I'm desperate for info proving or disproving the relationship between my Lyme & Babs treatment and my recent kidney failure. PLEASE let me know any info that will help.
My "alternative" dr has been treating me for Lyme and Babesia for about 2 years now. I've taken Mepron & Zithromax, Biaxin & Flagyl, Cipro, then I went back on Biaxin alone, but for only 2 days. The 3rd day I was in ICU with complete kidney failure. I was very close to not making it. Now I'm back home and all is well (considering).
My "regular" dr has never approved of my being treated for Lyme. She originally told me there was no way I had Lyme and that the treatment would harm me. Even after nearly 2 years of ongoing improvement, her position remained the same. Just as I KNEW she would, she is blaming my kidney failure on all the antibiotics that the other dr had me take. She is one step away from forbidding me to continue. For right now I am off all my many, many meds, except for pain meds, until I've seen a kidney specialist. Soon I'll have to decide though!
My "alternative" dr claims he has NEVER had a patient go into kidney failure, for any reason. Any and all who have taken these meds...please respond and let me know if you've ever had kidney trouble.Thanks! Take care, Beth
Posts: 72 | From California | Registered: Mar 2004
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posted
first of all is ur Alternative doctor LLMD? Secondly, if your "regular" doc isn't LLMD u can't listen to everything they tell you.
there are lots of complication with meds and the body-just like anything it's always a double edged sword. Meds help you but they also hurt you-a good doctor will find the balance.
i had kidney stones after being on meds for a year-fyi- this can happen along with a lot of other things..read up-be your own book of knowledge-don't rely on doctors to just give you what u need. Listen to their advice, research, and then do what you feel is right-
Good luck!!!
Posts: 484 | From Burlingame, Ca | Registered: Sep 2005
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lymie tony z
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 5130
posted
HI Bethanie70,
Not to be too sarcastic but...If you had "complete kidney failure" should'nt you be pushing up daisy's?
Glad you're not...
Did anyone in ER tell you what caused this kidney failure?
I have been on and off meds for eight years now and while I have had my liver quiver and my kidneys ache...I never had a REAL bonafide problem with these organs...
Everyone is different...and you may have had a problem prior to your abx regimen...Or maybe you're not drinking enough water to clear the bugs out(and there dead bodies/toxins) or it's just one more way in which this insidious bug enters another organ and makes it missfire.
Try and find out what caused the failure./ and get back to us.....zman
-------------------- I am not a doctor...opinions expressed are from personal experiences only and should never be viewed as coming from a healthcare provider. zman Posts: 2527 | From safety harbor florida(origin Cleve., Ohio | Registered: Jan 2004
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treepatrol
Honored Contributor (10K+ posts)
Member # 4117
posted
Babesiosis is infection of red blood cells caused by the one-celled parasite Babesia.
Babesiosis is transmitted by the same deer tick that transmits Lyme disease. Although infection in animals is common, people are rarely infected. In the United States, babesiosis usually affects people on the offshore islands or coastal regions of New York and Massachusetts. It also occurs in Europe.
Babesia lives inside red blood cells and eventually destroys them, producing fever, headache, and muscle aches. Anemia may result from the breakdown of red blood cells.
In people whose spleen has been removed, the risk of severe disease and death is high. In these people, babesiosis resembles malaria {causing a high fever, anemia, dark urine, jaundice, and kidney failure}. A person with a functioning spleen usually has a mild illness that disappears on its own without treatment.
To diagnose babesiosis, a doctor examines a blood sample under a microscope. Treatment consists of taking quinine and clindamycinSome Trade Names CLEOCIN an alternative combination is atovaquoneSome Trade Names MEPRON plus azithromycin Some Trade Names ZITHROMAX .
-------------------- Do unto others as you would have them do unto you. Remember Iam not a Doctor Just someone struggling like you with Tick Borne Diseases.
treepatrol
Honored Contributor (10K+ posts)
Member # 4117
posted
1: Vet Pathol. 1997 Mar;34(2):85-96. Links Morphologic, immunohistochemical, and ultrastructural characterization of a distinctive renal lesion in dogs putatively associated with Borrelia burgdorferi infection: 49 cases (1987-1992).Dambach DM, Smith CA, Lewis RM, Van Winkle TJ. Department of Pathobiology, School of Veterinary Medicine, University of Pennsylvania, Philadelphia, USA.
A distinctive renal lesion consisting of glomerulonephritis, diffuse tubular necrosis with regeneration, and interstitial inflammation was found in 49 biopsy/necropsy cases obtained from 1987 to 1992. This lesion is manifested clinically as a rapidly progressive glomerular disease that was uniformly fatal. Immune-mediated membranoproliferative glomerulonephritis predominated (43/49, 88%). Membranous glomerulonephritis (5/49, 10%) and amyloidosis (1/49, 2%) were also noted. Subendothelial deposits, IgG, IgM, and C3 were present along glomerular basement membranes. IgA was absent. The exact cause of the tubular necrosis is unknown. Affected dogs were significantly younger (5.6 +/- 2.6 years) than dogs with other forms of glomerulonephritis (7.1 +/- 3.6 years) and amyloidosis (7.8 +/- 3.5 years) both in the studied population for the same period and in the reported canine population. Labrador and Golden retrievers were 6.4 and 4.9 times more likely, respectively, to develop this lesion. This is the first report of a breed predilection for spontaneous canine glomerulonephritis. Previous reports have associated this lesion with Borrelia burgdorferi exposure. All dogs in this study were from Lyme disease-endemic areas. Of 18 dogs serologically tested, all were positive for exposure. Silver stain examination of kidneys revealed rare spirochetes, suggesting that the presence of spirochetes in the kidney is apparently unrelated to lesion development. The role of vaccination in development of the renal lesion is undetermined. The association of this histologically and clinically unique lesion, Lyme nephritis, with Borrelia burgdorferi infection is significant because it is the only fatal form of canine Lyme borreliosis.
PMID: 9066075 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
-------------------- Do unto others as you would have them do unto you. Remember Iam not a Doctor Just someone struggling like you with Tick Borne Diseases.
posted
Just about any drug can cause kidney failure, including pain meds. And I agree that babesia and/or Lyme could cause it.
Why don't you read all of your "patient information" sheets on each drug you've taken. Look to see what it says about "kidney disease".
I'm really sorry that you're having problems!! So, are the kidneys functioning again? No dialysis?
-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96239 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
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Jill E.
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 9121
posted
Some antibiotics are metabolized more through the liver, some are metabolized more through the kidneys, some like Doxycycline are more through the intestines, etc.
You can find out this information by checking each possible antibiotic in the Physicians Desk Reference (that's what I do), discussing each with the LLMD, etc. so you can try to tailor the meds, if possible, to not be the ones that are metabolized/excreted through the kidneys.
I wish you all the best. I was on the verge of liver failure from Ketek and had to go off all abx for months, so I know the fear. But I survived. But we have to choose abx extremely carefully for me from now on to try to avoid those that are hardest on the liver. So in your case, try to avoid the ones hardest on the kidneys.
Take care, Jill
-------------------- If laughter is the best medicine, why hasn't stand-up comedy cured me? Posts: 1773 | From San Diego | Registered: Apr 2006
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posted
anyone see a connection between my dog going into a "kidney failure" and myself getting sick at the same time?
Posts: 225 | From home | Registered: Aug 2006
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posted
I originally started my treatment by taking Ceftin. I was on this for approx. three months when I rushed to the ER in horrible pain. The ER doctor tells me it appeared to be a kidney stone although they couldn't see one on the xray. I was in pain for a few days but thankfully haven't had the same experience again. I have now been taking ABX for almost two years. Went off the ceftin after a year as it was decided that I'm allergic to it. My belief is that the ceftin caused my "kidney stone" since I had never had a history of stones before or after my experience. I'm wondering if you had a condition prior to taking the ABX that may have cause kidney failure. I guess its hard to diagnosis at this point. Were you taking supplements to support your liver and kidneys while you were on ABX?
Posts: 547 | From Maryland | Registered: Mar 2005
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posted
I apologize to everyone who responded, but my kids are not going to let me read them all right now let alone respond. I will soon and appreciate you taking the time.
Zman- I've never read a rude comment on this board before. (not that I've been well enough to visit all the time) Your comment sure came off as sarcastic, I'm not sure of your intent.
As the drs in ICU explained to me..."a human body can survive 2-3 weeks without any kidneys" (and therefore w/o any kidney function). I "was lucky to get there just as my time was to completely run out."
We all come here for support. Maybe you could try to keep the rude comments to yourself. I'd hate for a rude comment to scare a new person away.
Posts: 72 | From California | Registered: Mar 2004
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posted
Ok I'm back! Thanks to all! We all learn by sharing our stories!
smiles-Yes, my alternative dr is LLMD, reg is not. You're right. I gave up on drs doing what's best for me a long time ago. That's why I'm doing my best to figure out how to proceed/react.
Lyme ED- Thanks for the link:) I'll look into it.
tree patrol- I have read about my meds and have talked with the pharmacist, etc. Everything I can think of. Kidneys are up and running, thanks for asking. Still have to do labs every 48 hours for awhile.
Jill E- Will look into the Physicians Desk Reference:) Thanks for the kind words!
Lymeindunkirk- No supplements. Lots of meds though. In addition to Lyme meds, diabetes, high blood pressure, etc. I had kidney stones twice, but long before getting sick. In my research, one thing I have learned, is that there is no connection between kidney stones or kidney disease and accute kidney failure.
I did nearly check out and have 3 children to stick around for. So I'll have to do a lot of research to figure out what to do. Waiting for appt with kidney specialist too.
Thanks all for taking the time to share what you know!! Posts: 72 | From California | Registered: Mar 2004
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posted
Opps, I forgot. Some had asked about prior conditions. Like I wrote I have a whole list of medical problems- or at least have since I got sick. Diabetes etc...So labs are done on me at least every 6 months. When I asked my reg dr, after the kidney scare, to see my last lab results. Mysteriously, they were not in my chart. Hmmm!
Oh, and no one really has a clue why. The ER dr said it was from dehydration. The ICU dr said it was all my meds together. The specialist said it was one med in particular. I never met her, she just went by what was in my chart. That one med I only take 30 or so a YEAR. My reg dr believes it's the Lyme meds. My LLMD believes it's the diabetes. So, along with all of you, I'm on my own in really figuring it out!
Take care, Beth
Posts: 72 | From California | Registered: Mar 2004
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lymie tony z
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 5130
posted
Bethany,
Sorry if you thought I was being rude to you...I was not... Sarcasm was meant for the ER doctors. They may have seen something that they could'nt explain...
In much the same way that they diagnosed me as having a cardiac arrest...twice...then changed it to Angina...caused by "stress"...cuz there were no blockages in my arteries... Perhaps you had the "symptoms" of kidney failure but not actual kidney failure. The other person who wrote about a kidney stone that would'nt show up on xray or mri or whatever may not have had a stone...just possibly a cycs...
I also got a little education from your response cuz I thought that if the kidneys "failed completely" the next step was a dirt nap!
The bug likes our kidney's especially...for some reason.
My humor is at times a bit dry...and my disdain for ducks is everpresent....
sorry again if you thought I meant any harm....
zman
-------------------- I am not a doctor...opinions expressed are from personal experiences only and should never be viewed as coming from a healthcare provider. zman Posts: 2527 | From safety harbor florida(origin Cleve., Ohio | Registered: Jan 2004
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treepatrol
Honored Contributor (10K+ posts)
Member # 4117
posted
quote:Originally posted by i want help: anyone see a connection between my dog going into a "kidney failure" and myself getting sick at the same time?
I missed That!!!
There well could be a connection. You may want to be tested for canine viral & bacteria & fungi??? Thats common to your area?? Check the vet and see if he/she has any out of the normal things happening or even something that there is a possibility that a human could catch from there pet??
-------------------- Do unto others as you would have them do unto you. Remember Iam not a Doctor Just someone struggling like you with Tick Borne Diseases.
posted
I also got a little education from your response cuz I thought that if the kidneys "failed completely" the next step was a dirt nap!
quote:
tony z I've never heard this..."dirt nap"...hilarious!
bethanie70...are you doing something for hypercoagulation?
Hope your doing much better after your ordeal!!!
Bug
-------------------- Every experience God gives us, every person He puts in our lives, is the perfect preparation for a future only He can see....Corrie Ten Boom Posts: 343 | From Northcentral Iowa | Registered: May 2005
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quote:Originally posted by i want help: anyone see a connection between my dog going into a "kidney failure" and myself getting sick at the same time?
Tree....I would think she meant that they both have Lyme...??
-------------------- --Lymetutu-- Opinions, not medical advice! Posts: 96239 | From Texas | Registered: Feb 2001
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Andie333
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 7370
posted
Help,
My 11 year old Australian Shepherd has gotten two severe illnesses I've had at almost the same time: first, I had to have my gall bladder removed.
Two weeks later, he had exactly the same physical profile I did and had t be rushed to the vet's. They performed surgery and had to remove his gall bladder. He almost died in the process. Apparently, this is a very rare thing in a dog.
Then shortly after I started treatment for Lyme disease, he went lame. My SO thought it might be arthritis, but I knew it was Lyme, mostly because of that earlier gall bladder thing.
Sure enough, after a month on abx, he was fine and back in the park again.
There are vets who believe dogs will often take on their owners illnesses. One I spoke with had seen dogs and owners both with breast cancer and diabetes. Mine was the first case he'd heard about of gall bladder.
So that may be a possibility.
Andie
Posts: 2549 | From never never land | Registered: May 2005
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Marnie
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 773
posted
My father went into complete irreversible kidney shutdown following surgery as he was given 3 powerful IV abx due to a post-op infection. Vancomycin was one.
He did not have lyme.
He also went into toxic hepatitis. He turned "yellow" - jaundiced as the liver has to "detox" many abx on their way out of the system.
This cleared within 2 days as the liver has tremendous recuperative powers.
The kidneys do not. In his case, the kidney was totally destroyed. (He had one removed for cancer.) He had a history of kidney stones.
Kidney cells maintain the pH balance. This is the acid-base or acid-alkaline balance. pH stands for "potential of hydrogen".
Kidney cells are esp. vulnerable to damage from too many "negative charges". Acids fall in this category which is why the original Atkins diet caused kidney shutdown. Too much protein = acidic + not enough minerals and sugar (alkalines). It is all about balance. Lots of neg. charges but a few positive are absolutely needed too. Many minerals and sugar are alkaline.
We are supposed to be slightly alkaline.
In lyme, one is already too acidic.
Metabolic acidosis happens as the DNA hydrogen bonds (weak) are broken as well as when TNF alpha - a proinflammatory cytokine - goes thru the roof (for many protective reasons).
The body is trying to fight. NORMALLY acids -antibodies (specific highly targeted proteins) destroy pathogens. Bb is resistant to the various NORMAL approaches the body uses.
You might be interested in my response today under the "alcohol" post about how Bb is surviving and what I believe is a better approach to clearing this infection which we know is following the glycolysis AND cholesterol pathways.
Bb is a very, very unique pathogen!!! It does not have the typical outer LPS (sugar layer - simplified) cell wall and it mutates easily which makes it much harder to eliminate.
This is one very complex, very resistant pathogen!!!
Lyme causes a "significant" drop in Mg at the outset. This info. comes from a cancer hospital in Romania. The abstract is linked on this board.
Kidney stones are usually calcium. Too much circulating calcium. How is your bone density?
"Depending on its size and position, an untreated kidney stone could cause permanent damage to the kidneys."
"Urine normally contains chemicals--citrate, magnesium, pyrophosphate--that prevent the formation of crystals. Low levels of these inhibitors can contribute to the formation of kidney stones. Of these, citrate is thought to be the most important."
"Renal tubular acidosis: This is a condition in which the kidneys do not properly regulate the amount of acid in the body. It can cause kidney stones and affect a child's growth, but usually can be treated with medications."
Frequencies to shatter kidney stones can -> diabetes a few years later. That info. was in the news recently and I have a close friend this has happened to.
When Mg drops, up goes calcium.
Mg levels are very much related to diabetes and insulin resistance. There are over 2000 websites if you "Google" the words "Magnesium diabetes" to begin to understand this very complex connection.
Having diabetes AND lyme is extremely difficult to manage since this pathogen follows the glycolysis as well as the cholesterol pathways.
How long do you think you have had lyme?
Posts: 9481 | From Sunshine State | Registered: Mar 2001
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posted
Babesiosis [bab-EE-see-OH-sis] is caused by the Babesia parasite, an organism similar to that causing malaria. This attacks the red blood cells & its existence can only be shown by laboratory identification of the parasite. Symptoms, if any, begin with tiredness, loss of appetite, & a general ill feeling. As the infection progresses, fever, drenching sweats, muscle aches, & headache can follow, leading to complications such as very low blood pressure, liver problems, severe haemolytic anaemia (a breakdown of red blood cells), & kidney failure. Other people usually have a milder illness & often get better on their own.
Posts: 789 | From CT, | Registered: Jun 2006
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posted
Ehrlichiosis [air-LICK-ee-OH-sis] is a bacterial attack of the white blood cells. Symptoms usually appear 3 to 16 days after a tick bite. The most common symptoms are sudden high fever, tiredness, major muscle aches, severe headache, and, in some cases, a rash. Diagnosis is difficult, even in severe cases. Because diagnostic tests are not widely available, the diagnosis of Ehrlichiosis is usually based on symptoms & a history of exposure to ticks. Severely ill patients can develop abnormally low numbers of white blood cells, or platelets, & kidney failure.
Posts: 789 | From CT, | Registered: Jun 2006
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posted
Fortunately, you had acute kidney failure, not chronic which would mean dialysis. Acute kidney failure can be caused by medications, low blood pressure, shock etc....When the cause is removed the kidneys can repair.
Diabetes damages the kidneys over a period of time, especially insulin-dependent diabetes. I don't know how long you have been diabetic or if you are on insulin vs. oral meds for diabetes.
I think it's possible your kidneys could not handle metabolizing all the medications. You may never know for sure.
I'm glad you are ok.
Posts: 340 | From Ohio | Registered: Oct 2005
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zman- Ok, no problem. It did make me feel like I was exaggerating. I'm sure a lot of the people here have had to tolerate that kind of treatment from others. Thanks for the new post.
bugabooboo- Thanks for your kind words. Please excuse my ignorance...what is hypercoagulation??
marnie- How long have I had Lyme? Since the fall of 1999. I was seriously misdiagnosed in the beginning. After that I was told that I was just lazy, not sick. I was finally, properly diagnosed in spring of 2002. Thanks so much for all the info.
al- thanks to you too for sending me some info. Take care all, Beth Posts: 72 | From California | Registered: Mar 2004
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posted
Because your dog was sick also I'm wondering if you both could have been exposed to some type of chemical. Chemicals in our environment do a lot of damage. I spoke to a woman once who took all the chemicals out of her environment and had her son detoxed. Much to the amazement of school personnel he was out of special ed within I believe a year. Its hard to say how the chemicals effect us when we don't realize how much we are being given. Anyhow it was just a though. I often wonder if some of us don't get better from the lyme because of the chemical levels and other toxins existing in our bodies.
Posts: 547 | From Maryland | Registered: Mar 2005
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Marnie
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 773
posted
I ran across this while researching cholesterol lowering drugs:
Fluvastatin-induced rhabdomyolysis Modi JR and MS Cratty
OBJECTIVE: To demonstrate a case of rhabdomyolysis with acute renal failure in a patient receiving fluvastatin and to present evidence that this was an adverse drug reaction to fluvastatin.
CASE SUMMARY: A 51-year-old white man with a past medical history significant for hyperlipidemia treated with fluvastatin presented with malaise, myalgias, nausea, and lumbar back pain.
The patient had azotemia with elevated creatine kinase (CK), lactate dehydrogenase, and transaminases. He developed hematuria and proteinuria.
Laboratory results demonstrated a normal antinuclear antibody, rheumatoid factor, angiotensin-converting enzyme, antineutrophil cytoplasmic antibody, and thyroid-stimulating hormone.
Cytomegalovirus and Epstein-Barr virus titers were negative for recent infection. There were no signs of systemic infection; the white blood cell count was normal and blood and urine cultures were negative. Renal ultrasound showed hyperechoic renal cortices with no obstruction.
The discontinuation of fluvastatin and hemodialysis led to a rapid decrease in CK and improvement in symptoms.
DISCUSSION: Hydroxymethylglutaryl coenzyme A (HMG-CoA) reductase inhibitors have the potential to cause rhabdomyolysis.
However, fluvastatin is rarely associated with rhabdomyolysis when compared to other statins. Differences in biochemical and pharmacokinetic properties between fluvastatin and other HMG-CoA reductase inhibitors may be important in the development of rhabdomyolysis.
CONCLUSIONS: Fluvastatin was the precipitating factor causing rhabdomyolysis in this case report. This patient had no other findings to suggest infection or other disorder inducing rhabdomyolysis. An objective causality assessment revealed that the adverse drug reaction was probable as determined by the Naranjo probability scale.
Fluvastatin has the potential to cause serious adverse effects. Therefore, a heightened awareness by the patient and physician for potential signs of myopathy is recommended.
Rhabdomyolysis is the breakdown of muscle fibers resulting in the release of muscle fiber contents into the circulation. Some of these are toxic to the kidney and frequently result in kidney damage.
Magnesium ALSO inactivates HMG CoA reductase. IMO, a safer approach.
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She is one step away from forbidding me to continue. For right now I am off all my many, many meds, except for pain meds, until I've seen a kidney specialist. Soon I'll have to decide though!
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