posted
First I thought maybe the nurse did not know what she was talking about today when she called to tell me that me HIDA scan results are normal. But then I asked my GI doc to review the report. He too said the results are normal. BUT I got a copy of the report and my ejection fraction is 10%!!!!! That is way too low!! I am having so much pain, discomfort and other gallbladder problems. Okay, so I do NOT have stones/sludge, but my gallbladder is NOT emptying right. WHAT SHOULD I DO??? PLease help, anybody.
-------------------- Bullsye rash: 1994, tx w/ ABT, Symptomatic:1999 Hospitalization: 2004 Equivocol results (specialy lab) resulting in chronic use of ABT, herbs, etc ever since. Severity of symptoms continue to worsen intermittingly. Posts: 140 | From maryland | Registered: Oct 2006
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posted
How funny..now I know why I never had /have gallbladder issues...I have my sardines with olive oil and fresh squeezed lemons for breakfast on a weekly basis......
Posts: 983 | From The sky | Registered: Feb 2005
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posted
How funny..now I know why I never had /have gallbladder issues...I have my sardines with olive oil and fresh squeezed lemons for breakfast on a weekly basis......
Posts: 983 | From The sky | Registered: Feb 2005
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Tincup
Honored Contributor (10K+ posts)
Member # 5829
posted
"Since I don't have stones or sludge, what exactly would I be trying to flush out anyway?"
Sorry.. gotta laugh.
I don't have stones or sludge in my panties.. but I wash them regularly.
I honestly can't tell from here what the contents of your gall bladder are at any given moment... but if it hurts.. and they can't find anything wrong.... and this could possibly help... and you'd normally eat it anyway...
Might want to try?
It is up to you... I am just suggesting it might help and sincerely hoping it does.
Yo Blue..
I use to give my kid sardines in a can to take for school lunches (he was allergic to so many things so choices were limited)..
Till the teacher called one day and said no one would sit with or play with my little one because of what he ate for lunch.
lymie_in_md
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 14197
posted
Keebler that's a great list of foods for increasing the gall bladder's function. I thought a few I've tried is dandelion greens and parsley may help to clean, rebuild and/or repair tissue damage not only in the gall bladder but the rest of the major organs.
You could also try raw pineapples juiced. The acid is assumed by some to irritate the gall bladder. I think it is more curative. It could be tried for a few days and see if it helps.
I love dandelion greens in a pesto I make. One batch of dandelion greens, 2 tablespoons of olive oil, 1 whole lemon, 3 cloves garlic, 1 teaspoon ginger, 2 tablespoons ground flax seed, 1 tbls ACV blended together. I eat over the course of 4 or 5 days. You could substitute dandelion greens for parsley if you prefer. I also find the pineapple is great for my digestion, i eat a serving twice a day, every day. I did have the pain and don't anymore.
Also, supplementing with a good portion of digestive and metabolic enzymes may help.
-------------------- Bob Posts: 2150 | From Maryland | Registered: Dec 2007
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posted
I know in this part of the country that any EF of less than 35% constitutes removal, especially if you are symptomatic........sludge isn't something that can be seen from and ultrasound or an HB scan; they didn't see any sludge in mine til they got it out........and I had to seek a second opinion due to similar reasons you are describing.
I ended up having emergency surgery because my GB was on the verge of being gangrenous. That was the BEST surgery I have ever had and am grateful that I got that second opinion because after it was all said and done, he told me I could have easily died from it had it stayed in there......
-------------------- TL Posts: 365 | From OK | Registered: Jul 2007
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Your experience sounds scary. Which symptoms of mine were the same symptoms you experienced?? What exactly is a gangernous GB anyway?
If I don't have stones, I wonder how long I've had this GB motility problem. I hope I did not cause the problem with the years of various abx to treat lyme.
thanks for any thoughts.
-------------------- Bullsye rash: 1994, tx w/ ABT, Symptomatic:1999 Hospitalization: 2004 Equivocol results (specialy lab) resulting in chronic use of ABT, herbs, etc ever since. Severity of symptoms continue to worsen intermittingly. Posts: 140 | From maryland | Registered: Oct 2006
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Aniek
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 5374
posted
How do they know you don't have sludge? There is no test for sludge besides looking at the gallbladder once it is taken out. But a low ejection fraction suggests sludge.
Every doctor told me under 30 or 35 is a sick gallbladder. The surgeon I saw would have taken it out if it was under 30. Maybe you need to see a surgeon?
-------------------- "When there is pain, there are no words." - Toni Morrison Posts: 4711 | From Washington, DC | Registered: Mar 2004
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posted
My Hida scan showed gallbladder function at less than 10%. Doctor said at that point it is just a "pus pocket". It was removed.
During removal they found tons of sludge that had NOT previously shown up on ultrasound. In fact it was so inflammed that they almost could not get it out thru the laproscopic hole (almost had to do full incision)
I would get a 2nd opinion.
-------------------- Corinne Posts: 529 | From Raleigh, NC | Registered: Jun 2006
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hshbmom
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 9478
posted
You all probably know this...
My LLMD explained gallbladder problems this way:
Lyme bacteria love the gallbladder; they hide in there and evade treatment. It acts as a source of infection despite having good antibiotic treatment.
Antibiotics don't penetrate the gallbladder well enough to kill the bacteria stored in there. When the gallbladder contracts; it squeezes out some bacteria daily & you continually get a little dose of bacteria, so you stay sick.
My question is: Why can't a physician implant IV tube into your gallbladder and infuse medicine straight into it??? I'd think it would be better than having this organ removed.
A physician could do this by laparoscopic surgery...suture the tube into the gallbladder, and the other end to your abdominal skin. It would kind of be like a IV catheter going near your heart.
They put shunts into brains to remove excess fluid...and put the other end in the abdominal cavity. Why couldn't they do this?
My LLMD was wanted to take my gallbladder out, but my symptoms resolved and it's fine.
Thank God!
Posts: 1672 | From AL/WV/OH | Registered: Jun 2006
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TerryK
Frequent Contributor (5K+ posts)
Member # 8552
posted
hshbmom - I didn't know that! Thanks for explaining.
I've heard that the stones and sludge are bacterial breeding grounds. I've also read that a congested gallbladder can make it impossible to get rid of a parasitic infection as well. I guess I'll add this to my list of things to work on.
maryland - It seems like a serious gallbladder cleanse would help your situation but since it can be dangerous I would want a Naturopathic Doctor to direct it if I were in your situation.
I hope you get this solved.
Terry I'm not a doctor
Posts: 6286 | From Oregon | Registered: Jan 2006
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posted
Dear Maryland, I ended up in the ER several times with excruciating pain in my stomach area. It was so severe that I could barely eat or even drink water. This went on for awhile. I could barely function and lost 20 pounds in a month.
My naturopathic doctor tried to give me certain supplements to ease the pain, to no avail. Finally, on one of my ER trips, I was diagnosed with a low ejection fraction of my gall bladder. Surgery was recommended to remove it.
Being that I didn't want to give up an organ so readily, I went for a second opinion with a specialist, who concurred that I should have surgery. I then had the surgery which was done laproscopically, and voila...pain gone.
I would urge you to see another doctor with your test results. As someone above recommended, a GI specialist and/or a surgeon familiar with gall bladder issues. I am a fan of using wholistic approaches (in this case under the supervision of a naturopathic doctor), but there are times when allopathic approaches are called for. Of course, you are the best one to determine what is best for you.
P.S. I later found out that gall bladder issues are often related to lyme.
Well wishes, Hopeful4
Posts: 873 | From WA | Registered: Dec 2005
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posted
You have given me a lot to think about. Tomorrow morning I have an appointment with a GI specialist regarding my 10% ejection fraction and the laundry list of symptoms that follow. I am curious to hear what he is going to tell me. I don't know what I am going to do if he tells me there is nothing worng with me and I only have IBS. I am preparing myself to receive some disappointing news...
-------------------- Bullsye rash: 1994, tx w/ ABT, Symptomatic:1999 Hospitalization: 2004 Equivocol results (specialy lab) resulting in chronic use of ABT, herbs, etc ever since. Severity of symptoms continue to worsen intermittingly. Posts: 140 | From maryland | Registered: Oct 2006
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posted
Had my Gallbladder removed Jan 7th. It's now gone to Igenex for testing for borellia. I've been told however that it rarely comes back positive for lyme.
Didn't get into specifics but I guess now after reading this thread it might not survive there well.
Having had a CDC positive test for lyme, I just thought it would validate what I already know.
Barb
Posts: 281 | From san francisco | Registered: Jun 2006
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posted
Okay, here it is: I just saw a GI doc who told me that although my ejection fraction is only 10%, what I am experiencing is probably not gallbladder related symptoms. He was not sure if having my GB out would help or not. So, he referred me to a general suregon to further discuss having my GB removed. In the meantime this GI doc is certain that all I have is IBS. I give up.
-------------------- Bullsye rash: 1994, tx w/ ABT, Symptomatic:1999 Hospitalization: 2004 Equivocol results (specialy lab) resulting in chronic use of ABT, herbs, etc ever since. Severity of symptoms continue to worsen intermittingly. Posts: 140 | From maryland | Registered: Oct 2006
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posted
well, I give up. I saw a doc for a second opinion who still thinks I have only IBS despite the low ejection fraction. He just ordered my tests and a surgical consult to consider removing the gallbladder- but he does not reccomdend surgery. I have no idea what to do. If I have IBS it's only due to all the doctors telling me that I am not sick.
-------------------- Bullsye rash: 1994, tx w/ ABT, Symptomatic:1999 Hospitalization: 2004 Equivocol results (specialy lab) resulting in chronic use of ABT, herbs, etc ever since. Severity of symptoms continue to worsen intermittingly. Posts: 140 | From maryland | Registered: Oct 2006
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Tincup
Honored Contributor (10K+ posts)
Member # 5829
posted
maryland... you must be fit to kill at this point and I don't blame you. So sorry!
Have you been tested for Bartonella?
Have you been on antibiotics a long while? Well, how long actually would be the question.
Are you on regular yeast meds?
Do you have a LLMD?
I AM trying to help get you some answers here.. so if you respond.. we can put our heads together.. all the pieces from folks here.. and maybe get you on the right road.
posted
I just started seeing a new LLMD a few months ago. I have been on and off of just about every kind of antibiotic for at least the past five years (give or take). I just completed seven monts of bicilin. My LLMD also discontinued my the full cowden (I was on that also for seven months), I take acidolphis daily. Right now I am just about to start levequin and doxy. Becuase I have such a long standng history of GI symptoms, my docs are use much caution when ordering many high dose antibiotics.
Yes, I have been treated for all co-infections. My lyme and co-infections keep coming back negative for years now through IGNEX.
thoughts?
-------------------- Bullsye rash: 1994, tx w/ ABT, Symptomatic:1999 Hospitalization: 2004 Equivocol results (specialy lab) resulting in chronic use of ABT, herbs, etc ever since. Severity of symptoms continue to worsen intermittingly. Posts: 140 | From maryland | Registered: Oct 2006
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klutzo
Frequent Contributor (1K+ posts)
Member # 5701
posted
Maryland, I am absoulutely flabbergasted that they did not yank that puppy immediately with only a 10% ejection fraction!!! You should be able to find many articles on the Internet by docs stating that any EJF below 35% means surgery.
BTW, I had two normal ultrasounds and two normal HIDAs, with high ejection fractions, but when my GB was finally removed it was full of stones! Docs don't admit this, but ultrasound only shows calcium stones, and large stones, which are about 10% of stones. Most stones are made of cholesterol and the smaller ones are more likely to cause problems.
I still cannot eat fats, and have severe fat malabsorption. The problems do not go away even with removal for 40% of us, but they are better than before. Before surgery, I had lost the ability to eat anything but small amts. of hot cereal and applesauce.
My TCM doc explained that GB problems are really liver problems, and you can continue to make stones in the liver and get them stuck in ducts if your cholesterol to bile salt ratios are not right.
I am going to start bile salts soon to see if they help, and I am already on the maximum dose of prescription digestive enzymes. I may have to have an MRCP of my pancreas to see if I need double the max dose of enzymes....that would not be a GB problem, but a pancreas problem.
I don't think flushes to remove stones will change a bad HIDA score, which has nothing to do with stones, and if I were you, I'd get very assertive with the surgeon....maybe bring him articles you printed out about how any EJF under 35% means removal of the GB.
I am so sorry you are going through this. I lost 30 lbs., and my close up vision got much worse, permanently, from the stress I went through. My skin also shriveled up from not absorbing fats, and it looks 20 yrs. older.
BTW, the GI doc told me IBS gets worse after GB removal, and that has proven to be true, so be prepared to really get serious about diet.
I finally convinced them to take my GB out by having an EGD with biliary microscopy to prove I had cystals coming out in my bile. This requires gerneral anesthesia and is just as expensive as the surgery, so I hope you won't need to do it.
Good luck and God Bless, Klutzo
Posts: 1269 | From Clearwater, Florida, USA | Registered: May 2004
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posted
I had kidney stones and gallstones. And what I did was order peppermint oil from swanson. Take 3 capsals of peppermint oiland parsally and boil it in water for 5 min. Drink a cup hot and drink alot of water and the stones will desolve. I lost alot of weight with this. I have found that If something is wrong with you gallblader, You can not loose weight. Good luck!
-------------------- Except the ones you love,be sure that you are also being excepted!!!! Posts: 16 | From Elkton,MD. | Registered: Feb 2008
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