lymie tony z
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 5130
posted
Hey sorry Jimmy,
By the way...I was on a boat in the Navy with a guy by the name of James A Wagner who was from Poland NY...
Can you see if you can find him for me?
We used to call him JAW!
I was called SPIKE in case he askes who wants to find him!
thanks zman(how'd you know I was half sicilian?
-------------------- I am not a doctor...opinions expressed are from personal experiences only and should never be viewed as coming from a healthcare provider. zman Posts: 2527 | From safety harbor florida(origin Cleve., Ohio | Registered: Jan 2004
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As far as the other James W., don't know him, but try to search in the www.superpages.com site.
If he has a phone and is listed, you will find him there.
Meanwhile, have a Cannoli and some Espresso, and meet us in Bay Ridge Friday night!
Peace, Love and Wellness, JRW
[ 02. November 2006, 04:38 PM: Message edited by: JRWagner ]
Posts: 1414 | From Ny, Ny | Registered: Oct 2002
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ConnieMc
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 191
posted
For the group who is trying this, let's all PM one another and share email addresses so we can communicate and follow progress on one another. I will read back through this and determine who the guinea pigs are, then will PM. Anyone who wants to do this, please PM me and I will provide my email.
posted
Hi guys--I tried pming connie too--Just wanted to say I'm on board and look forward to seeing what happens. I've taken silver beofre and experienced a huge herx from it. I imagine I'll have to go slowly with it, a lot slower than what russell has in mind...we all have to know our limits!!
I hope you all come back to say how it's working for you... Posts: 77 | From New York | Registered: Oct 2006
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ConnieMc
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 191
posted
Ooops sorry about the full box. I fixed it. Let's all keep in touch. Should be interesting...
Posts: 2276 | From NC | Registered: Oct 2000
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posted
Ashley, I'm a bit concerned about herxing also. I am soooo sensitive. Although I am taking some Buhner herbs that are helping with herx's. But 20 drops 3 times a day is pretty heavy. I will check in with intuition when the bottle comes. Take care all. Joyce
Posts: 905 | From Santa Cruz,Calif | Registered: Aug 2005
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posted
Wanted to let you know I rec'd my bottle yesterday.
Yesterday I also found out I will be starting IV Roceph on Thurs. I am keeping the Nutra for the future, but not starting on it till I see the results of the Roceph. This is my final and last resort on IV's.
Please keep us up to date on your progress. I hope it works !!!! I hope the Roceph works !!! Please...let something work !!
Posts: 116 | From state of lyme | Registered: Oct 2006
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ConnieMc
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 191
posted
OK, I have emails from JRWagner and typhoon..sheri (but she can't start right now). IsThereHope, please send yours and I will include you in the conversation. To whoever wants to join in, I had the idea of assembling all emails then always clicking on "reply all" that way everyone will see what the others have ot say.
I do not have my bottle yet, but should have in the next few days.
Posts: 2276 | From NC | Registered: Oct 2000
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posted
Connie, Thanks for doing this.I just pm'd u. OOPS, forgot to send u my E-mail address. Will do. Joyce
Posts: 905 | From Santa Cruz,Calif | Registered: Aug 2005
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shazdancer
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 1436
posted
I wish you all well, I truly do. But I remember when colloidal silver was a big deal on Lymenet 5 years ago. It never became the "big cure" we've all been looking for.
Just be careful, okay?
-- Shaz
Posts: 1558 | From the Berkshires | Registered: Jul 2001
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Truthfinder
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 8512
posted
Best of luck to all of you who are willing to try this!
I think it's great, and especially since you all plan to keep in touch.
Don't forget to let the rest of know how it's going. We may not remember to check the website. After all, we do have Lyme, you know.
All the best, Tracy
-------------------- Tracy .... Prayers for the Lyme Community - every day at 6 p.m. Pacific Time and 9 p.m. Eastern Time � just take a few moments to say a prayer wherever you are�. Posts: 2966 | From Colorado | Registered: Dec 2005
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posted
This sounds like animal studies using human volunteers.
This stuff is being sold as a cure for Lyme, but one thing I have not found anywhere is any solid evidence of silver having any effect on Borrelia species in particular.
Silver is credited with some antimicrobial properties, but just which microbes? Someone asked if it kills benefial bacteria... 'Oh no, just bad ones.' So then it is selective, it only kills bad ones?
There are alot of very strong and very toxic antibiotics that have little or no effect on Bb. It is really difficult to kill with anything we have at our disposal... mainstream medical or alternative.
I did some experimentation with it last year, adding microscopic silver particles to a blood culture and watching it under a microscope for a few days. This was just for my own curiosity.
As usual bacteria of many kinds start multiplying until the sample is swarming with them. I couldn't see any attenuation of bacterial growth at all around the silver particles. I actually expected that I would see a zone of no growth around them, but I did not.
Like any antibiotic being tested by culture and sensitivity, silver compounds being sold for Lyme should be able to demonstrate attenuation of growth OF THE CAUSATIVE ORGANISM.
I would like to see some scientific evidence (as opposed to testimonials) showing that silver has activity specifically against Bb or the common co-infections. Even if it is useful for some infective agents, one should not just assume it is good for this one.
Lacking that, asking people to try it to see what it does... first bottle free or not... is immoral in my opinion.
Posts: 714 | From San Antonio TX | Registered: Oct 2004
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quote:Originally posted by James H: I would like to see some scientific evidence...
TRIAL RESULTS OF MILD SILVER PROTEIN IN LYME DISEASE*
Preliminary laboratory studies on Borrelia burgdorferi spirochetes revealed that mild silver protein solutions reduce the growth rate of these cells significantly and eventually lead to cell death. It has been pointed out, however, that the spirochetes tested belong to a laboratory ATCC strain which is widely used in cell and tissue cultures and does not represent recent isolates from Lyme disease patients. In these tests, various concentrations of silver protein solutions were added to the culture of Borrellia spirochetes. Low concentrations of a silver protein solution (ranging from 2 to 10 parts per million) slowed the growth rate of the spirochetes over a time span of 1 to 3 days. Higher concentrations of silver protein (between 15 to 75 parts per million) had a much faster deleterious effect on cell replication. Growth inhibition depended on the concentration of the silver protein and on the duration of treatment.
More studies are definitely necessary to obtain a clearer picture of the interaction between the silver protein and Borrelia burgdorferi. As these very preliminary studies suggest, growth and replication of Lyme spirochetes are measurably inhibited by silver protein in the in vitro setting.
Manfred E. Bayer, M.D. Senior Member Fox Chase Cancer Center, Institute for Cancer Research Philadelphia, PA 19111
Margret H. Bayer, Ph.D. Senior Research Associate Fox Chase Cancer Center, Institute for Cancer Research Philadelphia, PA 19111
Posts: 731 | From Humble,TX | Registered: Feb 2005
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posted
Quote: This ``free'' offer is being made as an experiment to see what effect, if any, this product may have on Lyme.
I just have to say I feel like I've been experimented on for a long time by docs, ducks, llmds and the herbal pushers.
Now I'm too sick to trust anything new. In fact, I'm trying to stop some of what I've been taking....the new cure is worse than the old curse of lyme sometimes.
I'll wait to see results from the brave ones here before I sign up to be a lab rat.
If the testimonials come in from people I know and trust here, I will consider this regimen.
good luck but be careful lab rats. :-)
Posts: 867 | From PA | Registered: Jan 2006
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shazdancer
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 1436
posted
Hi brent,
What is the link to this information?
Posts: 1558 | From the Berkshires | Registered: Jul 2001
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Truthfinder
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 8512
posted
Some people seem to think that it is SOOOO scary to participate in something like this.
Good grief.
If anything, it will just be a waste of time, and not much at that.
Would you rather be one of the volunteers who participated in the Cymbalta trials and ended up committing suicide?
Or, perhaps you would feel better if you were one of the Zelnorm drug ``lab rats'' that had to have their gall bladder removed since Zelnorm makes you dump all kinds of garbage into your gall bladder. (I now have sludge in my own gall bladder from taking Zelnorm, thank you very much.)
And the drugs I mentioned got approved as ``safe'' by the FDA!!
And James, please don't be a Spin Doctor. It just confuses the issue.
quote:``This stuff is being sold as a cure for Lyme,...''
That statement is patently false, and therefore doesn't do anybody any good. Besides, Tony Z has the corner on the market in the Spin Doctor arena, and he may resent your encroachment on his territory.
Tracy
-------------------- Tracy .... Prayers for the Lyme Community - every day at 6 p.m. Pacific Time and 9 p.m. Eastern Time � just take a few moments to say a prayer wherever you are�. Posts: 2966 | From Colorado | Registered: Dec 2005
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JRWagner
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 3229
posted
Just a little addendum to Truthfinder's last post:
In the Beginning of Time...when most Doctors(??!!) knew nothing (some things have not changed)about Borrelia Burg. we were given ABX that were NOT proven to be effective against the bacteria. These ABX may have worked against Syphilis, and other infections, but they were NOTY proved to be effective IN VIVO.
In fact, some of the ABX we are given now have not been conclusively proven to work for all species of Borrelia, or all strains of BB...except for some studies in Vitro...which proves nothing.
So what? We have been guinea pigs ever since we were bitten. We have all sorts of ABX combos thrown at us...I have tried them ALL, except Vanco, and I am NOT going there.
Hyperbaric, Infra Red Sauna, Ozone Therapy, H2O2 infusions O2, Accupuncture,Accupressure, Cranial Maipulation, Chinese Herbs, Other Herbs, DNP (ICHT), Sweat Lodges, Arsenic Therapy,ART testing, etc., etc., etc.
Except for a few of these treatments, no valid scientific, Peer Reviewed, Double Blind (placebo) studies have been done. If one includes Studies done at VALID, RESPECTED Institutions of Research and Higher Learning in the criteria, the list shrinks even more...(NO "Research Institutions" with a person's home address make the cut...sorry TM...we are NOT fools!
Silver has been used to purify drinking water for a long time. In fact, when I went to Med School in Guadalajara in the 70's (remember then?) we used Silver Halide tablets for our water purification, and to disinfect our veggies and fruits...lest we get Moctazuma's Revenge (Amoebic Dysentery), called "American Student's Running Out of Class QUICKLY Disease".
We are not in danger here. Some ABX, such as Flagyl, have been shown to be carcinogenic in animal studies...My Doctor did not want me to take Flagyl long term for this reason.
The sky is not falling...we are just doing a little friendly test. If this works, and I have absolutely no preconceptions, as I know all to well how tenacious this bacteria is, great.
If it does NOT work, nothing lost, knowledge gained.
Now, everyone go out and enjoy the day.
No more bickering, it is not positive energy, and we need to stay positive.
Peace, Love and Wellness, JRW
Posts: 1414 | From Ny, Ny | Registered: Oct 2002
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shazdancer
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 1436
posted
**sigh** I so hate it when people tell me to stop talking and go away....
Sorry, Wagner, I'm not bickering. I'm disagreeing.
I read through the page link from brent, and it doesn't convince me any more than before. Dr. Farber never published anything on Bb in peer review. (And if that is a cut-and-paste of his statement, I wonder if he is even real, because I see the same types of grammar and spelling errors that I saw in the company owner's words when he posted here.)
Burgdorfer admitted that the product killed a strain of Bb in vitro. I see nothing in his statements endorsing the use of silver at all in the treatment of Lyme, and he certainly did not endorse this particular product. To send his lab some of the product and then to quote anything that wasn't negative (if that is what happened), is dishonest.
Heck, lots of things kill Bb in a petrie dish, and I wouldn't take them, either.
Posts: 1558 | From the Berkshires | Registered: Jul 2001
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JRWagner
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 3229
As for the info on Silver, AGAIN: Look at all of the Brorson's studies on Flagyl and Tinnidazole...ALL were done in Vitro.
In fact, most studies of ABX and BB were done in Vitro as well...until Dr. Fallon and his Chronic Lyme Disease Study, funded by the NIH, done at Columbia Presb. Medical Center in NYC.
PLEASE... you have a right to agree or disagree...however,we will find the truth by taking the stuff. No amount of agreeing or disagreeing will effect the outcomes.
BrentB, thanks for the links,they were very interesting.
No, Russell Altman did not write anything in these links. Many of us can have typos or spelling issues.
Be well all,here's to finding an answer...just one for now!
Peace, Love and Wellness, JRW
[ 05. November 2006, 07:50 PM: Message edited by: JRWagner ]
Posts: 1414 | From Ny, Ny | Registered: Oct 2002
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JRWagner
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 3229
posted
LYME SMURFS!!!!!! Tres Cool, Non?
My luck I will turn Purple and lose an eye and grow a horn...and start flying...
You know the rest...
Question: Does your chewing gum lose it's flavor on the bedpost overnight?
It's not really me, I swear...must be the Hi Ho SILVER!!!! AWAYYYYYYYYYY!!!!
Peace, Love and Wellness, JRW
Posts: 1414 | From Ny, Ny | Registered: Oct 2002
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