh Gigi! I had no idea...I am terribly terribly sorry for your loss.
And yes, you have every right to be angry about that!
Posts: 7052 | From Colorado | Registered: Mar 2003
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GiGi
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 259
posted
This is only a fraction of the published research that I have been posting about. There are many, many more. But just reading the titles will give you an idea. I don't want to clutter up the board with more of the same. And please note the years of publication.
The references for chlorella, CGF, Fish oil, cilantro, garlic, ART, APN and others can be obtained from the American Academy of Neural Therapy: [email protected] and at www.neuraltherapy.com
1 Carlson, J., Larsen, J.T., and Edlund, M.-B.: Peptostreptococcus micros has a uniquely high capacity to form hydrogen sulfide from glutathione. Oral Microbiol. Immunol., 8: 42-45, 1993
2 Debelian, G.J., Olsen, I., and Tronstad, L.: Systemic diseases caused by oral microorganisms. Endod. Dent. Traumatol., 10: 57-65, 1994
3 De Boever, E.H., De Uzeda, M., and Loesche, W.J.: Relationship between volatile sulfur compounds, BANA-hydrolyzing bacteria and gingival health in patients with and without complaints of moral malodour. J. Clin. Dent., 4: 114-119, 1994
4 Duhr, E.F., Pendergrass, J.C., Slevin, J.T., and Haley, B.E.: HgEDTA complex inhibits GTP interactions with the E-site of the brain �-tubulin. Toxicol. Appl. Pharmacol., 122: 273-280, 1993
5 Giuliana, G., Ammatuna, P., Pizzo, G., Capone, F., and D'Angelo, M.: Occurrence of invading bacteria in radicular dentin of periodontally diseased teeth: microbiological findings. J. Clin. Periodonto., 24: 478-485, 1997
6 Granlundt-Edstedt, M., Johannson, E., Claesson, R., and Carlsson, J.: Effect of anaerobiosis and sulfide on killing of bacteria by polymorphonuclear leukocytes. J. Periodont. Res., 8: 346-353, 1993
7 Hannah, R.S., Hayden, L.J., and Roth, S.H.: Hydrogen sulfide exposure alters the amino acid content in developing rat CNS. Neurosci. Lett., 99: 323-327, 1989
8 Johnson, P.W., Yaegaki, K., and Tonzetich, J.: Effect of volatile thiol compounds on protein metabolism by human gingival fibroblasts. J. Periodont. Res., 27: 553-561, 1992
9 Khatoon, S., Campbell, S.R., Haley, B.E., and Slevin, J.T.: Aberrant guanosine triphosphate-�-tubulin interaction in Alzheimer's disease. Ann. Neurol., 26: 210-215, 1989
11 Kombian, S.B., Reiffenstein, R.J, and Colmers, W.F.: The actions of hydrogen sulfide on dorsal raphe serotonergic neurons in vitro. J. Neurophysiol. 81-96, 1993
12 Larsen, J.T., Claesson, R., Edlund, M.-B. and Carlsson, J.:Competition for peptides and amino acids among periodontal bacteria. J. Periodont. Res.,30: 390-395, 1995
13 Loomer, P.M., Sigusch, B., Sukhu, B., Ellen, R.P. and Tenenbaum, H.C.: Direct effects of metabolic products and sonicated extracts of Porphyromonas gingivalis 2561 on osteogenesis in vitro. Infect. Immun., 62: 1289-1297, 1994
14 Nair, P.N:R., Sjogren, U., Krey, G., Kahnberg, K.-E., Sundqvist, G.: Intraradicular bacteria and fungi in root-filled, asymptomatic human teeth with therapy-resistant periapical lesions: a long-term light and electron microscopic follow-up study. J. Endodon., 16: 580-588, 1990
15 Pendergrass, J.C., Haley, B.E., Vimy, M.J., Winfield, S.A., and Lorscheider, F.L.: Mercury vapor inhalation inhibits binding of GTP to tubulin in rat brain: similarity to a molecular lesion in Alzheimer diseased brain. Neurotoxicology, 18: 315-324, 1996
16 Pendergrass, J.C., Haley, B.E.: Inhibition of brain tubulin-guanosine 5'-triphosphate interactions by mercury: Similarity to Observations in Alzheimer's diseased brain. Metal ions in biological systems: mercury and its effects on environment and biology (Sigel, H. and Sigel, A., eds) Marcel Dekker, Inc., New York, pp461-478, 1996
17 Pendergrass, J.C., Haley, B.E.: Mercury-EDTA complex specifically blocks brain �-tubulin interactions: similarity to observations in Alzheimer's disease. Status quo and perspectives of amalgam and other dental materials (Friberg L.T. and Schrauzer G.N., eds) Georg Thieme Verlag, Stuttgart, pp98-105, 1995
18 Persson, S.: Hydrogen sulfide and methyl mercaptan in periodontal pockets. Oral Microbiol. Immunol., 7: 378-379, 1992
19 Persson, S., Claesson, R., Carlsson, J.: Chemotaxis and degranulation of polymorphonuclear leukocytes in the presence of sulfide. Oral Microbiol. Immunol., 8: 46-49, 1993
20 Ratcliff, P.: Local predisposing events leading to gingivitis and periodontitis. J. Periodont., 66: 749-750, 1995
21 Reiffenstein, R.J., Hulbert, W.C., and Roth, S.H.: Toxicology of hydrogen sulfide. Annu. Rev. Pharmacol. Toxicol. 109-134, 1992
22 Roth, S.H., Skrajny, B., and Reiffenstein, R.J.: Alterations of the morphology and neurochemistry of the developing mammalian nervous system by hydrogen sulfide. Clin. Exptl. Pharmacol. Physiol., 22: 379-380, 1995
23 Skrajny, B., Reiffenstein, R.J. Sainsbury, R.S., and Roth, S.H.: Effects of repeated exposures of hydrogen sulphide on rat hippocampal EEG. Toxicol. Lett., 84: 43-53, 1996
25 Safavi, K.E., Rossomando, E.F.: Tumor necrosis factor identified in periapical tissue exudates of teeth with apical periodontitis. J. of Endodontitis, 17(1): 12ff, 1990
26 Maiorino, R.M., et al.:Sodium 2,3-dimercaptopropane-1-sulfonate challenge test for mercury in humans. III. Urinary mercury after exposure to mercurous chloride. J. Pharmacol. Exp. Ther., 277(2): 938-44, 1996
27 Keith, R.L., et al.: Utilization of renal slices to evaluate the efficacy of chelating agents for removing mercury from the kidney. Toxicology, 116(1-3): 67-75, 1997
28 Aposhian, M.M., et al.: Sodium 2,3-dimercapto-1-propanesulfonate (DMPS) treatment does not redistribute lead or mercuri to the brain of rat. Toxicology, 109(1): 49-55, 1996
29 Aposhian, H.V., et al.: Urinary mercury after administration of 2,3-dimercaptopropane-1-sulfonic acid: correlation with dental amalgam score. FASEB J., 6(7): 2472-6, 1992
30 Aposhian, H.V., et al.: Human studies with the chelating agents, DMPS and DMSA. J. Toxicol. Clin. Toxicol., 30(4): 505-28, 1992
31 Hermann, M., Schweinsberg, F.: Biomonitoring for the evaluation of a mercury burden from amalgam fillings. Mercury determination in urine before and after oral doses of 2,3-dimercapto-1-propanesulfonic acid (DMPS) and in hair. Abteilung Allgemeine Hygiene und Umwelthygiene, Universit�t T�bingen, Zentralbl-Hyg-Umweltmed., 194(3): 271-91, 1993
32 Zander, D., et al.: The mercury exposure of the population. III. Mercury mobilisation by DMPS (Dimaval) in subjects with and without amalgam fillings. Medizinisches Institut f�r Umwelthygiene, Heinrich Heine-Universit�t D�sseldorf
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35 Gerhard, I., et al.: Diagnosis of heavy metal loading by the oral DMPS and chewing gum tests. Clin. Lab., 38: 404-11,
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38 WHO Criteria 118, 1991
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40 Lexmond, T.-M., et al.: On the methylation of inorganic mercury and the decomposition of organo-mercury compounds - A review. Neth. J. Aci., 24: 79-97, 1976
41 Compeau, G. and Bartha, R.: Methylation and demethylation of mercury under controlled redox, pH and salinity conditions. Appl. & Environ. Microbio. Vol. 48, No. 6, 1203-1207, 1984
42 Edwards, T.: Biosyntheses and degradation of methyl mercury in human faeces. Nature, Vol. 253, 462-464, 1975
43 Blum, J. and Bartha, R.: Effect of salinity on Methylation of mercury. Bulletin Environ. Contam. Toxicol., 25: 404-408, 1980
44 Bertilson, L. and Neujahr, H.Y.: Methylation of mercury compounds by methylcobalamin. Biochemistry, Vol. 10, No. 14, 2805-2828, 1971
45 Imura, N., et al.: Chemical Methylation of inorganic mercury with methylcobalamin, a vitamin B-12 analog. Science, Vol. 172, 1248-1249, 1971
46 Jernelov, A. and Martin, A.: Ecological implications of methal metabolism by microorganisms. Annual Review of Microbiology, 61-77, 1975
47 Lander, L.: Biochemical model for the biological Methylation of mercury suggested from Methylation studies in vivo with Neurospora crassa. Nature, Vol. 230, 452-454, 1971
48 Wataha et al.: Dental Materials. 10(5): pp2988-303, 1994
49 Hamdy, M.K., and Noyes, O.R.: Formation of methyl mercury by bacteria. Appl. Microbiol., Vol. 30, No. 3, 424-432, 1975
50 Brunker, R.L. and Bott, T.L.: Reduction of mercury to the elemental state by a yeast. Appl. Microbiol., Vol 27, No. 5, 870-73, 1974
51 Holm, H.W. and Cox, M.F.: Transformation of elemental mercury by bacteria. Appl. Microbiol., Vol. 29, No. 4, 491&494, 1975
52 Pan Hou, H.S. and Imura, N.: Involvement of mercury Methylation in Microbial mercury detoxification. Arch. Microbiol., 131: 176-177, 1982
53 Bisogni, J.J. and Lawrence, A.W.: Kinetics of mercury Methylation in aerobic and anaerobic aquatic environments. J. Water Pollut. Control Fed., 47: 135-152, 1975
54 Report on the international committee on MAC values on mercury (1969)
55 USEPA document on mercury 1973 & 1984
56 US NIOSH document on mercury 1973
57 Wieliczka, D.M. et al.: Equilibrium vapor pressure of mercury from dental amalgam in vitro. Dent. Mater., 12(3): 179-184, 1996
58 Bjorkman, L. and Lind, B.: Factors influencing mercury evaporation from dental amalgam fillings. Scand. J. Dent. Res., 100(6) 354-60, 1992
59 Lussi, A.: Mercury release from amalgam into saliva: An in-vitro study. Schweiz. Monatsschr. Zahnmed. 103(6): 722-6, 1993
60 Olson, S. and Bergman, M.: Daily dose calculations from measurements of intra-oral mercury vapor. J. Dent. Res., 71(2): 414--23, 1992
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257 Goyer, R.A.: Toxic effects of metals. Cassarett and Doull's toxicology - The basic science of poisons, ed3, New York, MacMillan, Publ. Co, pp582-609, 1986
258 Kuhnert, P. et al.: Comparison of mercury levels in maternal blood fetal chord and placental tissue. Am. J. Obstet and Gynecol., 139: 209-12, 1981
259 Kuntz, W.D.: Maternal and chord blood mercury background levels; Longitudinal surveillance. Am. J. Obstet and Gynecol., 143: 440-443, 1982
260 Brodsky, J.B.: Occupational exposure to mercury in dentistry and pregnancy outcome. JADA 111(11): 779-80, 1985
261 Yoshida, M., et al.: Milk transfer and tissue uptake of mercury in suckling offspring after exposure of lactating maternal guinea pigs to inorganic or methyl mercury. Arch. Toxicol., 68(3): 174-8, 1994
262 Ellender, G., et al.: Toxic effects of dental amalgam implants. Optical, histological and histochemical observations. Aust. Dent. J., 23:5 pp395-99, 1978
263 Fisher, D., et al.: A 4 year follow-up study of alveolar bone height influenced by 2 dissimilar class 2 amalgam restorations.
264 Freden, H., et al.: Mercury content in gingival tissues adjacent to amalgam fillings. Odont. Rev., 25: 207-210, 1974
265 Koivumaa, K.K. and Makila, E.: The effect of galvanism on accumulation of bacterial plaque invivo. Suom Hammaslaak Toim., 66: 367-371, 1970
266 Lindquist & Mornstad: Effects of removing amalgam fillings from patients with diseases affecting the immune system. Medical Science Research., 24, 1996
267 Bratel, J., et al.: Effect of replacement of dental amalgam on oral lichenoid reactions. J. Dent., 24(1-2): 41-45, 1996
268 Ibbotson, S.H., et al.: The relevance and effect of amalgam replacement in subjects with oral lichenoid reactions. Br. J. Dermatol., 134(3): 420-3, 1996
269 James, J., et al.: Oral lichenoid reactions related to mercury sensitivity. Br. J. Oral Maxillofac. Surg., 25(6): 474-480, 1987
270 Jameson, M.W. et al.: Mucosal reactions to amalgam restorations. J. Oral Rehabil., 17(4): 293-301, 1990
271 Koch, P. and Bahmer, F.A.: Oral lichenoid lesions, Hg hypersensitivity and combined hypersensitivity to mercury and other metals. Contact Dermatitis, 33(5): 323-328, 1995
272 Lind, P.O., et al.: Electrogalvanically-induced contact allergy of the oral mucosa. Report of a case. Int. J. Oral Surg., 13(4):339-345, 1984
273 Lind, P.O., et al.: Amalgam-related oral lichenoid reaction. Scand. J. Dent. Res., 94(5): 448-451, 1986
274 Pang, B.K. and Freeman, S.: Oral lichenoid lesions caused by allergy to mercury in amalgam fillings. Contact Dermatitis, 33(6): 423-427, 1995
275 Skoglund, A. and Egelrud, T.: Hypersensitivity reactions to dental materials in patients with lichenoid oral mucosal lesions and in patients with burning mouth syndrome. Scand. J. Dent. Res., 99(4): 320-8, 1991
276 Fox, J.G. and Jones, J.M.: Occupational stress in dental practice. B.D.J., 123:10 pp 465-473, 1967
277 Iyer, K., et al.: Mercury poisoning in a dentist. Arch. Neurol., 33: pp788-90, 1976
278 Ship, I.I. and Shapiro, I.M.: Preventing mercury poisoning in dental practice. The J. of the Houston District Dental Society, pp18-20, 1983
279 Simpson, R., et al.: Suicide statistics of dentists in Iowa 1968-1980. JADA 107, 441-3, 1983
280 Fox, C.H., et al.: Periodontal disease among New England elders. Journal of Periodontology, Vol 65, No. 7, pg. 676-684, 1994
281 Mattila, K.J. et al.: Association between dental health and acute myocardial infarction. British Medical J., Vol. 298, pg 779-782, 1989
282 DeStefano, F.D., et al.: Dental disease and risk of coronary heart disease and mortality. Br. Med. J., Vol. 306, 688-691, 1993
283 Joshipura, K.J. et al.: Poor oral health and coronary heart disease. Journal of dental Research, Vol. 75, No. 9, 1631-1636, 1996
284 Beck, J.D.: Periodontal disease and cardiovascular disease. Presented at the symposium: The relation of periodontal infection to systemic diseases. Bufallo N.Y., May 20, 1995
285 Offenbacher, S., et al.: Periodontal infection as a possible risk factor for preterm low birth weight. J. Periodontology, 1996
286 Pendergrass and Haley: Mercury and its effects on environment and biology in metal ions in biological systems. V 34, 461-478, 1997, Marcel Dekker, Inc. NY, NY
287 Brun, R.: Epidemiology of contact dermatitis in Geneva. Contact dermatitis, 1: 214-7, 1975
288 Djerassi, E. and Berova, N.: The possibilities of allergic reactions from silver amalgam restorations. Int. Dent. J., 19:4, 481-88, 1969
289 Miller, E.G., et al.: Prevalence of mercury hypersensitivity in dental students. J. Dent. Res., 64:338 Special issue abstracts # 1472, 1985
290 Nebenfuher, L., et al.: Mercury allergy in Budapest. Contact Dermatitis, 10(2): 121-122, 1983
291 Rudner, et al.: Epidemiology of contact dermatitis in North America. Arch. Derm., 108(4): 537-40, 1973, 1996
292 White, R. and Brandt, R.: Development of mercury hypersensitivity among dental students. JADA, 92: 1204-1207, 1976
293 Ahlbom, A. et al.: Dentists, Nurses and Brain Tumors: 4th International Symposium Epidemiology Occupational Health, Como, Italy, 10-12 September 1985 (Abstracts)
294 Arrhenius, E.: Methyl mercury in fish - a toxicologic-epidemiologic evaluation. Nord Hygien. Tidskr., suppl 4, pp166, 1971
295 Kuntz, W.D., et al.: Maternal and chord blood background mercury levels: A longitudinal surveillance. Am. J. Obstet. Gynecol., pp440-443, 1982
296 Mansour, M., et al.: Maternal-fetal transfer of organic mercury via placenta and milk. Env. Res., 6: pp 479-484, 1973
297 Nixon, G.S., et al.: Pregnancy outcome in female dentists. B.D.J. 146, pp 39-42, 1979
Pitkin, R.M. et al.: Mercury in human maternal and cord blood, placenta and milk. Proceedings of the society for experimental biology and medicine, 151 pp565-567,
Posts: 9834 | From Washington State | Registered: Oct 2000
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When I have had kidney pain, I make sure to get enough electroyles, via Emergen-C electrolyte power in water with a pinch of sea salt. You can get Emergen-C in natural food stores and sometimes in the pharmacy area of Walmart. We like the tangerine flavor at our house.
You may be able to drink as many as 3 packets a day in water as long as you have bowel tolerance for the vit c.
Another choice for eletrolytes is Elyte concentrate. Check Natural food retailers, or herb/ vitamin shops.
Also to help detox and soothe the kidneys, and liver, Drink very weak organic green tea. One tea bag / pot. Do not boil water, heat it to hot before boil.
Use the same tea bag multiple times during the same day, as different benefital substances will be release from the tea with repeated use. You can put the tea over ice too.
And finally, if your adrenals are exhausted, rest, rest , rest more than you thought was possible.
Hope you are feeling better!
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Melanie Reber
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Good evening Achey,
Thank you for the good suggestions...I have been drinking LOTS of herbal tea over ice, so I am glad you approve
Rest is not possible for me right now...I am working 50-55+ hours per week. It is a desk job mostly, but very demanding cognitively...and I seem to be failing in that area fast.
I'm sure the stress isn't helping matters...but we do what we must.
I think I will go and make some nice iced tea right now!
trails
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Member # 1620
posted
Melanie--I'll post this here so others know even though I wrote you an email about it.
My kidney pain is related to my PERIOD!!! and my loss of my right ovary and endometriosis.
Right before I had my right ovary out I had this "kidney" pain. (surgery was 3 weeks ago) And then during surgery recovery I had it VERY badly. and could tell it was coz the surgeon sort of cut away at that area---removed the ovary from the back of the pelvic wall??
Anyhow.....I started having the pain today and then tonight---viola. Period. Early and more hormonal than anything...but it explains why the "kidney" pain.
So---are you mid cycle or about to get yours?
This prolly just adds to the variables, but it might make sense.
All my lyme symptoms are FLARING like a banshee too. Hormones. I hate em.
You take care and good luck with thta work load! Trails
Posts: 1950 | From New Mexico | Registered: Sep 2001
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You have helped a tremendous amount of people here, many more than actually post replys.
Many blessings to you for that. What a tragedy you lived through with your child.
Mel -
the oil/lemon/grapefruit is the liver cleanse - generally you want to first cleanse colon (together with kidneys) before cleansing the liver - kind of so you start the flow out before cleansing the deeper organs.
I also take chlorella - I do think moving the metals and other heavier toxins out via the colon is important.
My organs took quite a beating over the years with all of this stuff. As they heal, the whole terrain changes.
Take care of your plumbing. It's not to say there aren't other things going on, but if organs are not clearing or need healing - your other treatments will not be effective IMO.
Mo
-------------------- life shrinks and expands in proportion to one's courage -- anais nin Posts: 8337 | From the other shore | Registered: Jul 2002
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Kidney stones are always a possibility. Hubby has one -- pretty sure it was due to a prolonged bout of antibiotic-induced diarrhea. Will have one year check-up on this soon. Various tests a year ago showed it was either 9mm or 4mm (I may have shrunk it with herbs). Curious as to whether it is still there now.
The lemon juice in water (citric acid) is good for preventing kidney stones -- even urologists agree with this. Generally kidney stones only hurt when they try to move so the pain is usually sudden and can be severe even causing nausea and vomiting.
Bea Seibert
Posts: 7306 | From Martinsville,VA,USA | Registered: Oct 2004
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posted
just curious as to how many people with the kidney and adrenal problems had the problem easily shown up on a test and if so what tests were run? I have been having severe pain on both sides of my back also and just trying to figure out where what to do about it next. I am due to see an endocrynologist. Would he test for the metals?
Posts: 47 | From WV | Registered: May 2006
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posted
forgot to mention that many multienzyme formulations will help with processing debris, thereby promoting micro-circulation. cleave and clear immune complexes embedded in kidney, and perhaps adrenal tissues.
too many properties to enumerate just now. many sites discuss the above properties. on bromelain,and perhaps other enzymes see http://www.thorne.com.
Carol in PA
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Member # 5338
posted
lymefighter7:
You may need to see your family doctor to get checked out. Is the pain in your back actually due to the kidneys?
He can do a test in the office with the urine test strips like I purchased, which tests ten things. He can have the lab do a urinalysis on a urine specimen. These tests can tell you if the kidneys are working properly, or if they have an infection.
In January 1998 I had a kidney stone, which I passed. I then had an "IV Pylogram" to check the flow of my kidneys, to make sure that they were working correctly. They were fine, and no stones in hiding.
(The worst part of that test was the bowel prep, because you have to be "cleaned out" to visualize the kidneys, which have lots of intestines in front of them.)
pq: You said, "many multienzyme formulations will help with processing debris, thereby promoting micro-circulation."
Oh good, I've been taking Wobenzym for over a year now. I hope that's helping the kidneys and improving bloodflow.
I DO NOT want to go through the ordeal of another kidney stone!
Carol
Posts: 6956 | From Lancaster, PA | Registered: Feb 2004
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GiGi
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posted
Melanie, re Electrolytes - see Dr. K's write-up for patients I posted separately:
Take care.
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Melanie Reber
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posted
Well, it has been 5 days now...and the ache continues. Now I am also getting stronger pangs in the same areas.
My urine color in the mornings has been a light yellow, , sort of a butter color.
Yes trails, coincidentally, I was mid cycle when the aches began...but this is sure a new symptom for me if it is a herx.
Gigi, thank you for the electrolyte information. I am just concerned that I shouldn't add anything else into the mix right now, not having a local that I can contact IF anything gets worse.
Miss M, thanks for the clarification on the cleanse...my mind isn't up to par right now, so I appreciate the reminders. I am actually experiencing the big ``D'' presently, so I am not sure if a colon cleanse would be a wise choice right now.
Bea, I have been drinking plenty of water and iced tea with lemon. Not sure if that counts as water with lemon? The pain isn't severe, so I am hoping it isn't a stone issue.
Lymefighter, I am so sorry for your pain with this...and hope you can get it resolved soon!
PQ, actually my last LLMD had me on Quercetin (bromellian, vit, C) for quite sometime while I was doing a detox thing from falling into a severe toxin overload. Thanks for reminding me of that, so I can check into the possibility of restarting.
Carol, thanks for the testing information...the urine test sounds simple enough. The problem is just getting INTO a doc right now for me.
I was supposed to begin Ketek today...but after reading the handout last night which stated NOT to take it if there were any kidney or liver concerns...I am starting to think I might just hold off a bit.
Although I hate the idea of waiting any longer to begin meds- I also don't want to incur any further problems right now. I think the Art is kicking things up enough.
I couldn't sleep again last night, so did a bit of research on Renal failure...the symptoms sure are consistent...but with TBDs added into the mix...it could be anything- or nothing.
Thanks again everyone, I so appreciate your thoughts, M
Posts: 7052 | From Colorado | Registered: Mar 2003
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TheCrimeOfLyme
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Its probably time for a urinalysis. My daughters urine, when it turns that odd buttery color ( like butter that has been melted obviously ) and is a tad bit foamy with a small bit of white infiltration...
means infection ( usually ecoli or proteus) .
Im not saying you have one, but I know the butter urine color all too well.
-------------------- You want your life back? Take it. Posts: 3169 | From Greensburg, Pennsylvania | Registered: Jun 2003
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Melanie Reber
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ankle, feet, and leg swelling generalized swelling decrease in sensation decreased appetite changes in mental status hand tremor nausea bruising easily flank pain fatigue
weight loss nausea general ill feeling fatigue headache generalized itching (the recent invisible bugs?) bruising decreased alertness muscle twitching decreased sensations excessive thirst agitation
Lordy, I HATE to make a big deal of this when it very well could be nothing. All of the above are specific, but they are also common TBD things!
Posts: 7052 | From Colorado | Registered: Mar 2003
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Bea Seibert
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Melanie Reber
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posted
Hey Bea,
I haven't had labs run in over a year. I found an older one from 2 years ago though and calculated the rate for a serum creatinine of 0.9.
It turns out to be ...lordy, I forgot already...just a sec
Posts: 7052 | From Colorado | Registered: Mar 2003
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Melanie Reber
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posted
ok...the GFR calculates like so: 74 ml/min/1.73 m2 in white* females
guess that is pretty low based on the scale of:
Age (Years) Average GFR 20-29 116 mL/min/1.73 m2 30-39 107 mL/min/1.73 m2 40-49 99 mL/min/1.73 m2 50-59 93 mL/min/1.73 m2 60-69 85 mL/min/1.73 m2 70+ 75 mL/min/1.73 m2
Hmmm...if I was 70+ years old, I would be fine!
Not sure what any of that means...but thanks for giving me something to do for a few minutes.
Posts: 7052 | From Colorado | Registered: Mar 2003
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posted
I agree with GiGi (sorry to hear about your child) I think the heavy metals are affecting our kidneys causing our low back pain.
Over the yrs I have tried everything, looked into everything except the mercury issue. Nothing has worked, still have the intense back/bladder pain. Now it is time to chelate.
Posts: 315 | From USA | Registered: May 2005
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Tincup
Honored Contributor (10K+ posts)
Member # 5829
posted
Yo ho Mountana...
After reading all of the symptoms.. my best guess is you either have a swollen prostate gland.. or you are suffering from lack of ice cream!
Your pick!
Actually.. I am sorry to hear of your pain and problems. Could it be caused by the fact you just miss me?
OK!
I might as well keep joking because the real answers.. well... I KNOW you don't want to hear them!
It is that BAD word again..
Babesiosis.
Just so you know... it can cause kidney failure.
And.. many.. if not all of your symptoms can be linked to Babesiosis. SORRY to tell you that! But that is why you pay me the big bucks.. eh? hehehe
Now... I am NOT saying Babesiosis is what is causing your problems.. just wanted to toss that in the pot for you to stew on.
Your symptoms can be caused by other things.. which I know YOU know.
May I suggest? Tomorrow evening after work.. hop on down to the nearest Care First or walk-in clinic you can locate in your area. It will be MUCH faster than the ER... MUCH cheaper... and less painful than dealing with a duck and waiting for an office appointment. And you won't need to miss work... butt head.. I mean Butter cup!!!
You don't need to address Lyme and coinfections at this clinic... just get the immediate problem checked out. I would like for them to check your BP.. your lungs/heart.. and...
You will get to pee in a cup... YIPPEE!
And... you will get some answers... and/or at least eliminate some of the possible causes.
And didn't your LLMD do blood work recently? If so.. call them and ask what the results were. If you need to.. tell them you are needing to go to a local doctor for an unexpected problem... so you need the results. Don't wait for the next appointment if you are having new problems! And tell them about the new symptoms and see if they have suggestions!
I would also STOP all the supplements/meds you are on.... until this clears up and/or you have answers. I know it probably isn't the Oil of Oregano, or other new stuff you are taking that is causing the problems.. but who knows?
Sometimes seemingly benign things make for problems. If nothing else.. the yeast die off from the yeast killer products you are taking COULD be adding LOTS of trash in your system.. and this could be causing a clogged up plumbing system, you know.. plumbing pipe #1.. not #2.
Plus.. didn't this problem become noticable after you started the Oil of O.. and the other new stuff?
I hope you go to the doctors and get some answers soon... before your kidneys blow up like a balloon and your ears fall off... you goof ball!
And do let us know how you are doing. For some reason.. we care!
PS... On the way home from the walk-in clinic... stop at the grocery store.. and buy a bottle or two of Pedilite (sp?) .. which can be found in the baby food section.
Drink it... and LOTS more water.. not tea!
Ok.. lecture over. Ain't you glad about that?
One more thought... maybe cut down the protein (meats) and add complex carbs for a while. Proteins can be hard on the kidneys.
And who knows.. it could be muscle/flank pain... and NOT kidney related. Your mid-lower back bones may be out of whack.. and could be pinching nerves that feed the kidneys and affect the functioning.
GiGi
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 259
posted
Or go find an ART practitioner: he/she will find within two minutes' time whether it's your kidney(s) that is stressed or a structural problem or an emotional factor that has surfaced. Whether it's a metal plugging them up; an allergic reaction, whatever. Adrenals, what would they best respond to. With ART, it is so simple to find the actual problem as well as the remedy that will best fix/alleviate the problem. ART eliminates all guesswork and you are on your way.
I just cannot visualize myself or anyone else ever maneuvering through this disease without ART. They are around everywhere - one just has to look.
Hope you find your answer and solution soon.
Take care.
Posts: 9834 | From Washington State | Registered: Oct 2000
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Melanie Reber
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posted
Good morning you guys!
I finally put in a call to my LLMD on Saturday, and they did return it yesterday. Unfortunately, they were under the impression that I mentioned liver problems...hmmm.
Don't know where that came from, but I laughed and said...did I mention too that my brain isn't working so great right now?
Anyway, they should get back with me again today. In the meantime, I am holding off on any additional meds till I get the go ahead.
And have been asking around for a LL PCP in the area. I have a name that my LLMD recommended, but he is out of network, so I was looking for other choices before I committed.
Littlesprout, best of luck with the chelation....and I am sorry that this is affecting you as well.
Moonbeam, I like the first two choices. But the third is most likely the real cause (missing you).
I wasn't aware that Babs could cause renal issues, so thanks for that little tidbit. I am supposed to begin Mepron soon...as soon as I can get comfortable on the other stuff...so we shall see what happens.
My doc did do blood work, but it was only for the TBD testing. I was to get the other stuff done in three weeks after beginning Ketek...so things are a bit off schedule right now.
I am guessing that he will want me to do exactly what you have mentioned, and I do know of a walk-in that I went to a few months back for a viral thingy...so, I am all set there.
Yes, this is a new problem...I have never had pain in those areas before.
I did consider the rib idea, because they have been tender in the last few months. But when that happens, they are tender everywhere I push at them...not just isolated in specific areas.
I also didn't realize that protein was hard on the kidneys. That is about all that I have been eating recently. That with some veggies thrown in for good measure. I have dropped 13 lbs this month by eliminating carbs and sugars. But honestly, I think much of that was edema related, and I just don't have any appetite either.
Yes, I know there are a lot of possibilities...that is what makes all of this so fun Thank you for all that you do, and for keeping an eye on me.
Gigi, Thank you so much for your help...and please just know that you are appreciated.
You will be happy to know that I had a little chat with my work yesterday and told them that we just could not keep putting in the hours that they are demanding of us (63 for me last week).
I think they heard me...and even if they didn't, I am still going to try and hold it back to a more manageable load.
I also wanted to share that I am a bit more aware of this issue due to my nephew dying from renal failure. That is NOT to say that this is my problem...but it does hit close to home.
OK, I will update when I have any answers. Thank you each so much for your concern and information!
Much love, M
Posts: 7052 | From Colorado | Registered: Mar 2003
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Melanie Reber
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posted
OUCH!
Why is it that things always seem to go wrong late on the weekends?
I am still in pain, and actually I am having sharp pains in the kidney areas now...
I am also having pain all around the right side and in the right front area too.
When I push in that area, it is very sore.
This is no longer just a dull ache.
I did go in for the urinalysis and that looked fine. The doc wanted me to follow up with bloodwork, but that place didnt do blood, so I had to put it off.
For those of you have had this sort of pain, did it go away on its own?
Thanks in advance, M
Posts: 7052 | From Colorado | Registered: Mar 2003
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posted
Any fevers? Does the urine have an unusual smell or color or sedimentation? Foamy?
Have they considered an ultrasound? Perhaps you have a cyst or kidney stones?
-------------------- We have only this moment, sparkling like a star in our hand... and melting like a snowflake. Let us use it before it is too late. Posts: 221 | From the hills | Registered: Mar 2006
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Melanie Reber
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posted
Hey Snowflake,
Guess you have insomnia too, huh?
Yes, I have been experiencing fevers recently. My norm is barely 97 but it has risen to 101.something.
Nope, no smell, no foam, no sedimentation. No, no ultrasound either.
Actually, I never got back with my LLMD...my bad. I just hate to be a problem patient already! This is a new doc for me, and I have a follow-up at the end of the month.
I was supposed to do bloodwork in two weeks anyway, so was waiting for that time.
My stomach sure is distended and the only place I am hurting at the moment is in the trunk area...weird.
Thanks for replying, M
Posts: 7052 | From Colorado | Registered: Mar 2003
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posted
Nausea or vomiting with the abdominal distention? Bloating = yeast, gastroparesis,
Possibly acute cholecystitis with the fevers and pain on the right side, bloating. Another possibility is pancreatitis (wt loss, fever, pain, thirst). With your edema I am thinking kidney, but kidney or bladder infections should have showed up in the UA.
hmmmmmm
I totally disagree with others about taking extra electrolytes. If this really is your kidneys and you have potential filtration issues, your kidneys would have a difficult time keeping the proper balance of sodium, potassium, calcium, and bicarbonate in your body. Healthy kidneys remove excess fluid, minerals, and waste. If your kidneys are not healthy right now, for whatever reason, I would think pushing it with extra electrolytes would help more harmful waste build up in your body. Too much sodium and potassium can be dangerous!
Have you seen a recent rise in your blood pressure?
Please get this checked out soon! I hate to see anyone in pain!
-------------------- We have only this moment, sparkling like a star in our hand... and melting like a snowflake. Let us use it before it is too late. Posts: 221 | From the hills | Registered: Mar 2006
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Marnie
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 773
posted
In acidosis...when your tissues are too acidic, sodium and hydrogen are "stuck" IN the cells. The pumps aren't working (Mg-Ca, Na-K, Mg-ATP, etc.). With sodium IN the cells...edema. Too little ATP in the cells too can trigger this.
The kidneys primary job is to constantly maintain the acid-base balance. The pH. Obviously they also maintain the amt. of water in our tissues.
If your system is too acidic, it calls for the minerals to help balance. Normally it doesn't take a lot of minerals to react with acids to raise the pH...become more alkaline.
Too many acids (negative charges) harm healthy cells. The kidney cells themselves are vulnerable. This is why the original Atkins diet caused kidney failures...way too acidic. (That diet has been modified).
Kidney cells (and even brain cells) can heal...ONLY TO AN EXTENT. It depends on the EXTENT of damage. And obviously, it takes time. I can document that if you need it.
Okay, I know someone reading is going to say, "Brain cells don't regenerate." Well...
Stem cell research looks very promising to help repair, restore damaged cells.
Now...pancreatitis (inflammation of the pancreas). The pancreas helps maintain our blood sugar level. When we eat something sugary, one type of cell produces (acidic) insulin to counter the alkaline glycogen. But when blood sugar reaches a certain level, another cell in the pancreas secretes (acidic)glucagon to stop the insulin production. Acids can "downregulate" one another.
Pancreatitis can be related to cancer. My sister-in-law had an acute attack while on vacation. When no cause was found, she was told when she returned home, to get a mammogram right away. Yup...breast cancer. Caught soon = lumpectomy = cured. Now why pancreatitis maybe a "sign" has to do with the fact that cancer follows the glycolysis (sugar) pathway. Cancer cells need sugar, not oxygen. The pancreas is stressed maintaining the sugar-insulin-glucagon.
Gall stones, sludge...are common in lyme because of the lack of choline and phosphorus (combo = lecithin). Bile is made IN the liver and simply stored in the gall bladder. It is too thick. Lecithin is a fat emulsifier...thins it...keeps it smooth and flowing. It is in many, many products and is why chocolate bars are so "smooth".
Keep in mind...the MAIN nutrient for ATP is phosphorus.
Kidney stones, most of them, are calcium deposits. This is also common in lyme. An IVP (quick x-ray using a dye to track the flow of liquids thru the kidneys) will show if this is a problem. With lyme...Mg drops, Ca rises (and K) initially. Over a LONG time...Ca and K will drop too. We can't "hang onto" those electrolytes if Mg is low. Now...if it is a stone...and if you are offered a choice...know upfront that lipotripsy (using sound waves to shatter the stones) has just recently been linked to diabetes and high blood pressure a few years later. It takes a HUGE neg. charge (frequencies are part of the electromagnetic spectrum) to shatter calcium. This depletes the OTHER minerals too (Mg is linked strongly to diabetes and high blood pressure). Think how long our bones normally last (skeleton). Boy, it must have taken a HUGE amt. of energy to shatter the stones! Small stones can be passed (ouch)and if they are too large, surgery still can be done to remove them.
When we are stressed (physical from fighting an infection) or mental ...up goes cortisol. Here's the adrenal connection. This increases calcium to go INTO the cells. This happens before delivery of a baby. Cortisol levels rise...need the muscles to contract (labor) to deliver the infant. In fact, both Mg and Ca are utilized, since the contraction isn't constant. The muscles contract (Ca), relax (Mg)...So, bottom line, it is important to stay as mentally stress free as possible.
Learn to meditate. Listen to music that is relaxing, that makes you happy. Watch funny movies. Try to keep a positive attitude. Pray. Our minds are very very powerful.
I suspect it IS the oil of oregano that put your kidneys over the top. It worked too well.
Posts: 9481 | From Sunshine State | Registered: Mar 2001
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Melanie Reber
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 3707
posted
Good morning Snowflake and Marnie,
Thank you both so much for your help!
I have been nauseous off and on...but not so much currently. Yes, the Candida is a HUGE problem for me, and I have been trying very hard to follow a strict diet to help with that. Of course, every week or so, I need a cheeseburger to keep going...but other than that, it has been all meat and veggies.
Perhaps that has contributed to the problem as TC suggested earlier and Marnie has just confirmed.
My UA PH was 6, whatever that means...and I don't know what else they looked at, but I was told it was ``fine''. This was over a week ago. At the time of the check-up, my BP was ``fine'' too. Not sure what it was, but I do tend to run on the low side.
I have been incredibly weak and light headed, woozy, dizzy, whatever you want to use to describe that just got off the boat and the ground is still moving sort of feeling. This was a past symptom for me, but would come and go...now it is constant.
Other current constants are: Tremor, muscle cramps, chills, flushed, memory loss (set off the smoke alarm the other night), insomnia, loss of appetite, weight loss (except when I bloat up and get edema), kidney area(?) pain and now R side pain (since 7-2).
Marnie, thank you so much for relaying your information in a way that I could actually understand! You are so wise, but normally you go right over my head
There is a lot of cancer in my family too, both sides. And I have dealt with it as well.
At 19, I had to have cryotherapy for cervical dysplasia. My Mother had a lung removed due to a malignant tumor. My Father passed at 43 due to Esophageal cancer. My Aunt also had a bout with early stage breast cancer. My grandfather passed from stomach cancer and my nephew passed from Wilms.
So...that is the very LAST thing I want to think about, but thank you for the enlightening info. I am so sorry that your sister had to deal with breast cancer, but am pleased that she was cured.
Also, thank you for the stone info...there is also a very large streak of diabetes in my family...again, several deaths due to that.
As I stated earlier, I have been under much stress recently. I am not normally a stressed individual, and can usually deal with it well whenever it pops up. I have cut back on my work load some to help alleviate the pressure. But, it is interesting to note, that my ``startle'' reflex is back at an all time high for me.
Is it possible that the additional cortisol from stress and adrenal issues going into my muscles are causing my recent surge in foot and calf cramps? I am talking ``wake you up in the middle of the night with severe pain and crying'' type of cramping. And ``forget about trying to stretch in the morning''- that sets off a cascade of cramping.
I did begin Mag supps recently (Slo-Mag) to try and help with that.
Yes, I am constantly listening to music and singing and chair dancing and laughing as much as possible. I am a very happy sick person indeed.
And of course, the other option is that all of this is only a HERX!
Again, thanks so much, M
Posts: 7052 | From Colorado | Registered: Mar 2003
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So sorry you are still in pain. As I PM'd you before about your kidney pain, trying to relate it to my own experience, here I am back w/ it again.
It had been over 6 months since I last had those symptoms and BAM it's back. In fact it was prevalent in my early days trying to figure out what the heck was going on w/ me.
And guess what is different in my tick-soup treatment? I've started treatment for babesiosis!
Now I was on the babs meds but had to stop all babs meds per the LLMD to treat a bladder infection w/ cipro.
I have started back on the babs meds today. I can tell you I had more energy each day while on the babs meds, but it also came along w/ the flank pain, shortness of breath, increased coughing, various short sharp pains, especially in back (different from flank which is more sore), and chest, sweats and chills.
So Mel, I don't know if babs is what is causing all your discomfort, but it is for me.
Can you really hold out until the end of the month before you talk to your doc? I know, I understand how you don't want to be labled a 'problem patient'. Maybe a call into the office to help ward off any potential different problems.
In addition to all the physical pain you have this can be so mentally taxing as well , just remember someone is only a click away. So keep us up to date how you are making out Melanie, ok?
Stella Marie
-------------------- Stella Marie Posts: 694 | From US | Registered: Apr 2005
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Marnie
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 773
posted
A number of your current symptoms MIGHT indicate hypoglycemia...low blood sugar. Those yeastie beasties might be gobbling it up. Our brain cells HAVE to have glycogen. Low blood sugar = light-headed, weak, etc.
Can you monitor your blood sugar level? Borrow one of the blood glucose monitoring devices from a diabetic friend. Take it first thing in the morning. Or...wait at least 2 hours after you eat something (that is when it is supposed to return to normal levels).
If you find your blood sugar is HIGH... you maybe developing insulin resistance. Then you could try Gluco Reg by Solar Ray. Follow the bottle directions. This is chromium + acids. Chromium and cinnamon are both "acknowledged" to help with later onset diabetes.
The bloating can be due to ammonia too. This happens in cows when they graze too long...eat too much nitrogen - containing grass.
There maybe a nitrogen problem. It isn't available, then it is...Bb is "borrowing" a lot of nutrients from us. When they are suddenly released...oops...now the balance is shifted the opposite direction???
Melanie...did you follow my melatonin posts?
Melatonin causes us to release bicarbonates from the intestine. To make us more alkaline.
Bicarbonates reduce nitrogen loss. Bb looks to contain a nitrogen-fixing protein. I'll leave it at that.
They think the "working" part of melatonin is an indole...if you look at the molecular structure, this is hydrogen bonded to nitrogen or H=N. The nitrogen is "stuck" out at the end.
This is also very much related to the # of beneficial bacteria in your gut. Get 'em up...lots. When they are too low, up goes yeast (which lower cholesterol....the body will find a back up route!) The "good guys" also help us to process nitrogen -> ammonia which should be eliminated by the kidneys. Ammonia makes us alkaline.
Drinking our urine.... to recycle? (Yuck...find me another way!)
"The ammonia produced in the latter two reactions is excreted as NH4+ in the urine, where it helps maintain urine pH in the normal range of pH 4 to pH 8.
The urea cycle operates only to eliminate excess nitrogen."
Now...the impact of nitrogen on Bb's presence...another time.
Posts: 9481 | From Sunshine State | Registered: Mar 2001
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Melanie Reber
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 3707
posted
Ya know...I really AM trying my best to ignore this.
But, I am having increasing sharp pains in my right abdominal area.
Is that where the GB lives?
Posts: 7052 | From Colorado | Registered: Mar 2003
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Marnie
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 773
posted
Type this into a search engine:
Edgar Cayce hot oil pack gall bladder attack
Right side upper abdomen...yup.
Posts: 9481 | From Sunshine State | Registered: Mar 2001
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Melanie Reber
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 3707
posted
thanks marnie,
dnt have it in me to search right now, trying to find a hopital to go into to get this checked out
Posts: 7052 | From Colorado | Registered: Mar 2003
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trueblue
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 7348
posted
Melanie, Please just go NOW! (Call one of your friendly coworkers to find out where a hospital is and maybe they'd take you.)
If not you can always call 911.
Please report back and let us know what happens and how you are. ok?
Hang in there, kiddo. I'm thinking about you.
-------------------- more light, more love more truth and more innovation Posts: 3783 | From somewhere other than here | Registered: May 2005
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Marnie
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 773
posted
When you return...
Gall bladder attacks can happen off and on.
Esp. to those who are:
Female Fair Fat Forty
We can live a long time with several stones in the gall bladder without them causing problems. If there are too many, or if they block the common bile duct -> a lot of gall bladder inflammation, then to be safe, it should be removed.
If the gall bladder is not "hot" (terribly inflammed and ready to rupture) and IF the stone is not plugging the common bile duct, then other things can be done.
There is a Rx that can be taken to dissolve stones, but it takes about 9 months if I remember correctly, so we have to have enough time.
It is called Actigall. Expensive.
To prevent stone formation, need lecithin.
My mom had periodic gallstone attacks for many years (30). It wasn't until she had one blocking the duct that she had to have her gall bladder removed.
When she had an attack (they hurt...a lot), she would take a small shotglass full of peppermint schnappes in a glass of very warm water and drink it. This worked for her. Now...unfortunately the alcohol part wouldn't be good for you, but...there is peppermint tea.
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