hshbmom
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 9478
posted
Hello lymies,
I have a friend with ankylosing spondylitis...and heart problems. I think he should have a real Lyme test.
How does Lyme disease cause calcifications? I'd like to be able to explain this to his parents, but I don't know enough about it.
He was told he had a bacterial infection at one time. He was also told that if he'd had been given the proper antibiotics spondylitis would not have developed. I guess his problem started out with what they call spinal arthritis.
He's been in constant pain for 4 years; he has had kidney stones too. This is a young man...still in college. His dad also has many Lyme symptoms, such as arthritis and heart problems.
Is this correct? Lyme disease can cause microcalcifications in the brain. These calcifications can be seen on an MRI.
Nancy
[ 21. September 2006, 11:15 PM: Message edited by: hshbmom ]
Posts: 1672 | From AL/WV/OH | Registered: Jun 2006
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NP40
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 6711
posted
Nothing surprises me with lyme anymore, I'm sure it can cause just about anything. When approaching folks you suspect of having Bb I always approach them with having an Igenex test to definitively "rule out" or "rule in" lyme.
They can go here and request the WB. www.igenex.com The cost is a couple hundred bucks and a lot of piece of mind.
Posts: 1632 | From Northern Wisconsin | Registered: Jan 2005
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posted
I don't get that "definitively rule out Lyme" part. Is that just a way of getting them to take the tests even though we know it is a clinical diagnosis?
I get calcifications since Lyme. In my ribcage and on my tendons in fingers. Have had some surgicallly removed.
I find that taking the mag tab SR and reducing my quantity of calcium supplements helps a lot at those times.
I see the ankylosing spondylosis in my patients too (acupuncturist) and the first thing I have them do is
-cut out bad calcium supplements that will cause deposits (like carbonate and tums), have them switch to good calcium (citrate usually)
- add the magnesium and try and make it a 1:1 ratio of cal to mag or even 2 mags to one calcium ratio... (like 600:600 or 800 mag:400 calcium)
-and acupuncture them and maybe some chinese herbs.
I have had very good success with this. I also acupuncture my own deposits in my tendons and they go away... but then come back later... and then ad infinatum.
Needless to s ay, I think it is a Lyme thing, as it started with me excatly when I started to get very sick. But then, at that time, my insomnia also got worse so I was taking excess calcium to sleep without enough magnesium.. . so who knows Posts: 589 | From Rhode Island | Registered: Jun 2006
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hshbmom
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 9478
posted
Hi luvdogs,
Can you treat ankylosing spondylitis with acupuncture? If so, what kind of improvement do you observe? After how long?
I have a friend who treats horses with acupuncture. He's very successful.
Can the calcifications be removed?
I just remembered; I have 2 other college friends (brothers) with AS. I wonder if they have Lyme?????
Nancy
Posts: 1672 | From AL/WV/OH | Registered: Jun 2006
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posted
Another area of calcifications is kidney stones. Docs finally figured out that it is not excess calcium which causes these, but deficient magnesium. The balance is what is important -- luvdogs is on the right track.
Marnie has written extensively about how Lyme depletes magnesium. Bb uses it and stress and sugar further deplete it. Of course diet is a major part of the problem.
Need to include the B vitmins -- especially B6 so magnesium will be utilized correctly.
Most patients with Ankylosing Spondylitis have a specific gene which predisposes them to this illness, but it takes a bacteria to activate the disease. This is some of the research that was done several years ago when Yale docs were trying to prove that Lyme was an autoimmune disease -- their research did not prove that but it may explain in part why some people have more arthritic symptoms and others have neuro or cardiac symptoms etc.
The lesions commonly seen on brain MRI's of both Lyme and MS patients are not usually calcified -- these bright white spots could be either inflammation or areas of hypoperfusion (low blood flow causing tissue death).
It definitely sounds like a Lyme test would be a good idea for your friend. Ankylosing Spondylitis does not generally affect any other parts of the body except for the spine -- the heart symptoms point to an additional illness which could be Lyme and other tick-borne diseases.
This is not medical advice, just my opinion.
Bea Seibert
Posts: 7306 | From Martinsville,VA,USA | Registered: Oct 2004
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posted
Hi - This is an edited version of what I wrote a few hours earlier.
My experience is that anybody with a chronic, inflammatory disease like ankylosing spondylitis can be helped a lot with acupuncture, but more in a symptomatic way. I find that they tend to need regular treatments for new things as they arise.. I have not had much success in getting to the "heart" of the condition, if it is anything like Lyme or other chronic inflammatory diseases. IN cases like this, acupuncture really needs to go hand in hand with allopathic medicine.
We can resolve bone spurs, if any (which there often are) through the acupuncture and herbs and magnesium. (In fact, contrary to what I said above, I often start by having them completely CUT calcium supplements altogether and only do magnesium for a few months until sx start to resolve - I then add the calcium - good form- later to prevent osteoporosis which many of them have).
Something like cervical spondylosis is a pretty quick fix, and usually permanent. But ankylosing spond is a chronic inflammatory one and so that is harder, except on a continual, symptomatic basis.
My general suspicion, when somebody comes in with many inflammatory conditions that resmble Lyme, is undiagnosed Lyme or Lyme-like illness. I might look at all of their sx and history and then ask if they have had a Lyme test - even more common is that they have checked off Lyme Disease as part of their history. They say that they were "treated" and they are better now.
If it is the right type of patient (and I feel this out very delicately), I encourage them to contact their doctor to make sure they do not still have active infection. Usually they do, if they follow through.
Very fine waters I am treading there and so I only do it when absolutely obvious to me and them... and medically necessary.
But - to answer your question - yes. Acupuncture helps many pain conditions and inflammatory conditions. I treat myself for all of my rheumatic and tendon / muscular symptoms and most neuro, with almost 100% success rate. Also for many of my patients, even if a chronic condition. But, while I might heal the finger tendon pain, a few days later there might be foot pain... or the tendon pain might return 6 months later, or variations on that. It is the darned cognitive sx that I can't seem to touch with acupunture, except that it helps one to relax and be less prone to anxiety and insomnia.
Hope this answers your question.
[ 22. September 2006, 03:39 PM: Message edited by: luvdogs ]
Posts: 589 | From Rhode Island | Registered: Jun 2006
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Background: Ankylosing spondylitis is a distinct disease entity characterized by inflammation of multiple articular and para-articular structures, frequently resulting in bony ankylosis.
The term ankylosing is derived from the Greek word ankylos, meaning stiffening of a joint, while spondylos means vertebra. Spondylitis refers to inflammation of one or more vertebrae. Ankylosing spondylitis usually is classified as a chronic and progressive form of seronegative arthritis.
Ankylosing spondylitis has a predilection for the axial skeleton, affecting particularly the sacroiliac and spinal facet joints and the paravertebral soft tissues. Extraspinal manifestations of the disease include peripheral arthritis, iritis, pulmonary involvement, and systemic upset.
Pathophysiology: The basic pathologic lesion of ankylosing spondylitis occurs at the entheses, which are sites of attachment to bone of ligaments, tendons, and joint capsules.
Enthesopathy results from inflammation, with subsequent calcification and ossification at and around the entheses. Inflammation with cellular infiltration by lymphocytes, plasma cells, and polymorphonuclear leukocytes is associated with erosion and eburnation of the subligamentous bone. The process usually starts at the sacroiliac joints.
Other enthesopathic sites include the iliac crest, ischial tuberosity, greater trochanter, patella, and calcaneum. In the paravertebral soft tissues, the lesion manifests as a formation of new bone within the outer layers of the annulus fibrosis of the intervertebral disk. The margins of the disk are invaded by hyperemic granulation tissue arising from the subchondral bone. This tissue replaces the disk fibers with new bone.
In the synovial joints, a proliferative chronic synovitis is seen that is indistinguishable from rheumatoid arthritis; however, subchondral bone and cartilage are invaded by reactive tissue originating from the bone, which is a feature not encountered in rheumatoid arthritis. Capsular fibrosis and bony ankylosis tend to occur.
Formation of bony bridges between adjacent vertebrae (syndesmophytes) and progressive ossification of extraspinal joint capsules and ligaments are characteristic of the disease. Unlike rheumatoid arthritis, pannus formation is not known to occur.
The etiology of ankylosing spondylitis is unknown; however, a strong genetic influence exists. Family history of the disease is common. Approximately 90-95% of patients with ankylosing spondylitis have the tissue antigen human leukocyte antigen B27 (HLA-B27), compared to 7% in the general population. Since only 1% of individuals who have positive findings for HLA-B27 develop the disease, the disease is likely triggered by an unknown environmental factor in patients who are genetically predisposed.
From above:
Ankylosing spondylitis usually is classified as a chronic and progressive form of seronegative arthritis.
When you click link then symptom file then up in left corner theres binoculars click on them and then on right side type arthritis it will bring them all up.
-------------------- Do unto others as you would have them do unto you. Remember Iam not a Doctor Just someone struggling like you with Tick Borne Diseases.
posted
Nancy - I answered earlier with a post, but I just edited it. it is sort of hard to explain the answer to your question, but I have tried. if you read earlier, you might want to read again...
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