posted
I couldnt find much on this when I did a search so I figured I'd give it a shot with a new message.
I recently had a hair sample sent out by a nutritionist for testing and one thing that came back was very high copper levels. My LLMD is going to test for copper through blood to see if the same result comes back but I was wondering if anyone here has had high copper levels and what kinds of symptoms you had.
Thanks!
-David
-------------------- Same nightmare, different day! Posts: 401 | From East Coast | Registered: Nov 2005
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Marnie
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posted
David, do you want me to post the section on copper from my nutrition book?
Posts: 9424 | From Sunshine State | Registered: Mar 2001
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clairenotes
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posted
I think I might have read in Dr. K's "Beyond Antibiotics" article that hair analysis tests that show high copper levels are misleading somehow and not indicative of real levels. I can't remember what the reasoning was. But he believes that lower levels actually exist with this disease. You might google the article and look under the minerals section a few pages in.
It will be interesting to see what Marnie's research says also.
Claire
Posts: 1111 | From Colorado | Registered: Oct 2006
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CaliforniaLyme
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posted
I had a friend with Wilsons SYndrome which is the inability to properly process copper- the worst thing about Wilsons is that it doesn't hit right away- anyway T. didn't get hit until her 20s and then began having gross neurological problems-
TODAY there is treatment for Wilsons if caught right away the person can be rbought back to baseline with appropriate treatment- but she went YEARS without being caught- and suffered accordingly- it can look very Lymie- she slurs her words and moves jerkily-
some people it hits in adolescence- some later- but basically the body can't clear the copper so it builds and builds and builds in the body!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Again, if caught early with appropriate treatment it is entirely treatable these days-
And cancer stores copper-
Best wishes, Sarah
1: Front Biosci. 2004 Sep 1;9:2652-62. Links
Copper storage diseases: Menkes, Wilsons, and cancer.
Daniel KG, Harbach RH, Guida WC, Dou QP. The Prevention Program, Barbara Ann Karmanos Cancer Institute, and Department of Pathology, School of Medicine, Wayne State University, Detroit, Michigan, USA.
The trace element copper is vital to the healthy functioning of organisms. Copper is used in a multitude of cellular activities including respiration, angiogenesis, and immune responses. Like other metals, copper homeostasis is a tightly regulated process.
Copper is transported from dietary intake through the serum and into cells via a variety of transporters.
There are a variety of copper chaperones designed to insure that copper is sequestered from interaction with cellular membranes, proteins, or DNA where its properties can result in oxidative damage.
However, there are disease states in which copper transporters crucial to homeostasis are impaired resulting in potentially toxic copper accumulation. Wilsons and Menkes diseases are two such cases.
Wilsons disease (hepatolenticular degeneration) is an autosomal recessive disorder resulting in extreme accumulation of copper in the liver with deposits elsewhere in the body.
Menkes is characterized by a systemic copper deficiency (different from the liver specificity of Wilsons disease) and is the result of an X-linked recessive mutation in a copper transporter. Uptake of copper is impaired due to inability to remove existing copper from cells primarily in the small intestine.
Though the causes are dramatically different, cancer also shares a similar diagnostic in the accumulation of copper in effected tissues. Studies have shown greatly elevated levels of copper in cancer tissues, and some diagnostics and treatments from Wilsons and Menkes diseases, such as copper chelation therapy, have been used in the treatment of cancer. Given the commonality of copper accumulation in these diseases and that common therapies exist between them, it may prove beneficial to study all three diseases in light of copper homeostasis.
This review will examine the chemical nature and biological roles of copper, Wilsons and Menkes disease and their therapies, and the use of copper related therapies in cancer.
PMID: 15358588 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
-------------------- There is no wealth but life. -John Ruskin
All truth goes through 3 stages: first it is ridiculed: then it is violently opposed: finally it is accepted as self evident. - Schopenhauer Posts: 5639 | From Aptos CA USA | Registered: Apr 2005
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Health
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posted
Hi,
I had really high copper levels on a hair analysis done about 9 years ago.
I never knew why. ND did not know why either. I was tested for Wilsons and it was negative. ND suggested chelation. I did live in a building with copper pipes, for 6 years, before I had this
hair analysis done.
I did have all mercury out about 2 years later, and did chelation for quite a while, but I never had the hair tested again to see if the
high copper levels were still high.
I did recieve a sheet of paper along with the hair analysis report as to some suggestions why the copper levels would be high.
If i find this sheet I will let you know what it says. I will look for it, maybe it applies to me now, I did not know I had lyme back then.
Trish
Posts: 1250 | From Canada | Registered: Aug 2004
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clairenotes
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posted
Quote from "A Look Beyond Antibiotics:"
"Amazingly, the most depleted minerals in our Lyme patients are often copper, magnesium, manganese (in Lyme) and iron (in Babesiosis). Bb and Bartonella need magnesium to duplicate and deplete the host's body rapidly. Copper and iron have all but disappeared from most of our supplements based on faulty interpretation of hair analysis. This immune system uses those 2 metals in the process of phagocytosis. They are the main constituent of the enzymes (or "bullets") the immune cells use in the battle against the invaders...
Oxidized used-up iron and copper get displaced into the extracellular compartment and body fluids and apears in the hair and skin, as the bodys' most efficient way of excreting toxins without hurting the kidneys. This has led to the dangerous and in its' consequence catastrophic assumption that these metals are the enemy and need to be restricted. It is true, that oxidized metals pose a danger and have to be reduced (=substitution of electrons) or eliminated. However, when copper and iron are needed and substitutely appropriately, major improvements have been observed..."
I do believe that copper is involved in cancer in high levels and/or in individuals who don't have the ability to detox metals properly etc. Many of us have copper plumbing. Other researchers I follow have stated this concern.
Still, I think what Dr. K is saying is interesting to think about and perhaps to look into further.
Claire
Posts: 1111 | From Colorado | Registered: Oct 2006
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david1097
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Member # 3662
posted
are you taking any chelating agents?
There is a copper metabolism disorder called wilsons disease, but it usually results in LOWER serum copper levels. In any case check it out, its easy to find via google or on Emedicine.com.
Posts: 1184 | From north america | Registered: Feb 2003
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posted
Taking high enough doses of Molybdenum will lower Copper. Kal sells N-Acetyl-Cysteine (NAC) with Molybdenum (under the label NAC+), for a fair price. That should lower your copper!
-------------------- "You know, the worst, meanest, nastiest, ticks in the world are politicks," - Steve Nostrum Posts: 242 | From South NJ | Registered: Dec 2006
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Marnie
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posted
From the book, Prescription For Nutritional Healing (recent edition)on the functions of copper:
"Among its many functions, copper aids in the formation of bone, hemaglobin, and red blood cells, and works in balance with zinc and vitamin C to from elastin, an important skin protein.
It is involved in the healing process, energy production, hair and skin coloring, and taste sensitivity.
This mineral is also needed for healthy nerves and joints. One of the early signs of copper deficiency is osteoporosis.
Copper is essential for the formation of collagen, one of the fundamental proteins making up bones, skin and connective tissue.
Other possible signs of copper deficiency include anemia, baldness, diarrhea, general weakness, impaired respiratory function, and skin sores. A lack of copper can also leas to increased blood fat levels.
Sources:
Besides its use in cookware an plumbing, copper is also widely distributed in foods. Food sources include almonds, avocados, barley, beans, beets, blackstrap molasses, broccoli, garlic, lentils, liver, mushrooms, nuts, oats, oranges, pecans, radishes, raisins, salmon, seafood, soybeans, and green leafy vegetables.
Comments:
The level of copper in the body is related to the levels of zinc and vitamin C. Copper levels are reduced if large amounts of zince or vitamin C are consumed. If copper intake is too high, levels of vitamin C and zinc drop.
The consumption of high amts of fructose (fruit sugar) can make a copper deficiency significantly worse. In a study conducted by the U.S. Department of Agriculture, people who obtained 20 percent of their daily calories from fructose showed decreased levels of red blood cell superoxide dismutase (SOD), a copper dependent enzyme critical to antioxidant protection within the red blood cells.
Cautions:
Excessive copper in the body can promote destruction of eye tissue through oxidation. Persons with eye problems should be especially careful to balance their intake of copper with that of iron, zinc, and calcium."
Copper poisoning in humans can cause intestinal distress, cramps, vomiting. Higher levels of copper poisoning in humans can be fatal. Copper is carried through the blood stream to all tissues, the highest concentrations being in the liver, heart, brain, kidneys and muscle.
The body does try to detoxify copper, it produces a natural chelating material called Metallothionein.
Metallothionein is a metal-binding protein which is important in heavy metal detoxification, it binds zinc, cadmium, copper, mercury and silver. Metallathionein creates a `memory' when exposed to these metals, becoming more adept at binding them.
posted
Hubby was tested for Wilson's Disease -- he had both urine and serum copper levels tested and even had the special eye exam looking for Keyser-Fleischer rings -- hope I spelled that right.
I think the eye exam is actually the gold standard test for Wilson's Disease.
Symptoms of the disease are usually both neurological and psychiatric.
Bea Seibert
Posts: 7306 | From Martinsville,VA,USA | Registered: Oct 2004
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I am taking zinc and a few other things that the nutritionist recommended to help with the copper levels. Also I brought this up to my LLMD and he did mention ruling out Wilson's so he is doing some blood testing for this but from what he told me this is a very rare disease.
As I mentioned the hair test was very high for copper so it will be interesting to see if the blood tests confirm this.
The strange thing was that a lot of my other elements (magnesium, iron, etc.) were low. But maybe with lyme this isn't so strange. My uranium levels were very high also! (Luckily it's the not the radioactive kind).
Thanks againg for all the responses!
-David
-------------------- Same nightmare, different day! Posts: 401 | From East Coast | Registered: Nov 2005
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CaliforniaLyme
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posted
David it IS rare- but in case your doc doesn't know- if you do have it- it is almost curable now- the drugs they have work so well it is a VERY favorable prognosis!!! If my friend T had been caught in todays world she would appear normal. Too much damage though- from 20 years-
Take care!!! Best wishes, Sarah
-------------------- There is no wealth but life. -John Ruskin
All truth goes through 3 stages: first it is ridiculed: then it is violently opposed: finally it is accepted as self evident. - Schopenhauer Posts: 5639 | From Aptos CA USA | Registered: Apr 2005
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Vanilla
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posted
I had a "borderline" high copper hair test done too. I have also heard that is not reliable way to test for copper levels.
My blood copper level tests out okay but it is in the high side of the "normal" range.
I think I will go take some Vitamin C just incase....
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