I know practically everyone with Lyme takes magnesium supplementation. As I've posted before, I'm having a terrible time with daily anxiety/panic/mania/inability to stop moving attacks that last for hours. In the late evening I usually feel better before going to bed.
For the past few weeks I've added in mag glycinate - about 500-600mg/day. The other day I saw my old muscle testing person and he insists that my anxiety is caused by a deficiency of CALCIUM brought on by taking too much magnesium.
The amount of magnesium I was taking doesn't seem to be very high, and I had only been taking it for about a month.
Does anyone else think this is likely, and do many of you take calcium supplements to offset the magnesium you take? I know almost everyone here takes quite alot of magnesium!
Thanks,
- Andrew
Posts: 443 | From The Wild West | Registered: Jan 2002
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GiGi
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 259
posted
Maybe Google for some of the different opinions - that way you can get a better picture. We definitely need to have a balance between Magnesium and Calcium - opinions vary because individuals vary.
Take care.
Posts: 9834 | From Washington State | Registered: Oct 2000
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I've admired you for a long time. Thanks for the reply!
I have googled alot on Calcium/Magnesium, and the general consensus seems to be you shouldn't do too much of one without the other.
But here on LymeNet, EVERYONE seems to be taking alot of Mg, and I don't hear much about taking Calcium. Hence my question for folks here...
- A
Posts: 443 | From The Wild West | Registered: Jan 2002
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Vanilla
Unregistered
posted
I take mag but no calcium except in the form of cell salts and not every day.
In some lab work maybe last Nov. or before my calcium came back in the higher range.
For me I am not going to add anymore in.
You might try adding in some Calcium Phos. It use to mellow me out sometimes when I was having anxiety a bit and sometimes the mag phos would help instead so I use to have to play around with the cell salts to see which one would work and Ferrum Phos and Kali Phos also helped a lot with my anxiety symptoms.
LD depletes mag and Babeisa depletes ferrum phos - iron
luvs2ride
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 8090
posted
I supplement coral calcium as needed. Calcium is also in some of my supplements like my daily vitamin.
The way I know when I need the calcium is by testing my urine ph each morning. If I am acidic, I add 1/4 to 1/2 tsp to my water. If I am alkaline, I leave the extra calcium alone.
Be sure to take calcium and other minerals away from your abx as they will bind to the minerals and lose potency.
A person's blood must maintain a neutral (7) PH or we will die. The body maintains that balance by leaching calcium from the bones if there is not enough calcium already. So when your blood shows a high calcium, it could mean you actually need more calcium. So I have read.
A poor diet will cause the body to be too acidic and the calcium to balance this acid comes from the bones causing osteoporosis. Sodas are extremely acidic and promote osteoporosis.
Please consult with your doctor and if he is not highly trained in nutrition (most medical schools do no focus on this area as they are medicine driven) find a doctor who is and follow their instructions.
Healthy people should pay more attention to their diet but everyone who is sick must be very aware of their diet. It will help you get well quicker.
Luvs
-------------------- When the Power of Love overcomes the Love of Power, there will be Peace. Posts: 3038 | From america | Registered: Oct 2005
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Marnie
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posted
"The glutamate then binds to NMDA (N-methyl-D-aspartate) receptors and triggers excessive influx of sodium and calcium ions, along with water, into the postsynaptic neurons.
The neurons swell and neuronal toxicity and apoptotic death are initiated (9). Before glutamate-poisoned neurons die they too release excessive amounts of glutamate and the process of poisoning continues in a cascade-like fashion.
Calcium released en bloc triggers release of calmodulin, which then stimulates nitric oxide synthase, an enzyme needed for the synthesis of nitric oxide.
This acts as a retrograde messenger that travels back to the presynaptic neuron where it activates guanylyl cyclase, initiating greater calcium and sodium influx (10).
Some scientists believe that, along with glutamate, excessive release of NO contributes to neuronal damage.
Most agree, however, that glutamate plays the central and starring role in ischemia-induced brain damage."
The NMDA (glutamate) receptors are gated by Mg, Zinc, glycine and glutamate.
When the first 3 are deficient...guess what happens.
Bb is triggering all of this.
Bb's motility depends on NaCl.
Bb is triggering Na to go INTO the cells, K...out.
This is the REVERSE of what should be the case.
NORMALLY K is supposed to be IN the cell and Na OUTSIDE.
This is a disruption of what is called the Na-K pump.
TNF alpha,which we are using to DEFEND...in reality OPENS Na channels in endothelial cells which is exactly where Bb is camped out.
In lyme...glutamate is thru the roof and acetylcholine down. In the body...acetylcholine is down and norepinephrine -> epinephrine (adrenaline) is UP...
NOT good.
Posts: 9426 | From Sunshine State | Registered: Mar 2001
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lymewreck36
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posted
Hi Marnie:
Something tells me that your above technical post is extremely important. Could you summarize in layman's terms, and add your suggestion for supplementation?
Thanks so much.
Mary
Posts: 1032 | From North Carolina | Registered: Aug 2003
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Marnie
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 773
posted
Mary...what this all boils down to is this:
We have to halt the cell signal, NFkBIKKA.
This is triggering ongoing inflammation + ...
This is what Bb WANTS to happen. It WANTS TNF alpha to open Na epithelial cell channels because
Bb's motility depends on NaCL.
There is a list of things that INactivate NFkBIKKA.
Bb depletes most of them....so the call bell (NFkBIKKA) continues to "ring".
Not good.
We need to take a hard look at that list and see what on the list Bb DOESN'T use.
For example...glutathione reduces NFkB.
However, glutathione comes from cysteine, glycine and glutamate.
Bb wants/needs cysteine (in its zinc fingers) and glycine...
So glutathione (our #1 antioxidant) is kapoot.
Once again...there is a LIST of what can INactivate NFkBIKKA.
Want the list?
Posts: 9426 | From Sunshine State | Registered: Mar 2001
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Jellybelly
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 7142
posted
Hi Andrew, it sounds to me like your muscle testing person is kind of off base. Magnesium deficency is a problem in the general population and much worse in us with Lyme.
Magnesium deficency is a known possible cause for depression and anxiety. Do a quick search on "magnesium, anxiety, depression" on google, you should bring up goobs of stuff.
I have read a lot about magnesium and I don't think I can rememeber reading anywhere that it can make depression or anxiety worse??
Posts: 1251 | From california | Registered: Apr 2005
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luvs2ride
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 8090
posted
Marnie, your IQ must be Menza level.
Huh?
The only thing I can conclude, even from your washed down version, is that our glutathione levels are kapoot. I'm not even sure I have that correct.
Do you mean kapoot as we are no longer making it and need supplementation? Or kapoot as in stay as far away from it as you can because Bb loves it.
Sorry, I feel so dumb.
And I can't for the life of me figure out where you stand on calcium and magnesium supplementation. I'm pretty sure I recall your past posts supporting magnesium supplementation.
Yes, please, the list. Hope I can understand it.
Luvs
-------------------- When the Power of Love overcomes the Love of Power, there will be Peace. Posts: 3038 | From america | Registered: Oct 2005
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Vermont_Lymie
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 9780
posted
Hi Andrew,
I take 200 mg/magnesium supplement in the morning; sometimes an additional 100mg in the afternoon.
In the evening, I often take 300 mg/calcium citrate (twinlabs) that also has 150mg/mg oxide. Seems to help me with sleep.
What has helped most with lyme anxiety is 10 months of antibiotic treatment, along with babs treatment for the past 3 months.
Posts: 2557 | From home | Registered: Aug 2006
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