trails
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 1620
posted
Welp--I think I have tendonitis from cipro.
I thought it was just a herx---kept taking cipro. Called LLMD---he said it mostly occurs in Achilles and since my problem is shoulder/arm/hand--it prolly isnt the cipro.
Then it just got worse. Today my arm is BURNING. when I looked up the quinolone cuased tendonitis I found that rotator cuff was one of them!!! that is where my pain is eminating from!
It started when I tried to draw on the chalkboard for my students....all of a sudden my right arm was SOOOO weak I couldnt hold it up to draw. It has been really bad since then---monday.
I have had this before but it was the beginning of my lyme symptoms so this is all just too much to try to figure out---is it a herx or is it tendonitis???
any sure fire way to find out? especially for shoulder/arm/hand?
so upset and in pain, trails Posts: 1950 | From New Mexico | Registered: Sep 2001
| IP: Logged |
Aniek
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 5374
posted
I don't think there is anyway to know for sure. But if you really think it's caused by the Cipro, then maybe better safe than sorry. You don't want to damage the tendon.
Tendinitis from quinolines can occur in any tendon. The achilles is a week area, that's why it's common there. Nothing specific to Cipro.
-------------------- "When there is pain, there are no words." - Toni Morrison Posts: 4711 | From Washington, DC | Registered: Mar 2004
| IP: Logged |
trails
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 1620
posted
thanks aniek!
what does shoulder/rotator cuff tendonitis FEEL like?
Posts: 1950 | From New Mexico | Registered: Sep 2001
| IP: Logged |
Jill E.
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 9121
posted
Trails,
I've been spending months recovering from Achilles Tendon pain and weakness from quinolones. A Lyme friend of mine also developed Achilles Tendon pain from Levaquin, but also complained about shoulder/arm pain, which she had never had from Lyme.
Her Lyme practitioner couldn't give her a definite answer either about tendonitis versus herx. However, she went off the Levaquin despite it helping her Bart symptoms.
Unfortunately she is out of town and I won't be seeing her for about one week, but I'll ask her for more details about the shoulder pain when she returns.
She has recovered quite well doing physical therapy and icing the area. I had found that icing my Achilles Tendons helped more than anything else I tried, so she tried it and agreed.
I also use a homeopathic cream called Topricin at www.topricin.com which helps a bit.
But more than anything, in terms of my Achilles Tendons, is I really had to stay off my feet a lot - so you may need to try to rest your arm as much as possible. Easier said than done - I couldn't walk or drive for quite awhile - and in your case, it interferes with your work.
Take care, Jill
-------------------- If laughter is the best medicine, why hasn't stand-up comedy cured me? Posts: 1773 | From San Diego | Registered: Apr 2006
| IP: Logged |
trueblue
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 7348
posted
trails, Have you stopped the Cipro? I would and see what happens.
It may take a while to tell but at least it wouldn't be getting worse if that's the cause.
The way I'm looking at it, if this is a herx it's too bad and you run the risk of doing more damage. If it's from the Cipro best to stop that anyway.
That's all just my opinion but rotator cuff pain sucks and we want it gone sooner than later.
I hope you feel better soon. Sorry, you've got yet another crappy thing to deal with.
-------------------- more light, more love more truth and more innovation Posts: 3783 | From somewhere other than here | Registered: May 2005
| IP: Logged |
-------------------- Daisy Posts: 122 | From at the computer | Registered: Jul 2006
| IP: Logged |
Melanie Reber
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 3707
posted
So sorry, my dear!
Sent an email, hope it helps.
Much love, M
Posts: 7052 | From Colorado | Registered: Mar 2003
| IP: Logged |
trails
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 1620
posted
Thanks everyone so very much for your concern and your stories and your help and your links that you sent privately.
Just got done watching doc B's video about bart...(robi you rock!) pretty upset that my LLMD didnt put me on magnesium BEFORE starting treatment. Sounds like that should have been done.
The damage is done I fear. It REALLLLLY hurts all the time. I took 800 mg of ibuprofen, 5mg of valium and .5 of ativan and I feel like crying myself to sleep.
sorry I am such a bummer. just needing to really be sad about this as this pain is so reminiscent of how I relapsed ---it is a VERY emotional thing on top of being a physical thing.
ALso---doc B says that his bartonella patients did NOT experience herx reactions while treating with levaquin.
I think i should call it a night with all these meds in me! thanks from the bottom of my heart, trails
Posts: 1950 | From New Mexico | Registered: Sep 2001
| IP: Logged |
trails
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 1620
posted
more detailed responses:
Cave-- yeah--we have discussed this nightmare before. Why dont the LLMDs wake up to this? You are NOT the only one that warned me and that said--woah on the quinolones, but I kept telling the LLMD and he kept brushing me off! Any dieas how to heal the tendonitis?
Jill---I am going to buy the topiricin--thanks! I really am in pain--anything that might help that is topical is awesome. Let me know when your freind returns--I really appreciate your time and your helping me!
TB---thanks so much dahlin. but you better just take care of you right now.
Ma--i think it might be something about pressing on the joint vs. the middle of the muscle...but I forget what it does really either. I am so upset about this and of course now that it has happened to me I strongly caution your son. I did NOTHING to bring this on except draw on the chalkboard. BUt this is an old injury and a weak point in my body. make sure your son pays attention to his weakest links and if he feels pain there he tells you right away! how is he doing otherwise?
daisy--- thanks here's one for you too--((((*daisy*))))
melanie--got your email---too depressed to reply. It really helped thought to pin point my own story and know this is really tendonitis and I am in for a ANOTHER long journey. Thanks for being such a great friend!
here's my new question everyone:
HOW DO I RECOVER FROM TENDONITIS?
do I do PT? heat? Ice? both? I know I should rest it.....will try my best.
HOW LONG UNTIL I FEEL SOME RELIEF???
thank you all over and over, trails
Posts: 1950 | From New Mexico | Registered: Sep 2001
| IP: Logged |
Areneli
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 6740
posted
I had a similiar damage done to me by Cipro some years ago. Eventually it did go away but it took about a year to heal.
I still don't understand how magnesium would prevent it.
Posts: 1538 | From Planet Earth | Registered: Jan 2005
| IP: Logged |
Jill E.
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 9121
posted
Hi again, Trails,
Like you, I watched Dr. B's DVD on Bart after I already had the tendon problems, so I would have liked being told to really load up my magnesium doses even higher than I was already were. But I was on magnesium during all this.
For me, I think time has been the best healer. Given that both of my Achilles Tendons ached and were weak (and still are a bit), every step of walking or driving was almost impossible.
So I had other people drive me, I but had to walk - so I sometimes used a cane if I had to go up or down hills. So I wore athletic shoes only for months, plus bought orthotics to put in them. Yes, I was a definite fashion "don't" at all times.
I realize you're dealing with the shoulder which is different, but again, I think anything you can do to use it less would help - but I know it's hard.
I am just now, after eight months, able to wear flat shoes with orthotics, but no high heels. But I am improving.
As I mentioned before, icing the area gives me the best temporary relief. and I put the Topricin cream on.
I sometimes use the detox foot pads and I think they helped a little. I don't know if they would work if you stuck them on your shoulder.
My pal who is doing the physical therapy believes it has helped. She mainly went to get some kind of physical therapy-=type ultrasound on the areas, but they mainly had her do stretching exercises.
I will go to PT if I can find the time but right now I can't.
One neighbor (not a Lyme patient, but a cancer patient) developed leg tendon problems from Cipro. She went to the ER and the doctor told her that it's essential to drink lots of water on quinolones, otherwise they can crystallize in the tissues and cause that stabbing pain.
Well, I always drink huge amounts of water - always have - so I don't think lack of water was my issue.
Anyway, try some ice on it and see how that works.
Also, both my LLMD and internist gave me the OK to take Advil for a couple of weeks. Normally I avoid it but I think it helped a little.
Take care, Jill
-------------------- If laughter is the best medicine, why hasn't stand-up comedy cured me? Posts: 1773 | From San Diego | Registered: Apr 2006
| IP: Logged |
trails
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 1620
posted
thanks again everyone.
areneli--doc B's video of his talk on bartonella mentions that if you load up the patient with magnesium before starting to treat with quinonlones, they have less chance of tendon problems.
jill and cave--I guess it helps to know that the bag doesnt always help--coz I hate regretting stuff. Mag has NEVER helped any of symptoms in the past and it intereferes with so many meds it is hard to find a time to take it. I am taking it now though.
THe ice does help very temporarily--and I HATE the cold, so everyone knows that I MUST be in a lot of pain to subject myself to these ice packs several times a day.
I am taking ibuprofen and hoping that it is helping with swelling and pain--but I cant tell the difference at all. It just hurts.
I will call LLMD on monday and get script for PT--i wont go to an ortho--as they have really screwed me over in the past.
How could I live with this pain for a year? I cant beleive I am RIGHT back where I started from and so much worse two years later. Posts: 1950 | From New Mexico | Registered: Sep 2001
| IP: Logged |
Jill E.
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 9121
posted
Trails,
Don't assume you'll have to live with the pain for a year! My tendons have taken many months to heal, but my friend with the shoulder pain is healing much faster! Maybe the PT really accelerated her healing.
As soon as she is back in town, I will get the scoop and PM you.
Jill
-------------------- If laughter is the best medicine, why hasn't stand-up comedy cured me? Posts: 1773 | From San Diego | Registered: Apr 2006
| IP: Logged |
Aniek
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 5374
posted
trails,
Remember, it might not be tendinitis. So it might not be damage, and it might clear up much faster.
I don't actually know what tendinitis feels like. I was misdiangosed with tendinitis before Lyme. But it turned out to really be referred pain from inflamed/tight muscles in my thoracic area.
From that, I did learn that referred pain from muscles can feel like what I assume tendon pain is. Because the pain feels like it is right next to the bone.
As far as helping it heal, if it is tendinitis you don't want to strain it. So I would stay away from using the shoulder and particularly stay away from exercise using your shoulder. PT should help if they do things to increase blood flow.
-------------------- "When there is pain, there are no words." - Toni Morrison Posts: 4711 | From Washington, DC | Registered: Mar 2004
| IP: Logged |
Ann-OH
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 2020
(This is the same information that is on the package insert for Cipro)
[quote] Tendon Effects:
Ruptures of the shoulder, hand, Achilles tendon or other tendons that required surgical repair or resulted in prolonged disability have been reported in patients receiving quinolones, including ciprofloxacin.
Post-marketing surveillance reports indicate that this risk may be increased in patients receiving concomitant corticosteroids, especially the elderly.
Ciprofloxacin should be discontinued if the patient experiences pain, inflammation, or rupture of a tendon.
Patients should rest and refrain from exercise until the diagnosis of tendonitis or tendon rupture has been excluded.
Tendon rupture can occur during or after therapy with quinolones, including ciprofloxacin.
[end quote]
Been there a couple of times. PT was the worst - Avelox, Cipro, and other fluoroquinolones can also effect cause neurologic symptoms.
I still have tendon problems that recur when I stretch or twist a joint. I have problems in my left hand right now.
Have had a ruptured tendon in my hip, problems with wrists, elbows, knees and heels and bottoms of my feet, but never, never achilles tendon.
trueblue
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 7348
posted
trails ~ the shoulder pain may not be tendonitis and even if it were, that doesn;t mean it takes everyone the same amount of time to heal.
You are a marvel at healing! I'm sorry you keep having to so it over and over.
I have had a lot of shoulder problems and they come and go. I did have problems with both rotator cuffs, one a partial tear the other I guess just inbflammed, I dunno. They got better it didn't take anywhere near a year.
I also have lysis of both Acromioclavicular joints. First one then the other from favoring it to protect the first one.
All of it has gotten better. Truly.
Hang in there, keep icing (and think of me... I love ice, if that helps) and do get the script for PT. That should provide you with a decent amount of relief and will also be your best bet at a proper evaluation of the shoulder.
(the right A/C joint had too much of the bone eaten away and wound up sort of deformed but otherwise... )
-------------------- more light, more love more truth and more innovation Posts: 3783 | From somewhere other than here | Registered: May 2005
| IP: Logged |
AZURE WISH
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 804
posted
I was on leviquin and pain just kep getting worse and worse....
no damage ... no herx.... the darn stuff just didnt work for me and allowed the lyme to do what it pleased.
I hope you have no damage you have been through so much already.
I would tell your llmd cuz of this pain you are not comfortable taking the cipro and you want a different abx.
posted
Hi Trails I have had so many issues after being on Cipro and later Levaquin. I still am suffereing after 3 years . It has actually become even more of a problem than Lyme - because the pain is intolerable. I Have pain/damage wrists, shoulder, back, Most significant is R hip pain,
When I was diagnosed with Lyme the worst of my problems were cognitive, memory , word loss , brain stuff.
But I did have previous swelling & pain in my left knee and some back problems , mild pain from years before , I also had mild arthritis like pain in hands & fingers.
After being on cipro it caused - the very 1st day , severe calf, ankle, and achilles pain, the low back pain,I stopped it within a few days and took to bed because of the severeity..
The LLMD agreed it was a good descision after my next visit when I explained after seperated my drugs out that I had found Cipro to be an immediate cause and could not even walk from the effects.
He took me off but I had been handed over to the Nurse practitioner for most of my visits instead of seeing him each time.
She insisted we try it again about a month later & eventually convinced me, this time no major issues with achilles, but back problems, and wrists weakened or worseened,
I probably had some carpal tunnel damage prior to the meds but not all the damage because it would have affected my ability to work..I am now very disabled as a result.
Now after MRI recently I find its actually torn ligaments in my wrists and ,carpal tunnel, nerve damage and the lower back pain became acute and into my hip causing the worst pain I have ever been in ..
A few months after the months of Cipro in combo with other orals and IV Abx. I was put on IV levaquin a few months later caused shoulder/rotator cuff pain that is still giving me problems three years later.
I can honestly say I would never ever touch a floraquinalone again in my life. Be very careful as these meds can continue to due damage for months after you stop taking them.
I read alot of stuff on them so the info is all over the internet - just look, you will be very shocked at the chat roms and message boards associated with cipro tendonitis, damage to joints and so forth.
I was a waitress while being treated long term IV and could not have been treated if not for Co. medical benifits, so I could not stop working even though I was on IV for 15 months.
I had my share of ups and downs , and herxs but Cipro was a serious part of a downward spiral for me , by the time the next 6 months of cipro then levaquin IV for months in combos with other meds I was in so much pain I just began focusing on getting rid of he pain.
I would strongly suggest you take it very easy, I injured things do nothing more than daily activities for me.I personally would never take these drugs again, nor recommend them to friends or family.
I would go way out of my way to stop family from taking them for any reason & have stopped my adult daughter who told me after taking her first dose .She never took another dose, she called and had them change her meds.
I hope you can figure it out in your case -of course it could be a herx, but if its severe pain I would back off and come at it with something else.Mine started with tendon pain which was in and of itself awful .. but got much worse than just tendons.
I really hope that your pain is relieved when you stop the meds or get done with treatment if you continue on them. The 1st time I stoppped the achilles pain did go away so there is some hope that it will, but not always.. Take care
-------------------- Sandi ( badkitti30043) Posts: 664 | From Atlanta Ga. | Registered: Aug 2002
| IP: Logged |
trails
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 1620
posted
thanks azure---I have stopped the cipro for now--I am glad there was no damage for you--gives me hope.
Sandi--your story breaks my heart! Oh the PAIN! and the suffering. I am so sorry to hear that you had to go thru all this.
I am still not sure WHAT is going on here with me. I woke up today a bit better and i have had moments of less pain today.
But I am keeping up the NSAIDs, the ice and then heat, and the resting the arm.
I will call LLMD on monday.
I still dont understand what TENDON pain is. I have read a lot and i am not sure my pain is tendon pain. my ENTIRE shoulder complex is hurting (and it actually starts up into my cervical spine) and then it shoots pain down my biceps and I can feel the pain all the way into my fingertips.
My muscles on the outside of my upper arm/shoulder are VERY tight and hurt a lot. THe muscles under my arm pit and next to my scapula are the same. and my arm is very weak. these are the things that say tendonitis to me, but the other things are neuro---so I dunno.
anyhow--I feel tiny bit more optimistic. maybe coz I finally stipped and dyed my hair orange. weeeeeeheeeeee! Posts: 1950 | From New Mexico | Registered: Sep 2001
| IP: Logged |
Aniek
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 5374
posted
Trails,
It could just be inflamed muscles. Your symptoms sound a lot like the pain I had when I was first diagnosed.
I had it for over a year, got it under control with Flexeril and myofascial trigger point release.
-------------------- "When there is pain, there are no words." - Toni Morrison Posts: 4711 | From Washington, DC | Registered: Mar 2004
| IP: Logged |
posted
Quinolones cause reactions that are far worse than a common course of lyme. Many injuries caused by quinolones are irreversible, and many people do not recover ever.
Around 80% of all reactions to cipro and levaquin emerge some weeks after completing the treatment, so nobody tends to link them with the antibiotic.
A close co-worker of mine has been crippled severely after taking quinolones for a suspected lyme infection.
For more information on the point of view of victims you may visit their sites at:
Hopefully if your shoulder rotator has not been deeply injured, you will feel better in some months time, save that you play sports, in which case, you might be facing years of tendinitis that would surface in more areas of the body.
Wish you get well soon.
Posts: 94 | From canada | Registered: Nov 2006
| IP: Logged |
posted
Trails, I saw this post and then your name next to it, and in my head there was a loud NO!
Simply NO, you have had enough.
You are a marvel at healing as True pointed out. This may be temporary inflammation from an infection or herxheimer. But it must be agonizing thinking of the worst.
Many Posts: 628 | From the south | Registered: Dec 2005
| IP: Logged |
The Lyme Disease Network is a non-profit organization funded by individual donations. If you would like to support the Network and the LymeNet system of Web services, please send your donations to:
The
Lyme Disease Network of New Jersey 907 Pebble Creek Court,
Pennington,
NJ08534USA http://www.lymenet.org/
UBBFriend: Email this page to someone!
![[shake]](graemlins/shake.gif)
![[kiss]](graemlins/kissing.gif)
![[Frown]](frown.gif)
![[Roll Eyes]](rolleyes.gif)
![[Wink]](wink.gif)
)![[Razz]](tongue.gif)
![[group hug]](graemlins/grouphug.gif)
Printer-friendly view of this topic